From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 18:47:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 11:47:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fwd: Possible Event Cache in Prescott 5/3 References: <20030401101312.13498.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Message-ID: <006801c31012$110c9980$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> Barring the unforeseen, it's likely that Cindy and I would come. Jerry Offtrail > Hi all, > I am posting this again, as I had a handful of interested and possibly > interested folks, just want to see how much interest there is. Anybody > else? I know it is a long way off, but I was told people needed alot > of notice to plan it if coming from a distance. And I don't want to go > to all the work of putting it together if not too many can make it. > Trisha "Lightning" > Preskitt > > > ------- Start of forwarded message ------- > > Subject: Possible Event Cache > From: "Trisha" > Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 18:49:55 -0700 (MST) > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > > Hi all, > > I would like to plan an event cache for May 3 (Saturday) but I want to > see how much interest there might be before I try and put it all > together. > > What I was thinking about doing was have the "Event" get-together/ > party at our Posse headquarters (a building at Pioneer Park in NW > Prescott) so we would have an indoor meeting area, full kitchen and > bathrooms, large covered porch as well as a BBQ area and parking lot. > > It would start at say....11 am, maybe 10am, until dusk (?) and would > have lunch-facilities available (BBQ/kitchen, people can bring their > own meat and stuff to share, we could provide some drinks (no alcohol) > and snacks.) I would have a cache there for sign-in, and for some > activities: plan one or more scavenger-hunt style cache trips where > people could, if they wanted, go out from the event (for less than an > hour) with one or more caches involved for added "finds" (and I'm > thinking to have a way to time the person/team with prizes for the > fastest, etc.) Any other ideas for activities? And of course, there > are the local caches to go after....I hope before the Nat'l Forest > closes! > > I'd like to get an idea of interest, from local AND non-local cachers. > I don't need suggestions for alternative dates, that is the only date > I want to plan for, and if there are not many people who can come, we > will do it in the Fall (maybe) > > Please answer on-list so all can see the response, thanks! > > Trisha "Lightning" > Prescott > > ------- End of forwarded message ------- > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 00:12:32 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 00:12:32 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] easy caches Message-ID:

Here's the list I usually pass out to handicapped cachers:

Hummingbird, Old West Cache, Kyrene del Norte, Hall of Flame, 12th Anniversary Cache, Stuck Up, Kangaroo is Watching You, A Break in Education, Golden Eagle Cache, Dance School Joke Cache, Roadrunner's Revenge: Net Serve, Cachette 1, Statues of Limitations, Lunch Break,  ACP Cache, Gold Miner Cache,  Tootsie, Old Man Greenstick, Desert  Critters, Ghostly Ride, D-Man, Revenge of Sliver, DV Mini, Land of Excess, North Mountain Park, Be My Valentoid, Home Run Country II, Electric Playground, Crismon Tide, Joe Dalton, Paradise Valley Park, Twofer (see map to park correctly), Coldest-N-Town, By the Farm, and Crocodile Hunter.

Not all of these are Tempe/East Valley Caches, but that should be enough to get you started until he recovers.




>From: "janelle n"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] easy caches
>Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 14:48:02 -0700
>
>
>Can anyone recommend East Valley/Tempe caches that are super
>handicap accessible? Half of our team is currently laid up with a
>bum foot and isn't too handy with his crutches. I wanted to get a
>short list that we could go search for, just to get him out of the
>house, with minimal walking required. I was thinking caches like "No
>Breeze" or "A Rosey Outlook." Unfortunately, I think we may have
>found most of the super easies that are nearby. Any suggestions
>would be appreciated. Thanks.
>
>Team Bumbling Bee, Aaron & Janelle.
>
>
>
>
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>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com

STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 01:34:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 18:34:00 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Bees Message-ID: <20030430183400.29130.h010.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> Heh Heh Heh.....didn't think it would take you two TOO long to figger that out! Trisha On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 14:28:14 -0700, connie.farquhar@cox.net wrote: > > What Trisha, you don't want to put the bee suit on and go in disguise > to > claim the find? > > --Connie > Team "Wyle E" > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 02:53:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 19:53:07 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New cacher and another reason to use GPS In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Photography and GPS are a wonderful combination. There's a not very active Yahoo!Group called Geographing which combines the two that might be worth checking out. I think some careful notetaking on when your photos were taken that includes the GPS measured coordinates and a direction is a great idea and one that is even easier with a digital camera. If you keep your digital camera's clock reasonably accurate, you can do a lot of back checking using your tracklog for most of your photos - and you don't have to think about it too much, just to leave your GPS on and tracking while your are exploring and photographing. Along with a couple of waypoints for special photos and calibration, you should be able to reconstruct the location of almost all your images, at least while the GPS is on and tracking satellites. I've done that with one hike, but haven't gone much farther with it - yet. As for what GPS, well, almost any will do. I like my Garmin Legend whose maps really help in a lot of circumstances (using MapSource Roads and Rec and/or Topo is my prefered). It's recent firmware upgrade that expanded the number of waypoints and trackpoints really makes it wonderful to be able to use both for keeping track of where your photos were taken (not to mention for geocaching). Its compass, however, depends on recent motion of the reciever, so a reciever with a built in compass might be preferable if she wants to include direction of photo a little more reliably. The biggest problem I've had in combining GPS and camera is just good old organization and record keeping. I'm still trying to find the best way of organizing my digital pictures (the old notebook with slides or transperancies worked pretty well, but with smaller numbers of images, it wasn't hard to keep track of the images I wanted - I need some sort of database scheme to keep track of my digital images.... Including more information like location, time, direction, and other notes in such a database should not be too hard to do. Jim. On Wed, 30 Apr 2003, gale and mike wrote: > A friend of mine sent me an e-mail recently. A coworker of his is a > photography buff. She is interested in getting her own GPS to use with > her photography. She does a lot of landscapes and nature photography and > wants to be able to find places again. Is anyone out there a photographer > and use their GPS like that? Any recommendations on what GPS she should > get? Jim Scotti Lunar & Planetary Laboratory University of Arizona Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 04:45:51 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:45:51 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <3EAF7621.4060206@mchsi.com> <006101c30f74$852010c0$0500a8c0@one> Message-ID: <001401c30f9c$8bcd2ca0$b6b33b41@fishkiller> umm so when do you start your caching vacation? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Loran Wilcox" To: Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:59 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > There is no shame in an outsider getting the most finds for a month in AZ. > Look at it as a complement to the area. > If I where there now, I would have 117 new cache to find within 25 miles of > where I lived. For someone that hasn't been there before they would have 275 > to choose from. It is easy to see how someone can run up big numbers in a > hurry. > > But I must congratulate Team Sprocket for finding 162 after having already > 200 finds. This feat is quite a bit harder. I know it gets much harder to > find available caches close by after awhile and you must travel further, > hike longer, and climb more peaks just to satisfy the caching urge. > > Team Sand Dollar > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Sparks" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:07 AM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > I don't know how many of you (if any) noticed that last month (March) an > > 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and swiftly blew > > away the record for the most Arizona Caches Found in One Month. At the > > time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, '"Sure, if we didn't > > already have so many finds, we could do that." We, of Team Sprocket, > > were apalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an Arizona > > record. :-[ In an effort to disperse the dark cloud of shame that > > hovered over all Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that > > revoltin' development. No need to thank us. :-D It's our pleasure to > > represent the Arizona Geocaching community. Now, who's up for spending > > next month in Illinois, picking up a couple hundred caches? ;-) > > > > -- Team Sprocket > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 05:04:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 22:04:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Happy Anniversary Message-ID: <002501c30f9f$17f0ce60$6401a8c0@DESKTOP> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C30F64.6B91F660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I just recalled that May 1st is the third anniversary of President Clinton's executive order removing Selective Availability from the Global Positioning System. That would make this Saturday the third anniversary of the first Geocache hide. Who could have foreseen.? HAPPY ANNIVERSARY, GEOCACHING! Steve Team Tierra Buena "Those who cannot learn from History are condemned to switch to Business Administration." ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C30F64.6B91F660 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I just recalled that May 1st is the = third anniversary of President Clinton’s executive order removing = Selective Availability from the Global Positioning System. That would make this = Saturday the third anniversary of the first Geocache hide. Who could have = foreseen…?

 

HAPPY ANNIVERSARY, = GEOCACHING!

 

Steve

Team Tierra = Buena

 

“Those who cannot learn from = History are condemned to switch to Business = Administration.”

------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C30F64.6B91F660-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 15:07:09 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:07:09 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <3EAF7621.4060206@mchsi.com> <006101c30f74$852010c0$0500a8c0@one> Message-ID: <002701c30ff3$574030c0$7efc3841@fishkiller> actually could YOU find those in a Day??? I would support the effort to raise the plane fair for ya :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Loran Wilcox" To: Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:59 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > There is no shame in an outsider getting the most finds for a month in AZ. > Look at it as a complement to the area. > If I where there now, I would have 117 new cache to find within 25 miles of > where I lived. For someone that hasn't been there before they would have 275 > to choose from. It is easy to see how someone can run up big numbers in a > hurry. > > But I must congratulate Team Sprocket for finding 162 after having already > 200 finds. This feat is quite a bit harder. I know it gets much harder to > find available caches close by after awhile and you must travel further, > hike longer, and climb more peaks just to satisfy the caching urge. > > Team Sand Dollar > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Sparks" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:07 AM > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > I don't know how many of you (if any) noticed that last month (March) an > > 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and swiftly blew > > away the record for the most Arizona Caches Found in One Month. At the > > time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, '"Sure, if we didn't > > already have so many finds, we could do that." We, of Team Sprocket, > > were apalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an Arizona > > record. :-[ In an effort to disperse the dark cloud of shame that > > hovered over all Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that > > revoltin' development. No need to thank us. :-D It's our pleasure to > > represent the Arizona Geocaching community. Now, who's up for spending > > next month in Illinois, picking up a couple hundred caches? ;-) > > > > -- Team Sprocket > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 15:35:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:35:05 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In-Reply-To: <002701c30ff3$574030c0$7efc3841@fishkiller> References: <3EAF7621.4060206@mchsi.com> <006101c30f74$852010c0$0500a8c0@one> <002701c30ff3$574030c0$7efc3841@fishkiller> Message-ID: <2633.172.30.1.10.1051803305.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> In an effort to congratulate myself, and to somehow get on the first 25 page, I have now completed my first 100 caches (in four months). That means, that if you select the top cachers since 1/1/03 to present, I am number 24. That is right in from of Wyle E, somehow (both at 100). How, I don't know. There has to be a software design flaw somewhere. I have no idea how you all devote the time to getting those huge numbers, though! But, it has been a blast for me to get this far. But, what I did find interesting is the following statistics: Cacheless has 269 in that time frame, with a total of 302, and that since the beginning of December 2002. What a workout! But, even more amazing to me (with all the hew and cries of "nothing left close", azsaluki has 232 in that same amount of time. With a grant total of 675. Now mind you, they have been at it since mid 2001. But, the effort involved to get those kind of numbers is quite enormous! Steven Stringham StringCachers > From: "Loran Wilcox" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:59 PM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > >> There is no shame in an outsider getting the most finds for a month in >> AZ. Look at it as a complement to the area. >> If I where there now, I would have 117 new cache to find within 25 >> miles > of >> where I lived. For someone that hasn't been there before they would >> have > 275 >> to choose from. It is easy to see how someone can run up big numbers >> in a hurry. >> >> But I must congratulate Team Sprocket for finding 162 after having >> already 200 finds. This feat is quite a bit harder. I know it gets >> much harder to find available caches close by after awhile and you >> must travel further, hike longer, and climb more peaks just to satisfy >> the caching urge. >> >> Team Sand Dollar >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Scott Sparks" >> To: >> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:07 AM >> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame >> >> >> > I don't know how many of you (if any) noticed that last month >> (March) an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and >> swiftly blew away the record for the most Arizona Caches Found in >> One Month. At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others >> like, '"Sure, if we didn't already have so many finds, we could do >> that." We, of Team Sprocket, were apalled that a cacher from out of >> state should hold an Arizona record. :-[ In an effort to disperse >> the dark cloud of shame that hovered over all Arizona cachers, we >> have consequently rectified that revoltin' development. No need to >> thank us. :-D It's our pleasure to represent the Arizona Geocaching >> community. Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, >> picking up a couple hundred caches? ;-) >> > >> > -- Team Sprocket >> > >> > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 15:58:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 08:58:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] (no subject) Message-ID: <20030501155834.71776.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1123069608-1051804714=:71728 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I checked the first stage of "Fortune Cookie" today and there is no problem with the first stage. No evidence of construction activity at this time. Note to CacheUsOut: Please go out and find both stages. If you need additional information, please contact me. Cache is now a regular cache (not Members Only). I have also restored Angels Spring Training World Championship Edition to encourage a few more visits here - it has a travel bug in it that needs to get moving again. If you would like to help the travel bug move, please visit this cache again to get the travel bug, even if you have visited the cache before. (I have another baseball-player themed travel bug that I want to release in this cache after I get the travel bug that is currently in there out to another cache). Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) --0-1123069608-1051804714=:71728 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
I checked the first stage of "Fortune Cookie" today and there is no problem with the first stage.  No evidence of construction activity at this time.  Note to CacheUsOut:  Please go out and find both stages.  If you need additional information, please contact me.
 
Cache is now a regular cache (not Members Only).  I have also restored Angels Spring Training World Championship Edition to encourage a few more visits here - it has a travel bug in it that needs to get moving again.  If you would like to help the travel bug move, please visit this cache again to get the travel bug, even if you have visited the cache before.  (I have another baseball-player themed travel bug that I want to release in this cache after I get the travel bug that is currently in there out to another cache).
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)
--0-1123069608-1051804714=:71728-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 16:04:03 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 09:04:03 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <20030430234941.TKUX1868.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> References: <20030430234941.TKUX1868.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Message-ID: <3EB14573.9@Snaptek.com> Well for a little bit, our lone mountain cache was looking like it might require snake handling equiptment. There were a bunch of posts stateing that a rattle snake had taken up residence next to the cache. I think I would take a few bee stinks any day over a rattle snake bite :) Brian Cluff Team Snaptek bcasteel@cox.net wrote: >Ok, Brian and Jason are officially sadistic. :) > >Bee suit or epinephrine as cache tool requirements for finding a cache...that's about as bad as some of the contents in [url=http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=2016058331&m=39960741&r=13360961#13360961]this[/url] thread. Specifically, the post/picture by Criminal. :) > >____________________________________________________________ >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource >http://www.azgeocaching.com > > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 17:58:05 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 10:58:05 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] (no subject) References: <20030430234941.TKUX1868.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> <3EB14573.9@Snaptek.com> Message-ID: <005101c3100b$378edca0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> ARIZONA WILDLIFE STAGES GEOCACHING PROTESTS Radical animals retake their territory FILM AT 1O:OO > Well for a little bit, our lone mountain cache was looking like it might > require snake handling equiptment. There were a bunch of posts stateing > that a rattle snake had taken up residence next to the cache. I think I > would take a few bee stinks any day over a rattle snake bite :) > > Brian Cluff > Team Snaptek > > bcasteel@cox.net wrote: > > >Ok, Brian and Jason are officially sadistic. :) > > > >Bee suit or epinephrine as cache tool requirements for finding a cache...that's about as bad as some of the contents in [url=http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=2016058331&m=3 9960741&r=13360961#13360961]this[/url] thread. Specifically, the post/picture by Criminal. :) > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource > >http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 18:43:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Regan Smith) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 11:43:27 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] (no subject) References: <20030430234941.TKUX1868.fed1mtao05.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> <3EB14573.9@Snaptek.com> <005101c3100b$378edca0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> Message-ID: <001201c31011$9405c380$9e803a41@fishkiller> here is an actual log from actual client on 2 of the animals/insects/reptiles names have been changed to protect the animals... This cache contained more sounds than I really wanted to hear and see today... After the first unsuccessful attempt at this cache called XXX as YYYYYYYY was the last finder of this cache and found that we were looking to far West... Fast Forward to a few weeks later.... Today as I was walking back to the Cache area was looking at the sky and flowers, and since I had previous experience with stopping and going in reverse when spotting a young rattle snake(about 3 feet long), was able to give the stretched out snake a wide track, I then continued to the cache area with eyes glued to the ground, as I approached this nice little indentation I then realized the unique sound of bees swarming, made a real stealthy sign and quick replace then made my way away from this cache... I would say thanks for the challenge of the hunt but I am very happy that this cache is off my radar :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Nelson" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 10:58 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] (no subject) > > > > ARIZONA WILDLIFE STAGES GEOCACHING PROTESTS > Radical animals retake their territory > > FILM AT 1O:OO > > > > > Well for a little bit, our lone mountain cache was looking like it might > > require snake handling equiptment. There were a bunch of posts stateing > > that a rattle snake had taken up residence next to the cache. I think I > > would take a few bee stinks any day over a rattle snake bite :) > > > > Brian Cluff > > Team Snaptek > > > > bcasteel@cox.net wrote: > > > > >Ok, Brian and Jason are officially sadistic. :) > > > > > >Bee suit or epinephrine as cache tool requirements for finding a > cache...that's about as bad as some of the contents in > [url=http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=2016058331&m=3 > 9960741&r=13360961#13360961]this[/url] thread. Specifically, the > post/picture by Criminal. :) > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > > >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > >http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 19:30:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 12:30:39 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In-Reply-To: <2633.172.30.1.10.1051803305.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <002901c31018$262b5760$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Steven, Thanks for noticing. Yes, I'm obsessed. If life weren't so full, I'd have a lot more. Geocaching also helps keep me in shape for backpacking. I have to agree with you. I've also noticed the run azsaluki has been making. I'm always impressed when a team with so many finds can continue to find at such a fast pace. And whether or not anyone is into the into the competitive aspect of the numbers, they are a quick way to track the adventures of many teams. And, of course, congratulations on your 100th find. Bill Tomlinson CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Steven Stringham Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 8:35 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In an effort to congratulate myself, and to somehow get on the first 25 page, I have now completed my first 100 caches (in four months). That means, that if you select the top cachers since 1/1/03 to present, I am number 24. That is right in from of Wyle E, somehow (both at 100). How, I don't know. There has to be a software design flaw somewhere. I have no idea how you all devote the time to getting those huge numbers, though! But, it has been a blast for me to get this far. But, what I did find interesting is the following statistics: Cacheless has 269 in that time frame, with a total of 302, and that since the beginning of December 2002. What a workout! But, even more amazing to me (with all the hew and cries of "nothing left close", azsaluki has 232 in that same amount of time. With a grant total of 675. Now mind you, they have been at it since mid 2001. But, the effort involved to get those kind of numbers is quite enormous! Steven Stringham StringCachers From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 19:48:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 12:48:10 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <002901c31018$262b5760$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <009601c3101a$99139f60$9e803a41@fishkiller> EAT SLEEP CACHE the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always PS are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:30 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > Steven, > > Thanks for noticing. Yes, I'm obsessed. If life weren't so full, I'd have > a lot more. Geocaching also helps keep me in shape for backpacking. > > I have to agree with you. I've also noticed the run azsaluki has been > making. I'm always impressed when a team with so many finds can continue to > find at such a fast pace. And whether or not anyone is into the into the > competitive aspect of the numbers, they are a quick way to track the > adventures of many teams. > > And, of course, congratulations on your 100th find. > > Bill Tomlinson > CacheLess > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Steven > Stringham > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 8:35 AM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > In an effort to congratulate myself, and to somehow get on the first 25 > page, I have now completed my first 100 caches (in four months). That means, > that if you select the top cachers since 1/1/03 to present, I am number 24. > That is right in from of Wyle E, somehow (both at 100). How, I don't know. > There has to be a software design flaw somewhere. I have no idea how you all > devote the time to getting those huge numbers, though! But, it has been a > blast for me to get this far. > > But, what I did find interesting is the following statistics: > > Cacheless has 269 in that time frame, with a total of 302, and that since > the beginning of December 2002. What a workout! > > But, even more amazing to me (with all the hew and cries of "nothing left > close", azsaluki has 232 in that same amount of time. With a grant total of > 675. Now mind you, they have been at it since mid 2001. But, the effort > involved to get those kind of numbers is quite enormous! > > Steven Stringham > StringCachers > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 20:18:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 13:18:41 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In-Reply-To: <009601c3101a$99139f60$9e803a41@fishkiller> Message-ID: <002a01c3101e$dc0b0980$6701a8c0@qwest.net> I love that motto! Yes, family is first and sleep is optional. I just wish I could find a way to make work optional. ;-) No big runs in the near future. Just a few here and there. Too busy with Boy Scouts. Your lead should be safe, perhaps even through the Summer. -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Team Evil Fish Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:48 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame EAT SLEEP CACHE the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always PS are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 20:37:03 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 13:37:03 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Happy Anniversary In-Reply-To: <002501c30f9f$17f0ce60$6401a8c0@DESKTOP> References: <002501c30f9f$17f0ce60$6401a8c0@DESKTOP> Message-ID: <3EB1856F.8010005@snaptek.com> YA!!!!! 3 years of geocaching!!! jason Team Tierra Buena wrote: > I just recalled that May 1st is the third anniversary of President > Clinton’s executive order removing Selective Availability from the > Global Positioning System. That would make this Saturday the third > anniversary of the first Geocache hide. Who could have foreseen…? > > > > HAPPY ANNIVERSARY, GEOCACHING! > > > > Steve > > Team Tierra Buena > > > > “Those who cannot learn from History are condemned to switch to Business > Administration.” > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 22:11:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 15:11:10 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Bees Message-ID: <3EB19B7E.2010101@mchsi.com> --------------000706060305070108090304 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was surprised to hear about the bees at the Why? cache. We were there just days before and didn't see or hear any bees. Lucky for me, as bees tend to find me whether I'm looking for them or not. :-\ Check out my log for Billsville (GCDB28) on April 5th. Or, if you happen to run into AJ.JR while out geocaching sometime, ask him about a certain bee-utiful hiking trip to Reavis Ranch some 15 to 20 years ago. :-[ I'll bet he can't tell you about it with a straight face. -- Sprocket P.S. He might also relate to you a story of an ass-tounding rattlesnake at nearby Mound Mountain. --------------000706060305070108090304 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was surprised to hear about the bees at the Why? cache.  We were there just days before and didn't see or hear any bees.   Lucky for me, as bees tend to find me whether I'm looking for them or not.  :-\  Check out my log for Billsville (GCDB28) on April 5th.  Or, if you happen to run into AJ.JR while out geocaching sometime, ask him about a certain bee-utiful hiking trip to Reavis Ranch some 15 to 20 years ago.  :-[ I'll bet he can't tell you about it with a straight face.

-- Sprocket

P.S.  He might also relate to you a story of an ass-tounding  rattlesnake at nearby Mound Mountain.
--------------000706060305070108090304-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Thu May 1 22:47:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter) Date: Thu, 01 May 2003 15:47:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] New cacher and another reason to use GPS In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3EB1A3EA.4010801@snaptek.com> sounds like a great way to use a gps!!! jason Jim Scotti wrote: > Photography and GPS are a wonderful combination. There's a not very > active Yahoo!Group called Geographing which combines the two that might be > worth checking out. I think some careful notetaking on when your photos were > taken that includes the GPS measured coordinates and a direction is a great > idea and one that is even easier with a digital camera. If you keep your > digital camera's clock reasonably accurate, you can do a lot of back checking > using your tracklog for most of your photos - and you don't have to think > about it too much, just to leave your GPS on and tracking while your are > exploring and photographing. Along with a couple of waypoints for special > photos and calibration, you should be able to reconstruct the location of > almost all your images, at least while the GPS is on and tracking satellites. > I've done that with one hike, but haven't gone much farther with it - yet. > As for what GPS, well, almost any will do. I like my Garmin Legend whose > maps really help in a lot of circumstances (using MapSource Roads and Rec > and/or Topo is my prefered). It's recent firmware upgrade that expanded the > number of waypoints and trackpoints really makes it wonderful to be able to > use both for keeping track of where your photos were taken (not to mention > for geocaching). Its compass, however, depends on recent motion of the > reciever, so a reciever with a built in compass might be preferable if she > wants to include direction of photo a little more reliably. > The biggest problem I've had in combining GPS and camera is just good old > organization and record keeping. I'm still trying to find the best way of > organizing my digital pictures (the old notebook with slides or > transperancies worked pretty well, but with smaller numbers of images, it > wasn't hard to keep track of the images I wanted - I need some sort of > database scheme to keep track of my digital images.... Including more > information like location, time, direction, and other notes in such a > database should not be too hard to do. > > Jim. > > On Wed, 30 Apr 2003, gale and mike wrote: > > >>A friend of mine sent me an e-mail recently. A coworker of his is a >>photography buff. She is interested in getting her own GPS to use with >>her photography. She does a lot of landscapes and nature photography and >>wants to be able to find places again. Is anyone out there a photographer >>and use their GPS like that? Any recommendations on what GPS she should >>get? > > > Jim Scotti > Lunar & Planetary Laboratory > University of Arizona > Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:12:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 00:12:07 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame Message-ID: <20030502001239.765FB24A802@sequoia.net> Okay, that's enough! Let's get a few facts on the table. > an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and > swiftly blew away the record and > We ... were appalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an > Arizona record. Jeez guys ... 1) I lived in Arizona from mid 1993 until 2000. 2) I left both my kids behind to live in Arizona ... yep, they have spouses, jobs and homes, so probably won't be leaving anytime soon. 3) With the kids there, do you honestly think my wife will let me retire anyplace else but Arizona? And, don't even start with the whining about snowbird status. So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue against the derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now consider Loren from Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept the title, but if not, don't throw me out because I had to move to the Midwest right before the sport was invented. > At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, "Sure if we > didn't already have so many finds, we could do that." Well, just ignore "Team Roping the Wind" ... honest, he'll quiet down after awhile. > Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, picking up a couple > hundred caches? ;-) I just put out nine new ones ... will that help? Actually, Chicago has some of the best cache hunting around ... if you don't mind the dripping humidity, mucky swamps and mosquitoes the size of roadrunners. Phoenix micros are great, but finding a pill bottle in the middle of a hot, humid, tick and mosquito infested forest preserve adds new meaning to frustration. By the way, a hunting trip to Chicago is about a three hundred mile round trip … humm, you can fly there in the same time it takes me to drive. > Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that revoltin' development. What, you took all month to move the bar up a couple of caches? You must remember that I only took two weeks (14 days … not a single day more) to find 160 caches. Yes, that’s 160 caches. I know the stats only show 159, but Highpointer was obviously so mad he changed every cache I found into a members only cache just to reduce the count ... and I'm a dues paying member to boot. Shame on you Ken!!! So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two weeks, not a whole month. And, no more fluffing up your count with just those 1/1 caches either ... one cache hunt has to be "Return to Sender" ... and at least a sprinkling of five star difficulty caches. Oh, and don’t forget … you probably should find all of the caches in the South Mountain Range … just to make it fair. Okay, so now I've vented ... I'll go back to lurking. With tongue in cheek, Jeepster (Tom Clark) Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and the 55 finds in a single day. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:30:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran Wilcox) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 20:30:53 -0400 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <20030502001239.765FB24A802@sequoia.net> Message-ID: <003701c31042$17991460$0500a8c0@one> Actually I think they do consider me an outsider. But then I looking at the bright side. When I do finally get back to AZ I will have a lot of new caches to find. Team Sand Dollar ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 8:12 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > Okay, that's enough! Let's get a few facts on the table. > > > an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and > > swiftly blew away the record > > and > > > We ... were appalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an > > Arizona record. > > Jeez guys ... > > 1) I lived in Arizona from mid 1993 until 2000. > > 2) I left both my kids behind to live in Arizona ... yep, they have spouses, > jobs and homes, so probably won't be leaving anytime soon. > > 3) With the kids there, do you honestly think my wife will let me retire > anyplace else but Arizona? And, don't even start with the whining about > snowbird status. > > So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue against the > derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now consider Loren from > Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept the title, but if not, don't > throw me out because I had to move to the Midwest right before the sport was > invented. > > > At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, "Sure if we > > didn't already have so many finds, we could do that." > > Well, just ignore "Team Roping the Wind" ... honest, he'll quiet down after > awhile. > > > Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, picking up a couple > > hundred caches? ;-) > > I just put out nine new ones ... will that help? Actually, Chicago has some of > the best cache hunting around ... if you don't mind the dripping humidity, > mucky swamps and mosquitoes the size of roadrunners. Phoenix micros are great, > but finding a pill bottle in the middle of a hot, humid, tick and mosquito > infested forest preserve adds new meaning to frustration. By the way, a > hunting trip to Chicago is about a three hundred mile round trip . humm, you > can fly there in the same time it takes me to drive. > > > Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that revoltin' development. > > What, you took all month to move the bar up a couple of caches? You must > remember that I only took two weeks (14 days . not a single day more) to find > 160 caches. Yes, that's 160 caches. I know the stats only show 159, but > Highpointer was obviously so mad he changed every cache I found into a members > only cache just to reduce the count ... and I'm a dues paying member to boot. > Shame on you Ken!!! So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two > weeks, not a whole month. And, no more fluffing up your count with just those > 1/1 caches either ... one cache hunt has to be "Return to Sender" ... and at > least a sprinkling of five star difficulty caches. Oh, and don't forget . you > probably should find all of the caches in the South Mountain Range . just to > make it fair. > > Okay, so now I've vented ... I'll go back to lurking. > > With tongue in cheek, > Jeepster (Tom Clark) > > Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and the 55 > finds in a single day. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:33:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran Wilcox) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 20:33:06 -0400 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <3EAF7621.4060206@mchsi.com> <006101c30f74$852010c0$0500a8c0@one> <002701c30ff3$574030c0$7efc3841@fishkiller> Message-ID: <004101c31042$66114680$0500a8c0@one> Wouldn't even try. But I would have a lot of 14 find days to enjoy with plenty of nice long walks. Team Sand Dollar ----- Original Message ----- From: "Regan Smith" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 11:07 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > actually could YOU find those in a Day??? I would support the effort to > raise the plane fair for ya :) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Loran Wilcox" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:59 PM > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > There is no shame in an outsider getting the most finds for a month in AZ. > > Look at it as a complement to the area. > > If I where there now, I would have 117 new cache to find within 25 miles > of > > where I lived. For someone that hasn't been there before they would have > 275 > > to choose from. It is easy to see how someone can run up big numbers in a > > hurry. > > > > But I must congratulate Team Sprocket for finding 162 after having already > > 200 finds. This feat is quite a bit harder. I know it gets much harder to > > find available caches close by after awhile and you must travel further, > > hike longer, and climb more peaks just to satisfy the caching urge. > > > > Team Sand Dollar > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott Sparks" > > To: > > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:07 AM > > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > > > > I don't know how many of you (if any) noticed that last month (March) an > > > 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and swiftly blew > > > away the record for the most Arizona Caches Found in One Month. At the > > > time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, '"Sure, if we didn't > > > already have so many finds, we could do that." We, of Team Sprocket, > > > were apalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an Arizona > > > record. :-[ In an effort to disperse the dark cloud of shame that > > > hovered over all Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that > > > revoltin' development. No need to thank us. :-D It's our pleasure to > > > represent the Arizona Geocaching community. Now, who's up for spending > > > next month in Illinois, picking up a couple hundred caches? ;-) > > > > > > -- Team Sprocket > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:46:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran Wilcox) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 20:46:19 -0400 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <3EAF7621.4060206@mchsi.com> <006101c30f74$852010c0$0500a8c0@one> <002701c30ff3$574030c0$7efc3841@fishkiller> <2633.172.30.1.10.1051803305.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org> Message-ID: <004701c31044$3ed6f040$0500a8c0@one> But you forgot to divide your number of finds but the total number available. Lets see You have found about 10 percent of the available caches within 100 miles of where you live. Whereas Wyle E. has probably found somewhere in the range of 50 percent or more. When the selection is greater It is easier to post higher numbers. Team Sand Dollar ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Stringham" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 11:35 AM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > In an effort to congratulate myself, and to somehow get on the first 25 > page, I have now completed my first 100 caches (in four months). That > means, that if you select the top cachers since 1/1/03 to present, I am > number 24. That is right in from of Wyle E, somehow (both at 100). How, I > don't know. There has to be a software design flaw somewhere. I have no > idea how you all devote the time to getting those huge numbers, though! > But, it has been a blast for me to get this far. > > But, what I did find interesting is the following statistics: > > Cacheless has 269 in that time frame, with a total of 302, and that since > the beginning of December 2002. What a workout! > > But, even more amazing to me (with all the hew and cries of "nothing left > close", azsaluki has 232 in that same amount of time. With a grant total > of 675. Now mind you, they have been at it since mid 2001. But, the effort > involved to get those kind of numbers is quite enormous! > > Steven Stringham > StringCachers > > > From: "Loran Wilcox" > > To: > > Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 4:59 PM > > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > > >> There is no shame in an outsider getting the most finds for a month in > >> AZ. Look at it as a complement to the area. > >> If I where there now, I would have 117 new cache to find within 25 > >> miles > > of > >> where I lived. For someone that hasn't been there before they would > >> have > > 275 > >> to choose from. It is easy to see how someone can run up big numbers > >> in a hurry. > >> > >> But I must congratulate Team Sprocket for finding 162 after having > >> already 200 finds. This feat is quite a bit harder. I know it gets > >> much harder to find available caches close by after awhile and you > >> must travel further, hike longer, and climb more peaks just to satisfy > >> the caching urge. > >> > >> Team Sand Dollar > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Scott Sparks" > >> To: > >> Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 3:07 AM > >> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > >> > >> > >> > I don't know how many of you (if any) noticed that last month > >> (March) an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and > >> swiftly blew away the record for the most Arizona Caches Found in > >> One Month. At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others > >> like, '"Sure, if we didn't already have so many finds, we could do > >> that." We, of Team Sprocket, were apalled that a cacher from out of > >> state should hold an Arizona record. :-[ In an effort to disperse > >> the dark cloud of shame that hovered over all Arizona cachers, we > >> have consequently rectified that revoltin' development. No need to > >> thank us. :-D It's our pleasure to represent the Arizona Geocaching > >> community. Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, > >> picking up a couple hundred caches? ;-) > >> > > >> > -- Team Sprocket > >> > > >> > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:49:52 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran Wilcox) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 20:49:52 -0400 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <002a01c3101e$dc0b0980$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <007101c31044$bde61960$0500a8c0@one> That work optional thing doesn't work. It usually comes in the form of a layoff. Yea you have plenty of time for caching but the family still wants to eat. And when you finally do find a job it's in the frozen (thawing) north. Team Sand Dollar lost in MI ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 4:18 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > I love that motto! Yes, family is first and sleep is optional. I just wish > I could find a way to make work optional. ;-) > > No big runs in the near future. Just a few here and there. Too busy with > Boy Scouts. Your lead should be safe, perhaps even through the Summer. > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Team > Evil Fish > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:48 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > EAT SLEEP CACHE > > the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always > > PS > > are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 00:59:50 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 00:59:50 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame Message-ID:

Jeepster next time you're out here, maybe we can have you and Sprocket race to see who can get a predetermined list of caches. That's the only fair way to see who's the fastest team. The last cache could be an event cache. Are you up for a challenge Sprocket, Jeepster?




>From: thejeepster@att.net
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame
>Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 00:12:07 +0000
>
>Okay, that's enough! Let's get a few facts on the table.
>
> > an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and
> > swiftly blew away the record
>
>and
>
> > We ... were appalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an
> > Arizona record.
>
>Jeez guys ...
>
>1) I lived in Arizona from mid 1993 until 2000.
>
>2) I left both my kids behind to live in Arizona ... yep, they have spouses,
>jobs and homes, so probably won't be leaving anytime soon.
>
>3) With the kids there, do you honestly think my wife will let me retire
>anyplace else but Arizona? And, don't even start with the whining about
>snowbird status.
>
>So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue against the
>derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now consider Loren from
>Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept the title, but if not, don't
>throw me out because I had to move to the Midwest right before the sport was
>invented.
>
> > At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, "Sure if we
> > didn't already have so many finds, we could do that."
>
>Well, just ignore "Team Roping the Wind" ... honest, he'll quiet down after
>awhile.
>
> > Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, picking up a couple
> > hundred caches? ;-)
>
>I just put out nine new ones ... will that help? Actually, Chicago has some of
>the best cache hunting around ... if you don't mind the dripping humidity,
>mucky swamps and mosquitoes the size of roadrunners. Phoenix micros are great,
>but finding a pill bottle in the middle of a hot, humid, tick and mosquito
>infested forest preserve adds new meaning to frustration. By the way, a
>hunting trip to Chicago is about a three hundred mile round trip … humm, you
>can fly there in the same time it takes me to drive.
>
> > Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that revoltin' development.
>
>What, you took all month to move the bar up a couple of caches? You must
>remember that I only took two weeks (14 days … not a single day more) to find
>160 caches. Yes, that’s 160 caches. I know the stats only show 159, but
>Highpointer was obviously so mad he changed every cache I found into a members
>only cache just to reduce the count ... and I'm a dues paying member to boot.
>Shame on you Ken!!! So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two
>weeks, not a whole month. And, no more fluffing up your count with just those
>1/1 caches either ... one cache hunt has to be "Return to Sender" ... and at
>least a sprinkling of five star difficulty caches. Oh, and don’t forget … you
>probably should find all of the caches in the South Mountain Range … just to
>make it fair.
>
>Okay, so now I've vented ... I'll go back to lurking.
>
>With tongue in cheek,
>Jeepster (Tom Clark)
>
>Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and the 55
>finds in a single day.
>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 02:19:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 02:19:33 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame Message-ID: <20030502021950.B121A24A802@sequoia.net> > Jeepster next time you're out here, maybe we can have you > and Sprocket race to see who can get a predetermined list > of caches. That's the only fair way to see who's the fastest > team. The last cache could be an event cache. Are you up for > a challenge Sprocket, Jeepster? I'll take your suggestion as a compliment. But, the racing I'll leave to the young. I'm more of the draft horse type ... slow and plodding. Tell Scott to stop his giggling, I meant I'm slow and plodding physically not mentally. My top find in a single day is 24 (and not in Arizona ... in Michigan where Team Sand Dollar is shivering away). That kind of a single day high hardly compares to what is being accomplished in Phoenix. Cheers, Jeepster (Tom Clark) From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 04:07:37 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 21:07:37 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In-Reply-To: <007101c31044$bde61960$0500a8c0@one> Message-ID: <003501c31060$5e1b2d10$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Yep, I suppose I should have been more specific. I was hoping for enough money to not need to work. Besides, being Illinois/Wisconsin natives, my family would be happy to move back to the upper Midwest, at least for a while. That's beautiful country in the Spring and Fall! CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Loran Wilcox Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 5:50 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame That work optional thing doesn't work. It usually comes in the form of a layoff. Yea you have plenty of time for caching but the family still wants to eat. And when you finally do find a job it's in the frozen (thawing) north. Team Sand Dollar lost in MI ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 4:18 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > I love that motto! Yes, family is first and sleep is optional. I > just wish > I could find a way to make work optional. ;-) > > No big runs in the near future. Just a few here and there. Too busy > with Boy Scouts. Your lead should be safe, perhaps even through the > Summer. > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of > Team Evil Fish > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:48 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > EAT SLEEP CACHE > > the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always > > PS > > are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 04:16:39 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 21:16:39 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame In-Reply-To: <20030502001239.765FB24A802@sequoia.net> Message-ID: <003601c31061$a1561030$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Hey Jeepster, I didn't know you were still lurking around here. I never had a chance before you left to tell you how pissed I was when you screwed up the record month I was having. My life will never be the same. I might as well just quit caching altogether. ;-) Seriously, though, that was very impressive. Especially from a fellow flat-lander. I was born and raised in Rockford before moving to Phoenix 10 years ago. Most of my family's still there. Perhaps we'll run into each other at your end or mine some day. Cheers, Bill Tomlinson CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of thejeepster@att.net Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 5:12 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame Okay, that's enough! Let's get a few facts on the table. > an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and swiftly > blew away the record and > We ... were appalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an > Arizona record. Jeez guys ... 1) I lived in Arizona from mid 1993 until 2000. 2) I left both my kids behind to live in Arizona ... yep, they have spouses, jobs and homes, so probably won't be leaving anytime soon. 3) With the kids there, do you honestly think my wife will let me retire anyplace else but Arizona? And, don't even start with the whining about snowbird status. So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue against the derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now consider Loren from Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept the title, but if not, don't throw me out because I had to move to the Midwest right before the sport was invented. > At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, "Sure if we > didn't already have so many finds, we could do that." Well, just ignore "Team Roping the Wind" ... honest, he'll quiet down after awhile. > Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, picking up a couple > hundred caches? ;-) I just put out nine new ones ... will that help? Actually, Chicago has some of the best cache hunting around ... if you don't mind the dripping humidity, mucky swamps and mosquitoes the size of roadrunners. Phoenix micros are great, but finding a pill bottle in the middle of a hot, humid, tick and mosquito infested forest preserve adds new meaning to frustration. By the way, a hunting trip to Chicago is about a three hundred mile round trip . humm, you can fly there in the same time it takes me to drive. > Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that revoltin' > development. What, you took all month to move the bar up a couple of caches? You must remember that I only took two weeks (14 days . not a single day more) to find 160 caches. Yes, that's 160 caches. I know the stats only show 159, but Highpointer was obviously so mad he changed every cache I found into a members only cache just to reduce the count ... and I'm a dues paying member to boot. Shame on you Ken!!! So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two weeks, not a whole month. And, no more fluffing up your count with just those 1/1 caches either ... one cache hunt has to be "Return to Sender" ... and at least a sprinkling of five star difficulty caches. Oh, and don't forget . you probably should find all of the caches in the South Mountain Range . just to make it fair. Okay, so now I've vented ... I'll go back to lurking. With tongue in cheek, Jeepster (Tom Clark) Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and the 55 finds in a single day. ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 06:47:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 06:47:10 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame Message-ID:



Jeepster wrote
" I'll take your suggestion as a compliment. "

 

It was meant as  one. It would have been fun to see the two of you race. And of course any excuse for a party afterwards.


Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 07:25:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (T. Hernlund) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 00:25:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting Message-ID: I was recently asked by Offtrail why I chose the nym General Ursus. Because of that query and a thread I read (posted below), it got me thinking and on a whim I decided to vanity search for it. Turns out another individual used it for a time. Even though I've had it longer I've decided to just nym-shift as it was a little muddied. I'll now be General Bracket. I posted an explanation of the nym in this thread... http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=82360914&r=18960645#18960645 Anyone who's been around Usenet for awhile knows that nym-shifting without sending out a public notice is bad form, hence my notice. :-) Have fun! -T. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 14:00:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 07:00:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <002a01c3101e$dc0b0980$6701a8c0@qwest.net> <007101c31044$bde61960$0500a8c0@one> Message-ID: <001701c310b3$465d0ec0$738c9a40@fishkiller> Yeah the Family is in front of everything ----- Original Message ----- From: "Loran Wilcox" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 5:49 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > That work optional thing doesn't work. It usually comes in the form of a > layoff. > > Yea you have plenty of time for caching but the family still wants to eat. > And when you finally do find a job it's in the frozen (thawing) north. > > Team Sand Dollar lost in MI > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Tomlinson" > To: > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 4:18 PM > Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > I love that motto! Yes, family is first and sleep is optional. I just > wish > > I could find a way to make work optional. ;-) > > > > No big runs in the near future. Just a few here and there. Too busy with > > Boy Scouts. Your lead should be safe, perhaps even through the Summer. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Team > > Evil Fish > > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:48 PM > > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > > > > EAT SLEEP CACHE > > > > the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always > > > > PS > > > > are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 14:05:00 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 07:05:00 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <20030502001239.765FB24A802@sequoia.net> Message-ID: <001801c310b3$d32ae520$738c9a40@fishkiller> HI Jeepster Please don't hold the rest of us in a need to vent condition as I personally Think YOU Rate right up with Steve from Terra Buenna Is it only 10 months until your return? I will have the Wet and Dry caches available for you by then I gave up on the Jack-a-lope idea but not the name :) BTW I got more of those dimes :) for the rest of you it is a long inside story.. Happy Hunting ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 5:12 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > Okay, that's enough! Let's get a few facts on the table. > > > an 'out-of-towner' breezed into the Phoenix metro area and > > swiftly blew away the record > > and > > > We ... were appalled that a cacher from out of state should hold an > > Arizona record. > > Jeez guys ... > > 1) I lived in Arizona from mid 1993 until 2000. > > 2) I left both my kids behind to live in Arizona ... yep, they have spouses, > jobs and homes, so probably won't be leaving anytime soon. > > 3) With the kids there, do you honestly think my wife will let me retire > anyplace else but Arizona? And, don't even start with the whining about > snowbird status. > > So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue against the > derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now consider Loren from > Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept the title, but if not, don't > throw me out because I had to move to the Midwest right before the sport was > invented. > > > At the time, we heard a lot of grumbling from others like, "Sure if we > > didn't already have so many finds, we could do that." > > Well, just ignore "Team Roping the Wind" ... honest, he'll quiet down after > awhile. > > > Now, who's up for spending next month in Illinois, picking up a couple > > hundred caches? ;-) > > I just put out nine new ones ... will that help? Actually, Chicago has some of > the best cache hunting around ... if you don't mind the dripping humidity, > mucky swamps and mosquitoes the size of roadrunners. Phoenix micros are great, > but finding a pill bottle in the middle of a hot, humid, tick and mosquito > infested forest preserve adds new meaning to frustration. By the way, a > hunting trip to Chicago is about a three hundred mile round trip . humm, you > can fly there in the same time it takes me to drive. > > > Arizona cachers, we have consequently rectified that revoltin' development. > > What, you took all month to move the bar up a couple of caches? You must > remember that I only took two weeks (14 days . not a single day more) to find > 160 caches. Yes, that's 160 caches. I know the stats only show 159, but > Highpointer was obviously so mad he changed every cache I found into a members > only cache just to reduce the count ... and I'm a dues paying member to boot. > Shame on you Ken!!! So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two > weeks, not a whole month. And, no more fluffing up your count with just those > 1/1 caches either ... one cache hunt has to be "Return to Sender" ... and at > least a sprinkling of five star difficulty caches. Oh, and don't forget . you > probably should find all of the caches in the South Mountain Range . just to > make it fair. > > Okay, so now I've vented ... I'll go back to lurking. > > With tongue in cheek, > Jeepster (Tom Clark) > > Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and the 55 > finds in a single day. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 14:08:07 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 07:08:07 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame References: <002a01c3101e$dc0b0980$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <002c01c310b4$424ff580$738c9a40@fishkiller> should?????????? perhaps????????? that work thing is sooooooo restrictive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 1:18 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > I love that motto! Yes, family is first and sleep is optional. I just wish > I could find a way to make work optional. ;-) > > No big runs in the near future. Just a few here and there. Too busy with > Boy Scouts. Your lead should be safe, perhaps even through the Summer. > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Team > Evil Fish > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 12:48 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocachers' Shame > > > EAT SLEEP CACHE > > the new motto after work and family sleep is optional as always > > PS > > are you getting ready for a big run??? or can I take a break??? > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 15:22:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 08:22:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Outsider Message-ID: <002101c310be$b62e3ca0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C31084.09B3ED60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Loran, For the record, *I* don't consider you an outsider. In fact, I have 2 = of your Sand Dollar's and a Sand Nickel sitting right here with me. :) =20 It is too bad that I didn't really get a chance to know you before you = left town for that awful place. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C31084.09B3ED60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Loran,
 
For the record, *I* don't consider you = an=20 outsider.  In fact, I have 2 of your Sand Dollar's and a Sand = Nickel=20 sitting right here with me. :) 
 
It is too bad that I didn't really get = a chance to=20 know you before you left town for that awful place.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C31084.09B3ED60-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Fri May 2 18:17:15 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks) Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 11:17:15 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Arizona Cacher's shame Message-ID: <3EB2B62B.6060600@mchsi.com> --------------000707030804000904040009 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jeepster wrote: > So, Team Sprocket, the challenge is 161 caches in two weeks, not a > whole month. Well, technically, we did our 163 (not 161, but 163) in just 13 days..... just not in a row. ;-) Those in-between days we were busy working on our perpetual motion machine, our cold fusion theory and our formula for turning lead into gold. > So, although I don't presently live in Arizona, I'm would argue > against the derogatory "cacher from out of state" label. Do you now > consider Loren from Team Sand Dollar an outcast? If so, I'll accept > the title, but if not, don't throw me out because I had to move to the > Midwest right before the sport was invented. > > I didn't intend anything to be derogatory. And I'm not throwing anybody out of anything. I just think a full-time Arizonan ought to hold an Arizona record. Anything else would be like giving an award for the "Best Chicago Style Pizza" to a Pizza Hut in North Dakota. The shame was ours (as Arizonans) not yours. You done good! :-) I hate to think what you could have done if you'd stayed another two weeks. > Oh, by the way Scott, congrats on the 162 cache finds last month and > the 55 finds in a single day. > We humbly thank you. And I tip my hat to you for finding, what, 214 caches (in three states) in the month of March! > With tongue in cheek, > Jeepster (Tom Clark) > With so much tongue-in-cheek I'm about to choke, -- Sprocket --------------000707030804000904040009-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 02:18:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 19:18:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache thief. Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C311A8.C9D40880 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just read the logs for the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) for today. Ther= e is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate. I pulled up his profi= le and searched his cache finds. So far (as of 7:00 p.m.) today he claim= s to have plundered nine caches. Rand (RandMan) ------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C311A8.C9D40880 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just read th= e logs for the Pushing Tin  cache (GCG1N6) f= or today.  There is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate.&nb= sp; I pulled up his profile and searched his cache finds.  So far (a= s of 7:00 p.m.) today he claims to have plundered nine caches.
=
 
Rand (RandMan)

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C311A8.C9D40880-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 03:36:04 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 20:36:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache thief. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030504033604.85048.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1236428805-1052019364=:84721 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii He left the same message on all nine caches, and it looks like today was his first day. Gregg of MO & GO RAND HARDIN wrote:I just read the logs for the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) for today. There is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate. I pulled up his profile and searched his cache finds. So far (as of 7:00 p.m.) today he claims to have plundered nine caches. Rand (RandMan) --0-1236428805-1052019364=:84721 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
He left the same message on all nine caches, and it looks like today was his first day.
 
Gregg of MO & GO

RAND HARDIN <RHrdn8@msn.com> wrote:
I just read the logs for the Pushing Tin  cache (GCG1N6) for today.  There is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate.  I pulled up his profile and searched his cache finds.  So far (as of 7:00 p.m.) today he claims to have plundered nine caches.
 
Rand (RandMan)

--0-1236428805-1052019364=:84721-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 04:44:10 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian LaFrance) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 21:44:10 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Due to the wonderful world of office politics, I am no longer going to be considered Team LeapLab. I will now be Team AZEvil. The story behind this name is that Arizona Evil is the name of the paintball team I play with. We are sponsered by the manufacturer of Evil paint and we are from Arizona... Anyway...maybe I can use the short time off (hopefully short) to go on a caching binge. I haven't been for a while and this may now be my opportunity. Brian Team AZEvil -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of T. Hernlund Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 12:26 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting I was recently asked by Offtrail why I chose the nym General Ursus. Because of that query and a thread I read (posted below), it got me thinking and on a whim I decided to vanity search for it. Turns out another individual used it for a time. Even though I've had it longer I've decided to just nym-shift as it was a little muddied. I'll now be General Bracket. I posted an explanation of the nym in this thread... http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=823609 14&r=18960645#18960645 Anyone who's been around Usenet for awhile knows that nym-shifting without sending out a public notice is bad form, hence my notice. :-) Have fun! -T. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 05:09:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 05:09:58 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting Message-ID:






If I'm reading this correctly, our condolences. We've been there too at some point. We hope things work out for you. In the meantime, enjoy the caching binge.

>From: "Brian LaFrance"

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To:
>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting
>Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 21:44:10 -0700
>
>Due to the wonderful world of office politics, I am no longer going to be
>considered Team LeapLab. I will now be Team AZEvil. The story behind this
>name is that Arizona Evil is the name of the paintball team I play with. We
>are sponsered by the manufacturer of Evil paint and we are from Arizona...
>
>Anyway...maybe I can use the short time off (hopefully short) to go on a
>caching binge. I haven't been for a while and this may now be my
>opportunity.
>
>Brian
>Team AZEvil
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of T.
>Hernlund
>Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 12:26 AM
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting
>
>
>I was recently asked by Offtrail why I chose the nym General Ursus. Because
>of that query and a thread I read (posted below), it got me thinking and on
>a whim I decided to vanity search for it. Turns out another individual
>used it for a time. Even though I've had it longer I've decided to just
>nym-shift as it was a little muddied.
>
>I'll now be General Bracket. I posted an explanation of the nym in this
>thread...
>
>http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=823609
>14&r=18960645#18960645
>
>Anyone who's been around Usenet for awhile knows that nym-shifting without
>sending out a public notice is bad form, hence my notice. :-)
>
>Have fun!
>
>
>-T.
>
>
>
>
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
>http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com

Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 06:36:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian LaFrance) Date: Sat, 3 May 2003 23:36:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C311CC.D9F6B310 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thank you...Yes, you read correctly...It should work out for the better. I've needed out and it was the kick in the butt I needed to get out. -Brian -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale and mike Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 10:10 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting If I'm reading this correctly, our condolences. We've been there too at some point. We hope things work out for you. In the meantime, enjoy the caching binge. ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C311CC.D9F6B310 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank=20 you...Yes, you read correctly...It should work out for the better.  = I've=20 needed out and it was the kick in the butt I needed to get=20 out.
 
-Brian
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = gale=20 and mike
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 10:10 PM
To: = listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = NOTICE - I'm=20 nym shifting

 
 If I'm reading this = correctly, our condolences. We've been there too at some point. We = hope things=20 work out for you. In the meantime, enjoy the caching=20 binge.
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C311CC.D9F6B310-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 07:27:29 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 00:27:29 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache thief. References: <20030504033604.85048.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3EB4C0E1.4080907@uccinc.net> I assume that someone has deleted the log - I do not see it?? did I miss something? Tamo GREGG OBUCH wrote: > He left the same message on all nine caches, and it looks like today > was his first day. > > Gregg of MO & GO > > RAND HARDIN wrote: > > I just read the logs for the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) for > today. There is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate. I > pulled up his profile and searched his cache finds. So far (as of > 7:00 p.m.) today he claims to have plundered nine caches. > > Rand (RandMan) > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 07:34:06 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 00:34:06 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache thief. References: <20030504033604.85048.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com> <3EB4C0E1.4080907@uccinc.net> Message-ID: <3EB4C26E.4090205@uccinc.net> Found it Duh ----Sorry Marc wrote: > I assume that someone has deleted the log - I do not see it?? did I > miss something? > > Tamo > > GREGG OBUCH wrote: > >> He left the same message on all nine caches, and it looks like today >> was his first day. >> >> Gregg of MO & GO >> >> RAND HARDIN wrote: >> >> I just read the logs for the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) for >> today. There is a thief who is claiming he is a cache pirate. I >> pulled up his profile and searched his cache finds. So far (as of >> 7:00 p.m.) today he claims to have plundered nine caches. >> Rand (RandMan) >> > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 13:55:02 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 06:55:02 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting References: Message-ID: <000801c31244$c3610f60$72c19d40@fishkiller> ok well you can still take a pic without the Yellow Vehicle :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian LaFrance" To: Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 9:44 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting > Due to the wonderful world of office politics, I am no longer going to be > considered Team LeapLab. I will now be Team AZEvil. The story behind this > name is that Arizona Evil is the name of the paintball team I play with. We > are sponsered by the manufacturer of Evil paint and we are from Arizona... > > Anyway...maybe I can use the short time off (hopefully short) to go on a > caching binge. I haven't been for a while and this may now be my > opportunity. > > Brian > Team AZEvil > > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of T. > Hernlund > Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 12:26 AM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] NOTICE - I'm nym shifting > > > I was recently asked by Offtrail why I chose the nym General Ursus. Because > of that query and a thread I read (posted below), it got me thinking and on > a whim I decided to vanity search for it. Turns out another individual > used it for a time. Even though I've had it longer I've decided to just > nym-shift as it was a little muddied. > > I'll now be General Bracket. I posted an explanation of the nym in this > thread... > > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=823609 > 14&r=18960645#18960645 > > Anyone who's been around Usenet for awhile knows that nym-shifting without > sending out a public notice is bad form, hence my notice. :-) > > Have fun! > > > -T. > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 17:42:58 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 10:42:58 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID: <001001c31264$9a29b500$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C31229.EDA4B760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, it's official. azcachemeister visited Pushing Tin this morning, = and confirmed what we had hoped was NOT the case. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D67154 The only items remaining were the cache container and the logbook. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C31229.EDA4B760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, it's official.  = azcachemeister visited=20 Pushing Tin this morning, and confirmed what we had hoped was NOT the=20 case.
 
htt= p://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D67154
 
The only items remaining were the cache = container=20 and the logbook.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C31229.EDA4B760-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 18:33:41 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 11:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches Message-ID: <20030504183341.19020.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1184044094-1052073221=:18630 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, Will Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) --0-1184044094-1052073221=:18630 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from plundering.  (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I will do for you.  If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member.  To do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief description.  You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)
 
 
--0-1184044094-1052073221=:18630-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 18:57:23 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 11:57:23 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <20030504183341.19020.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3EB56293.40606@uccinc.net> Sounds like a good idea on the surface, but the reality is "who is the pirate?" Are they worth going after? I think we are all smart enough to "trap" them if this would be the case. Are they even worth going after? There has been much controversy over members only and don't think this should be the driving force to put all of them in there. If the pirate wants to continue to do this, I'm sure spending the $30.00 would not be an issue for them. Anyone who would want to do something like this would not stop for a mere $30.00. These are just my thoughts. They do not reflect the thoughts of anyone else. Tamo - Ken Akerman wrote: > To Arizona Geocachers, > > It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate > on the loose. > I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at > two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was > plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin > near Sky > Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister > had visited the > cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. > > I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the > way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, > Will Travel > . I > stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I > moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. > Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no > travel bugs in it. > > In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all > Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it > appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I > recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a > Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from > plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to > all). > > Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want > to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I > will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, > and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher > for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you > could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do > this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, > and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief > description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the > cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com > until you become a Premium Member. > > This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply > to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to > all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium > Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. > > Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) > > From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:07:34 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:07:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches In-Reply-To: <3EB56293.40606@uccinc.net> Message-ID: <20030504190734.56583.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com> --0-990451173-1052075254=:54669 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Do you lock you house or car? Of course, not locking your house or car does not prevent a determined their from entering your house or car and stealing things inside it - one could easily break a window with a rock or pick a lock, for example - but it will discourage many theives. Also, if the Cache Pirate does become a Geocaching Member, then we could appeal to the adminstrators at Geocaching.com to revoke his membership. Ken Akerman Marc wrote:Sounds like a good idea on the surface, but the reality is "who is the pirate?" Are they worth going after? I think we are all smart enough to "trap" them if this would be the case. Are they even worth going after? There has been much controversy over members only and don't think this should be the driving force to put all of them in there. If the pirate wants to continue to do this, I'm sure spending the $30.00 would not be an issue for them. Anyone who would want to do something like this would not stop for a mere $30.00. These are just my thoughts. They do not reflect the thoughts of anyone else. Tamo - Ken Akerman wrote: > To Arizona Geocachers, > > It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate > on the loose. > I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at > two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was > plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin > near Sky > Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister > had visited the > cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. > > I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the > way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, > Will Travel > . I > stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I > moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. > Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no > travel bugs in it. > > In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all > Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it > appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I > recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a > Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from > plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to > all). > > Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want > to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I > will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, > and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher > for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you > could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do > this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, > and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief > description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the > cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com > until you become a Premium Member. > > This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply > to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to > all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium > Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. > > Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) > > ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com --0-990451173-1052075254=:54669 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Do you lock you house or car?  Of course, not locking your house or car does not prevent a determined their from entering your house or car and stealing things inside it - one could easily break a window with a rock or pick a lock, for example - but it will discourage many theives.
 
Also, if the Cache Pirate does become a Geocaching Member, then we could appeal to the adminstrators at Geocaching.com to revoke his membership.
 
Ken Akerman

Marc <webmaster@uccinc.net> wrote:
Sounds like a good idea on the surface, but the reality is "who is the
pirate?" Are they worth going after? I think we are all smart enough to
"trap" them if this would be the case. Are they even worth going after?
There has been much controversy over members only and don't think this
should be the driving force to put all of them in there. If the pirate
wants to continue to do this, I'm sure spending the $30.00 would not be
an issue for them. Anyone who would want to do something like this would
not stop for a mere $30.00.

These are just my thoughts. They do not reflect the thoughts of anyone else.

Tamo -


Ken Akerman wrote:

> To Arizona Geocachers,
>
> It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate
> on the loose.
> I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at
> two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was
> plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin
> near Sky
> Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister
> had visited the
> cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered.
>
> I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the
> way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug,
> Will Travel
> . I
> stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I
> moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day.
> Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no
> travel bugs in it.
>
> In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all
> Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it
> appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I
> recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a
> Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from
> plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to
> all).
>
> Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want
> to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I
> will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches,
> and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher
> for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you
> could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do
> this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find,
> and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief
> description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the
> cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com
> until you become a Premium Member.
>
> This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply
> to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to
> all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium
> Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers.
>
> Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)
>
>




____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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Arizona's Geocaching Resource
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--0-990451173-1052075254=:54669-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:13:27 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:13:27 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches In-Reply-To: <3EB56293.40606@uccinc.net> Message-ID: <002901c31271$3e3a2bf0$6701a8c0@qwest.net> I don't think the issue of members only caches has been so much a controversy as a sales pitch. It's sad that I cringed when I saw one of my caches had been hit by the pirate. I wasn't as frustrated about being plundered as I was in knowing I would have to sit through yet another sales pitch for members only. Ken, you've made your point. Please let it go. CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Marc Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:57 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches Sounds like a good idea on the surface, but the reality is "who is the pirate?" Are they worth going after? I think we are all smart enough to "trap" them if this would be the case. Are they even worth going after? There has been much controversy over members only and don't think this should be the driving force to put all of them in there. If the pirate wants to continue to do this, I'm sure spending the $30.00 would not be an issue for them. Anyone who would want to do something like this would not stop for a mere $30.00. These are just my thoughts. They do not reflect the thoughts of anyone else. Tamo - Ken Akerman wrote: > To Arizona Geocachers, > > It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate > on the loose. > I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at > two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was > plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin > near Sky > Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister > had visited the > cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. > > I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the > way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, > Will Travel > . I > stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I > moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. > Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no > travel bugs in it. > > In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all > Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it > appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I > recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a > Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from > plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to > all). > > Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want > to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I > will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, > and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher > for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you > could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do > this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, > and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief > description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the > cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com > until you become a Premium Member. > > This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply > to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to > all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium > Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. > > Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) > > ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:18:17 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:18:17 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <20030504183341.19020.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <006501c31271$eabaa210$91f50244@cx301817d> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C31237.3E436010 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out grabbing = my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will = protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the loose. = I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at two = caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the = way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, Will = Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in = it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later = that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there = were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it = appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want = to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I = will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, and = you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher for = less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you could = find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do this, = send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I = will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply = to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to = all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium = Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C31237.3E436010 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I have decided to do the same. With all = the land=20 managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is = becoming to=20 frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ken = Akerman=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 11:33 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache = Pirate on=20 the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache = pirate=20 on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because he = stated=20 that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning = (neither=20 one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had = been=20 plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on = the way=20 there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e Bug,=20 Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to get the = only travel=20 bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County = later=20 that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, = there=20 were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all=20 Members Only. This is to protect my own caches = from=20 plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com = Premium=20 Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches = Members=20 Only (and become a Premium Member if you are = not a=20 member) now to protect them from plundering.  (Virtual = caches=20 cannot be plundered, so those are open to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they = want=20 to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here = is what I=20 will do for you.  If you want to find one of my Members Only = caches, and=20 you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher for = less=20 than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then = you could=20 find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member.  To do = this,=20 send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I = will=20 respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. =20 You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the cache, but you = won't be=20 able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium=20 Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does = not=20 apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable=20 to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium = Members=20 without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C31237.3E436010-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:24:56 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:24:56 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches In-Reply-To: <006501c31271$eabaa210$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <002c01c31272$d9109460$6701a8c0@qwest.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C31238.2CB1BC60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ken, =20 Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in place? =20 CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out grabbing = my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to frustrating. =20 Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the loose. = I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at two = caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was plundered at = that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. =20 I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, Will = Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I = moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no = travel bugs in it. =20 In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it appears = the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I recommend that = all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a Premium Member if = you are not a member) now to protect them from plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to all). =20 Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want to = pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I will do = for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, and you are not = yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief description. You could find = the cache and sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't be able to log = your finding on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium Member. =20 This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply = to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to all, = and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium Members = without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. =20 Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C31238.2CB1BC60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Ken,
 
Am I=20 understanding correctly that you will be making your caches members only = to=20 avoid land managers and the policies they have in = place?
 
CacheLess
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of = Ken
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache = Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my = caches

I have decided to do the same. With = all the land=20 managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is = becoming=20 to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 11:33=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache = pirate=20 on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because = he stated=20 that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning = (neither=20 one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed = had been=20 plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so = on the=20 way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e Bug,=20 Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to get the = only=20 travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in = Pinal County=20 later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this = cache,=20 there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches = from=20 plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com = Premium=20 Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches = Members=20 Only (and become a Premium Member if you = are not a=20 member) now to protect them from plundering.  (Virtual = caches=20 cannot be plundered, so those are open to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they want=20 to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here = is what=20 I will do for you.  If you want to find one of my Members Only = caches,=20 and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active = geocacher for=20 less than three months with fewer than 50 cache = findings, then=20 you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium = Member.  To=20 do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to = find, and=20 I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief=20 description.  You could find the cache and sign the logbook in = the=20 cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com = until you=20 become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously = does not=20 apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to = become=20 Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by = newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C31238.2CB1BC60-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:33:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:33:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <002901c31271$3e3a2bf0$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <002d01c31274$19904f20$6f869e40@fishkiller> ya know the items taken value oh 2 or 3 dollars geesh restock it and get on with it he will be found out soon enough ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Tomlinson" To: Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:13 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches > I don't think the issue of members only caches has been so much a > controversy as a sales pitch. It's sad that I cringed when I saw one of my > caches had been hit by the pirate. I wasn't as frustrated about being > plundered as I was in knowing I would have to sit through yet another sales > pitch for members only. > > Ken, you've made your point. Please let it go. > > CacheLess > > -----Original Message----- > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Marc > Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:57 AM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will > protect my caches > > > Sounds like a good idea on the surface, but the reality is "who is the > pirate?" Are they worth going after? I think we are all smart enough to > "trap" them if this would be the case. Are they even worth going after? > There has been much controversy over members only and don't think this > should be the driving force to put all of them in there. If the pirate > wants to continue to do this, I'm sure spending the $30.00 would not be > an issue for them. Anyone who would want to do something like this would > not stop for a mere $30.00. > > These are just my thoughts. They do not reflect the thoughts of anyone else. > > Tamo - > > > Ken Akerman wrote: > > > To Arizona Geocachers, > > > > It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate > > on the loose. > > I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was at > > two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was > > plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin > > near Sky > > Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister > > had visited the > > cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. > > > > I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the > > way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, > > Will Travel > > . I > > stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in it and I > > moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later that day. > > Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there were no > > travel bugs in it. > > > > In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all > > Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it > > appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I > > recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a > > Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from > > plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to > > all). > > > > Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they want > > to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what I > > will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, > > and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher > > for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you > > could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do > > this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, > > and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief > > description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the > > cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com > > until you become a Premium Member. > > > > This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not apply > > to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is agreeable to > > all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become Premium > > Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. > > > > Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:37:36 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:37:36 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <20030504183341.19020.qmail@web21103.mail.yahoo.com> <006501c31271$eabaa210$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <003901c31274$9ea62220$6f869e40@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C31239.F16D16C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable what is frustrating is that I am unable to read my logs on a open to all = cache that has been change..... I'm this close to paying the 30 so I can delete them myself and avoid such wishy washy caches in the future ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out grabbing = my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the = loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was = at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on the = way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, Will = Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel bug in = it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County later = that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, there = were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it = appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they = want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what = I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, = and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher = for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you = could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do = this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, = and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not = apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become = Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C31239.F16D16C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
what is frustrating is that I am unable = to read my=20 logs on a open to all cache that has been change.....
 
I'm this close to paying the 30 so I = can delete=20 them myself
 
and avoid such wishy washy caches in = the=20 future
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ken =
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

I have decided to do the same. With = all the land=20 managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is = becoming=20 to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 11:33=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache = pirate=20 on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because = he stated=20 that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning = (neither=20 one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed = had been=20 plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so = on the=20 way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e Bug,=20 Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to get the = only=20 travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in = Pinal County=20 later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this = cache,=20 there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches = from=20 plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com = Premium=20 Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches = Members=20 Only (and become a Premium Member if you = are not a=20 member) now to protect them from plundering.  (Virtual = caches=20 cannot be plundered, so those are open to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they want=20 to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here = is what=20 I will do for you.  If you want to find one of my Members Only = caches,=20 and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active = geocacher for=20 less than three months with fewer than 50 cache = findings, then=20 you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium = Member.  To=20 do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to = find, and=20 I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief=20 description.  You could find the cache and sign the logbook in = the=20 cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com = until you=20 become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously = does not=20 apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to = become=20 Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by = newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C31239.F16D16C0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:45:24 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:45:24 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <002c01c31272$d9109460$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <007701c31275$b452ba60$91f50244@cx301817d> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C3123B.07D250A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageNo..most of my caches were placed before they implemented their = policies. My "Black Cave" cache has recently been picked up by an = unknown self appointed cache cop. According to this unknown person the = cache was apparently near an archeological site. This was totally = unknown to me when I placed the cache and they never made any attempt to = contact me about the sensitive nature of the placement. Black Cave is = clearly posted on TOPO maps of the region and there is a clear trail to = the entrance. The cave is not a secret and again is publicly known from = the posting on TOPO maps. The only way I found about the confiscation = was from a cryptic note that was left by the person who took it. See = GCA0E6 for more info. Ken ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Tomlinson=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches Ken, Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches = members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in place? CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com = [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how = I will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out = grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to = frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the = loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was = at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on = the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, = Will Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel = bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County = later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, = there were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it = appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they = want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what = I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, = and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher = for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you = could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do = this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, = and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not = apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become = Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C3123B.07D250A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
No..most of my caches were placed = before they=20 implemented their policies. My "Black Cave" cache has recently been = picked up by=20 an unknown self appointed cache cop. According to this unknown person = the cache=20 was apparently near an archeological site. This was totally unknown to = me when I=20 placed the cache and they never made any attempt to contact me about the = sensitive nature of the placement. Black Cave is clearly posted on TOPO = maps of=20 the region and there is a clear trail to the entrance. The cave is not a = secret=20 and again is publicly known from the posting on TOPO maps. The only way = I found=20 about the confiscation was from a cryptic note that was left by the = person who=20 took it.  See GCA0E6 for more=20 info.
 
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bill=20 Tomlinson
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:24 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

Ken,
 
Am I=20 understanding correctly that you will be making your caches members = only to=20 avoid land managers and the policies they have in = place?
 
CacheLess
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocachi= ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf = Of=20 Ken
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20 caches

I have decided to do the same. With = all the=20 land managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose = it is=20 becoming to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 11:33=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache = pirate=20 on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because = he=20 stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the = morning=20 (neither one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the = log for=20 Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed = had=20 been plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so = on the=20 way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e=20 Bug, Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to = get the=20 only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache = in Pinal=20 County later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean = out this=20 cache, there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them = all=20 Members Only. This is to protect my own = caches from=20 plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com = Premium=20 Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches=20 Members Only (and become a Premium=20 Member if you are not a member) now to protect = them from=20 plundering.  (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those = are open=20 to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they want=20 to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, = here is=20 what I will do for you.  If you want to find one of my = Members Only=20 caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an = active=20 geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 = cache=20 findings, then you could find one of my caches without = becoming a=20 Premium Member.  To do this, send me an e-mail explaining = what cache=20 you would like to find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing = the=20 coordinates and a brief description.  You could find the = cache and=20 sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't be able to log your = finding=20 on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously = does not=20 apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy = is=20 agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to = become=20 Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by=20 newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
=
 
------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C3123B.07D250A0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:50:03 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:50:03 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cave Creek MIA Message-ID: <004901c31276$5b3a63a0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C3123B.AE90C700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Yesterday, Cindy and I visited two caches north of Phoenix in Cave Creek = Recreation Area. The first that we found had recently been replaced by = the owner after the original disappeared. The second, "Here's Johnny" = by AZMark. GCE917, was found under the traditional pile of rocks but was = only the rolled up, large geocaching sticker that had obviously been = peeled from the box. I'm guessing these two caches were removed at the = same time by the same person. Does anyone who's more familiar with this = area know whether this is the doing of the management officials or more = likely an individual? It's kind of strange that the taker would have = carefully replaced the rocks and leave behind evidence of the cache = unless he/she wanted the next person to know for sure that it was gone. Jerry=20 Offtrail ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C3123B.AE90C700 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yesterday, Cindy and I visited two = caches=20 north of Phoenix in Cave Creek Recreation Area.  The first = that we=20 found had recently been replaced by the owner after the original=20 disappeared.  The second, "Here's Johnny" by AZMark. = GCE917, was found=20 under the traditional pile of rocks but was only the rolled up, large = geocaching=20 sticker that had obviously been peeled from the box.  I'm guessing = these=20 two caches were removed at the same time by the same person.  = Does=20 anyone who's more familiar with this area know whether this is the doing = of the=20 management officials or more likely an individual? It's kind of strange = that the=20 taker would have carefully replaced the rocks and leave behind evidence = of the=20 cache unless he/she wanted the next person to know for sure that it was=20 gone.
 
Jerry 
Offtrail
------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C3123B.AE90C700-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 19:52:31 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 12:52:31 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <002c01c31272$d9109460$6701a8c0@qwest.net> Message-ID: <000c01c31276$b4502ce0$6f869e40@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3123C.06D3FE00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Messageyeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I guess if we as established cachers = are unable to abide by ALL the rules why should a new cacher do the = same. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Tomlinson=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches Ken, Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches = members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in place? CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com = [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how = I will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out = grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to = frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the = loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was = at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on = the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, = Will Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel = bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County = later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, = there were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it = appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they = want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what = I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, = and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher = for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you = could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do = this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, = and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not = apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become = Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3123C.06D3FE00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
yeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I guess if = we as=20 established cachers are unable to abide by ALL the rules why should a = new cacher=20 do the same.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bill=20 Tomlinson
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:24 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

Ken,
 
Am I=20 understanding correctly that you will be making your caches members = only to=20 avoid land managers and the policies they have in = place?
 
CacheLess
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocachi= ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf = Of=20 Ken
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20 caches

I have decided to do the same. With = all the=20 land managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose = it is=20 becoming to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 11:33=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache = pirate=20 on the loose.  I thought his entries were a joke, because = he=20 stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the = morning=20 (neither one was plundered at that time), but when I checked the = log for=20 Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it indeed = had=20 been plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so = on the=20 way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e=20 Bug, Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to = get the=20 only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache = in Pinal=20 County later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate did clean = out this=20 cache, there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them = all=20 Members Only. This is to protect my own = caches from=20 plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com = Premium=20 Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your caches=20 Members Only (and become a Premium=20 Member if you are not a member) now to protect = them from=20 plundering.  (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those = are open=20 to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they want=20 to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, = here is=20 what I will do for you.  If you want to find one of my = Members Only=20 caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an = active=20 geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 = cache=20 findings, then you could find one of my caches without = becoming a=20 Premium Member.  To do this, send me an e-mail explaining = what cache=20 you would like to find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing = the=20 coordinates and a brief description.  You could find the = cache and=20 sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't be able to log your = finding=20 on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously = does not=20 apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal policy = is=20 agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to = become=20 Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by=20 newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
=
 
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C3123C.06D3FE00-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 20:01:31 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 13:01:31 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <002c01c31272$d9109460$6701a8c0@qwest.net> <000c01c31276$b4502ce0$6f869e40@fishkiller> Message-ID: <009301c31277$f4d98490$91f50244@cx301817d> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C3123D.485F3550 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageI don't remember seeing either of you when I was at the land = managers meeting last year. I make every attempt to abide by the rules = and have been very active in attempting to make this hobby acceptable. Ken ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Evil Fish=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches yeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I guess if we as established cachers are = unable to abide by ALL the rules why should a new cacher do the same. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Tomlinson=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how = I will protect my caches Ken, Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches = members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in place? CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com = [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is = how I will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out = grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to = frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how = I will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the = loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was = at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so on = the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have Bug, = Will Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only travel = bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal County = later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this cache, = there were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all = Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it = appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if they = want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is what = I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only caches, = and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active geocacher = for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, then you = could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. To do = this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, = and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief = description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does not = apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become = Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C3123D.485F3550 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
I don't remember seeing either of you = when I was at=20 the land managers meeting last year. I make every attempt to abide by = the rules=20 and have been very active in attempting to make this hobby=20 acceptable.
 
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team Evil=20 Fish
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

yeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I guess = if we as=20 established cachers are unable to abide by ALL the rules why should a = new=20 cacher do the same.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bill=20 Tomlinson
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:24=20 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

Ken,
 
Am=20 I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches = members only=20 to avoid land managers and the policies they have in=20 place?
 
CacheLess
-----Original Message-----
From: = az-geocachi= ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On = Behalf Of=20 Ken
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 = PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20 caches

I have decided to do the same. = With all the=20 land managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the = loose it is=20 becoming to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, = 2003 11:33=20 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache=20 pirate on the loose.  I thought his entries were a = joke,=20 because he stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I = visited=20 in the morning (neither one was plundered at that time), but = when I=20 checked the log for Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it = indeed had=20 been plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, = so on=20 the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Hav= e=20 Bug, Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning to = get the=20 only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another = cache in=20 Pinal County later that day.  Fortunately, if the pirate = did clean=20 out this cache, there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them = all=20 Members Only. This is to protect my own = caches=20 from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a = Geocaching.com=20 Premium Member.  I recommend that all cachers make your = caches=20 Members Only (and become a Premium=20 Member if you are not a member) now to protect = them from=20 plundering.  (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those = are open=20 to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they=20 want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium = Member,=20 here is what I will do for you.  If you want to find one of = my=20 Members Only caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and = have been=20 an active geocacher for less than three months with = fewer than=20 50 cache findings, then you could find one of my caches = without=20 becoming a Premium Member.  To do this, send me an e-mail=20 explaining what cache you would like to find, and I will respond = with an=20 e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief description.  = You could=20 find the cache and sign the logbook in the cache, but you won't = be able=20 to log your finding on Geocaching.com until you become a Premium = Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and = obviously does=20 not apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal = policy is=20 agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to = become=20 Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by=20 newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
=
 
------=_NextPart_000_0090_01C3123D.485F3550-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 20:22:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 13:22:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches References: <002c01c31272$d9109460$6701a8c0@qwest.net> <000c01c31276$b4502ce0$6f869e40@fishkiller> <009301c31277$f4d98490$91f50244@cx301817d> Message-ID: <000b01c3127a$e65a6620$6f869e40@fishkiller> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C31240.38CD6E60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Messagewhen was it? as I really didn't get going until August=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 1:01 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I = will protect my caches I don't remember seeing either of you when I was at the land managers = meeting last year. I make every attempt to abide by the rules and have = been very active in attempting to make this hobby acceptable. Ken ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Team Evil Fish=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how = I will protect my caches yeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I guess if we as established cachers = are unable to abide by ALL the rules why should a new cacher do the = same. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Tomlinson=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is = how I will protect my caches Ken, Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your caches = members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in place? CacheLess -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com = [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is = how I will protect my caches I have decided to do the same. With all the land managers out = grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the loose it is becoming to = frustrating. Ken WhereRwee? ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ken Akerman=20 To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 11:33 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is = how I will protect my caches To Arizona Geocachers, It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache pirate on the = loose. I thought his entries were a joke, because he stated that he was = at two caches on Saturday that I visited in the morning (neither one was = plundered at that time), but when I checked the log for Pushing Tin near = Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachmeister had visited = the cache this morning and reported that it indeed had been plundered. I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short time, so = on the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, Have = Bug, Will Travel. I stopped there Saturday morning to get the only = travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to another cache in Pinal = County later that day. Fortunately, if the pirate did clean out this = cache, there were no travel bugs in it. In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them = all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as = it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Premium Member. I = recommend that all cachers make your caches Members Only (and become a = Premium Member if you are not a member) now to protect them from = plundering. (Virtual caches cannot be plundered, so those are open to = all). Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure if = they want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium Member, here is = what I will do for you. If you want to find one of my Members Only = caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and have been an active = geocacher for less than three months with fewer than 50 cache findings, = then you could find one of my caches without becoming a Premium Member. = To do this, send me an e-mail explaining what cache you would like to = find, and I will respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a = brief description. You could find the cache and sign the logbook in the = cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on Geocaching.com until = you become a Premium Member. This is available to new geocachers only (and obviously does = not apply to the Cache Pirate). I hope this new personal policy is = agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage Geocachers to become = Premium Members without restricting access to geocaching by newcomers. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C31240.38CD6E60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
when was it? as I really didn't get = going until=20 August
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ken =
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 1:01 = PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache Pirate=20 on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

I don't remember seeing either of you = when I was=20 at the land managers meeting last year. I make every attempt to abide = by the=20 rules and have been very active in attempting to make this hobby=20 acceptable.
 
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Team=20 Evil Fish
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:52=20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

yeah Well Spoken ChacheLess, I = guess if we as=20 established cachers are unable to abide by ALL the rules why should = a new=20 cacher do the same.
 
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Bill Tomlinson
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 12:24=20 PM
Subject: RE: = [Az-Geocaching] Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

Ken,
 
Am I understanding correctly that you will be making your = caches=20 members only to avoid land managers and the policies they have in=20 place?
 
CacheLess
-----Original = Message-----
From: az-geocachi= ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On = Behalf Of=20 Ken
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 12:18 = PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] = Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20 caches

I have decided to do the same. = With all the=20 land managers out grabbing my caches and now this bozo on the = loose it=20 is becoming to frustrating.
 
Ken
WhereRwee?
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Ken=20 Akerman
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, = 2003 11:33=20 AM
Subject: = [Az-Geocaching] Cache=20 Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my = caches

To Arizona Geocachers,

It's sad to see that there apparently is a cache=20 pirate on the loose.  I thought his entries were a = joke,=20 because he stated that he was at two caches on Saturday that I = visited=20 in the morning (neither one was plundered at that time), but = when I=20 checked the log for Pus= hing=20 Tin near Sky Harbor International Airport, I read that Azcachme= ister=20 had visited the cache this morning and reported that it = indeed had=20 been plundered.
 
I am heading out to the Diamondbacks game in a short = time, so on=20 the way there I will stop at a cache that I visit frequently, = Hav= e=20 Bug, Will Travel.  I stopped there Saturday morning = to get=20 the only travel bug in it and I moved the travel bug to = another cache=20 in Pinal County later that day.  Fortunately, if the = pirate did=20 clean out this cache, there were no travel bugs in it.
 
In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made = them all=20 Members Only. This is to protect my own = caches=20 from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a=20 Geocaching.com Premium Member.  I recommend that all = cachers make=20 your caches Members Only (and become a=20 Premium Member if you are not a member) = now to=20 protect them from plundering.  (Virtual caches cannot be=20 plundered, so those are open to all).
 
Since there are some new cachers who perhaps aren't sure = if they=20 want to pay the $30 annual fee to become a Premium = Member,=20 here is what I will do for you.  If you want to find one = of my=20 Members Only caches, and you are not yet a Premium Member and = have=20 been an active geocacher for less than three months = with=20 fewer than 50 cache findings, then you could find one = of my=20 caches without becoming a Premium Member.  To do this, = send me an=20 e-mail explaining what cache you would like to find, and I = will=20 respond with an e-mail listing the coordinates and a brief=20 description.  You could find the cache and sign the = logbook in=20 the cache, but you won't be able to log your finding on = Geocaching.com=20 until you become a Premium Member.
 
This is available to new geocachers only (and = obviously does=20 not apply to the Cache Pirate).  I hope this new personal = policy=20 is agreeable to all, and in my opinion will encourage = Geocachers to=20 become Premium Members without restricting access to = geocaching by=20 newcomers.
 
Ken Akerman = (a.k.a.=20 Highpointer)
 
=
 
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C31240.38CD6E60-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 20:59:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 13:59:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirates/Members Only Caches Message-ID: <001e01c31280$03e096b0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C31245.575EA650 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Y'know, I was waiting for the sales pitch of Members Only caches/Premium = Memberships after this came out. I'm surprised it took this long. I'll give my canned respone, then provide a little insight on the land = manager aspect vs. Premium Membership. An annual membership is not the only way to support geocaching.com. = Purchasing merchandise through the site also goes to support the sport. = [/soapbox] Now, from what I understand, site stewards/land managers are able to = obtain a premium membership FREE of charge from geocaching.com. What = good will it do to convert caches to Members Only when the = powers-that-be are still able to view all the necessary information to = visit/remove these caches? Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C31245.575EA650 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Y'know, I was waiting for the sales = pitch of=20 Members Only caches/Premium Memberships after this came out.  I'm = surprised=20 it took this long.
 
I'll give my canned respone, then = provide a little=20 insight on the land manager aspect vs. Premium Membership.
 
An annual membership is not the only = way to support=20 geocaching.com.  Purchasing merchandise through the site also goes = to=20 support the sport.  [/soapbox]
 
Now, from what I understand, site = stewards/land=20 managers are able to obtain a premium membership FREE of charge from=20 geocaching.com.  What good will it do to convert caches to Members = Only=20 when the powers-that-be are still able to view all the necessary = information to=20 visit/remove these caches?
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C31245.575EA650-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 21:08:52 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:08:52 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] My 'note' to the cache_pirate Message-ID: <002701c31281$5dca3540$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C31246.B1481DD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I posted this on Pushing Tin, hoping that perhaps the individual = responsible reads it. I imagine that will be the case, because someone = pushing to get attention in this manner will certainly want to read the = reactions to their exploits in an effort to pad their ego/justify their = activity. I doubt that it's going to make them stop, but perhaps the = thought will be planted that the risk isn't worth the thrill. [Note] To cache_pirate: CAUTION should be taken when plundering a cache. Most of us AZ = GEOcachers are reasonable, understanding people. However, I can't say = that everyone would react in such a manner as to not pummel you with the = ammo can you are plundering if you are happened upon by another caching = team. My guess is that you are a teenager looking for attention from = someone, and turning the eyes of all geocachers red from anger seems to = be your avenue of choice. =20 I just hope that when/if another cacher interrupts your 'activities', = that we aren't reading about it on the front page of the paper the next = day. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C31246.B1481DD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I posted this on Pushing Tin, hoping = that perhaps=20 the individual responsible reads it.  I imagine that will be the = case,=20 because someone pushing to get attention in this manner will certainly = want to=20 read the reactions to their exploits in an effort to pad their = ego/justify their=20 activity.  I doubt that it's going to make them stop, but perhaps = the=20 thought will be planted that the risk isn't worth the = thrill.
 
[Note]
To cache_pirate:
 
CAUTION should be taken when plundering = a=20 cache.  Most of us AZ GEOcachers are reasonable, understanding=20 people.  However, I can't say that everyone would react in such a = manner as=20 to not pummel you with the ammo can you are plundering if you are = happened upon=20 by another caching team.  My guess is that you are a teenager = looking for=20 attention from someone, and turning the eyes of all geocachers red from = anger=20 seems to be your avenue of choice. 
 
I just hope that when/if another cacher = interrupts=20 your 'activities', that we aren't reading about it on the front page of = the=20 paper the next day.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C31246.B1481DD0-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 21:12:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Joe Brekke) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:12:38 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates References: <001001c31264$9a29b500$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> Message-ID: <025e01c31281$e6fe1c00$f950a8c0@default> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_025B_01C31247.3833C240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was looking at the logs of this Yo Ho Ho Bozo, and his profile. He = says that he travels the country plundering caches...leaving only the = log book and the container and a skull and crossbone stamp in the log = book. I would imagine that he has had several names with = geocaching.com and done this before. The owners of these caches should report the plundering to the people at = geocaching.com. It won't stop it, but at least he'll have to get a new = name...they should be able to trace the computer if he is using the same = one, and eventualy his access to the site and creating caches to put his = loot in will be taken away Hopefully this will stop soon, or he will move on to another city to do = this there. I did have one thought, however. Instead of the usual bickering = exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community could band = together to right this wrong. I know that I was looking forward to = visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that was = referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that. =20 In all of the cases, I believe the cache container and log book are = still in place. Now would it be possible for the memebers of this list = serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches and restock = them...whether we have been to the caches before or not...if you've been = there post a note, if not, log the cache. Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted golf ball, or chewed on = Mc'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a still in box Hot Wheels = car, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store items. If the 25% of this list serv who are regular cachers would do this that = would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think. Even if each one only visits 1 = cache and leaves an item, each cache would have 5 items in them. Would this be a good idea? Is it possible for us to band together as a = community to help out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue = our usual bickering? I hope so. And I plan to visit these cache in the next 2 weeks to do = exacly as I have said here. I invite you all to do the same. Thanks, Joe TeamBlunder ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Brian Casteel=20 To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 10:42 AM Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Well, it's official. azcachemeister visited Pushing Tin this morning, = and confirmed what we had hoped was NOT the case. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D67154 The only items remaining were the cache container and the logbook. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_025B_01C31247.3833C240 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I was looking at the logs of this Yo Ho = Ho Bozo,=20 and his profile.  He says that he travels the country plundering=20 caches...leaving only the log book and the container and a skull = and=20 crossbone stamp in the log book.   I would imagine that he has = had=20 several names with geocaching.com and done this before.
 
The owners of these caches should = report the=20 plundering to the people at geocaching.com.  It won't stop it, but = at least=20 he'll have to get a new name...they should be able to trace the computer = if he=20 is using the same one, and eventualy his access to the site and creating = caches=20 to put his loot in will be taken away
 
Hopefully this will stop soon, or he = will move on=20 to another city to do this there.
 
I did have one thought, however.  = Instead of=20 the usual bickering exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a = community=20 could band together to right this wrong.  I know that I was looking = forward=20 to visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that = was=20 referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that.  =
 
In all of the cases, I believe the = cache container=20 and log book are still in place.  Now would it be possible for the = memebers=20 of this list serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches = and=20 restock them...whether we have been to the caches before or not...if = you've been=20 there post a note, if not, log the cache.
 
Leave an item or two, and not the=20 usual divoted golf ball, or chewed on Mc'D's toy, but something = fairly=20 decent, like a still in box Hot Wheels car, neat key ring, etc...you = know,=20 dollar store items.
 
If the 25% of this list serv who are = regular=20 cachers would do this that would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I = think.  Even=20 if each one only visits 1 cache and leaves an item, each cache would = have 5=20 items in them.
 
Would this be a good idea?  Is it = possible for=20 us to band together as a community to help out some neat caches, and = people,=20 rather than continue our usual bickering?
 
I hope so.  And I plan to visit = these cache in=20 the next 2 weeks to do exacly as I have said here.  I invite you = all to do=20 the same.
 
Thanks,
 
Joe
TeamBlunder
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Brian = Casteel=20
To: az-geocaching@lis= tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 = 10:42 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: = Cache=20 Pirates

Well, it's official.  = azcachemeister visited=20 Pushing Tin this morning, and confirmed what we had hoped was NOT the=20 case.
 
htt= p://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D67154
 
The only items remaining were the = cache container=20 and the logbook.
 
Brian
Team = A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_025B_01C31247.3833C240-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 21:42:19 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:42:19 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID: ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree with Joe. In a way, these caches belong to all of us. We are a = community and we should take care of each other. Thanks Joe for remindin= g us. Rand (RandMan) . . . . I did have one thought, however. Instead of the usual bickering = exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community could band togeth= er to right this wrong. I know that I was looking forward to visiting th= e Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that was referenced a= nd would love to watch them coming in like that. =20 In all of the cases, I believe the cache container and log book are still= in place. Now would it be possible for the memebers of this list serv, = in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches and restock them...whe= ther we have been to the caches before or not...if you've been there post= a note, if not, log the cache. Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted golf ball, or chewed on M= c'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a still in box Hot Wheels ca= r, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store items. If the 25% of this list serv who are regular cachers would do this that w= ould be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think. Even if each one only visits 1 c= ache and leaves an item, each cache would have 5 items in them. Would this be a good idea? Is it possible for us to band together as a c= ommunity to help out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue o= ur usual bickering? I hope so. And I plan to visit these cache in the next 2 weeks to do exa= cly as I have said here. I invite you all to do the same. Thanks, Joe TeamBlunder ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I agree with Joe.  In a way, these c= aches belong to all of us.  We are a community and we should take ca= re of each other.  Thanks Joe for reminding us.
 
Rand (RandMan)
. . . . I did have one thought, however.  Instead of the us= ual bickering exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community cou= ld band together to right this wrong.  I know that I was looking for= ward to visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie th= at was referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that. =
 
= In all of the cases, I believe the cache cont= ainer and log book are still in place.  Now would it be possible for= the memebers of this list serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit th= ese caches and restock them...whether we have been to the caches before o= r not...if you've been there post a note, if not, log the cache.
 
Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted go= lf ball, or chewed on Mc'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a sti= ll in box Hot Wheels car, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store ite= ms.
 
If the 25% of this list serv who are regula= r cachers would do this that would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think.&nbs= p; Even if each one only visits 1 cache and leaves an item, each cache wo= uld have 5 items in them.
<= /FONT> 
Would this be a good = idea?  Is it possible for us to band together as a community to help= out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue our usual bickeri= ng?
 
I hope so.  And I plan to visit these = cache in the next 2 weeks to do exacly as I have said here.  I invit= e you all to do the same.
<= /FONT> 
Thanks,
=
 
Joe
TeamBlunde= r
 
=  
------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 23:24:49 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 23:24:49 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID:


I reported him to TPTB last night. Your idea about us restocking is fine, unless that vermin decides its fun to keep plundering the same caches over and over again. Or he decides to "graduate" to stealing the entire cache outright. It's going to be a question of who gives up first: him or us. I wonder if he knows that several cachers are in law enforcement? That may scare him off.




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"
 
Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898
>From: "RAND HARDIN"
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: "AZ-Geocaching"
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
>Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:42:19 -0700
>
>I agree with Joe. In a way, these caches belong to all of us. We are a community and we should take care of each other. Thanks Joe for reminding us.
>
>Rand (RandMan)
>
>. . . . I did have one thought, however. Instead of the usual bickering exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community could band together to right this wrong. I know that I was looking forward to visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that was referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that.
>
>In all of the cases, I believe the cache container and log book are still in place. Now would it be possible for the memebers of this list serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches and restock them...whether we have been to the caches before or not...if you've been there post a note, if not, log the cache.
>
>Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted golf ball, or chewed on Mc'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a still in box Hot Wheels car, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store items.
>
>If the 25% of this list serv who are regular cachers would do this that would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think. Even if each one only visits 1 cache and leaves an item, each cache would have 5 items in them.
>
>Would this be a good idea? Is it possible for us to band together as a community to help out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue our usual bickering?
>
>I hope so. And I plan to visit these cache in the next 2 weeks to do exacly as I have said here. I invite you all to do the same.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Joe
>TeamBlunder

Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 23:33:16 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:33:16 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030504163153.027082d8@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 11:24 PM 5/4/2003 +0000, you wrote: >I reported him to TPTB last night. Your idea about us restocking is fine, >unless that vermin decides its fun to keep plundering the same caches over >and over again. Or he decides to "graduate" to stealing the entire cache >outright. It's going to be a question of who gives up first: him or us. I >wonder if he knows that several cachers are in law enforcement? That may >scare him off. You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been committed here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down to it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that people have intentionally left out for other people to take. Scott scott@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 23:35:53 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:35:53 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3EB5A3D9.4010207@Snaptek.com> With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out that they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind. The stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were spring cleaning. As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and I might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to. Brian Cluff Team Snaptek From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 23:53:12 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:53:12 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates In-Reply-To: <3EB5A3D9.4010207@Snaptek.com> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030504165239.01becf58@mail.myblueheaven.com> At 04:35 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote: >With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out that >they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind. The >stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were spring >cleaning. >As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and I >might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the >possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to. I agree. I find much greater pleasure in signing the logbook, and leaving our signature keychains than I do in finding anything in a cache. Scott scott@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com From listserv@azgeocaching.com Sun May 4 23:52:49 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:52:49 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID: Unfortunately that's probably what Morty is thinking, and as such thinks everyone else will find it funny. We're not ammused Morty. >From: Brian Cluff >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates >Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:35:53 -0700 > >With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out that >they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind. The >stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were spring >cleaning. >As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and I >might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the >possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to. > >Brian Cluff >Team Snaptek > >____________________________________________________________ >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource >http://www.azgeocaching.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 00:32:38 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike) Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 00:32:38 +0000 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID:

"You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been committed here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down to it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that people have intentionally left out for other people to take. "


No he is not commiting a crime, which is why I did not suggest charging him with crimes. However he does seem to be abusing the privileges of the website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher who wrote on the forums last night that their family loves this sport and now some creep has to spoil it. They seemed  quite upset. All I did was ask TPTB to check him out. I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing? And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the difference between plundering a cache and stealing the ammo can,  leaving the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset when that happens, yet they can be replaced for only a few dollars.

 


Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 00:45:42 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 17:45:42 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Personally I think this kind of thing goes with Geocaching. You don't hear of people who take up skateboarding complaining of grazed knees and how it has totally spoilt it for them. Leaving things lying around for whatever reason invites people to take them. Accept it and have fun with Geocaching. If you don't like it then just seek caches. You cannot exclude the people who are selfish, rude, childish and inconsiderate from a public activity unfortunately. Andy -----Original Message----- From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale and mike Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:33 PM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates "You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been committed here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down to it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that people have intentionally left out for other people to take. " No he is not commiting a crime, which is why I did not suggest charging him with crimes. However he does seem to be abusing the privileges of the website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher who wrote on the forums last night that their family loves this sport and now some creep has to spoil it. They seemed quite upset. All I did was ask TPTB to check him out. I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing? And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the difference between plundering a cache and stealing the ammo can, leaving the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset when that happens, yet they can be replaced for only a few dollars. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Personally I think this kind of thing goes = with=20 Geocaching. You don't hear of people who take up skateboarding = complaining of=20 grazed knees and how it has totally spoilt it for them. Leaving things = lying=20 around for whatever reason invites people to take them. Accept it and = have fun=20 with Geocaching. If you don't like it then just seek caches. You cannot = exclude=20 the people who are selfish, rude, childish and inconsiderate from a = public=20 activity unfortunately.
 

Andy

 

-----Original Message-----
From:=20 az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20 [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of = gale=20 and mike
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:33 PM
To:=20 listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: = Cache=20 Pirates

"You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been = committed=20 here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right = down to=20 it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that = people=20 have intentionally left out for other people to take. = "


No he is not commiting a crime, which is = why I did=20 not suggest charging him with crimes. However he does seem to be = abusing the=20 privileges of the website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher = who=20 wrote on the forums last night that their family loves this sport and = now some=20 creep has to spoil it. They seemed  quite upset. All I did was = ask TPTB=20 to check him out. I seem to recall hearing that they've limited = someone's=20 access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, = and you=20 don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore = what he is=20 doing? And since when does something have to be a crime before it is=20 considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? = What's=20 the difference between plundering a cache and stealing the ammo = can, =20 leaving the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset when that = happens,=20 yet they can be replaced for only a few dollars.

 


Protect your PC - Click = here for=20 McAfee.com VirusScan Online=20 ____________________________________________________________ = Az-Geocaching=20 mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe = or=20 unsubscribe visit:=20 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching = Arizona's=20 Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =
------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 01:20:33 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:20:33 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030504181810.0227e4b8@mail.myblueheaven.com> --=====================_100825499==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 12:32 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote: >I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the >website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care >about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing? >And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered >unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the I think you must have missed the message I was replying to. It was said that a number of the Arizona geocaching community was law enforcement. That made me wonder just what law enforcement would do about this. The fact remains though, that since there is no crime, and there is nothing of any real value taken, then this is not an issue for any level of law enforcement, as was suggested in the message I replied to. Do I think we should just ignore this, no, but on the other hand I am not really sure what can be done about it. Scott scott@myblueheaven.com www.myblueheaven.com --=====================_100825499==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 12:32 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote:


I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing? And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the

I think you must have missed the message I was replying to.  It was said that a number of the Arizona geocaching community was law enforcement.  That made me wonder just what law enforcement would do about this.  The fact remains though, that since there is no crime, and there is nothing of any real value taken, then this is not an issue for any level of law enforcement, as was suggested in the message I replied to.  Do I think we should just ignore this, no, but on the other hand I am not really sure what can be done about it.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
--=====================_100825499==_.ALT-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 01:34:28 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 18:34:28 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID: <003801c312a6$785bd060$0500a8c0@fbidaemon> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C3126B.CBDFFA80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My only thinking of a cacher being in law enforcement (myself being one = of them, but in a civilian role FOR the officer), is that one of these = cachers coming across this twit and scaring the bejeezus out of them. = In all likelihood, it's a teenager with nothing better to do, so that = might be all it takes. Regardless, I'm sure any of us would take the = opportunity to deal with the issue, law enforcement or not. Some well = thought out words and some voice tone do wonders for rattling someone's = nerves. Brian Team A.I. ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C3126B.CBDFFA80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
My only thinking of a cacher being in = law=20 enforcement (myself being one of them, but in a civilian role FOR the = officer),=20 is that one of these cachers coming across this twit and scaring the = bejeezus=20 out of them.  In all likelihood, it's a teenager with nothing = better to do,=20 so that might be all it takes.  Regardless, I'm sure any of us = would take=20 the opportunity to deal with the issue, law enforcement or not.  = Some well=20 thought out words and some voice tone do wonders for rattling someone's=20 nerves.
 
Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C3126B.CBDFFA80-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 02:49:24 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman) Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 19:49:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches In-Reply-To: <002d01c31274$19904f20$6f869e40@fishkiller> Message-ID: <20030505024924.17733.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com> --0-1894577810-1052102964=:17700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii What happens when this cache pirate, or some other pirate, decides to graduate from just stealing the contents to stealing the entire cache? Some have speculated that this may be the work of a mischevious teenager. If so, then he would not be likely to pay $30 to become a Premium Member when there are so many non-members caches available that he can view without paying the $30 fee. Also, even if he knows where some Members Only caches are, he cannot log his findings (and plunderings) of Members Only caches on Geocaching.com. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) Team Evil Fish wrote:ya know the items taken value oh 2 or 3 dollars geesh restock it and get on with it he will be found out soon enough --0-1894577810-1052102964=:17700 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
What happens when this cache pirate, or some other pirate, decides to graduate from just stealing the contents to stealing the entire cache? 
 
Some have speculated that this may be the work of a mischevious teenager.  If so, then he would not be likely to pay $30 to become a Premium Member when there are so many non-members caches available that he can view without paying the $30 fee.  Also, even if he knows where some Members Only caches are, he cannot log his findings (and plunderings) of Members Only caches on Geocaching.com.
 
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish <buggers@mindspring.com> wrote:
ya know

the items taken value oh 2 or 3 dollars

geesh restock it and get on with it he will be found out soon enough
--0-1894577810-1052102964=:17700-- From listserv@azgeocaching.com Mon May 5 03:04:49 2003 From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks) Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 20:04:49 -0700 Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates Message-ID: <3EB5D4D1.7030201@mchsi.com> --------------030307010309080009000504 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > >Do I think >we should just ignore this, > Personally, I think this is exactly what we should do. Ignore the punk. He'll get bored and tire of stealing hot wheels, used golf balls and keychains. As long as people keep making a big deal about it, and giving him the attention he craves, he will continue his stupidity. Let's face it folks, we're not talking about a serial rapist here; it's just a punk looking for attention. If you ignore him, he'll move on to some other juvenile prank. Brian (Team A.I.), I understand your intentions but, I think you're giving him just what he wants. I suggest you delete your (mildly) threatening note on the Pushing Tin cache page. Idiots like this feed on this kind of attention; it only spurs them on. Ken (Highpointer), my wife and I have been out of work for over a year, downsized from jobs we both held for over 20 years each. We can't afford a Premium Membership, what with us having to feed our kids and stuff. Will you pay for it? It's _only_ $30. >Ken Akerman wrote: > >"It only costs $30 per year." > While you're at it, will you pay for my son's College tuition? It's only about $5200 a term. Then we can talk about my mortgage.... $30, to some, may not seem like much, but to others it is a lot of money to throw around for a "hobby" that's supposed to be free. "The traditional Geocaching game will always be free." --- quoted from http://www.geocaching.com/subscribe/ >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches > >To Arizona Geocachers, >... > >... In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Pre! >mium Member. > I have the coordinates to all your Members Only caches. I have been downloading the complete list of AZ Caches at least every week since I started in this hobby. I don't just throw them away. Do you think I'm the only one who has a list of caches that were formerly open to all? Sure, I'm unable to log them now, so they're of little interest to me. But if I were into plundering, nothing would stop me. -- Sprocket --------------030307010309080009000504 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 
Do I think 
we should just ignore this,

Personally, I think this is exactly what we should do.  Ignore the punk.  He'll get bored and tire of stealing hot wheels, used golf balls and keychains.  As long as people keep making a big deal about it, and giving him the attention he craves, he will continue his stupidity.  Let's face it folks, we're not talking about a serial rapist here; it's just a punk looking for attention.  If you ignore him, he'll move on to some other juvenile prank.

Brian (Team A.I.),
 I understand your intentions but,  I think you're giving him just what he wants.  I suggest you delete your (mildly) threatening note on the Pushing Tin cache page.  Idiots like this feed on this kind of attention; it only spurs them on.

Ken (Highpointer),
 my wife and I have been out of work for over a year, downsized from jobs we both held for over 20 years each.  We can't afford a Premium Membership, what with us having to feed our kids and stuff. Will you pay for it?     It's _only_ $30.   



  
Ken Akerman wrote:

"It only costs $30 per year."



While you're at it, will you pay for my son's College tuition? It's only
about $5200 a term.  Then we can talk about my mortgage....



$30, to some, may not seem like much, but to others it is a lot of money
to throw around for a "hobby" that's supposed to be free.



"The traditional Geocaching game will always
be free."

   --- quoted  from http://www.geocaching.com/subscribe/





  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my caches

To Arizona Geocachers,
...





  
... In order to protect my traditional caches, I have made them all Members Only. This is to protect my own caches from plundering, as it appears the Cache Pirate is not a Geocaching.com Pre!
mium Member.



I have the coordinates to all your Members Only caches.  I have been downloading
 the complete list of AZ Caches at least every week since I started in this
hobby.  I don't just throw them away.  Do you think I'm the only one who
has a list of caches that were formerly open to all?  Sure, I'm unable to
log them now, so they're of little interest to me. But if I were into plundering,
nothing would stop me.



-- Sprocket






--------------030307010309080009000504--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 03:17:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 20:17:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

It looks like this cache is gone completely.

GC9C9F
Hidden Meadows - Around the Bend
by The Hidden Manor Mutts

The cache page has a note from the cache owner stating "the cache has 
dissapeared". It has now been archived.

Scott
Team RTW

_________________________________________________________________
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 04:15:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 04:15:15 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 










That made me wonder just what law enforcement would do about this. The fact remains though, that since there is no crime, and there is nothing of any real value taken, then this is not an issue for any level of law enforcement, as was suggested in the message I replied to. Do I think we should just ignore this, no, but on the other hand I am not really sure what can be done about it. 


 




A few years ago, we were harassed by a bratty teenager for a period of a year and a half. Nothing we did  would make him stop. Finally one day, out of desperation,  I called the police. Although no "crime" had been committed except for some earlier inexpensive damage to my car, he talked to the kid and his parents. The kid still lives here and we haven't been bothered since then. I just figured that maybe if this low life knew there were law enforcement cachers, that might be enough to stop his plundering. If I'm wrong then I'm wrong.  I was not suggesting by any means that any of our cachers, law enforcement or otherwise,  do anything either illegal or unethical.



 














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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 04:25:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 21:25:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
Message-ID: 

No flaming please. I am simply asking a question and looking for some 
suggestions and feedback.

I am thinking about making my next cache a 'non-members only' cache. Since 
there are those out there who feel that us 'poor boyz' who cant afford a 
membership (or for whatever other reason we choose not to have a charter 
membership; my reasoning has something to do with it being FREE to play this 
game) should not be able to find their members only caches. SO... I propose 
making my next cache available only to those who DONT have a charter 
membership. In other words, if you log a find on this cache and you are a 
charter member, your log will be deleted. This will be cleary stated in the 
cache description.....

.....Wait a minute.......

I am not going to do that. I just cant get myself to do that. I would rather 
allow EVERYONE that opportunity to go for my caches. Well, ok.. so my caches 
arent quite drive by caches and may already be limited to those who are able 
to hike great distances and/or climb steep mountains. Why limit it anymore? 
I have met some really nice people in the geocaching community. Some who are 
members and some who are not. I want them all to be able to find my caches. 
(ok, so I only have one caches hidden, but RTW-2 has been in the planning 
stages recently and we have been considering hiding it very soon).

The way I figure it... making a cache MO is not going to save it from 
plunder. Hiding it well on a wilderness type cache or being creative with a 
cache container on an urban cache is what it takes these days to keep your 
caches safe. And no, you dont need to do no freakin' puzzle crap to keep it 
safe, just be creative in how you design and hide the container.

Most caches that get plundered are accidently stumbled upon. Ok.. so this 
recent 'cache pirate' situation is not the same. They obviously have been 
locating these caches on geocaching.com and going after them.

My take on charter memberships: It would do nothing for me. I read the 
charter membership page and found out that I could get a one month 
membership for a mere $3. I thought I would give it a try. But, after 
reading all about it, I dont see what I am getting for my hard earned money. 
A couple of options that I dont really even need. Being a business owner.. I 
watch very closely where I spend my money and what I get for every dollar 
spent. As Brian (Team AI) stated, there are other ways to support the site. 
If ever I should need a new GPS or any accessories, I will most certainly 
purchase from a geocaching.com vendor. This way, a percentage of my purchase 
goes to support geocaching.com. Heck, just playing the game supports the 
site.

Quite honestly... the only way I would ever purchase a charter membership 
was if EVERYONE HAD to have a charter membership in order to even use the 
services of geoaching.com. I do beleive the caches would be of greater 
quality and we would have less issues with the land management agencies and 
the public than we do now. But, I dont think this is realistic. Because, if 
geocaching.com did that.. another web site would pop up anyways offering 
their services for free and many would just switch.

Team RTW typically logs 30-40 caches or more a month. Last month (April), I 
only logged 9 finds. I just havent been impressed with the current trends in 
geocaching. I am getting bored of hiking some great distance on a hot 
afternoon only to find the cache is not there, has been plundered, had wrong 
coordinates posted (a new team hiding their first cache with no finds) or 
any other reason. Offtrail just reported two caches in Cave Creek had been 
plundered. Caches I have yet to go find. Black Cave was taken. I had really 
been wanting to do that cache. It has been on my todo list for a long time. 
Now, I will never get the chance. It is gone. Sounded like a really cool 
piece of Arizona to explore. I guess I can still go there. But, would rather 
have a cache to find in the process. A new cache in the San Tan Mountains 
was plundered as well recently. Although still a very limited issue, this is 
becoming more and more of a concern to me.

The other thing that is really irritating me is the fact that I have lost 
several caches to my stats because they became members only after I had 
already found it. I beleive a cache should not be changed over to a MO cache 
after it was originally available to all. It screws up my numbers (yes, I am 
into the numbers). I only cache in Arizona, so there should be no 'finds' in 
my out of state column. I understand this issue is tough to resolve.. but, I 
dont fault azgeocaching.com for it... I understand their situation with it 
and why they cant correct this problem. There have been a few other cachers 
who have mentioned this as well. So, for all those cache owners who choose 
to change their caches over midlife to a MO cache.. help Brian and Jason out 
so they dont have to deal with that issue. Leave your old caches the way 
they were and make your new caches MO if you want to, then I will just not 
go seek out those new caches. It will also keep the stats orderly and 
simple.

Also.. and most importantly.. the thing that irritates me most about this 
situation is that I can no longer view my log (my dairy if you will) on a 
given cache that I found that has since become members only. Most people who 
know me sometimes joke about my lengthy logs on caches. Well, those logs are 
basically my diary of my experiences at that cache. That 'experience' is now 
lost forever as I cant go back and read about it anymore. I like clicking on 
the old caches that I have visited a year or two ago and reading my log and 
reading some of the later logs on that cache. Now I cannot do that as the 
owner has made it a members only cache. I now would have to pay for that 
privelege if I want to view them.

As far as the so called 'cache pirate' goes: ignore him. He will go away. 
The more you talk about him and the more everyone eggs him on (in terms of 
threats and such), the more he will plunder. Simply put.. we should be 
thankful that all he took was the cache contents. The most important 
items... the container itself and the logbook.. are still there. This will 
not be the last time someone like this will come along. Geocaching is 
getting too public now and more and more people are hearing about it (I wish 
it would have remained more of an 'underground' hobby, but with all the 
media and such lately buzzing about geocaching...). But, it is not. So, 
instead of changing your caches to MO... simply be more creative with them 
and they will last longer. Why is it that some of the oldest geocaches are 
still around, yet many new caches dont last a week? hhmmm.

Anyways, just some thoughts and ramblings from a cacher with 650 finds in 16 
months.

Will I stop caching? Probably not. Generally speaking, it is alot of fun. I 
just want to sit back a while and kinda see where the current trends with 
geocaching goes. I will probably just be more selective in the caches I seek 
out when I am in the mood to find a cache. Getting #1 in the rankings was a 
big goal of mine.. but, that has kinda slipped into the background right 
now. Business has been good this season and that has limited how much I have 
been caching as well. But, I always have time to spare to find lots of 
caches. But, I think I will slow down for a while and wait to see where this 
all goes. Heck, look at how much money in gas I have saved lately!!!!!

Scott
Team RTW



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 02:38:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bonnie Hickman)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 19:38:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What do I need to do to get taken off the mailing list-  PLEASE REMOVE!!!!
References: <200305050110.SAA30049@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <000701c312af$7701f6a0$8439bbd0@BonnieHickman>

What do I need to do to get taken off the mailing list-  PLEASE REMOVE!!!!


            Bonnie P. Hickman
            Independent Sales Director
            Mary Kay Cosmetics
            7238 E Nido Ave Mesa AZ 85208 USA
            602-430-8234 480-985-3299
            bhickman@marykay.com www.marykay.com/bhickman



Add this card to your address book

----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: 
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 6:10 PM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1141 - 9 msgs


> Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
> az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
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> than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Re:  Cache Pirates (RAND HARDIN)
>    2. Re: Re: Cache Pirates (gale and mike)
>    3. Re: Re: Cache Pirates (Scott Wood)
>    4. Re: Re:  Cache Pirates (Brian Cluff)
>    5. Re: Re:  Cache Pirates (Scott Wood)
>    6. Re: Re: Cache Pirates (Terry Hernlund)
>    7. Re: Re: Cache Pirates (gale and mike)
>    8. RE: Re: Cache Pirates (Andrew Ayre)
>    9. Re: Re: Cache Pirates (Scott Wood)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> From: "RAND HARDIN" 
> To: "AZ-Geocaching" 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
> Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:42:19 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>
> ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> I agree with Joe.  In a way, these caches belong to all of us.  We are a =
> community and we should take care of each other.  Thanks Joe for remindin=
> g us.
>
> Rand (RandMan)
>
> . . . . I did have one thought, however.  Instead of the usual bickering =
> exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community could band togeth=
> er to right this wrong.  I know that I was looking forward to visiting th=
> e Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that was referenced a=
> nd would love to watch them coming in like that.  =20
>
> In all of the cases, I believe the cache container and log book are still=
>  in place.  Now would it be possible for the memebers of this list serv, =
> in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches and restock them...whe=
> ther we have been to the caches before or not...if you've been there post=
>  a note, if not, log the cache.
>
> Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted golf ball, or chewed on M=
> c'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a still in box Hot Wheels ca=
> r, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store items.
>
> If the 25% of this list serv who are regular cachers would do this that w=
> ould be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think.  Even if each one only visits 1 c=
> ache and leaves an item, each cache would have 5 items in them.
>
> Would this be a good idea?  Is it possible for us to band together as a c=
> ommunity to help out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue o=
> ur usual bickering?
>
> I hope so.  And I plan to visit these cache in the next 2 weeks to do exa=
> cly as I have said here.  I invite you all to do the same.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Joe
> TeamBlunder
>
> ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500
> Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>  ackground-color:#ffffff; ">
I agree with Joe.  In a way, these c=
> aches belong to all of us.  We are a community and we should take ca=
> re of each other.  Thanks Joe for reminding us.
 
  IV> 
Rand (RandMan)
 
 DDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN=
> -RIGHT: 0px"> 
  50.4134.100" name=3DGENERATOR>  
 
 rial size=3D2>
 
 > 
 
 size=3D2>. . . . I did have one thought, however.  Instead of the us=
> ual bickering exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community cou=
> ld band together to right this wrong.  I know that I was looking for=
> ward to visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie th=
> at was referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that. =
>  
 
 
 
=
> In all of the cases, I believe the cache cont=
> ainer and log book are still in place.  Now would it be possible for=
>  the memebers of this list serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit th=
> ese caches and restock them...whether we have been to the caches before o=
> r not...if you've been there post a note, if not, log the cache. DIV> 
 
 
 =3DArial size=3D2>Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted go=
> lf ball, or chewed on Mc'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a sti=
> ll in box Hot Wheels car, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store ite=
> ms.
 
 
  V>If the 25% of this list serv who are regula=
> r cachers would do this that would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think.&nbs=
> p; Even if each one only visits 1 cache and leaves an item, each cache wo=
> uld have 5 items in them.
 
<=
> /FONT> 
 
Would this be a good =
> idea?  Is it possible for us to band together as a community to help=
>  out some neat caches, and people, rather than continue our usual bickeri=
> ng?
 
 
  V>I hope so.  And I plan to visit these =
> cache in the next 2 weeks to do exacly as I have said here.  I invit=
> e you all to do the same.
 
<=
> /FONT> 
 
Thanks,
 =
> 
 
 
 ial size=3D2>Joe
 
TeamBlunde=
> r
 
 
 
=
>  
 
 ltr style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BOR=
> DER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> 
 size=3D2>
 
 OCKQUOTE>

>
> ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C3124B.5D706500--
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> From: "gale and mike" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 23:24:49 +0000
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> 

> 

I reported him to TPTB last night. Your idea about us restocking is
fine, unless that vermin decides its fun to keep plundering the same caches
over and over again. Or he decides to "graduate" to stealing the entire
cache outright. It's going to be a question of who gives up first: him or
us. I wonder if he knows that several cachers are in law enforcement? That
may scare him off. 

> 




> 
Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang
interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night
repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look
behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and
waiting for you. Go!"

> 

> 
 

> 

> 
Rudyard Kipling ,   The
Explorer  1898

> 

> 

> 

> 
>From: "RAND HARDIN" 
> 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> 
>To: "AZ-Geocaching" 
> 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
>Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 14:42:19 -0700
> 
>
> 
>I agree with Joe. In a way, these caches belong to all of
us. We are a community and we should take care of each other. Thanks Joe for
reminding us.
> 
>
> 
>Rand (RandMan)
> 
>
> 
>. . . . I did have one thought, however. Instead of the
usual bickering exhibited on this list serve, perhaps we as a community
could band together to right this wrong. I know that I was looking forward
to visiting the Pushing Tin cache as I am familiar with the movie that was
referenced and would love to watch them coming in like that.
> 
>
> 
>In all of the cases, I believe the cache container and log
book are still in place. Now would it be possible for the memebers of this
list serv, in the next couple of weeks, to visit these caches and restock
them...whether we have been to the caches before or not...if you've been
there post a note, if not, log the cache.
> 
>
> 
>Leave an item or two, and not the usual divoted golf ball,
or chewed on Mc'D's toy, but something fairly decent, like a still in box
Hot Wheels car, neat key ring, etc...you know, dollar store items.
> 
>
> 
>If the 25% of this list serv who are regular cachers would
do this that would be about 40 - 45 cachers, I think. Even if each one only
visits 1 cache and leaves an item, each cache would have 5 items in them.
> 
>
> 
>Would this be a good idea? Is it possible for us to band
together as a community to help out some neat caches, and people, rather
than continue our usual bickering?
> 
>
> 
>I hope so. And I plan to visit these cache in the next 2
weeks to do exacly as I have said here. I invite you all to do the same.
> 
>
> 
>Thanks,
> 
>
> 
>Joe
> 
>TeamBlunder
> 

Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com
VirusScan Online 
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:33:16 -0700
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> From: Scott Wood 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> At 11:24 PM 5/4/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>
>
> >I reported him to TPTB last night. Your idea about us restocking is fine,
> >unless that vermin decides its fun to keep plundering the same caches
over
> >and over again. Or he decides to "graduate" to stealing the entire cache
> >outright. It's going to be a question of who gives up first: him or us. I
> >wonder if he knows that several cachers are in law enforcement? That may
> >scare him off.
>
> You raise an interesting point.  Exactly what crime has been committed
> here?  It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down
> to it.  None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that
> people have intentionally left out for other people to take.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:35:53 -0700
> From: Brian Cluff 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out
> that they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind.
>     The stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were
> spring cleaning.
> As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and
> I might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the
> possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:53:12 -0700
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> From: Scott Wood 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> At 04:35 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out that
> >they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind.
The
> >stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were spring
> >cleaning.
> >As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and I
> >might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the
> >possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to.
>
> I agree.  I find much greater pleasure in signing the logbook, and leaving
> our signature keychains than I do in finding anything in a cache.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:52:49 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> Unfortunately that's probably what Morty is thinking, and as such thinks
> everyone else will find it funny.
>
> We're not ammused Morty.
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: Brian Cluff 
> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
> >Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 16:35:53 -0700
> >
> >With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out that
> >they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind.
The
> >stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were spring
> >cleaning.
> >As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and I
> >might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the
> >possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to.
> >
> >Brian Cluff
> >Team Snaptek
> >
> >____________________________________________________________
> >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
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>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 7
> From: "gale and mike" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 00:32:38 +0000
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> 

> 
"You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been committed
here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down to
it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that people
have intentionally left out for other people to take. "


> 

> 

No he is not commiting a crime, which is why I
did not suggest charging him with crimes. However he does seem to be abusing
the privileges of the website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher
who wrote on the forums last night that their family loves this sport and
now some creep has to spoil it. They seemed  quite upset. All I did was
ask TPTB to check him out. I seem to recall hearing that they've limited
someone's access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no
crime, and you don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers
ignore what he is doing? And since when does something have to be a crime
before it is considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good
manners? What's the difference between plundering a cache and stealing the
ammo can,  leaving the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset
when that happens, yet they can be replaced for only a few
dollars.

> 
 

Protect
your PC - Click here for
McAfee.com VirusScan Online 
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 8
> From: "Andrew Ayre" 
> To: 
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 17:45:42 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> Personally I think this kind of thing goes with Geocaching. You don't hear
> of people who take up skateboarding complaining of grazed knees and how it
> has totally spoilt it for them. Leaving things lying around for whatever
> reason invites people to take them. Accept it and have fun with
Geocaching.
> If you don't like it then just seek caches. You cannot exclude the people
> who are selfish, rude, childish and inconsiderate from a public activity
> unfortunately.
>
> Andy
>
>
>
>   -----Original Message-----
>   From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale
and
> mike
>   Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:33 PM
>   To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>   Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
>
>
>   "You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been committed
> here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right down
to
> it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that
people
> have intentionally left out for other people to take. "
>
>
>
>
>   No he is not commiting a crime, which is why I did not suggest charging
> him with crimes. However he does seem to be abusing the privileges of the
> website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher who wrote on the
forums
> last night that their family loves this sport and now some creep has to
> spoil it. They seemed  quite upset. All I did was ask TPTB to check him
out.
> I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the
> website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care
> about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing?
> And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered
> unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the
> difference between plundering a cache and stealing the ammo can,  leaving
> the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset when that happens, yet
> they can be replaced for only a few dollars.
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> --
>   Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> ____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
> mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
> unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
> Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> 
> 
>  charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> 
> 
> 
 class=3D593534100-05052003>Personally I think this kind of thing goes =
> with=20
> Geocaching. You don't hear of people who take up skateboarding =
> complaining of=20
> grazed knees and how it has totally spoilt it for them. Leaving things =
> lying=20
> around for whatever reason invites people to take them. Accept it and =
> have fun=20
> with Geocaching. If you don't like it then just seek caches. You cannot =
> exclude=20
> the people who are selfish, rude, childish and inconsiderate from a =
> public=20
> activity unfortunately.

> 
 

> 
Andy

  

> 

>   
 face=3DTahoma=20
>   size=3D2>-----Original Message-----
From:=20
>   az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of =
> gale=20
>   and mike
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 5:33 PM
To:=20
>   listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: =
> Cache=20
>   Pirates


>   

>   

>   
"You raise an interesting point. Exactly what crime has been =
> committed=20
>   here? It would be really hard to call this theft when it comes right =
> down to=20
>   it. None of the items are of any real value, and they are things that =
> people=20
>   have intentionally left out for other people to take. =
> "


>   

>   

No he is not commiting a crime, which is =
> why I did=20
>   not suggest charging him with crimes. However he does seem to be =
> abusing the=20
>   privileges of the website and he upset at least one new Arizona cacher =
> who=20
>   wrote on the forums last night that their family loves this sport and =
> now some=20
>   creep has to spoil it. They seemed  quite upset. All I did was =
> ask TPTB=20
>   to check him out. I seem to recall hearing that they've limited =
> someone's=20
>   access to the website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, =
> and you=20
>   don't care about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore =
> what he is=20
>   doing? And since when does something have to be a crime before it is=20
>   considered unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? =
> What's=20
>   the difference between plundering a cache and stealing the ammo =
> can, =20
>   leaving the only the logbook behind? Some of you are upset when that =
> happens,=20
>   yet they can be replaced for only a few dollars.

>   
 


>   

>   Protect your PC - Click =
> here for=20
>   McAfee.com VirusScan Online=20
>   ____________________________________________________________ =
> Az-Geocaching=20
>   mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
> or=20
>   unsubscribe visit:=20
>   http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
> Arizona's=20
>   Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =
> 

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C31264.FBBEC940--
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:20:33 -0700
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> From: Scott Wood 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> --=====================_100825499==_.ALT
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> At 12:32 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote:
>
>
> >I seem to recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the
> >website for doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't
care
> >about the McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is
doing?
> >And since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered
> >unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's the
>
> I think you must have missed the message I was replying to.  It was said
> that a number of the Arizona geocaching community was law
> enforcement.  That made me wonder just what law enforcement would do about
> this.  The fact remains though, that since there is no crime, and there is
> nothing of any real value taken, then this is not an issue for any level
of
> law enforcement, as was suggested in the message I replied to.  Do I think
> we should just ignore this, no, but on the other hand I am not really sure
> what can be done about it.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
> --=====================_100825499==_.ALT
> Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
>
> 
> At 12:32 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote:


> 

> 
I seem to
> recall hearing that they've limited someone's access to the website for
> doing this before. Since there is no crime, and you don't care about the
> McToys, would you prefer all geocachers ignore what he is doing? And
> since when does something have to be a crime before it is considered
> unacceptable behavior? What ever happened to good manners? What's
> the


> I think you must have missed the message I was replying to.  It was
> said that a number of the Arizona geocaching community was law
> enforcement.  That made me wonder just what law enforcement would do
> about this.  The fact remains though, that since there is no crime,
> and there is nothing of any real value taken, then this is not an issue
> for any level of law enforcement, as was suggested in the message I
> replied to.  Do I think we should just ignore this, no, but on the
> other hand I am not really sure what can be done about it.


> 

> 

> 
Scott

> 

> 
scott@myblueheaven.com

> 
> 
>
> --=====================_100825499==_.ALT--
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list
> listserv@azgeocaching.com
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> End of Az-Geocaching Digest
>


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 04:43:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (jim Stamm)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 21:43:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <10B90497-7EB4-11D7-BB00-000A959F12C6@Comcast.net>

On Sunday, May 4, 2003, at 09:25  PM, RopingThe Wind wrote:

> No flaming please.........

> And no, you dont need to do no freakin' puzzle crap to keep it 
> safe,.....

First you ask us not to, then you "ask for it."  Make up your mind.

-Jim


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 04:51:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 21:51:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What do I need to do to get taken off the mailing list-  PLEASE REMOVE!!!!
Message-ID: <20030504.215124.1192.4.feistyfemale42@juno.com>

God, me to Bonnie, how do I get off this merri-go-round, it's driving me
crazy! HELP 

LV4TDAY



On Sun, 4 May 2003 19:38:49 -0700 "Bonnie Hickman" 
writes:
> What do I need to do to get taken off the mailing list-  PLEASE 
> REMOVE!!!!
> 
> 
>             Bonnie P. Hickman
>             Independent Sales Director
>             Mary Kay Cosmetics
>             7238 E Nido Ave Mesa AZ 85208 USA
>             602-430-8234 480-985-3299
>             bhickman@marykay.com www.marykay.com/bhickman
> 
> 
> 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 04:47:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Sun, 4 May 2003 21:47:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my caches
References: <20030505024924.17733.qmail@web21110.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <004101c312c1$7af572c0$50023b41@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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 Also, even if he knows where some Members Only caches are, he cannot =
log his findings (and plunderings) of Members Only caches on =
Geocaching.com.

and when a Member finds it has been plundered the Member can log it for =
them....




  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ken Akerman=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 7:49 PM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I =
will protect my caches


  What happens when this cache pirate, or some other pirate, decides to =
graduate from just stealing the contents to stealing the entire cache?=20

  Some have speculated that this may be the work of a mischevious =
teenager.  If so, then he would not be likely to pay $30 to become a =
Premium Member when there are so many non-members caches available that =
he can view without paying the $30 fee.=20

  Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

  Team Evil Fish  wrote:
    ya know

    the items taken value oh 2 or 3 dollars

    geesh restock it and get on with it he will be found out soon enough

------=_NextPart_000_003A_01C31286.CD826BA0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









 Also, even if he knows where some Members Only caches are, he =
cannot=20
log his findings (and plunderings) of Members Only caches on=20
Geocaching.com.


 


and when a Member finds it has been =
plundered the=20
Member can log it for them....


 


 


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Ken =
Akerman=20
  

  
  
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 7:49 =
PM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache Pirate=20
  on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

  


  
What happens when this cache pirate, or some other pirate, =
decides to=20
  graduate from just stealing the contents to stealing the entire=20
  cache? 

  
 

  
Some have speculated that this may be the work of a mischevious=20
  teenager.  If so, then he would not be likely to pay $30 to =
become a=20
  Premium Member when there are so many non-members caches available =
that he can=20
  view without paying the $30 fee. 

  
 

  
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish=20
  <buggers@mindspring.com> wrote:

  ya=20
    know

the items taken value oh 2 or 3 dollars

geesh =
restock it=20
    and get on with it he will be found out soon=20
enough


------=_NextPart_000_003A_01C31286.CD826BA0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 05:15:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 22:15:44 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What do I need to do to get taken off the mailing
 list-  PLEASE REMOVE!!!!
In-Reply-To: <000701c312af$7701f6a0$8439bbd0@BonnieHickman>
References: <200305050110.SAA30049@ns2.sequoia.net> <000701c312af$7701f6a0$8439bbd0@BonnieHickman>
Message-ID: <3EB5F380.8020401@Snaptek.com>

The best way I know of is to actually read the messages.  On the bottom 
of every message to the list is the list to click to get unsubscribed.

Brian Cluff
AzGeocaching.com

> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 06:00:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 23:00:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030504225256.02717e58@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:25 PM 5/4/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>FREE to play this game) should not be able to find their members only 
>caches. SO... I propose making my next cache available only to those who 
>DONT have a charter membership. In other words, if you log a find on this 
>cache and you are a charter member, your log will be deleted. This will be 
>cleary stated in the cache description.....

Since I know that you would actually not do this, as you mention later in 
your message, that would be one of the surest ways to make sure that I 
never find another cache.  I have had a find log deleted, and it really 
upset me.  I have even had a no find log deleted that upset me even 
worse.  I am of the opinion that cache logs should not be allowed to be 
deleted by anyone other than the person who made the log, or the admins at 
geocaching.com.  As I said, I had my log deleted from one of the downtwon 
urban Phoenix caches and the only reason I could ever get from the cache 
owner what they apparently didn't like me.

>takes these days to keep your caches safe. And no, you dont need to do no 
>freakin' puzzle crap to keep it safe, just be creative in how you design 
>and hide the container.

Thank you.  Puzzle caches have become all the rage down here in the Tucson 
area, and while there have been a few of them that I have enjoyed, I have 
really lost interest in them.  I might go back to finding them again, but 
probably not for the for seeable future.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 06:24:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 23:24:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Ramblin' RTW
Message-ID: <3EB60399.5050905@mchsi.com>

Scott or RTW wrote:

>The other thing that is really irritating me is the fact that I have lost 
>several caches to my stats because they became members only after I had 
>already found it. I beleive a cache should not be changed over to a MO cache 
>after it was originally available to all. It screws up my numbers (yes, I am 
>into the numbers). I only cache in Arizona, so there should be no 'finds' in 
>my out of state column. I understand this issue is tough to resolve.. but, I 
>dont fault azgeocaching.com for it... I understand their situation with it 
>and why they cant correct this problem. There have been a few other cachers 
>who have mentioned this as well. So, for all those cache owners who choose 
>to change their caches over midlife to a MO cache.. help Brian and Jason out 
>so they dont have to deal with that issue. Leave your old caches the way 
>they were and make your new caches MO if you want to, then I will just not 
>go seek out those new caches. It will also keep the stats orderly and 
>simple.
>

I feel the same way about the caches I already found that have been made 
into M.O. caches.  I'd like to suggest the following solution for those 
who feel impelled to make existing caches Members Only for security or 
whatever reasons:

1.  Remove the Member's Only designation from the cache that was 
previously a non-members cache.  This way those who are 'into the 
numbers' can still get their stats and those who have already found them 
can go back and review their logs whenever they please.
2.  Change the coordinates to something ridiculous, like the middle of 
Roosevelt Lake or something.  That way no "new" cachers can find the cache.
3. Archive the cache.
4.  Create a new, Member's Only,  cache with a slightly different name 
and a new waypoint number.  Use the same coordinates as the old or move 
it slightly if you wish.  This way, only Premium Members can find it 
from this point forward.
5.  Make everybody happy!  The cache still exists, only under a new 
name, new waypoint and is only visible to Premium Members.  The old 
cache waypoint, with new fictitious coordinates, can still be viewed and 
counted in the stats by those who have already found it and logged it. 
Everybody wins!

This seems to me like it would solve the dillemma(s) as viewed from both 
sides of the coin.  Somebody correct me if I'm overlooking something.

-- Sprocket


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 07:32:53 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (James and Diane Herr)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 00:32:53 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
Message-ID: <3EB613A5.2070400@cox.net>

Well, I've read a lot of emails lately on this, and I finally have to 
comment.  If anyone believes that the geocaching hobby is supposed to be 
free, and that you get nothing for your hard earned money by paying the 
membership fees, I suggest you start a web site and watch the bills 
grow.  You get to register domain names, you get to find a host, find a 
more expensive host when users complain that they can't connect all the 
time, find more reliable hosts.  Then there is the cost of developing 
all the custom software that Geocaching.com has.  And a staff to process 
requests from 139 countries to approve caches.  It all costs money.  I 
feel that being a charter member helps support the hobby, and pay for 
many of the features and software that makes the site so useable and the 
sport so enjoyable.  I work in the software industry. I know of what I 
speak.  If Geocaching.com was a big long list of caches, not sortable, 
not searchable, without forums, without the ability to log and track 
your finds, without travelbugs, would it be nearly as much fun?

To those who say there are other ways to contribute to Geocaching.com, I 
applaud your support.  With a membership at $30 a year, you'd have to 
spend $240 or more through Offroute.com to support Geocaching.com at the 
same level. (I'm assuming an average 12.5% kickback, the range goes from 
5 - 20%).  I doubt too many people do that on an annual basis, but I'm 
sure every bit does help Geocaching.com.

While I understand that not everyone can afford membership, I have to 
question that as a position to not be a member.  If I could not afford 
$30 for a membership (or better $3 a month) I doubt I could afford the 
gas (a whopping 2 gallons) , or the trinkets (a whopping 3 one dollar 
trinkets) to leave in caches.  If I had to do less caches, to afford my 
membership, I surely would.  If all the money dried up for 
Geocaching.com, how long do you think it would take for the site to go 
belly-up?

While I don't feel as strongly about this topic as Ken does, I find 
myself having to agree with him on a number of points.  Becoming a 
member does support the hobby.  You become an invested member in the 
sport.  I also feel it probably would protect caches from plunderer's 
such as the cache pirate as they are likely not a paying member.

Having said all that, I feel slightly saddened that people will view me 
as an elitist just because I have a charter membership.  Scott's mention 
of a non-members only cache really rubbed me the wrong way.  Do they 
need a new level of membership 
(Contributing-but-keep-it-a-secret-so-no-one-knows) just so I can 
participate in the sport at the same level as all the people who don't 
have a membership? All my caches have always been available for everyone 
and anyone, and I've enjoyed each and every cache log that I've read on 
my caches.

I'm amazed that AZgeocaching.com has been free for so long.  It provides 
a lot of great services and software all for free (Thanks Team Snaptek). 
  I'd probably be the first one in line with my checkbook if this site 
every goes fee based, but please don't hold that against me too.

--
Jim - Team 8 Feet


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 10:27:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 03:27:20 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
In-Reply-To: <3EB613A5.2070400@cox.net>
Message-ID: <20030505102720.55889.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>

I'm suprised that no one has mentioned the biggest
thing non-members do to support the sport, hide
caches.


Eric
Team Dragon

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 11:06:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 04:06:00 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

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As Scott said, "idiots like this feed on . . . attention."  I also sugges=
t deleting.  I believe that every cache owner should delete Morty's log e=
ntries.  If the cache owner wants a history of the event, then the cache =
owner could substitute their own note regarding the plundering.  =20

Rand (RandMan)

*************************************************************************=
**********************************************
Scott Sparks wrote on May 4th, 2003  =20
Personally, I think this is exactly what we should do.  Ignore the punk. =
 He'll get bored and tire of stealing hot wheels, used golf balls and key=
chains.  As long as people keep making a big deal about it, and giving hi=
m the attention he craves, he will continue his stupidity.  Let's face it=
 folks, we're not talking about a serial rapist here; it's just a punk lo=
oking for attention.  If you ignore him, he'll move on to some other juve=
nile prank. =20

Brian (Team A.I.),
 I understand your intentions but,  I think you're giving him just what h=
e wants.  I suggest you delete your (mildly) threatening note on the Push=
ing Tin cache page.  Idiots like this feed on this kind of attention; it =
only spurs them on.

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As Scott said,=
 "idiots like this feed on . . . attention."  I also suggest de=
leting.  I believe that every cache owner should delete Morty's log =
entries.  If the cache owner wants a history of the event, then the =
cache owner could substitute their own note regarding the plunderi=
ng.  
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
 <=
/DIV> 
 
***************************************************=
******************************************************************** 
Scott Sparks wrote on May 4th, 2003  
 
Personally,=
 I think this is exactly what we should do.  Ignore the punk.  =
He'll get bored and tire of stealing hot wheels, used golf balls and keyc=
hains.  As long as people keep making a big deal about it, and givin=
g him the attention he craves, he will continue his stupidity.  Let'=
s face it folks, we're not talking about a serial rapist here; it's just =
a punk looking for attention.  If you ignore him, he'll move on to s=
ome other juvenile prank. 

Brian (Team A.I.),
 I understan=
d your intentions but,  I think you're giving him just what he wants=
.  I suggest you delete your (mildly) threatening note on the=
 Pushing Tin cache page.  Idiots like this feed on this kind =
of attention; it only spurs them on.

 
 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 11:37:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 04:37:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
References: <20030505102720.55889.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00c301c312fa$a8bd2d40$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

I paid the $30 for a membership to support geocaching.com. I have yet to
hide
a MO cache or find an MO cache...I have no desire nor do I like the concept.

I am tired of hearing 'active cachers' crying about not having $30 to spend
on a membership. If you do not want to buy one, don't. Quit making up
excuses.
Let us take for example the average cacher that goes out once a week drives
All over Phoenix in their SUV with AC cranked full blast in 75-degree
weather.
$20 in gas, and lets throw in a coffee and bagel from Starbucks $5. GPS
battery usage is going to be around 2$ per outing. That is $27 per full
caching day (yes, I left out lunch and a lot of other stuff as well). Let's
assume
4 outings per months, 12 months per year. That is 27*4*12 gives $1296 a year
to
geocache. A $30 membership is only 2.4% of that! If you can afford to
geocache
at the above rate then quit crying about being a poor boy. If $30 dollars is
too much, you should be out looking for a job, not out caching.

>>takes these days to keep your caches safe. And no, you don't need to do no
>>freakin' puzzle crap to keep it safe, just be creative in how you design
>>and hide the container.

>Thank you.  Puzzle caches have become all the rage down here in the Tucson
>area, and while there have been a few of them that I have enjoyed, I have
>really lost interest in them.  I might go back to finding them again, but
>probably not for the for seeable future.

Hey, some of us enjoy creating and finding these 'freakin puzzle crap'
caches.
If you do not enjoy them, then do not try to find them, but do not knock
them.
I enjoy finding difficult caches that exploit the navigational,
mathematical,
surveying, and mapping aspect of geocaching. There is a lot more to GPS work
than running around with GSPr blindly being a 'gadget man'. Those of us that
create puzzle caches are only trying to expand the sport, and give the
cacher
another alternative. I personally get real tired of finding mint containers
stuck to the bottom of park benches, or ammo cans placed 100 ft from the
road in
places that have no redeeming quality other than that there is a cache
there.

The assumption is that the pirate is some teenager out playing a joke.
I don't think it is a teenager. He obviously has been doing this for a
while. He is
not a beginner, he found 9-caches in one day and his profile was set up
quickly
and professionally. Personally, I think he is a member of our geocaching
community
that subscribes to this mailing list and is fed up with all the nonsense
that
is being muttered and has decided to play a joke on all of us. This guy got
the
response that he was out to get.

ARRRGHH. HAHAHAHAHAHA

-Rob (Wily Javelina)





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 11:46:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 11:46:06 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 










Just curious, is the creep now getting the listserv e-mail?




 










>As Scott said, "idiots like this feed on . . . attention." I also suggest deleting. I believe that every cache owner should delete Morty's log entries. If the cache owner wants a history of the event, then the cache owner could substitute their own note regarding the plundering. 

> 

>Rand (RandMan) 

> 




Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 11:57:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 11:57:29 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle caches
Message-ID: 








RTW wrote:









 And no, you don't need to do no freakin' puzzle crap to keep it safe, just be creative in how you design and hide the container. 



Scott replied:


 Puzzle caches have become all the rage down here in the Tucson area, and while there have been a few of them that I have enjoyed, I have really lost interest in them. 


Wily Javelina replied:


Hey, some of us enjoy creating and finding these 'freakin puzzle crap' caches. If you do not enjoy them, then do not try to find them, but do not knock them. I enjoy finding difficult caches that exploit the navigational, mathematical, surveying, and mapping aspect of geocaching. There is a lot more to GPS work than running around with GSPr blindly being a 'gadget man'. Those of us that create puzzle caches are only trying to expand the sport, and give the cacher another alternative. 


My reply:


I agree with Wily Javelina. We like a variety of caches. Some days we want to do simple straightforward caches and some days we want a challenge. If you don't like them, then don't do them, but please don't try to stop anyone else from doing them. Or bash people for creating/finding them.


 





The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 12:08:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 05:08:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
Message-ID: 

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I agree with Scott.  I have no problem if a cache owner wants to have a m=
embers only cache (as long as it starts out as a members only cache).  I =
think it is inconsiderate to fellow cachers if a cache owner changes a no=
n-members only cache to a members only cache after it had been found by n=
on-members.  I feel I have an investment in every cache I find and to hav=
e my investment taken from me is irritating.  I too enjoy following the A=
rizona stats and do not seek out-of-state caches.  I too am like Scott wh=
en it comes to my log entries.  Sometimes I enjoy writing lengthy notes a=
bout my adventure.  I am always going back and re-reading my (and others)=
 comments.  We talk about how irritating it is to have our caches stolen =
or plundered . . . it is equally irritating to have our "finds" (our inve=
stments) stolen from us and our access denied to a cache that we have pre=
viously found because we choose not to become a Premium Member.

Rand (RandMan)  =20

----- Original Message -----
From: RopingThe Wind
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 9:30 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW

The other thing that is really irritating me is the fact that I have lost=
 =20
several caches to my stats because they became members only after I had =20
already found it. I beleive a cache should not be changed over to a MO ca=
che =20
after it was originally available to all. It screws up my numbers (yes, I=
 am =20
into the numbers). I only cache in Arizona, so there should be no 'finds'=
 in =20
my out of state column. I understand this issue is tough to resolve.. but=
, I =20
dont fault azgeocaching.com for it... I understand their situation with i=
t =20
and why they cant correct this problem. There have been a few other cache=
rs =20
who have mentioned this as well. So, for all those cache owners who choos=
e =20
to change their caches over midlife to a MO cache.. help Brian and Jason =
out =20
so they dont have to deal with that issue. Leave your old caches the way =20
they were and make your new caches MO if you want to, then I will just no=
t =20
go seek out those new caches. It will also keep the stats orderly and =20
simple.

Also.. and most importantly.. the thing that irritates me most about this=
 =20
situation is that I can no longer view my log (my diary if you will) on a=
 =20
given cache that I found that has since become members only. Most people =
who =20
know me sometimes joke about my lengthy logs on caches. Well, those logs =
are =20
basically my diary of my experiences at that cache. That 'experience' is =
now =20
lost forever as I cant go back and read about it anymore. I like clicking=
 on =20
the old caches that I have visited a year or two ago and reading my log a=
nd =20
reading some of the later logs on that cache. Now I cannot do that as the=
 =20
owner has made it a members only cache. I now would have to pay for that =20
privelege if I want to view them. =20


Scott
Team RTW

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I agree with S=
cott.  I have no problem if a cache owner wants to have a membe=
rs only cache (as long as it starts out as a members only cache).&nb=
sp; I think it is inconsiderate to fellow cachers if a cache owner change=
s a non-members only cache to a members only cache after it had been=
 found by non-members.  I feel I have an investment in every ca=
che I find and to have my investment taken from me is irritating.  I=
 too enjoy following the Arizona stats and do not seek o=
ut-of-state caches.  I too am like Scott when it comes to my lo=
g entries.  Sometimes I enjoy writing lengthy notes about my adventu=
re.  I am always going back and re-reading my (and others)=
 comments.  We talk about how irritating it is to have our cach=
es stolen or plundered . . . it is equally irritating to have our "finds"=
 (our investments) stolen from us and our access denied to a cache t=
hat we have previously found because we choose not to become a =
Premium Member.
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)   
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
=
 
Fr=
om: RopingThe Wind
 
Sent:=
 Sunday, May 04, 2003 9:30 PM
 
To=
: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
=
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
 
 
 
T=
he other thing that is really irritating me is the fact that I have lost =

several caches to my stats because they became members only after I h=
ad 
already found it. I beleive a cache should not be changed o=
ver to a MO cache 
after it was originally available to all. It sc=
rews up my numbers (yes, I am 
into the numbers). I only cache in Ariz=
ona, so there should be no 'finds' in 
my out of state column. I under=
stand this issue is tough to resolve.. but, I 
dont fault azgeocaching=
.com for it... I understand their situation with it 
and why they cant=
 correct this problem. There have been a few other cachers 
who have m=
entioned this as well. So, for all those cache owners who choose 
to c=
hange their caches over midlife to a MO cache.. help Brian and Jason out =

so they dont have to deal with that issue. Leave your old caches the =
way 
they were and make your new caches MO if you want to, then I will=
 just not 
go seek out those new caches. It will also keep the stats o=
rderly and 
simple.

Also.. and most importantly.. the thing =
that irritates me most about this 
situation is that I can no longer v=
iew my log (my diary if you will) on a 
given cache that I found that =
has since become members only. Most people who 
know me sometimes =
joke about my lengthy logs on caches. Well, those logs are 
basically =
my diary of my experiences at that cache. That 'experience' is now 
lo=
st forever as I cant go back and read about it anymore. I like clicking o=
n 
the old caches that I have visited a year or two ago and reading my=
 log and 
reading some of the later logs on that cache. Now I cannot d=
o that as the 
owner has made it a members only cache. I now would hav=
e to pay for that 
privelege if I want to view them. 


Scott=

Team RTW




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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 13:02:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 06:02:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
Message-ID: 

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Good observation Rob!  Then too it could be someone who has a point to ma=
ke.  Creating a conflict and stirring the masses to get a point across is=
 simple dialectics.  (Reminds me of the 60's!)

RandMan
----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Brinkerhoff
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only

The assumption is that the pirate is some teenager out playing a joke.
I don't think it is a teenager. He obviously has been doing this for a
while. He is
not a beginner, he found 9-caches in one day and his profile was set up
quickly
and professionally. Personally, I think he is a member of our geocaching
community
that subscribes to this mailing list and is fed up with all the nonsense
that
is being muttered and has decided to play a joke on all of us. This guy g=
ot
the
response that he was out to get.

ARRRGHH. HAHAHAHAHAHA

-Rob (Wily Javelina)




____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

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Good observati=
on Rob!  Then too it could be someone who has a point to make. =
 Creating a conflict and stirring the masses to get a point acr=
oss is simple dialectics.  (Reminds me of the 60's!)
 
&nbs=
p;
 
RandMan
 
 
----- Original Message -----<=
/DIV> 
=
From: Rob Brinkerhoff
 
Sen=
t: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only=

 

The assumption is that the pirate is some teenager out pl=
aying a joke.
I don't think it is a teenager. He obviously has been=
 doing this for a
while. He is
not a beginner, he found 9-cache=
s in one day and his profile was set up
quickly
and professionally.=
 Personally, I think he is a member of our geocaching
community
=
that subscribes to this mailing list and is fed up with all the nonse=
nse
that
is being muttered and has decided to play a joke on all of=
 us. This guy got
the
response that he was out to get.

ARRRG=
HH. HAHAHAHAHAHA

-Rob (Wily Javelina)




_________=
___________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mail=
ing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or =
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/a=
z-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocach=
ing.com


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 14:03:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 07:03:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic
Message-ID: <003101c3130f$13417540$ae8a3a41@fishkiller>

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How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?

then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?

just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers???









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How does June 6ish look for a evening =
Pizza Event=20
Cache?


 


then May 31ish for a morning=20
Breakfast Cache?


 


just thinking aloud.....any Tucson=20
Takers???


 


 


 


 


 


 


 


 


 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 14:40:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 07:40:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I wil
 l protect my caches
Message-ID: 

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this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


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 I will only say one thing about 
  this,

  
We should in the words of Tony (from the 
  Soprano's)

  
Wack the *******  
  *****.

  
 

  
 Tres 
  Hombres!!!


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 15:13:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:13:43 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
In-Reply-To: <00c301c312fa$a8bd2d40$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

Rob wrote:

>>Thank you.  Puzzle caches have become all the rage down here in the Tucson
>>area, and while there have been a few of them that I have enjoyed, I have
>>really lost interest in them.  I might go back to finding them again, but
>>probably not for the for seeable future.

>Hey, some of us enjoy creating and finding these 'freakin puzzle crap'
>caches.
>If you do not enjoy them, then do not try to find them, but do not knock
>them.
>I enjoy finding difficult caches that exploit the navigational,
>mathematical,
>surveying, and mapping aspect of geocaching. There is a lot more to GPS
work
>than running around with GSPr blindly being a 'gadget man'. Those of us
that
>create puzzle caches are only trying to expand the sport, and give the
>cacher
>another alternative. I personally get real tired of finding mint containers
>stuck to the bottom of park benches, or ammo cans placed 100 ft from the
>road in
>places that have no redeeming quality other than that there is a cache
>there.

I agree with this 100% - as Rob knows. :)

Andy


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 15:30:21 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 08:30:21 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Combining an event cache with a webcam cache
In-Reply-To: <003101c3130f$13417540$ae8a3a41@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <20030505153021.48195.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>

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The pizza event sounds like a good idea.  I would recommend having it at a place in downtown Tempe so we could get on Smile for Sneaky Peak (the closest cache to my home that I haven't claimed yet).  Someone should bring a laptop computer and monitor the location of the webcam while we are at the restaurant, then when the camera is zoomed in on a place on the street, we should all go there together to get on the cam. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish  wrote:How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache? then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache? just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers???
--0-1789286301-1052148621=:47916
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The pizza event sounds like a good idea.  I would recommend having it at a place in downtown Tempe so we could get on Smile for Sneaky Peak (the closest cache to my home that I haven't claimed yet).  Someone should bring a laptop computer and monitor the location of the webcam while we are at the restaurant, then when the camera is zoomed in on a place on the street, we should all go there together to get on the cam.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish <buggers@mindspring.com> wrote:







How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?


 


then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?


 


just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers???

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:21:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:21:20 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic
In-Reply-To: <003101c3130f$13417540$ae8a3a41@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505091957.0199a210@mail.myblueheaven.com>

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At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?
>
>then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?
>
>just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers??

We would love to make it up for an event cache, but Friday nights are going 
to be tough since we all have to get out of work and then head to 
Phoenix.  A Saturday night would probably be best.  Breakfast caches for us 
would probably be out of the picture, just have to get up to early on a 
weekend morning to make it to Phoenix for breakfast.  A lunch cache might 
be a good idea.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

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At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:



How does
June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?

 

then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast
Cache?

 

just thinking aloud.....any Tucson
Takers??


We would love to make it up for an event cache, but Friday nights are
going to be tough since we all have to get out of work and then head to
Phoenix.  A Saturday night would probably be best.  Breakfast
caches for us would probably be out of the picture, just have to get up
to early on a weekend morning to make it to Phoenix for breakfast. 
A lunch cache might be a good idea.







Scott




scott@myblueheaven.com




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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:18:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:18:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505091543.0197c838@mail.myblueheaven.com>

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At 11:57 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote:

>I agree with Wily Javelina. We like a variety of caches. Some days we want 
>to do simple straightforward caches and some days we want a challenge. If 
>you don't like them, then don't do them, but please don't try to stop 
>anyone else from doing them. Or bash people for creating/finding them.

I agree.  The nice thing about geocaching is that there are all sorts of 
caches.  I personally like the 3/3 type of caches that send me out on a 
nice drive and a good hike.  I have also enjoyed puzzle caches in the past, 
and will in the future, but as I said, they seem to have become the flavor 
of the month down here in Tucson, and I have lost interest in them for the 
time being.  Much like the urban micros did last summer when the forests 
were closed.  Not that there is anything wrong with urban micros, I just 
lost interest in them for awhile also.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

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At 11:57 AM 5/5/2003 +0000, you wrote:



I agree with
Wily Javelina. We like a variety of caches. Some days we want to do
simple straightforward caches and some days we want a challenge. If you
don't like them, then don't do them, but please don't try to stop anyone
else from doing them. Or bash people for creating/finding
them.


I agree.  The nice thing about geocaching is that there are all
sorts of caches.  I personally like the 3/3 type of caches that send
me out on a nice drive and a good hike.  I have also enjoyed puzzle
caches in the past, and will in the future, but as I said, they seem to
have become the flavor of the month down here in Tucson, and I have lost
interest in them for the time being.  Much like the urban micros did
last summer when the forests were closed.  Not that there is
anything wrong with urban micros, I just lost interest in them for awhile
also.







Scott




scott@myblueheaven.com




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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:14:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:14:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
In-Reply-To: <00c301c312fa$a8bd2d40$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
References: <20030505102720.55889.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505091306.0197bc88@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 04:37 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>Hey, some of us enjoy creating and finding these 'freakin puzzle crap'
>caches.
>If you do not enjoy them, then do not try to find them, but do not knock
>them.

I think that the comments I left on a previous message might be taken 
wrong.  I was critical of puzzle caches, not because I don't enjoy them, 
but because it seems that all the recent caches hidden in the Tucson area 
are these sort of caches.  One of yours is one that I am currently working 
on, I am enjoying my time with it, but sadly life has gotten in the way so 
much that I have been working on it for over a month. :-(  I think this is 
the longest I have ever taken from when I started looking for a cache, to 
still not having found it.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:35:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:35:05 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirate (update)
Message-ID: <001901c31324$48f6a560$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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Folks,

I just received a response from geocaching.com re: our local =
Cache_Pirate.  Jeremy was aware of the situation and has dealt with it.

Brian
Team A.I.
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Folks,


 


I just received a response from =
geocaching.com re:=20
our local Cache_Pirate.  Jeremy was aware of the situation and has =
dealt=20
with it.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:42:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:42:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
Message-ID: 


>Since I know that you would actually not do this, as you mention later in 
>your message, that would be one of the surest ways to make sure that I 
>never find another cache.  I have had a find log deleted, and it really 
>upset me.  I have even had a no find log deleted that upset me even worse.  
>I am of the opinion that cache logs should not be allowed to be deleted by 
>anyone other than the person who made the log, or the admins at 
>geocaching.com.  As I said, I had my log deleted from one of the downtwon 
>urban Phoenix caches and the only reason I could ever get from the cache 
>owner what they apparently didn't like me.

NO. Of course I would not do that. That would be an incredibly rude thing to 
do and would alienate all the charter members out there. I am not one to do 
that. Just making a point. I have had a log deleted before too and I wasnt 
very happy about it. I finally got it back. But, imagine finding a cache and 
then having that cache experience more or less taken away from you because 
that cache became a members only cache half way thru it's life (and you 
werent a charter member)... it is the same thing. I can no longer view my 
logs on all those caches that have lately turned members only. Those caches 
have been basically erased from my stats and I cannot view them anymore 
either.

Changing a cache midway thru it's life to a MO cache is the same thing that 
I speak of above (the non members only cache idea). It alienates all the non 
members out there and that IS elitist.

Scott
Team RTW



_________________________________________________________________
Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:45:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Donn Sanford)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:45:20 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505091957.0199a210@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: 

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count me in IF we're back in town --  a week later would be LOTS better.,
but that's my problem,
  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Scott
Wood
  Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:21 AM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic


  At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:


    How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?

    then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?

    just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers??

  We would love to make it up for an event cache, but Friday nights are
going to be tough since we all have to get out of work and then head to
Phoenix.  A Saturday night would probably be best.  Breakfast caches for us
would probably be out of the picture, just have to get up to early on a
weekend morning to make it to Phoenix for breakfast.  A lunch cache might be
a good idea.




  Scott


  scott@myblueheaven.com
  www.myblueheaven.com

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count me in=20
IF we're back in town --  a week later would be LOTS better., but =
that's my=20
problem,



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Scott Wood
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:21 =
AM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Off=20
  tropic

At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you =
wrote:


  
How does=20
    June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event =
Cache?
 
then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast=20
    Cache?
 
just thinking =

    aloud.....any Tucson Takers??

We would love =
to make it=20
  up for an event cache, but Friday nights are going to be tough since =
we all=20
  have to get out of work and then head to Phoenix.  A Saturday =
night would=20
  probably be best.  Breakfast caches for us would probably be out =
of the=20
  picture, just have to get up to early on a weekend morning to make it =
to=20
  Phoenix for breakfast.  A lunch cache might be a good=20
  idea.




  
Scott


  
scott@myblueheaven.com

  


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:47:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:47:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic
In-Reply-To: <003101c3130f$13417540$ae8a3a41@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <006f01c31326$01570130$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

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Well, I hesitate to respond because something has come up to prevent me =
from
attending any of the events since finding all of my new friends here.  =
As it
stands now, the weekend of the 31st, I'll be camping with the scouts.  =
The
6th or anytime that weekend looks OK.
=20
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Team
Evil Fish
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:03 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic


How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?
=20
then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?
=20
just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers???
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20


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Message






Well,=20
I hesitate to respond because something has come up to prevent me from =
attending=20
any of the events since finding all of my new friends here.  As it =
stands=20
now, the weekend of the 31st, I'll be camping with the scouts.  The =
6th or=20
anytime that weekend looks OK.


 


CacheLess



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Team Evil Fish
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:03 =
AM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off=20
  tropic


  
How does June 6ish look for a evening =
Pizza Event=20
  Cache?

  
 

  
then May 31ish for a morning=20
  Breakfast Cache?

  
 

  
just thinking aloud.....any Tucson=20
  Takers???

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:51:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:51:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <007801c31326$9d651bc0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

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Reminds me of a threat someone made in the forums recently.  I don't =
know
that person and have no other basis for suspicion, but if nothing else, =
this
shows the stupidity of making threats in public.  Now that person is a
likely suspect whether he did it or not.
=20
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of RAND
HARDIN
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 6:03 AM
To: AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only


Good observation Rob!  Then too it could be someone who has a point to =
make.
Creating a conflict and stirring the masses to get a point across is =
simple
dialectics.  (Reminds me of the 60's!)
=20
RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Brinkerhoff
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates and Members only

The assumption is that the pirate is some teenager out playing a joke.
I don't think it is a teenager. He obviously has been doing this for a
while. He is
not a beginner, he found 9-caches in one day and his profile was set up
quickly
and professionally. Personally, I think he is a member of our geocaching
community
that subscribes to this mailing list and is fed up with all the nonsense
that
is being muttered and has decided to play a joke on all of us. This guy =
got
the
response that he was out to get.

ARRRGHH. HAHAHAHAHAHA

-Rob (Wily Javelina)




____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com



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Message




Reminds me of =
a threat=20
someone made in the forums recently.  I don't know that person and =
have no=20
other basis for suspicion, but if nothing else, this shows the stupidity =
of=20
making threats in public.  Now that person is a likely suspect =
whether he=20
did it or not.


 


CacheLess



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  RAND HARDIN
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 6:03 =
AM
To:=20
  AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates =
and=20
  Members only


  
Good observation Rob!  Then too it could be someone who has =
a point=20
  to make.  Creating a conflict and stirring the masses =
to get a=20
  point across is simple dialectics.  (Reminds me of the =
60's!)

  
 

  
RandMan

  
    
----- Original Message -----

    From: Rob=20
    Brinkerhoff

    
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 =
4:45=20
AM

    
To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

    
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Re: Cache=20
    Pirates and Members only

    

The assumption is that the pirate is some teenager out =
playing a=20
    joke.
I don't think it is a teenager. He obviously has been =
doing this=20
    for a
while. He is
not a beginner, he found 9-caches in =
one day=20
    and his profile was set up
quickly
and professionally. =
Personally,=20
    I think he is a member of our geocaching
community
that =
subscribes to=20
    this mailing list and is fed up with all the =
nonsense
that
is=20
    being muttered and has decided to play a joke on all of us. This guy =

    got
the
response that he was out to get.

ARRRGHH.=20
    HAHAHAHAHAHA

-Rob (Wily=20
    =
Javelina)




____________________________________________=
________________
Az-Geocaching=20
    mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, =
subscribe or=20
    unsubscribe=20
    =
visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching=


Arizona's=20
    Geocaching=20
Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_000_0079_01C312EB.F10643C0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:55:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 09:55:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <007f01c31327$26826d40$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

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Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats and
then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, Tres Hombres?  We
just can't take you anywhere.
 
LOL,
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford,
Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will
protect my caches


 

 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


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Message






Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making =
public=20
threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with =
you, Tres=20
Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.


 


LOL,


CacheLess



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 =
AM
To:=20
  'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache=20
  Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my =
caches


  
 

  

    
 I will only say one =
thing about=20
    this,

    
We should in the words of =
Tony (from=20
    the Soprano's)

    
Wack the ******* =20
    *****.

    
 
    
 Tres=20
    =
Hombres!!!


------=_NextPart_000_0080_01C312EC.7A239540--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 16:56:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 09:56:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Ramblin' RTW
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505095423.018efc08@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:42 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>Changing a cache midway thru it's life to a MO cache is the same thing 
>that I speak of above (the non members only cache idea). It alienates all 
>the non members out there and that IS elitist.

I agree 100%.  I was one of those that was against changing all those 
caches to members only after the Republic article, and I am against doing 
it now.  While I do believe in supporting geocahing.com, I don't think that 
making caches MO, especially after they have already been in the open, will 
do anything to prevent plundering.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 17:08:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:08:28 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] FW: [LOG] Team C.H.U.M.P. found your cache!
Message-ID: <008f01c31328$f368d820$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

I want to publicly thank Team C.H.U.M.P. for adding some items to my
"Crocodile Hunter" cache after it's demise.  I have also been there to check
it's state, and will return soon to add more items.

I have also deleted the offending log.

Thanks!!
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: Geocaching.com Emailer Bot [mailto:emailer@geocaching.com] 
Subject: [LOG] Team C.H.U.M.P. found your cache!

Team C.H.U.M.P. has added a log to your cache (Crocodile Hunter). You can
visit the cache at the following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=57897

User comments:
Some grade school kid named Cache Pirate (or mentality thereof) took
everything but the log book out of the cache yesterday.  Signed the log and
put in a few trinkets to get it going again.  Otherwise a beautiful day for
caching.

Thanks!
Rob and Troy, Team CHUMP


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 17:24:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:24:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I wil
 l protect my caches
Message-ID: 

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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But it would solve the issue,
simple and Quick.
 
We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to
do with you, Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.
 
LOL,
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


 

 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


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Message






But it 
would solve the issue,


simple 
and Quick.


 


We can 
make him an offer he can't refuse!


a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  
;)



  
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson 
  [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 
  AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: 
  [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
  caches


  
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public 
  threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, Tres 
  Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.

  
 

  
LOL,

  
CacheLess

  

    

    
-----Original Message-----
From: 
    az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
    Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 
    'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 
    Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
    caches


    
 

    

      
 I will only say one thing 
      about this,

      
We should in the words of Tony (from 
      the Soprano's)

      
Wack the *******  
      *****.

      
 

      
 Tres 
      Hombres!!!


------_=_NextPart_001_01C3132B.37215A40--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 17:31:37 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:31:37 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <009501c3132c$2ee934f0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Can we make that an event cache?

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford,
Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will
protect my caches


But it would solve the issue,
simple and Quick.
 
We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will
protect my caches


Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats and
then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, Tres Hombres?  We
just can't take you anywhere.
 
LOL,
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford,
Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will
protect my caches


 

 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


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Message






Can we=20
make that an event cache?



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 =
AM
To:=20
  'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache=20
  Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my =
caches


  
But=20
  it would solve the issue,

  
simple and Quick.

  
 

  
We=20
  can make him an offer he can't refuse!

  
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the =
lake. =20
  ;)

  

    
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson=20
    [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, =
2003 9:56=20
    AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE:=20
    [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will =
protect my=20
    caches


    
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of =
making public=20
    threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with =
you,=20
    Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you =
anywhere.

    
 

    
LOL,

    
CacheLess

    

      

      
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
      az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On =
Behalf Of=20
      Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 =
AM
To:=20
      'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache=20
      Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20
      caches


      
 

      

        
 I will only say =
one thing=20
        about this,

        
We should in the words =
of Tony=20
        (from the Soprano's)

        
Wack the *******  =

        *****.

        
 
        
 Tres=20
        =
Hombres!!!


------=_NextPart_000_0096_01C312F1.828A5CF0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 17:38:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 10:38:22 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I wil
 l protect my caches
Message-ID: 

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3132D.1F972100
Content-Type: text/plain

Just as long as the event cache has false coordinates so we have an alibi.

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:32 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


Can we make that an event cache?

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


But it would solve the issue,
simple and Quick.
 
We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to
do with you, Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.
 
LOL,
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


 

 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


------_=_NextPart_001_01C3132D.1F972100
Content-Type: text/html




Message






Just 
as long as the event cache has false coordinates so we have an 
alibi.



  
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson 
  [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:32 
  AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: 
  [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
  caches


  
Can 
  we make that an event cache?

  

    

    
-----Original Message-----
From: 
    az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
    Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 AM
To: 
    'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 
    Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
    caches


    
But it would solve the issue,

    
simple and Quick.

    
 

    
We 
    can make him an offer he can't refuse!

    
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the 
    lake.  ;)

    

      
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson 
      [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 
      AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: 
      [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
      caches


      
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public 
      threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, 
      Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.

      
 

      
LOL,

      
CacheLess

      

        

        
-----Original Message-----
From: 
        az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
        [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
        Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 
        AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: 
        [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
        caches


        
 

        

          
 I will only say one thing 
          about this,

          
We should in the words of Tony 
          (from the Soprano's)

          
Wack the *******  
          *****.

          
 

          
 Tres 
          Hombres!!!


------_=_NextPart_001_01C3132D.1F972100--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 18:09:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:09:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <3EB5A3D9.4010207@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: 

I agree with you on that one, Brian.

Some people tell me I have a twisted sense of humor, so it should come as no
surprise that I actually chuckled when I read the Cache Pirate's post and
bio. I would have been upset if he/she had taken the cache and logbooks as
well, since those are the real "gold" to be found, in my opinion. But
because I find caches only for the experience of the visit and the adventure
of the find, not for the goodies within, I wasn't too bothered that someone
plundered the trinkets from these caches. Besides, it seems like this
particular pirate has a plan to create a cache somewhere and store all the
stolen stuff -- a creative new idea on the geocaching game. Whether he/she
actually does create this cache remains to be seen, but I'm intrigued by the
idea.

For those of you who feel "violated" that your caches were plundered, I
guess I can understand that as well. Some of the items may have been special
to you, while others would view them as junk. I hope y'all aren't too hurt
by it. Like I said, it seems that the pirate only took the trinkets. If they
had been really malicious, they would have removed the whole cache, thus
leaving fellow searchers frustrated throughout the valley (and my view of
them would change for the worse). I will certainly chip in to help re-stock
these caches with various dollar store items (not of the McJunk variety
either). So let's not start a big lynch mob over the whole thing.

But I can tell you that I am disgusted when I find so much junk in a cache
that the container can barely be closed. I have only done some "spring
cleaning" on one occasion such as this, and it was for a cache in Hawaii
that was no longer being maintained, since it was placed by a tourist from
the mainland (a whole different issue that I won't get into now).

Anyway, the cache pirate made me laugh, especially with the Disneyland
"Pirates of the Carribbean" song and the skull and crossbones idea. Pretty
clever. Sadistic, yes, but clever as well. Sorry if I offended anyone by
finding humor in this whole thing. (And for any of you would-be detectives
who watch too much TV -- no, I'm not the pirate.) :D

As for the membership/non-membership argument, I notice that you can become
a monthly member for three lousy dollars. Is this the same as the year-long
membership, only in quicker installments? If so, if you're changing your
caches to MEMBER-ONLY to prevent plundering, all the priate has to do is pay
three bucks, and then your caches are once again visible. Likewise, for
those on the fence, this is a cheap way to help support Geocaching.com, a
website that gives us plenty of entertainment. I became an annual member
last month, after enjoying the site for free since May of 2002. Whether you
support it or not is your own choice. I'm not going to judge you either way.
But now there is a three-dollar option, so at least it's more affordable on
a short-term basis.

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Brian
Cluff
Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2003 4:36 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


With all the talk about the cache pie-rat I though I would point out
that they, whoever they are, are leaving everything of any value behind.
    The stuff they are taking is stuff that I would throw away if I were
spring cleaning.
As long as my log books are intact, I don't think it's a huge loss, and
I might not ever restock it, and let it be a log only cache with the
possibility of leaving stuff if you wanted to.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 18:13:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:13:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Combining an event cache with a webcam cache
In-Reply-To: <20030505153021.48195.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

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That's a good idea, Ken. I haven't scored that cache yet, either. Someone
told me that the cam shoots the same angles at the same time every day, so
it wouldn't be too difficult to plan an appearance by us. It holds it's
position for 30 minutes at a time, I believe.

I would love to make a lunch trip to Mama's Pizza sometime. It's been years
since I had a "Killer Calzone."

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Ken
Akerman
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 8:30 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Combining an event cache with a webcam cache


The pizza event sounds like a good idea.  I would recommend having it at a
place in downtown Tempe so we could get on Smile for Sneaky Peak (the
closest cache to my home that I haven't claimed yet).  Someone should bring
a laptop computer and monitor the location of the webcam while we are at the
restaurant, then when the camera is zoomed in on a place on the street, we
should all go there together to get on the cam.

Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish  wrote:
  How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?

  then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?

  just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers???


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That's=20
a good idea, Ken. I haven't scored that cache yet, either. Someone told m=
e that=20
the cam shoots the same angles at the same time every day, so it wouldn't=
 be too=20
difficult to plan an appearance by us. It holds it's position for 30 minu=
tes at=20
a time, I believe.


 


I=20
would love to make a lunch trip to Mama's Pizza sometime. It's been years=
 since=20
I had a "Killer Calzone."


 


-FroBro Q-Tip


 


 


-----Original Message-----
From:=20
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Ken=20
Akerman
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 8:30 AM
To:=20
listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Combinin=
g an=20
event cache with a webcam cache



The pizza event sounds like a good idea.  I would recommend hav=
ing it=20
at a place in downtown Tempe so we could get on Smil=
e for=20
Sneaky Peak (the closest cache to my home that I haven't claimed yet)=
=2E =20
Someone should bring a laptop computer and monitor the location of the we=
bcam=20
while we are at the restaurant, then when the camera is zoomed in on a pl=
ace on=20
the street, we should all go there together to get on the cam.


 


Ken (a.k.a.=20
Highpointer)

Team Evil Fish=20
<buggers@mindspring.com> wrote:


  
  

  
How does June 6ish look for a evening =
Pizza Event=20
  Cache?

  
 

  
then May 31ish for a morning=20
  Breakfast Cache?

  
 

  
just thinking aloud.....any Tucson=20
  Takers???
=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D







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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 18:37:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 11:37:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my ca
Message-ID: 

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I was wondering when someone was going to get off the fence and actually =
say what they really feel toward this individual!  [:-D]  =20

I found myself counting the asterisks and trying to substitute words . . =
. but I came up blank.  [;-)]

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:45 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I wil=
l protect my caches


 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.

 Tres Hombres!!!

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I was wondering when someone was going to=
 get off the fence and actually say what they really feel toward this ind=
ividual!  [:-D]  
 
 
 
I found myself c=
ounting the asterisks and trying to substitute words . . . but I came up =
blank.  [;-)]
 
 
 
RandMan
 
 =

 
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Ford, De=
nny
 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 20=
03 7:45 AM
 
To: 'listserv@azg=
eocaching.com'
 
Subject: RE: =
[Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my =
caches
 
 
    
 
 
 
 I will only say one thing a=
bout this,
 
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
 
Wack the=
 *******  *****.
 
 
  Tres Hombres!!!=



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 19:21:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 12:21:28 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my ca
Message-ID: 

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That's a great idea!  We could have an event cache on the lake and have t=
he Pirate walk the gangplank!

RandMan  =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Tomlinson
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:35 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I wil=
l protect my caches

Can we make that an event cache?
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching=
-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I wil=
l protect my caches


But it would solve the issue,
simple and Quick.

We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I wil=
l protect my caches


Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats an=
d then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, Tres Hombres? =
 We just can't take you anywhere.

LOL,
CacheLess
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching=
-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I wil=
l protect my caches



 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.

 Tres Hombres!!!

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That's a great idea!  We could =
have an event cache on the lake and have the Pirate walk the gangplank! 
 
 
RandMan  
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Bill Tomlinson
 =

Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:35 A=
M
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.=
com
 
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocach=
ing] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches 
 
    
Can we make that an event cache?
 
 
=
 
-----Original Message-----
From: az-=
geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@li=
stserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ford, Denny
Sent: =
Monday, May 05, 2003 10:25 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is =
how I will protect my caches

 
But it would s=
olve the issue,
 
simple and Quick.
 
 
 
We can make him an o=
ffer he can't refuse!
 
a pair of =
cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson=
 [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:=
56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-=
Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my cach=
es

 
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the=
 dangers of making public threats and then I read this one.  What ar=
e we going to do with you, Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you any=
where.
 
 
 
L=
OL,
 
CacheLess
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv=
.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] =
On Behalf Of Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40=
 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-=
Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my cach=
es

 
=
 
 
 &n=
bsp;I will only say one thing about this=
,
 
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
 
Wack the *******&nb=
sp; *****.
 
 
 
 Tres Hombres!!!
=


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 20:29:12 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 13:29:12 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I will protect my caches
References: 
Message-ID: <002b01c31344$fe582800$9d8e3a41@fishkiller>

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MessageWHAT? so he can find Team Evil Fish's cache :)
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ford, Denny=20
  To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'=20
  Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:24 AM
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I =
will protect my caches


  But it would solve the issue,
  simple and Quick.

  We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
  a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)
    -----Original Message-----
    From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
    Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how =
I will protect my caches


    Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public =
threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, =
Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.

    LOL,
    CacheLess
      -----Original Message-----
      From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Ford, Denny
      Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
      To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
      Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is =
how I will protect my caches



         I will only say one thing about this,
        We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
        Wack the *******  *****.

         Tres Hombres!!!
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Message






WHAT? so he can find Team Evil Fish's =
cache=20
:)



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Ford, Denny 

  
  
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 =
10:24 AM

  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache Pirate=20
  on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

  


  
But=20
  it would solve the issue,

  
simple and Quick.

  
 

  
We=20
  can make him an offer he can't refuse!

  
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the =
lake. =20
  ;)

  

    
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson=20
    [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, =
2003 9:56=20
    AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.comSubject:=20
    RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will =
protect my=20
    caches


    
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of =
making public=20
    threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with =
you,=20
    Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you =
anywhere.

    
 

    
LOL,

    
CacheLess

    

      

      
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
      az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On =
Behalf Of=20
      Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 =
AM
To:=20
      'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache=20
      Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my=20
      caches


      
 

      

        
 I will only say =
one thing=20
        about this,

        
We should in the words =
of Tony=20
        (from the Soprano's)

        
Wack the *******  =

        *****.

        
 
        
 Tres=20
        =
Hombres!!!


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 20:37:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ford, Denny)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 13:37:30 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose:  Here is how I wil
 l protect my caches
Message-ID: 

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Those lakes are not deep enough, 

-----Original Message-----
From: Team Evil Fish [mailto:buggers@mindspring.com]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 1:29 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


WHAT? so he can find Team Evil Fish's cache :)

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Ford, Denny   
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'   
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:24 AM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

But it would solve the issue,
simple and Quick.
 
We can make him an offer he can't refuse!
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the lake.  ;)

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to
do with you, Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.
 
LOL,
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches


 

 I will only say one thing about this,
We should in the words of Tony (from the Soprano's)
Wack the *******  *****.
 
 Tres Hombres!!!


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Message






Those 
lakes are not deep enough, 



  
-----Original Message-----
From: Team Evil Fish 
  [mailto:buggers@mindspring.com]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 1:29 
  PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: 
  [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
  caches


  
WHAT? so he can find Team Evil Fish's cache 
  :)

  

    
----- Original Message ----- 

    
    
    
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 10:24 
    AM

    
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 
    Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my caches

    


    
But it would solve the issue,

    
simple and Quick.

    
 

    
We 
    can make him an offer he can't refuse!

    
a pair of cement shoes, and a visit to the 
    lake.  ;)

    

      
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Tomlinson 
      [mailto:billtomlinson@qwest.net]
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 9:56 
      AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: 
      RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect 
      my caches


      
Ironic.  I just sent a note about the dangers of making public 
      threats and then I read this one.  What are we going to do with you, 
      Tres Hombres?  We just can't take you anywhere.

      
 

      
LOL,

      
CacheLess

      

        

        
-----Original Message-----
From: 
        az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
        [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
        Ford, Denny
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 7:40 
        AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: 
        [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate on the loose: Here is how I will protect my 
        caches


        
 

        

          
 I will only say one thing 
          about this,

          
We should in the words of Tony 
          (from the Soprano's)

          
Wack the *******  
          *****.

          
 

          
 Tres 
          Hombres!!!


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:06:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:06:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References: 
Message-ID: 

Replies inline...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brent Milner" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 11:09 AM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


> I agree with you on that one, Brian.
>
> Some people tell me I have a twisted sense of humor, so it should come as
no
> surprise that I actually chuckled when I read the Cache Pirate's post and
> bio. I would have been upset if he/she had taken the cache and logbooks as
> well, since those are the real "gold" to be found, in my opinion. But
> because I find caches only for the experience of the visit and the
adventure
> of the find, not for the goodies within, I wasn't too bothered that
someone
> plundered the trinkets from these caches. Besides, it seems like this
> particular pirate has a plan to create a cache somewhere and store all the
> stolen stuff -- a creative new idea on the geocaching game. Whether he/she
> actually does create this cache remains to be seen, but I'm intrigued by
the
> idea.
>

Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but maybe
we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the info
yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners (and
whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad that
even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not been
very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better if
this was his thinking.

Curious...  What if this was the case.  Who'd still be ready to lynch him?

> For those of you who feel "violated" that your caches were plundered, I
> guess I can understand that as well. Some of the items may have been
special
> to you, while others would view them as junk. I hope y'all aren't too hurt
> by it. Like I said, it seems that the pirate only took the trinkets. If
they
> had been really malicious, they would have removed the whole cache, thus
> leaving fellow searchers frustrated throughout the valley (and my view of
> them would change for the worse). I will certainly chip in to help
re-stock
> these caches with various dollar store items (not of the McJunk variety
> either). So let's not start a big lynch mob over the whole thing.

Anyone have a disposable camera in the pludered caches?  Was it taken?
That'd piss me right off, joke or not.



> Anyway, the cache pirate made me laugh, especially with the Disneyland
> "Pirates of the Carribbean" song and the skull and crossbones idea. Pretty
> clever. Sadistic, yes, but clever as well. Sorry if I offended anyone by
> finding humor in this whole thing. (And for any of you would-be detectives
> who watch too much TV -- no, I'm not the pirate.) :D

I'm always ragging people about not having a sense of humor.  Now it seems I
lost mine for a bit as I was rather irritated.  Thanks for reminding me.
;-)

>
> As for the membership/non-membership argument, I notice that you can
become
> a monthly member for three lousy dollars. Is this the same as the
year-long
> membership, only in quicker installments? If so, if you're changing your
> caches to MEMBER-ONLY to prevent plundering, all the priate has to do is
pay
> three bucks, and then your caches are once again visible.



Agreed that MO caches are hardly an answer.  I'm a member, but I don't agree
with the idea MO caches at all.  Sorta makes them commercial, which is
against GC.com general policy anyway.  Ironic.


-T.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:19:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 23:19:36 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I think he's right
Message-ID: 






Whoever it was who said this vermin was one of us, I think he's right. Here's the latest missive from Mad Morty posted on Hidden Meadows around the Bend. The cache was archived by the owner after finding the container missing. They weren't happy. (By the way Morty, a nice cache was lost thanks to you, are you happy with your stupid "joke"?)


Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate| has logged a cache on your watch 
list (Hidden Meadows - Around the Bend). You can visit the cache at the 
following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=40095

User comments:
Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and 
will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be 
placed at another location for another cacher to find  replaced at the 
original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER remove 
the container or logbook.



Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8  and get 2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:31:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:31:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I think he's right
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <00b101c3135e$767fdad0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_00B2_01C31323.CA2102D0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ooooh...  He has scruples!  And to think we were bad mouthing him.  =
Shame on
us.
=20
What a loser!

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of gale =
and
mike
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I think he's right



Whoever it was who said this vermin was one of us, I think he's right.
Here's the latest missive from Mad Morty posted on Hidden Meadows around =
the
Bend. The cache was archived by the owner after finding the container
missing. They weren't happy. (By the way Morty, a nice cache was lost =
thanks
to you, are you happy with your stupid "joke"?)

Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate| has logged a cache on your watch=20
list (Hidden Meadows - Around the Bend). You can visit the cache at the=20
following link:

 
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D40095

User comments:
Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and=20
will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be=20
placed at another location for another cacher to find  replaced at the=20
original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER =
remove=20
the container or logbook.





  _____ =20

Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8   and =
get
2 months FREE* =
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your =
setting,
subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20


------=_NextPart_000_00B2_01C31323.CA2102D0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable




Message




Ooooh...  He has scruples!  And to think we were bad =
mouthing=20
him.  Shame on us.


 


What a=20
loser!



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  gale and mike
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:20 =
PM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I think =
he's=20
  right


  

  

  

  
Whoever it was who said this vermin was one of us, I think he's =
right.=20
  Here's the latest missive from Mad Morty posted on Hidden Meadows =
around the=20
  Bend. The cache was archived by the owner after finding the container =
missing.=20
  They weren't happy. (By the way Morty, a nice cache was lost thanks to =
you,=20
  are you happy with your stupid "joke"?)

  
Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate| has logged a cache on your =
watch=20
  
list (Hidden Meadows - Around the Bend). You can visit the cache =
at the=20
  
following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D400=
95

User=20
  comments:
Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have =
plundered=20
  and 
will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the =
contents to be=20
  
placed at another location for another cacher to find  =
replaced at=20
  the 
original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not =
EVER=20
  remove 
the container or logbook.




  

  Help STOP SPAM with the new =
MSN 8=20
  and get 2 months FREE*=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
  http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
  Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =



------=_NextPart_000_00B2_01C31323.CA2102D0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:32:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:32:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References:  
Message-ID: <053401c3135e$99f6ae80$319c4094@BILLPC>

If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from each owner.  Is that
the case?

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hernlund" 
>
> Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but maybe
> we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the info
> yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners (and
> whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad that
> even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not been
> very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better if
> this was his thinking.




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:44:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:44:40 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <053401c3135e$99f6ae80$319c4094@BILLPC>
Message-ID: 

Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty much describes
exactly what the plan is: (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)

Profile for Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate| 
Member since May, 2003 
Email this user 
Last visit: 5/5/2003

Caches Found/Hidden: 0/0
Travel Bugs Owned/Found: 0/0
Benchmarks Found: 0

 
Background:
Yo Ho Yo Ho a Pirates Life for Me, I pirate caches all over North
America, plundering your goods and taking
them back to hide them in another cache for you to find. ARRRGHH.
HAHAHAHAHA

Read the Info below...


ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's.
Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that yee
neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the
contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them
again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within another
cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it back to the
original location only if yee can replace it, if not leave it there for
another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's only one of me, and your
job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty McVane.
So you don't like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag me or
identify me in the field you must say so to me at the time of the
sighting. Then Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the capture and
a prize rewarded to the person or Team responsible.
No emails saying you saw me or the likes. It must be a field capture
matey's. So many good idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee
fruitless meanderings. On with the hunt!
Good Luck Land Lubbers...
 
Other Hobbies:
Plundering your caches. Signs of me visiting your cache include an
emptied out cache and a time,dated, Skull and Crossbones mark in the
logbook by me your Cache Pirate Captain Mad Morty McVane.

Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and
will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be
placed at another location for another cacher to find replaced at the
original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER
remove the container or logbook.
 
Latest News:
Captain Mad Morty McVane is always looking to Shanghai new recruits...so
beware

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
each owner.  Is that
the case?

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hernlund" 
>
> Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
maybe
> we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
info
> yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
(and
> whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
that
> even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
been
> very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
if
> this was his thinking.



____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:50:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:50:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References:   <053401c3135e$99f6ae80$319c4094@BILLPC>
Message-ID: 

Hmmm...

Just read this...

http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=122054

Dunno how I feel about that.


-T.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


> If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
each owner.  Is that
> the case?
>
> Bill
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> >
> > Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but maybe
> > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
info
> > yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
(and
> > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
that
> > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
been
> > very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
if
> > this was his thinking.
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May  5 23:58:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:58:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

I still think this is a good, harmless, and creative spin on the game. I
will keep my eye (the one without the patch) on the lookout for this pirate.
>From what I've read thus far, it doesn't look like Capt. Morty has done
anything wrong, especially if all the cache contents are individually bagged
and waiting in a different cache location. It sounds like the pirate is
leaving clues as to where they may be located.

I think we're all just a little bit on edge and people are prematurely
jumping into a defensive stance bearing fangs just because someone has a new
idea.

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Aus
Dem Kasten
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty much describes
exactly what the plan is: (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)

Profile for Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate|
Member since May, 2003
Email this user
Last visit: 5/5/2003

Caches Found/Hidden: 0/0
Travel Bugs Owned/Found: 0/0
Benchmarks Found: 0


Background:
Yo Ho Yo Ho a Pirates Life for Me, I pirate caches all over North
America, plundering your goods and taking
them back to hide them in another cache for you to find. ARRRGHH.
HAHAHAHAHA

Read the Info below...


ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's.
Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that yee
neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the
contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them
again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within another
cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it back to the
original location only if yee can replace it, if not leave it there for
another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's only one of me, and your
job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty McVane.
So you don't like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag me or
identify me in the field you must say so to me at the time of the
sighting. Then Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the capture and
a prize rewarded to the person or Team responsible.
No emails saying you saw me or the likes. It must be a field capture
matey's. So many good idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee
fruitless meanderings. On with the hunt!
Good Luck Land Lubbers...

Other Hobbies:
Plundering your caches. Signs of me visiting your cache include an
emptied out cache and a time,dated, Skull and Crossbones mark in the
logbook by me your Cache Pirate Captain Mad Morty McVane.

Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and
will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be
placed at another location for another cacher to find replaced at the
original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER
remove the container or logbook.

Latest News:
Captain Mad Morty McVane is always looking to Shanghai new recruits...so
beware

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Bill
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
each owner.  Is that
the case?

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hernlund" 
>
> Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
maybe
> we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
info
> yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
(and
> whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
that
> even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
been
> very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
if
> this was his thinking.



____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:03:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:03:46 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

So I don't suppose anyone has found one of his bags?  It also seems like part
of his game is to have someone find him - maybe his clues can be used by a
genius cacher to track him down and "tag" him?  Maybe that will end his game.

At this point, though I don't like his game, it almost sounds like an
interesting variant on our game.....

Jim.

On Mon, 5 May 2003, Brent Milner wrote:

> I still think this is a good, harmless, and creative spin on the game. I
> will keep my eye (the one without the patch) on the lookout for this pirate.
> >From what I've read thus far, it doesn't look like Capt. Morty has done
> anything wrong, especially if all the cache contents are individually bagged
> and waiting in a different cache location. It sounds like the pirate is
> leaving clues as to where they may be located.
> 
> I think we're all just a little bit on edge and people are prematurely
> jumping into a defensive stance bearing fangs just because someone has a new
> idea.
> 
> -FroBro Q-Tip
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Aus
> Dem Kasten
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
> 
> Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty much describes
> exactly what the plan is: (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)
> 
> Profile for Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate|
> Member since May, 2003
> Email this user
> Last visit: 5/5/2003
> 
> Caches Found/Hidden: 0/0
> Travel Bugs Owned/Found: 0/0
> Benchmarks Found: 0
> 
> 
> Background:
> Yo Ho Yo Ho a Pirates Life for Me, I pirate caches all over North
> America, plundering your goods and taking
> them back to hide them in another cache for you to find. ARRRGHH.
> HAHAHAHAHA
> 
> Read the Info below...
> 
> 
> ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's.
> Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that yee
> neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the
> contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them
> again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within another
> cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it back to the
> original location only if yee can replace it, if not leave it there for
> another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's only one of me, and your
> job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty McVane.
> So you don't like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag me or
> identify me in the field you must say so to me at the time of the
> sighting. Then Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the capture and
> a prize rewarded to the person or Team responsible.
> No emails saying you saw me or the likes. It must be a field capture
> matey's. So many good idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee
> fruitless meanderings. On with the hunt!
> Good Luck Land Lubbers...
> 
> Other Hobbies:
> Plundering your caches. Signs of me visiting your cache include an
> emptied out cache and a time,dated, Skull and Crossbones mark in the
> logbook by me your Cache Pirate Captain Mad Morty McVane.
> 
> Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and
> will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be
> placed at another location for another cacher to find replaced at the
> original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER
> remove the container or logbook.
> 
> Latest News:
> Captain Mad Morty McVane is always looking to Shanghai new recruits...so
> beware
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Bill
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
> If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
> each owner.  Is that
> the case?
> 
> Bill
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> >
> > Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
> maybe
> > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
> info
> > yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
> (and
> > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
> that
> > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
> been
> > very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
> if
> > this was his thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> ====
> This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
> or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
> must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
> ====
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:04:38 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:04:38 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References:   <053401c3135e$99f6ae80$319c4094@BILLPC> 
Message-ID: 

I decided that I can forgive Mortey.  It's a slick concept and kinda funny
now that I have all the info.  I don't feel bad for being annoyed, but I'm
not annoyed anymore.

He should have planned it better and stated the terms of his plundering in
the first place.  Then it probably would have been better received.

That's all just me though.  Some people probably won't have any sense of
humor about it no matter what you tell them.


-T.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hernlund" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


> Hmmm...
>
> Just read this...
>
> http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=122054
>
> Dunno how I feel about that.
>
>
> -T.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill" 
> To: 
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
>
>
> > If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
> each owner.  Is that
> > the case?
> >
> > Bill
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> > >
> > > Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
maybe
> > > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
> info
> > > yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
> (and
> > > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
> that
> > > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
> been
> > > very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
> if
> > > this was his thinking.
> >
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:10:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 17:10:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505170947.018b6f88@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 05:03 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>At this point, though I don't like his game, it almost sounds like an
>interesting variant on our game.....

I am willing to bet that once this person is "tagged" it will turn out to 
be a very high profile cacher that everyone already knows.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:13:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 17:13:30 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
 
 <053401c3135e$99f6ae80$319c4094@BILLPC>
 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505171122.018c4120@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 05:04 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>I decided that I can forgive Mortey.  It's a slick concept and kinda funny
>now that I have all the info.  I don't feel bad for being annoyed, but I'm
>not annoyed anymore.

I agree.  The more I think about this, and after having read the latest 
profile, I sort of find all this as being very creative.  Speaking only for 
myself, after 300 finds there are parts of this game that are getting a 
little routine.  This could be a spark that adds some excitement to the 
game again.

>He should have planned it better and stated the terms of his plundering in
>the first place.  Then it probably would have been better received.

Agreed again.  As I said in a previous message, my prediction is that this 
is someone that most or all of us know, and is a high profile cacher.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:17:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:17:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would seem that
Mortey hasn't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wait to see, I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almost sounds like Mortey
is someone we all know, because we're supposed to figure out his identity.
Either that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and ask, "Are
you the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
buffs.)

Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot Mad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:05 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


I decided that I can forgive Mortey.  It's a slick concept and kinda funny
now that I have all the info.  I don't feel bad for being annoyed, but I'm
not annoyed anymore.

He should have planned it better and stated the terms of his plundering in
the first place.  Then it probably would have been better received.

That's all just me though.  Some people probably won't have any sense of
humor about it no matter what you tell them.


-T.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Terry Hernlund" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


> Hmmm...
>
> Just read this...
>
> http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=122054
>
> Dunno how I feel about that.
>
>
> -T.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill" 
> To: 
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
>
>
> > If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from
> each owner.  Is that
> > the case?
> >
> > Bill
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> > >
> > > Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
maybe
> > > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the
> info
> > > yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners
> (and
> > > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
> that
> > > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not
> been
> > > very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little better
> if
> > > this was his thinking.
> >
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
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====




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:16:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Brown)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:16:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

Hey,
My bet is that Team TJ is back in town.  Probably only a few of us out
there remember "The Other Yellow Jeep".

Cody,
Team CBX2




|---------+--------------------------------------------->
|         |           Scott Wood                        |
|         |                     |
|         |           Sent by:                          |
|         |           az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeo|
|         |           caching.com                       |
|         |                                             |
|         |                                             |
|         |           05/05/2003 05:10 PM               |
|         |           Please respond to listserv        |
|         |                                             |
|---------+--------------------------------------------->
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
  |                                                                                                              |
  |       To:       listserv@azgeocaching.com                                                                    |
  |       cc:                                                                                                    |
  |       bcc:                                                                                                   |
  |       Subject:  RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates                                                       |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|




At 05:03 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>At this point, though I don't like his game, it almost sounds like an
>interesting variant on our game.....

I am willing to bet that once this person is "tagged" it will turn out to
be a very high profile cacher that everyone already knows.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:26:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 17:26:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505172549.01918378@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 05:17 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot Mad
>Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

Sort of makes me wish I was in the Phoenix area more often.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:28:21 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 17:28:21 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505172717.0193db60@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 05:16 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:


>Hey,
>My bet is that Team TJ is back in town.  Probably only a few of us out
>there remember "The Other Yellow Jeep".

Perhaps azgeocaching.com should setup a place for all of us to secretly 
list who we think it is, and why.  After the gig is up, the list could be 
made public and we could all see if anyone got it right or not.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:28:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:28:28 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030506002828.44329.qmail@web40608.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty
> much describes exactly what the plan is: 
> (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)

Amusing. It looks like there are some MO caches he
wants to involve in the game. 

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:34:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:34:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <00b801c31367$4ce19fc0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

I agree.  Game or not, my cache was not entered.  He has no right to plunder
it.  Now, all finders would have to go away empty handed which isn't the way
geocaching was meant to be and not the way my cache was created.  Plenty of
people on this list have griped about the time and money spent placing
caches.  I agree, and now I have to go spend more time and more money
because he, without asking, chose to include one of my caches in his "game".
You can bet I'll "tag" him if I see him.

Sad part is, it might have been fun had he been up front about it.  His only
redemption would be to take my cache contents that he has "bagged and
relocated" and replace them before I replenish my cache.

CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Jim
Scotti
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:04 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


So I don't suppose anyone has found one of his bags?  It also seems like
part of his game is to have someone find him - maybe his clues can be used
by a genius cacher to track him down and "tag" him?  Maybe that will end his
game.

At this point, though I don't like his game, it almost sounds like an
interesting variant on our game.....

Jim.

On Mon, 5 May 2003, Brent Milner wrote:

> I still think this is a good, harmless, and creative spin on the game. 
> I will keep my eye (the one without the patch) on the lookout for this 
> pirate.
> >From what I've read thus far, it doesn't look like Capt. Morty has 
> >done
> anything wrong, especially if all the cache contents are individually 
> bagged and waiting in a different cache location. It sounds like the 
> pirate is leaving clues as to where they may be located.
> 
> I think we're all just a little bit on edge and people are prematurely 
> jumping into a defensive stance bearing fangs just because someone has 
> a new idea.
> 
> -FroBro Q-Tip
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Aus 
> Dem Kasten
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:45 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
> 
> Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty much describes 
> exactly what the plan is: (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)
> 
> Profile for Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate|
> Member since May, 2003
> Email this user
> Last visit: 5/5/2003
> 
> Caches Found/Hidden: 0/0
> Travel Bugs Owned/Found: 0/0
> Benchmarks Found: 0
> 
> 
> Background:
> Yo Ho Yo Ho a Pirates Life for Me, I pirate caches all over North 
> America, plundering your goods and taking them back to hide them in 
> another cache for you to find. ARRRGHH. HAHAHAHAHA
> 
> Read the Info below...
> 
> 
> ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's. 
> Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that yee 
> neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the 
> contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them 
> again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within another 
> cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it back to the 
> original location only if yee can replace it, if not leave it there 
> for another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's only one of me, and 
> your job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty McVane. So you don't 
> like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag me or identify me in 
> the field you must say so to me at the time of the sighting. Then 
> Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the capture and a prize 
> rewarded to the person or Team responsible. No emails saying you saw 
> me or the likes. It must be a field capture matey's. So many good 
> idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee fruitless meanderings. 
> On with the hunt! Good Luck Land Lubbers...
> 
> Other Hobbies:
> Plundering your caches. Signs of me visiting your cache include an 
> emptied out cache and a time,dated, Skull and Crossbones mark in the 
> logbook by me your Cache Pirate Captain Mad Morty McVane.
> 
> Capt Mad Mortey McVane here, as with all caches I have plundered and 
> will plunder in the future. I take and bag/tag only the contents to be 
> placed at another location for another cacher to find replaced at the 
> original cache by the finder. Capt Mad Mortey McVane does not EVER 
> remove the container or logbook.
> 
> Latest News:
> Captain Mad Morty McVane is always looking to Shanghai new 
> recruits...so beware
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
> Bill
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
> If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache 
> from each owner.  Is that the case?
> 
> Bill
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> >
> > Hmmm...  Hadn't thought of that.  It's not funny at the moment but
> maybe
> > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all 
> > the
> info
> > yet.  Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache 
> > owners
> (and
> > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is.  Too bad
> that
> > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has 
> > not
> been
> > very well received thus far.  Morty could have planned a little 
> > better
> if
> > this was his thinking.
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> ====
> This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use or 
> disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message 
> must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized 
> recipient. ====
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/


____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:40:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:40:55 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505171122.018c4120@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: 

Hmmmm...Trisha has been a bit quiet on all of this... ;)

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Scott
Wood
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:14 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


At 05:04 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>I decided that I can forgive Mortey.  It's a slick concept and kinda funny
>now that I have all the info.  I don't feel bad for being annoyed, but I'm
>not annoyed anymore.

I agree.  The more I think about this, and after having read the latest
profile, I sort of find all this as being very creative.  Speaking only for
myself, after 300 finds there are parts of this game that are getting a
little routine.  This could be a spark that adds some excitement to the
game again.

>He should have planned it better and stated the terms of his plundering in
>the first place.  Then it probably would have been better received.

Agreed again.  As I said in a previous message, my prediction is that this
is someone that most or all of us know, and is a high profile cacher.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

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http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 00:39:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 17:39:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <20030506002828.44329.qmail@web40608.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00b901c31368$05fe6330$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

Everybody's a member.  You have to be a member to log anything.  Charter
Members are the one's who've paid.

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Eric
Quinn
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:28 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates



--- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty
> much describes exactly what the plan is:
> (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)

Amusing. It looks like there are some MO caches he
wants to involve in the game. 

__________________________________
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The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com
____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 01:18:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 01:18:42 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 





That link doesn't work for me. All I get is a log in page that won't let me log in.







Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898








>From: "Terry Hernlund" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates 

>Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:50:06 -0700 

> 

>Hmmm... 

> 

>Just read this... 

> 

>http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=122054 

> 

>Dunno how I feel about that. 

> 

> 

>-T. 

> 

> 

>----- Original Message ----- 

>From: "Bill" 

>To: 

>Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 4:32 PM 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates 

> 

> 

> > If that were the plan, he would have plundered only a single cache from 

>each owner. Is that 

> > the case? 

> > 

> > Bill 

> > 

> > ----- Original Message ----- 

> > From: "Terry Hernlund" 

> > > 

> > > Hmmm... Hadn't thought of that. It's not funny at the moment but maybe 

> > > we're missing the bigger picture because we haven't been given all the 

>info 

> > > yet. Maybe it'll turn out to be an event cache where the cache owners 

>(and 

> > > whoever else) all go to the spot where the hidden booty is. Too bad 

>that 

> > > even if that was the plan it'll probably not happen now as it has not 

>been 

> > > very well received thus far. Morty could have planned a little better 

>if 

> > > this was his thinking. 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > ____________________________________________________________ 

> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> > 

> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

> > http://www.azgeocaching.com 

> > 

>____________________________________________________________ 

>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> 

>Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

>http://www.azgeocaching.com 


Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 01:27:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 01:27:32 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirates revisited
Message-ID: 




Okay, where is this information from? I don't see it on his profile or elsewhere on the website. Someone said MO caches are involved. Where is this please.


There was no damage done? I spoken with newbie cachers who were distressed by this. I wonder how many new cachers might drop out of the game because of this. There is also an archived cache because of this. Yes it would have been a fun "game" if it was done right. Perhaps a heads up before the plundering that it was a new game, or posted on the profile beforehand that it was all a game. Or an e-mail to the listserv when we first started whining (including me) about it. The fact is that some geocachers were hurt (see above). Yo ho ho ho.














>From: "Aus Dem Kasten" 


>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates 

>Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:44:40 -0700 







 


>ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's. 


>Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that yee 

>neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the 

>contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them 

>again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within another 

>cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it back to the 

>original location only if yee can replace it, if not leave it there for 

>another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's only one of me, and your 

>job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty McVane. 

>So you don't like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag me or 

>identify me in the field you must say so to me at the time of the 

>sighting. Then Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the capture and 

>a prize rewarded to the person or Team responsible. 

>No emails saying you saw me or the likes. It must be a field capture 

>matey's. So many good idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee 

>fruitless meanderings. On with the hunt! 

>Good Luck Land Lubbers... 

> 




STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 01:36:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:36:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <00b901c31368$05fe6330$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: <20030506013605.56800.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Bill Tomlinson  wrote:
> Everybody's a member.  You have to be a member to
> log anything.  Charter
> Members are the one's who've paid.
 
Doh! You're right.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 01:37:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian LaFrance)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:37:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <00b801c31367$4ce19fc0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: 

Holy cow people...GEOCACHING IS A GAME!!!  Straight from Geocaching.com
"Geocaching is an entertaining adventure game for gps users. "  If you place
a cache, you enter the game...like it or not.  Give this guy a chance...if
he follows through, it will be cool.  If he doesn't then we can hunt him
down and hack off his manhood.

Brian
Team AZ Evil


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bill
Tomlinson
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:35 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


I agree.  Game or not, my cache was not entered.  He has no right to plunder
it.  Now, all finders would have to go away empty handed which isn't the way
geocaching was meant to be and not the way my cache was created.  Plenty of
people on this list have griped about the time and money spent placing
caches.  I agree, and now I have to go spend more time and more money
because he, without asking, chose to include one of my caches in his "game".
You can bet I'll "tag" him if I see him.

Sad part is, it might have been fun had he been up front about it.  His only
redemption would be to take my cache contents that he has "bagged and
relocated" and replace them before I replenish my cache.

CacheLess




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 01:51:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 18:51:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirates revisited
References: 
Message-ID: <3EB7151D.7080201@pcgraffiti.com>

Gale and Mike,

    Open a browser, go to the site, and log in then you should be able 
to go to http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=12205 and see 
the profile.  He is using more than one profile name:


Profile for Capt Mad Mortey McVane |cache_pirate|

and

Profile for Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate)

Also,  Bill cleared up the fact that he is not a charter member.  So no 
MO caches that we know of.  His original username could of course be a 
charter membership.

Aus Dem Kasten

gale and mike wrote:

> Okay, where is this information from? I don't see it on his profile or 
> elsewhere on the website. Someone said MO caches are involved. Where 
> is this please.
>
> There was no damage done? I spoken with newbie cachers who were 
> distressed by this. I wonder how many new cachers might drop out of 
> the game because of this. There is also an archived cache because of 
> this. Yes it would have been a fun "game" if it was done right. 
> Perhaps a heads up before the plundering that it was a new game, or 
> posted on the profile beforehand that it was all a game. Or an e-mail 
> to the listserv when we first started whining (including me) about it. 
> The fact is that some geocachers were hurt (see above). Yo ho ho ho.
>
>
> >From: "Aus Dem Kasten"
> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: >Subject: RE: 
> [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates >Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 16:44:40 -0700
>
>  
>
> >ARRGGGGHHHHHHH, SHIVER ME TIMBERS, you're all a violent lot, Matey's.
>
> >Captain Mad Morty McVane (Cache_Pirate) here to tell yous all that 
> yee >neednt be worried about your caches. It's your job to recover the 
> >contents and place them back whence they came from after I hide them 
> >again. All of the cache's are bagged and will be placed within 
> another >cache nearby, and ifn yee find it your jobn is to take it 
> back to the >original location only if yee can replace it, if not 
> leave it there for >another land lubber to find. Aye Matey there's 
> only one of me, and your >job is to identify and tag Captain Mad Morty 
> McVane. >So you don't like my twist on things ehhhh? Well if yee tag 
> me or >identify me in the field you must say so to me at the time of 
> the >sighting. Then Captain Mad Morty McVane will acknowledge the 
> capture and >a prize rewarded to the person or Team responsible. >No 
> emails saying you saw me or the likes. It must be a field capture 
> >matey's. So many good idea's on how to catch me, but I sneer at yee 
> >fruitless meanderings. On with the hunt! >Good Luck Land Lubbers... >
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8  and 
> get 2 months 
> FREE*____________________________________________________________ 
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your 
> setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 02:18:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Mon, 05 May 2003 19:18:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References: 
Message-ID: <3EB71B71.5040201@pcgraffiti.com>

>Give this guy a chance...if
>he follows through, it will be cool.  If he doesn't then we can hunt him
>down and hack off his manhood.

	I agree, let's see how this plays out, but if not, it might be hard to cut off Morty's manhood if Morty is actually female.  Can't really rule anyone out at this point.

Aus Dem Kasten



Brian LaFrance wrote:

>Holy cow people...GEOCACHING IS A GAME!!!  Straight from Geocaching.com
>"Geocaching is an entertaining adventure game for gps users. "  If you place
>a cache, you enter the game...like it or not.  Give this guy a chance...if
>he follows through, it will be cool.  If he doesn't then we can hunt him
>down and hack off his manhood.
>
>Brian
>Team AZ Evil
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Bill
>Tomlinson
>Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:35 PM
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
>
>
>I agree.  Game or not, my cache was not entered.  He has no right to plunder
>it.  Now, all finders would have to go away empty handed which isn't the way
>geocaching was meant to be and not the way my cache was created.  Plenty of
>people on this list have griped about the time and money spent placing
>caches.  I agree, and now I have to go spend more time and more money
>because he, without asking, chose to include one of my caches in his "game".
>You can bet I'll "tag" him if I see him.
>
>Sad part is, it might have been fun had he been up front about it.  His only
>redemption would be to take my cache contents that he has "bagged and
>relocated" and replace them before I replenish my cache.
>
>CacheLess
>
>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>  
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 02:24:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 19:24:09 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: <20030506013605.56800.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <00ba01c31376$935c1520$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

Of course, I'm always right...  LOL  At least my wife says I THINK I'm
always right.  ;-)

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Eric
Quinn
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 6:36 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates



--- Bill Tomlinson  wrote:
> Everybody's a member.  You have to be a member to
> log anything.  Charter
> Members are the one's who've paid.
 
Doh! You're right.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 03:00:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:00:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Off tropic
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030505091957.0199a210@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030506030023.74029.qmail@web80204.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1786669910-1052190023=:74007
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I agree with Scott, a Saturday lunch or evening pizza event would be good.  It's a long haul from Tucson to the Phoenix area after a full day at work.  Would June 7th work? Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood  wrote:At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:

How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?
 
then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?
 
just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers??
We would love to make it up for an event cache, but Friday nights are going to be tough since we all have to get out of work and then head to Phoenix.  A Saturday night would probably be best.  Breakfast caches for us would probably be out of the picture, just have to get up to early on a weekend morning to make it to Phoenix for breakfast.  A lunch cache might be a good idea.



Scott
scott@myblueheaven.comwww.myblueheaven.com
--0-1786669910-1052190023=:74007
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I agree with Scott, a Saturday lunch or evening pizza event would be good.  It's a long haul from Tucson to the Phoenix area after a full day at work.  Would June 7th work?


 


Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood <scott@myblueheaven.com> wrote:


At 07:03 AM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:



How does June 6ish look for a evening Pizza Event Cache?
 
then May 31ish for a morning Breakfast Cache?
 
just thinking aloud.....any Tucson Takers??

We would love to make it up for an event cache, but Friday nights are going to be tough since we all have to get out of work and then head to Phoenix.  A Saturday night would probably be best.  Breakfast caches for us would probably be out of the picture, just have to get up to early on a weekend morning to make it to Phoenix for breakfast.  A lunch cache might be a good idea.





Scott



scott@myblueheaven.com



--0-1786669910-1052190023=:74007--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 03:07:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:07:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
Message-ID: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>

The New York Times
May 4, 2003
Bah, Wilderness! Reopening a Frontier to Development
By TIMOTHY EGAN

 
SEATTLE - More than a century after historians declared an end to the
American Frontier, the Interior Department made a somewhat similar
announcement last month, with no fanfare. On a Friday night, just after
Congress had left for spring break, the government said it would no
longer consider huge swaths of public land to be wilderness.

The administration declared that it would end reviews of Western
landholdings for new wilderness protection. As long as the lands had
been under consideration for the American wilderness system, they had
temporary protection from development.

With a single order, the Bush administration removed more than 200
million acres from further wilderness study, including caribou stamping
ground in Alaska, the red rock canyons and mesas of southern Utah, Case
Mountain with its sequoia forests in California and a wall of
rainbow-colored rock known as Vermillion Basin in Colorado.

By declaring an end to wild land surveys, the administration ruled out
protection of these areas as formal wilderness - which, by law, are
supposed to be places people can visit but not stay. Now, these areas,
managed by the Bureau of Land Management, could be opened to mining,
drilling, logging or road-building.

The idea of designating an area as wilderness - wild land left as is,
for its own sake - is an American construct. Artists and writers in the
mid-19th century led the charge for wilderness, with Henry David Thoreau
arguing from his pond-side home in Concord, Mass., that wilderness
sanctuaries were a necessary complement to civilization.

In setting aside the first wildlife refuge in 1903, on Pelican Island in
Florida, President Theodore Roosevelt protected a patch of America that
is now the smallest of the formally protected lands - a mere five acres.
And since passage of the Wilderness Act of 1964, 106 million acres have
been given the wild lands designation, with more than half of that total
in Alaska.

Over the years, the Bureau of Land Management, the nation's biggest
landlord, with 262 million acres under its control, has continued to
survey its vast holdings, trying to determine whether more land is
suitable for wilderness. But the Bush administration says wilderness
reviews should have ended 13 years ago, at the close of a study period
mandated by Congress. This interpretation is challenged by
conservationists who plan to appeal the Bush order in court. 

If the Friday night declaration represents the beginning of a broad new
land management policy, the Interior Department has not said so. There
was not even an announcement of the end of the wilderness reviews on the
department's Web site.

Instead, the change came about in a settlement of a 1996 lawsuit filed
by the State of Utah against the Interior Department over a reinventory
of three million acres conducted by Bruce Babbitt, the interior
secretary at the time. Most of the lawsuit had been dismissed and sat
dormant until the state amended its complaint in March.

"This does not mean that someday down the road we may still manage some
of these lands as wilderness," said Patricia Lynn Scarlett, an assistant
interior secretary.

The move follows a consistent pattern in the president's environmental
policy: to change the way the land is managed, without changing the law.
Whether the issue is allowing snowmobiles in Yellowstone National Park
or logging in the Pacific Northwest, the course has been to settle
lawsuits by opponents of wild land protection, opening up the areas to
wide use, without going to Congress to rewrite the rules.

Oil and gas developers and others point out that the Clinton
administration did the same thing - making broad changes of policy by
administrative order - but on behalf of an environmental constituency.
In their view, wilderness protection amounts to a land grab, putting
potential timber or mining areas off limits. They say citizen groups
were abusing the law by bringing land surveys to the government, which
then managed the land as de facto wilderness. Leaders of some Western
states have long complained that wilderness study essentially eliminates
the chance to gain any economic value from the land, money that is
needed for state coffers.

To many conservationists, the announcement was more than another
setback. Wilderness, in the oft-quoted line of the writer Wallace
Stegner, is "the geography of hope." To have that geography capped, they
argue, has had the same effect on some outdoor lovers as the fencing of
the public range had on open-country cattle ranchers. "They are trying
to declare, by fiat, that wilderness does not exist," said Heidi
McIntosh of the Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance.

The interior secretary, Gale A. Norton, said that the policy reflected
the administration's attempt to cooperate with local officials and heed
concerns of industries that rely on public lands' resources. "The
Department of the Interior believes that we should manage these lands in
a way that provides the greatest benefit to the public," Ms. Norton
wrote in a letter to Senator Robert F. Bennett, Republican of Utah.

In another letter, Ms. Norton said it seemed senseless to consider
declaring any more wilderness areas in Alaska because its elected
officials are against expanding this protection. But critics say that in
California, a majority of elected officials favor more wilderness. And
in New Mexico, Gov. Bill Richardson, a Democrat, has asked the
government to prevent drilling in 1.8 million acres of the Otero Mesa,
an area that has all the qualities of wilderness.

The New Mexico land is the largest contiguous piece of Chihuahuan Desert
grassland left in North America, Governor Richardson said. It may be
wild, but for now, it can no longer be Wilderness.


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 03:50:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (John Kleist)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:50:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References: <20030506002828.44329.qmail@web40608.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003801c31382$ace6f800$0ad67518@john>

Actually everyones profile page says member.Paid members the page will say
charter member.
TEAM BUBBA
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Eric Quinn" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:28 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


>
> --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> > Here is what Morty has in his profile.  This pretty
> > much describes exactly what the plan is:
> > (NOTICE THAT HE IS A MEMBER)
>
> Amusing. It looks like there are some MO caches he
> wants to involve in the game.
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 03:53:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (jeanne williams)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:53:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
In-Reply-To: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <20030506035304.92125.qmail@web21401.mail.yahoo.com>

I stand with George Bush!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 03:53:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (jeanne williams)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 20:53:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
In-Reply-To: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <20030506035304.92125.qmail@web21401.mail.yahoo.com>

I stand with George Bush!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 04:58:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 21:58:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
In-Reply-To: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <20030506045848.33317.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-206824624-1052197127=:33240
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I know most of my environmentalist friends will criticize me severly for expressing this view, but I firmly believe that we no more designated wilderness areas in the USA.  One of things I hate about designated wilderness areas is that it prohibits so many activities that I enjoy doing - not only geocaching but also mountain biking and driving my 4WD SUV. The recent removal of many geocaches in the Superstition Wilderness Area has solidified my opposition to the designation of more wilderness areas.  I hope that other geocachers agree, because more wilderness areas mean fewer lands available for geocaching. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Tierra Buena  wrote:The New York Times
May 4, 2003
Bah, Wilderness! Reopening a Frontier to Development
By TIMOTHY EGAN

--0-206824624-1052197127=:33240
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I know most of my environmentalist friends will criticize me severly for expressing this view, but I firmly believe that we no more designated wilderness areas in the USA.  One of things I hate about designated wilderness areas is that it prohibits so many activities that I enjoy doing - not only geocaching but also mountain biking and driving my 4WD SUV. The recent removal of many geocaches in the Superstition Wilderness Area has solidified my opposition to the designation of more wilderness areas.  I hope that other geocachers agree, because more wilderness areas mean fewer lands available for geocaching.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Team Tierra Buena <teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net> wrote:


The New York Times
May 4, 2003
Bah, Wilderness! Reopening a Frontier to Development
By TIMOTHY EGAN

--0-206824624-1052197127=:33240--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 05:03:16 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 22:03:16 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirate
Message-ID: <01f201c3138c$cdf46140$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_01EF_01C31352.214C2430
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ok, now that it's coming out that this is a game within a game, and that =
the cache(s) are to be placed nearby, it does sound kind of interesting.

On a side note, has anyone besides me noticed there are TWO profiles now =
for this person?

http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=3D121309
http://www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=3D122054

I am guessing that Jeremy suspended the account after he was e-mailed =
concerning the 'thief'.  How it was begun initially was where he/she/it =
messed up.  Had we known initially that this was going to be what it =
turned into, I'm fairly certain nobody would have reacted to the extent =
we all did.  But, it's live and learn.

Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_01EF_01C31352.214C2430
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Ok, now that it's coming out that this =
is a game=20
within a game, and that the cache(s) are to be placed nearby, it does =
sound kind=20
of interesting.


 


On a side note, has anyone besides me =
noticed there=20
are TWO profiles now for this person?


 


http://=
www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=3D121309


http://=
www.geocaching.com/profile/default.asp?A=3D122054


 


I am guessing that Jeremy suspended the =
account=20
after he was e-mailed concerning the 'thief'.  How it was begun =
initially=20
was where he/she/it messed up.  Had we known initially that this =
was going=20
to be what it turned into, I'm fairly certain nobody would have reacted =
to the=20
extent we all did.  But, it's live and learn.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_01EF_01C31352.214C2430--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 05:12:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 22:12:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
References: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <00f201c3138e$1f4b05c0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>

I believe there are a few folks who might want Mr. Bush to reconsider, and
they will likely let him know about it.

Jerry
Offtrail

----- Original Message -----
From: "Team Tierra Buena" 
To: "Arizona Geocaching" 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 8:07 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...


> The New York Times
> May 4, 2003
> Bah, Wilderness! Reopening a Frontier to Development
> By TIMOTHY EGAN
>
>
> SEATTLE - More than a century after historians declared an end to the
> American Frontier, the Interior Department made a somewhat similar
> announcement last month, with no fanfare. On a Friday night, just after
> Congress had left for spring break, the government said it would no
> longer consider huge swaths of public land to be wilderness.
>
> The administration declared that it would end reviews of Western
> landholdings for new wilderness protection. As long as the lands had
> been under consideration for the American wilderness system, they had
> temporary protection from development.
>
> With a single order, the Bush administration removed more than 200
> million acres from further wilderness study, including caribou stamping
> ground in Alaska, the red rock canyons and mesas of southern Utah, Case
> Mountain with its sequoia forests in California and a wall of
> rainbow-colored rock known as Vermillion Basin in Colorado.
>
> By declaring an end to wild land surveys, the administration ruled out
> protection of these areas as formal wilderness - which, by law, are
> supposed to be places people can visit but not stay. Now, these areas,
> managed by the Bureau of Land Management, could be opened to mining,
> drilling, logging or road-building.
>
> The idea of designating an area as wilderness - wild land left as is,
> for its own sake - is an American construct. Artists and writers in the
> mid-19th century led the charge for wilderness, with Henry David Thoreau
> arguing from his pond-side home in Concord, Mass., that wilderness
> sanctuaries were a necessary complement to civilization.
>
> In setting aside the first wildlife refuge in 1903, on Pelican Island in
> Florida, President Theodore Roosevelt protected a patch of America that
> is now the smallest of the formally protected lands - a mere five acres.
> And since passage of the Wilderness Act of 1964, 106 million acres have
> been given the wild lands designation, with more than half of that total
> in Alaska.
>
> Over the years, the Bureau of Land Management, the nation's biggest
> landlord, with 262 million acres under its control, has continued to
> survey its vast holdings, trying to determine whether more land is
> suitable for wilderness. But the Bush administration says wilderness
> reviews should have ended 13 years ago, at the close of a study period
> mandated by Congress. This interpretation is challenged by
> conservationists who plan to appeal the Bush order in court.
>
> If the Friday night declaration represents the beginning of a broad new
> land management policy, the Interior Department has not said so. There
> was not even an announcement of the end of the wilderness reviews on the
> department's Web site.
>
> Instead, the change came about in a settlement of a 1996 lawsuit filed
> by the State of Utah against the Interior Department over a reinventory
> of three million acres conducted by Bruce Babbitt, the interior
> secretary at the time. Most of the lawsuit had been dismissed and sat
> dormant until the state amended its complaint in March.
>
> "This does not mean that someday down the road we may still manage some
> of these lands as wilderness," said Patricia Lynn Scarlett, an assistant
> interior secretary.
>
> The move follows a consistent pattern in the president's environmental
> policy: to change the way the land is managed, without changing the law.
> Whether the issue is allowing snowmobiles in Yellowstone National Park
> or logging in the Pacific Northwest, the course has been to settle
> lawsuits by opponents of wild land protection, opening up the areas to
> wide use, without going to Congress to rewrite the rules.
>
> Oil and gas developers and others point out that the Clinton
> administration did the same thing - making broad changes of policy by
> administrative order - but on behalf of an environmental constituency.
> In their view, wilderness protection amounts to a land grab, putting
> potential timber or mining areas off limits. They say citizen groups
> were abusing the law by bringing land surveys to the government, which
> then managed the land as de facto wilderness. Leaders of some Western
> states have long complained that wilderness study essentially eliminates
> the chance to gain any economic value from the land, money that is
> needed for state coffers.
>
> To many conservationists, the announcement was more than another
> setback. Wilderness, in the oft-quoted line of the writer Wallace
> Stegner, is "the geography of hope." To have that geography capped, they
> argue, has had the same effect on some outdoor lovers as the fencing of
> the public range had on open-country cattle ranchers. "They are trying
> to declare, by fiat, that wilderness does not exist," said Heidi
> McIntosh of the Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance.
>
> The interior secretary, Gale A. Norton, said that the policy reflected
> the administration's attempt to cooperate with local officials and heed
> concerns of industries that rely on public lands' resources. "The
> Department of the Interior believes that we should manage these lands in
> a way that provides the greatest benefit to the public," Ms. Norton
> wrote in a letter to Senator Robert F. Bennett, Republican of Utah.
>
> In another letter, Ms. Norton said it seemed senseless to consider
> declaring any more wilderness areas in Alaska because its elected
> officials are against expanding this protection. But critics say that in
> California, a majority of elected officials favor more wilderness. And
> in New Mexico, Gov. Bill Richardson, a Democrat, has asked the
> government to prevent drilling in 1.8 million acres of the Otero Mesa,
> an area that has all the qualities of wilderness.
>
> The New Mexico land is the largest contiguous piece of Chihuahuan Desert
> grassland left in North America, Governor Richardson said. It may be
> wild, but for now, it can no longer be Wilderness.
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 07:44:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 00:44:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

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RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pickup (possibly an =
F50).

I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on th=
e 3rd.  I parked across the road from the cache in a dirt lot as far NE a=
s I could get to the cache (about 150 ft).  As I was getting out of my va=
n, a white pickup traveling SW came to a quick stop on the road next to m=
e and then suddenly turned right (jumping a curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had=
 he traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't have needed to jump the curb.)  He=
 then pulled up behind me, sat there a few seconds and then slowly drove =
further SW about 600 feet.  He then turned his truck so he was facing my =
direction and parked.  His actions made me think that he was a cacher by =
the way he handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the road and then turn=
ing, as if he were checking his GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (=
you know the drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )

I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered yet. =
 When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00 and 6:00)=
 Morty had already logged his find advising us that the cache had been pl=
undered.  His profile was already set up and the nine caches he had plund=
ered for the day were already posted.  The time frame would just about be=
 right if he plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him tim=
e to drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.

So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!

Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the cache page by dpo was either=
 a wrong time or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of the 3rd.  Dpo's log =
entry was already posted when I logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on t=
he 3rd.  The cache was plundered after dpo found the cache. =20

Rand (RandMan) =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Brent Milner
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would seem t=
hat
Mortey hasn't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wait to see, =
I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almost sounds like Mort=
ey
is someone we all know, because we're supposed to figure out his identity=
.
Either that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and ask, "A=
re
you the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
buffs.)

Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot M=
ad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip

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RE: Mo=
rty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pickup (possibly an F=
50).
 
 
 
I arrived at the Pu=
shing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on the=
 3rd.  I parked across the road from the cache in a dirt lot&nb=
sp;as far NE as I could get to the cache (about 150 ft).  As I was g=
etting out of my van, a white pickup traveling SW came to a quick stop on=
 the road next to me and then suddenly turned right (jumping a curb) onto=
 the dirt lot. (Had he traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't have neede=
d to jump the curb.)  He then pulled up behind me, sat there a few s=
econds and then slowly drove further SW about 600 feet.  He then tur=
ned his truck so he was facing my direction and parked.  His actions=
 made me think that he was a cacher by the way he handled the truck (stop=
ping suddenly on the road and then turning, as if he were checking h=
is GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (you know the drill . . .=
 we all do it!  [;-)] )
 
 
 
I left the=
 site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered yet.  When=
 I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00 and 6:00)=
 Morty had already logged his find advising us=
 that the cache had been plundered.  His profile was already set up =
and the nine caches he had plundered for the day were alre=
ady posted.  The time frame would just about be right if he plundere=
d the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him time to drive =
(home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.
 
 <=
/DIV> 
So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!
=
 
 
 
Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd po=
sting on the cache page by dpo was eith=
er a wrong time or dpo was there on the=
 2nd instead of the 3rd.  Dpo's log entry wa=
s already posted when I logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on the 3rd.&=
nbsp; The cache was plundered after dpo=
 found the cache. 
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan) =

 
 
 
 
----- Original Message ----- 
=
From: Brent Milner
 
Sent:=
 Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
 
To=
: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
=
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
 
 I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all the<=
BR>anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would see=
m that
Mortey hasn't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wai=
t to see, I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almos=
t sounds like Mortey
is someone we all know, because we're =
supposed to figure out his identity.
Either that, or we're supposed to=
 go up to complete strangers and ask, "Are
you the Dread Pirate Mortey=
?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
buffs.)

Either way=
, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot Mad<=
BR>Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

-FroBro Q=
-Tip



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 08:12:56 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 08:12:56 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
Message-ID: 




Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 09:55:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 02:55:00 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
In-Reply-To: <004f01c3137c$93ea63b0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <20030506095500.10096.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>

So we swing from one extreme to another.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 10:26:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 10:26:27 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
Message-ID: 




Meaning?














>From: Eric Quinn 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 





 


>So we swing from one extreme to another. 


> 




Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 10:57:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 03:57:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030506105719.41141.qmail@web40613.mail.yahoo.com>

Meaning that policies are all or nothing, as opposed
to  saying "there are enough Wilderness areas in
Alaska so let's not make any more but the people in
California want more so lets keep that option open."
It's too easy, and the lazy way out, to create an all
or nothing policy. Witness the inflexibility of some
of the land management policies not even allowing a
review and permit process for Geocaching while
allowing activities that are far more destructive.

No, I do not support Mr. Bush in this action.

--- gale and mike 
wrote:

---------------------------------

Meaning?





>From: Eric Quinn >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

 

>So we swing from one extreme to another. 
> 

---------------------------------
Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan
Online
____________________________________________________________Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.comTo edit your
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe
visit:http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocachingArizona's
Geocaching Resourcehttp://www.azgeocaching.com


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 14:19:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 07:19:30 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
References: 
Message-ID: <06ae01c313da$841ae820$319c4094@BILLPC>

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Where I live the only broadband option is satellite.  I use Starband, =
and I like it a lot.  I have been using it for about three years.

Bill
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: gale and mike=20


  Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what =
everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.


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Where I live the only =
broadband=20
option is satellite.  I use Starband, and I like it a lot.  I =
have=20
been using it for about three years.


 


Bill


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  gale and mike 

  


  

  

  
Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just =
wondering what=20
  everyone else uses, and if they like/hate=20
it.


------=_NextPart_000_06AA_01C3139F.D5F70790--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 14:23:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 07:23:11 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different...
References: 
Message-ID: <06b501c313db$07e57670$319c4094@BILLPC>

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I think designation as wilderness is automatically too extreme.  For =
example, wilderness prohibits almost all access by disabled persons, =
since vehicles, including wheel chairs, are excluded.  I am surprised =
nobody has sued under ADA.  There are other designations that can =
protect an area without being so elitist.

Bill
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: gale and mike=20
  >From: Eric Quinn=20
  >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  >So we swing from one extreme to another.=20


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I think designation as =
wilderness is=20
automatically too extreme.  For example, wilderness prohibits =
almost all=20
access by disabled persons, since vehicles, including wheel chairs, are=20
excluded.  I am surprised nobody has sued under ADA.  There =
are other=20
designations that can protect an area without being so =
elitist.


 


Bill


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  gale and mike 
  

  

  

  

  
>From: Eric Quinn 

  

  
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  

  

  
>So we swing from one extreme to another.=20



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 14:29:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 07:29:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G
Message-ID: <005f01c313db$e1ca4140$49fc3841@fishkiller>

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Jason and Brian

I want to thank you in (some fancy word) for the time and effort you've =
put into writing code over the past few days....

then Brian, as Jason is to far away, what do you want for lunch??


Thanks

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Jason and Brian


 


I want to thank you in (some fancy =
word) for=20
the time and effort you've put into writing code over the past few=20
days....


 


then Brian, as Jason is to far away, =
what do you=20
want for lunch??


 


 


Thanks


 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 15:10:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 08:10:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
References: 
Message-ID: 

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I love Cox.

Ummm... don't read anything into that.


-T.
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: gale and mike=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 1:12 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious


  Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what =
everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.



  Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
    On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
  "Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
    "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

  Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
  Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. =
____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your =
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: =
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 
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I love Cox.


 


Ummm... don't read anything into =
that.


 


 


-T.


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  gale and mike 
  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
1:12 AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just=20
  curious

  


  

  

  
Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just =
wondering what=20
  everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.



  
Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang =
interminable=20
  changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- =

  so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the =
Ranges=20
  --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for =
you.=20
  Go!"

  

  
 

  

  
Rudyard Kipling ,   The =
Explorer =20
  1898

  


  

  Add photos to your e-mail with MSN=20
  8. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
  http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
  Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 15:37:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 08:37:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
References:  
Message-ID: <3EB7D6B7.5050806@uccinc.net>

I love UCCI

Tamo

Terry Hernlund wrote:

> I love Cox.
>  
> Ummm... don't read anything into that.
>  
>  
> -T.
>
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     From: gale and mike 
>     To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>     Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 1:12 AM
>     Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
>
>     Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering
>     what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.
>
>
>     Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
>       On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
>     "Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
>       "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"
>      
>     Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8.
>      Get 2 months FREE*.
>     ____________________________________________________________
>     Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your
>     setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>     http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>     Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 15:47:31 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 08:47:31 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EB7D913.5070306@Snaptek.com>

I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that my 
cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, and it's 
been especially good since they started their own internet business 
rather than having @home employees and cox employees stepping on each 
others toes.

What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just switched 
to DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better that cable 
would be if the signal was perfect.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

gale and mike wrote:
> Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what everyone 
> else uses, and if they like/hate it.



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 16:00:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 09:00:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Just throwing this idea out there. Do you think Morty would be slick enough
to post his plunder first, and then go out and actually do the deed some
time later? This would certainly throw us off the scent, although it would
be a dirty trick...just like a pirate.

-FroBro Q-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND
HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
To: AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pickup (possibly an
F50).

I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on the
3rd.  I parked across the road from the cache in a dirt lot as far NE as I
could get to the cache (about 150 ft).  As I was getting out of my van, a
white pickup traveling SW came to a quick stop on the road next to me and
then suddenly turned right (jumping a curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had he
traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't have needed to jump the curb.)  He then
pulled up behind me, sat there a few seconds and then slowly drove further
SW about 600 feet.  He then turned his truck so he was facing my direction
and parked.  His actions made me think that he was a cacher by the way he
handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the road and then turning, as if he
were checking his GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (you know the
drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )

I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered yet.
When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00 and 6:00)
Morty had already logged his find advising us that the cache had been
plundered.  His profile was already set up and the nine caches he had
plundered for the day were already p osted.  The time frame would just about
be right if he plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him time
to drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.

So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!

Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the cache page by dpo was either a
wrong time or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of the 3rd.  Dpo's log entry
was already posted when I logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on the 3rd.
The cache was plundered after dpo found the cache.

Rand (RandMan)

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Brent Milner
  Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

  I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all the
  anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would seem
that
  Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wait to see,
I
  guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almost sounds like
Mortey
  is someone we all know, because we're supposed to figure out his identity.
  Either that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and ask,
"Are
  you the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
  buffs.)

  Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot
Mad
  Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

  -FroBro Q-Tip




====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====



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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Just throwing =
this idea=20
out there. Do you think Morty would be slick enough to post his plunder f=
irst,=20
and then go out and actually do the deed some time later? This would cert=
ainly=20
throw us off the scent, although it would be a dirty trick...just like a=20
pirate.


 


-FroBro=20
Q-Tip


 


 


 


-----Original Message-----
From:=20
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND=20
HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
To:=20
AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache=20
Pirates



RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pi=
ckup=20
(possibly an F50).


 


I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6)&=
nbsp;at=20
a little before 2:00 on the 3rd.  I parked across the road from the=20
cache in a dirt lot as far NE as I could get to the cache (abou=
t 150=20
ft).  As I was getting out of my van, a white pickup traveling SW ca=
me to a=20
quick stop on the road next to me and then suddenly turned right (jumping=
 a=20
curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had he traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't =
have=20
needed to jump the curb.)  He then pulled up behind me, sat there a =
few=20
seconds and then slowly drove further SW about 600 feet.  He then tu=
rned=20
his truck so he was facing my direction and parked.  His actions mad=
e me=20
think that he was a cacher by the way he handled the truck (stopping sudd=
enly on=20
the road and then turning, as if he were checking his GPSr and reali=
zed he=20
was at the site).  (you know the drill . . . we all do it! =20
[;-)] )


 


I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered=20
yet.  When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00=
=20
and 6:00) Morty had already logged his=20
find advising us that the cache had been plundered.  His profil=
e was=20
already set up and the nine caches he had plundered for th=
e day=20
were already p osted.  The time frame would just about be right if h=
e=20
plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him time t=
o drive=20
(home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.


 


So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!


 


Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the c=
ache=20
page by dpo was either a wrong time=20
or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of =
the=20
3rd.  Dpo's log entry was already posted whe=
n I=20
logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on the 3rd.  The cache=20
was plundered after dpo found the=20
cache. 


 =20

Rand (RandMan) 


 


  
----- Original Message -----

  
F=
rom:=20
  Brent Milner

  
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 =
PM

  
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re:=
 Cache=20
  Pirates

  
 
I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-pla=
nned=20
  once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his profile pag=
e, it=20
  would seem that
Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will=
 have=20
  to wait to see, I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it al=
so=20
  almost sounds like Mortey
is someone we all know, because=
 we're=20
  supposed to figure out his identity.
Either that, or we're supposed =
to go=20
  up to complete strangers and ask, "Are
you the Dread Pirate Mortey?"=
=20
  (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
buffs.)

Either way,=
 I=20
  will be interested to see who is the first person to spot=20
  Mad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout.=20
  Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip

=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D







------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C313AD.E5B4FEE0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 16:02:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 09:02:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G
In-Reply-To: <005f01c313db$e1ca4140$49fc3841@fishkiller>
References: <005f01c313db$e1ca4140$49fc3841@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <3EB7DC8F.5020505@snaptek.com>

forthe record we are not "caching gods"...  that would have to be

Wyle "E"... i belive the technical term for us is

"cache programming gods"!!


what code have we written in the past few days.... may you enlighten us 
with this information???

if we have done some in the past few days... we must be gods because we 
didn't even have to think about programming anything it just came into 
existence from our subcontious thoughts.... ;)

jason
"omnipotent one"


Team Evil Fish wrote:
> Jason and Brian
>  
> I want to thank you in (some fancy word) for the time and effort you've 
> put into writing code over the past few days....
>  
> then Brian, as Jason is to far away, what do you want for lunch??
>  
>  
> Thanks
>  


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 16:24:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 09:24:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different (let's end this)...
In-Reply-To: <20030506105719.41141.qmail@web40613.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030506162411.4545.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-621777503-1052238251=:3980
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I already get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better shut up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I feel that I may be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then everyone else will pummel me with inflamatory replies. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
Am in the majority or the minority?  Shall I change my views to match those of others I meet, or firmly believe what I do believe without waffling?


--0-621777503-1052238251=:3980
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I already get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better shut up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I feel that I may be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then everyone else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)



Am in the majority or the minority?  Shall I change my views to match those of others I meet, or firmly believe what I do believe without waffling?


--0-621777503-1052238251=:3980--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 09:30:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 02:30:43 MST
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
Message-ID: <20030506162929.4A02824A802@sequoia.net>

Tell us more. I am thinking of doing this.

Hawk
Team RedHawk

Brian Cluff  wrote :

> I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that my 
> cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, and it's 
> been especially good since they started their own internet business 
> rather than having @home employees and cox employees stepping on each 
> others toes.
> 
> What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just switched 
> to DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better that cable 
> would be if the signal was perfect.
> 
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
> 
> gale and mike wrote:
> > Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what everyone
> 
> > else uses, and if they like/hate it.
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



_________________________________________
CableAmerica WebMail, http://www.cableaz.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 16:57:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 12:57:59 EDT
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
Message-ID: <49.2e131650.2be94397@aol.com>

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Well,
This is my view point having been hit by the pirate. I am new to geocaching, 
love it. Have placed caches myself already (Pushing Tin being one of them, 
and it was hit). I first thought when I found out about the pirate logging on 
my cache page his hit, that it was just his tag line and that he hadn't 
actually emptied my cache, but then learned he actually had. Upon learning 
this my first thoughts were that this was a subculture within geocaching, and 
although a little annoyed at my cache being hit by a pirate so soon after 
placing it, no big deal I just would have to go restock it and check on its 
placement. Now I see that this is new to this sport (pirates) and really I 
don't see any harm done, especially with what the pirate has stated he plans 
on doing (if he follows thru with it). It will just be a new adventure to 
have to go find my plundered goods and return them home to pushing tin, plus 
an added part of the game to try and figure out who the pirate is. I would 
think as long as he only plunders the little items (leaving log books and 
possible travel bugs that may be in caches) its not any real harm, only makes 
a cache placer go out to his own cache to restock it and then gives him a new 
twist to try and find his plundered goods. I would suggest that the pirate 
also offer the hit cache owner the right to ask him (the pirate) to return 
the goods taken and the right not to participate in the pirates game, thus 
leaving those who do not want to be part of his sub-game not bound by it. 
Just my opinion as a new cacher and a recent victim of the pirate. I thank 
you all for offering this great new sport to my adventures. IFISHAZ (Dennis 
P).

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Well,

This is my view point having been hit by the pirate. I am new to geocaching,=
 love it. Have placed caches myself already (Pushing Tin being one of them,=20=
and it was hit). I first thought when I found out about the pirate logging o=
n my cache page his hit, that it was just his tag line and that he hadn't ac=
tually emptied my cache, but then learned he actually had. Upon learning thi=
s my first thoughts were that this was a subculture within geocaching, and a=
lthough a little annoyed at my cache being hit by a pirate so soon after pla=
cing it, no big deal I just would have to go restock it and check on its pla=
cement. Now I see that this is new to this sport (pirates) and really I don'=
t see any harm done, especially with what the pirate has stated he plans on=20=
doing (if he follows thru with it). It will just be a new adventure to have=20=
to go find my plundered goods and return them home to pushing tin, plus an a=
dded part of the game to try and figure out who the pirate is. I would think=
 as long as he only plunders the little items (leaving log books and possibl=
e travel bugs that may be in caches) its not any real harm, only makes a cac=
he placer go out to his own cache to restock it and then gives him a new twi=
st to try and find his plundered goods. I would suggest that the pirate also=
 offer the hit cache owner the right to ask him (the pirate) to return the g=
oods taken and the right not to participate in the pirates game, thus leavin=
g those who do not want to be part of his sub-game not bound by it. Just my=20=
opinion as a new cacher and a recent victim of the pirate. I thank you all f=
or offering this great new sport to my adventures. IFISHAZ (Dennis P).

--part1_49.2e131650.2be94397_boundary--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 17:18:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 10:18:00 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
References: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C313B8.C5BAA6C0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Probably not given the apparent bad planning in the first place.  But =
it's possible.


-T.

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brent Milner=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:00 AM
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


  Just throwing this idea out there. Do you think Morty would be slick =
enough to post his plunder first, and then go out and actually do the =
deed some time later? This would certainly throw us off the scent, =
although it would be a dirty trick...just like a pirate.

  -FroBro Q-Tip



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND =
HARDIN
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
  To: AZ-Geocaching
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


  RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pickup (possibly =
an F50).

  I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on =
the 3rd.  I parked across the road from the cache in a dirt lot as far =
NE as I could get to the cache (about 150 ft).  As I was getting out of =
my van, a white pickup traveling SW came to a quick stop on the road =
next to me and then suddenly turned right (jumping a curb) onto the dirt =
lot. (Had he traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't have needed to jump the =
curb.)  He then pulled up behind me, sat there a few seconds and then =
slowly drove further SW about 600 feet.  He then turned his truck so he =
was facing my direction and parked.  His actions made me think that he =
was a cacher by the way he handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the =
road and then turning, as if he were checking his GPSr and realized he =
was at the site).  (you know the drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )

  I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered =
yet.  When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00 and =
6:00) Morty had already logged his find advising us that the cache had =
been plundered.  His profile was already set up and the nine caches he =
had plundered for the day were already p osted.  The time frame would =
just about be right if he plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That =
would give him time to drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at =
the latest.

  So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!

  Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the cache page by dpo was =
either a wrong time or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of the 3rd.  =
Dpo's log entry was already posted when I logged my find between 5:00 =
and 6:00 on the 3rd.  The cache was plundered after dpo found the cache. =

   =20
  Rand (RandMan)=20

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Brent Milner
    Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

    I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all =
the
    anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would =
seem that
    Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wait to =
see, I
    guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almost sounds like =
Mortey
    is someone we all know, because we're supposed to figure out his =
identity.
    Either that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and =
ask, "Are
    you the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you =
movie
    buffs.)

    Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to =
spot Mad
    Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

    -FroBro Q-Tip


=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D



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Probably not given the apparent bad planning in =
the first=20
place.  But it's possible.


 


 


-T.


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brent =
Milner=20
  

  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
9:00 AM

  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Re: Cache=20
  Pirates

  


  
Just =
throwing this idea=20
  out there. Do you think Morty would be slick enough to post his =
plunder first,=20
  and then go out and actually do the deed some time later? This would =
certainly=20
  throw us off the scent, although it would be a dirty trick...just like =
a=20
  pirate.

  
 

  
-FroBro=20
  Q-Tip

  
 

  
 

  
 

  
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocachi=
ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of =
RAND=20
  HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
To:=20
  AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache=20
  Pirates


  
RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white =
pickup=20
  (possibly an F50).

  
 

  
I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache=20
  (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on the 3rd.  I parked =
across the=20
  road from the cache in a dirt lot as far NE as I could get =
to the=20
  cache (about 150 ft).  As I was getting out of my van, a white =
pickup=20
  traveling SW came to a quick stop on the road next to me and then =
suddenly=20
  turned right (jumping a curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had he traveled =
another=20
  30 ft he wouldn't have needed to jump the curb.)  He then pulled =
up=20
  behind me, sat there a few seconds and then slowly drove further SW =
about 600=20
  feet.  He then turned his truck so he was facing my direction and =

  parked.  His actions made me think that he was a cacher by the =
way he=20
  handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the road and then =
turning, as if=20
  he were checking his GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (you =
know=20
  the drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )

  
 

  
I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been =
plundered=20
  yet.  When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between =
5:00=20
  and 6:00) Morty had already logged his=20
  find advising us that the cache had been plundered.  His =
profile was=20
  already set up and the nine caches he had plundered for =
the day=20
  were already p osted.  The time frame would just about be right =
if he=20
  plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him =
time to=20
  drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.

  
 

  
So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!

  
 

  
Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on =
the cache=20
  page by dpo was either a wrong time=20
  or dpo was there on the 2nd instead =
of the=20
  3rd.  Dpo's log entry was already posted =
when I=20
  logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on the 3rd.  The cache=20
  was plundered after dpo found the=20
  cache. 

  
 =20
  
Rand (RandMan) 

  
 

  
    
----- Original Message -----

    From:=20
    Brent Milner

    
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 =
5:20=20
PM

    
To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

    
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Re: Cache=20
    Pirates

    
 
I agree, it seems to have been planned and then =
re-planned=20
    once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his profile =
page, it=20
    would seem that
Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We =
will have=20
    to wait to see, I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it =
also=20
    almost sounds like Mortey
is someone we all know, =
because=20
    we're supposed to figure out his identity.
Either that, or we're =
supposed=20
    to go up to complete strangers and ask, "Are
you the Dread Pirate =

    Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you =
movie
buffs.)

Either=20
    way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot=20
    Mad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout.=20
    Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip

=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D





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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 17:55:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 10:55:40 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different (let's end this)...
References: <20030506162411.4545.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001701c313f8$b56c59e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>

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But we all have so much fun bashing each other, let's not spoil the good =
times. :o)

I suppose the old barroom rule of no political or religious discussions =
should be followed mostly, but a little banter among friends doesn't =
hurt.  We just need to watch out for the so called "keyboard bravado" =
that makes folks say things they never would  if we were all talking =
face to  face.

Jerry
Offtrail
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ken Akerman=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:24 AM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely =
Different (let's end this)...


  I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I already get =
bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better shut up.  =
Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I feel that I may =
be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then everyone =
else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.

  Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

  Am in the majority or the minority?  Shall I change my views to match =
those of others I meet, or firmly believe what I do believe without =
waffling?


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But we all have so much fun =
bashing each=20
other, let's not spoil the good times. :o)


 


I suppose the old barroom rule of no =
political or=20
religious discussions should be followed mostly, but a little banter =
among=20
friends doesn't hurt.  We just need to watch out for the so =
called=20
"keyboard bravado" that makes folks say things they never would  if =
we were=20
all talking face to  face.


 


Jerry


Offtrail



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Ken =
Akerman=20
  
  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
9:24 AM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
And Now for=20
  Something Completely Different (let's end this)...

  


  
I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I =
already=20
  get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better =
shut=20
  up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I =
feel that I=20
  may be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then =
everyone=20
  else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.

  
 

  
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

  

Am in the majority or the minority?  =
Shall I=20
  change my views to match those of others I meet, or firmly believe =
what I do=20
  believe without =
waffling?



------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C313BE.08D38620--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 18:22:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 11:22:40 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
In-Reply-To: <20030506162929.4A02824A802@sequoia.net>
References: <20030506162929.4A02824A802@sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <3EB7FD70.3060008@snaptek.com>

paulross@cableaz.com wrote:
> Tell us more. I am thinking of doing this.
> 
> Hawk
> Team RedHawk

I assume you are talking to me sice you quoted me... .what do you want 
to know more about?

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 18:25:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 11:25:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fire restrictions info
Message-ID: <002301c313fc$ec16f640$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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FYI all, this link is to the BLM fire restrictions page.  Might be of =
use to all of us.  :)

http://azwww.az.blm.gov/fire.htm

Brian
Team A.I.
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FYI all, this link is to the BLM fire =
restrictions=20
page.  Might be of use to all of us.  :)


 


http://azwww.az.blm.gov/fire.ht=
m


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 18:33:31 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 11:33:31 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different (let's
 end this)...
In-Reply-To: <001701c313f8$b56c59e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
References: <20030506162411.4545.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c313f8$b56c59e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <3EB7FFFB.7030007@snaptek.com>

There has been more than one person that didn't like the amount of 
discussion on some particular subjects, but as far as lists go, 
geocachers seems to be VERY level headed type of people.  The 
discussions on this mailing list have never really been out of control, 
and 4 letter words have never been slung.
Heck, there have been very few occations that Godwin's Law has has been 
invoked.

Godwin's Law is a natural law of Usenet named after Mike Godwin
(godwin@eff.org) concerning Usenet "discussions".  It reads, according 
to the Jargon File:

   As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison
   involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one.

The complete Godwin's Law explained:
http://www.killfile.org/~tskirvin/faqs/godwin.html

I think that Godwin's law has actually only been invoked in relation to 
a certain Site Steward :)

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

Jerry Nelson wrote:
> But we all have so much fun bashing each other, let's not spoil the good 
> times. :o)
>  
> I suppose the old barroom rule of no political or religious discussions 
> should be followed mostly, but a little banter among friends doesn't 
> hurt.  We just need to watch out for the so called "keyboard bravado" 
> that makes folks say things they never would  if we were all talking 
> face to  face.
>  
> Jerry
> Offtrail
> 
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* Ken Akerman 
>     *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>     *Sent:* Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:24 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely
>     Different (let's end this)...
> 
>     I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I already
>     get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better
>     shut up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I
>     feel that I may be compelled to respond to something I disagree
>     with, and then everyone else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.
>      
>     Ken (a.k.a. */Highpointer/*)
> 
>     /Am in the majority or the minority?  Shall I change my views to
>     match those of others I meet, or firmly believe what I do believe
>     without waffling?/
> 



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 18:51:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 11:51:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fire restrictions info
In-Reply-To: <002301c313fc$ec16f640$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
References: <002301c313fc$ec16f640$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <3EB80437.9000309@snaptek.com>

Rather biblical to have a web page full of commandments with a picture 
of a burning bush on it.

They should rephrase them "Thou shalt not not smoke, Thou shalt not not 
light open fires.. etc etc.."

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

Brian Casteel wrote:
> FYI all, this link is to the BLM fire restrictions page.  Might be of 
> use to all of us.  :)
>  
> http://azwww.az.blm.gov/fire.htm
>  
> Brian
> Team A.I.



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 19:14:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 12:14:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G
References: <005f01c313db$e1ca4140$49fc3841@fishkiller> <3EB7DC8F.5020505@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <002401c31403$b7c05b00$618f3a41@fishkiller>

I will just be quite to the fact that Team Evil Fish no longer shows ANY out
of State finds when there are 5 Member only caches that have in the past
would have shown OUT OF STATE...

then after taking a nap I wonder if it had anything to do with the WISHY
WASHY nature of the caches being switched from open to all the being
restricted to open to all then again being restricted then again open to all
then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open
to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all then
being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open
to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all then
being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open
to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all then
being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open
to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Poulter" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G


> forthe record we are not "caching gods"...  that would have to be
>
> Wyle "E"... i belive the technical term for us is
>
> "cache programming gods"!!
>
>
> what code have we written in the past few days.... may you enlighten us
> with this information???
>
> if we have done some in the past few days... we must be gods because we
> didn't even have to think about programming anything it just came into
> existence from our subcontious thoughts.... ;)
>
> jason
> "omnipotent one"
>
>
> Team Evil Fish wrote:
> > Jason and Brian
> >
> > I want to thank you in (some fancy word) for the time and effort you've
> > put into writing code over the past few days....
> >
> > then Brian, as Jason is to far away, what do you want for lunch??
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 19:20:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 12:20:08 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

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Who knows what this Pirate is thinking - you may have just given him an i=
dea!  [;-)]  =20

As for dpo's log at 8:20 p.m. on the 3rd, the cache owner Dennis (IFISHAZ=
), told me that the date should have been the 2nd. (dpo is a friend of hi=
s and they went to the cache together the evening of the 2nd so dpo could=
 find it).

Rand (RandMan)

----- Original Message -----
From: Brent Milner
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:22 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

Just throwing this idea out there. Do you think Morty would be slick enou=
gh to post his plunder first, and then go out and actually do the deed so=
me time later? This would certainly throw us off the scent, although it w=
ould be a dirty trick...just like a pirate.

-FroBro Q-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching=
-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
To: AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates


RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new white pickup (possibly an =
F50).

I arrived at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a little before 2:00 on th=
e 3rd.  I parked across the road from the cache in a dirt lot as far NE a=
s I could get to the cache (about 150 ft).  As I was getting out of my va=
n, a white pickup traveling SW came to a quick stop on the road next to m=
e and then suddenly turned right (jumping a curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had=
 he traveled another 30 ft he wouldn't have needed to jump the curb.)  He=
 then pulled up behind me, sat there a few seconds and then slowly drove =
further SW about 600 feet.  He then turned his truck so he was facing my =
direction and parked.  His actions made me think that he was a cacher by =
the way he handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the road and then turn=
ing, as if he were checking his GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (=
you know the drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )

I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been plundered yet. =
 When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere between 5:00 and 6:00)=
 Morty had already logged his find advising us that the cache had been pl=
undered.  His profile was already set up and the nine caches he had plund=
ered for the day were already p osted.  The time frame would just about b=
e right if he plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That would give him ti=
me to drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the latest.

So . . . we may be looking for a fairly new white truck!

Note:  The 8:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the cache page by dpo was either=
 a wrong time or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of the 3rd.  Dpo's log =
entry was already posted when I logged my find between 5:00 and 6:00 on t=
he 3rd.  The cache was plundered after dpo found the cache. =20
  =20
Rand (RandMan) =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Brent Milner
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

I agree, it seems to have been planned and then re-planned once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his profile page, it would seem t=
hat
Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cache bags. We will have to wait to see,=
 I
guess. I agree with what Scott just said, it also almost sounds like Mort=
ey
is someone we all know, because we're supposed to figure out his identity=
.
Either that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and ask, "A=
re
you the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie
buffs.)

Either way, I will be interested to see who is the first person to spot M=
ad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout. Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip


=3D=3D=3D=3D This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthori=
zed use or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this me=
ssage must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipi=
ent. =3D=3D=3D=3D   =20

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Who knows what=
 this Pirate is thinking - you may have just given him an idea!  [;-=
)]  
 
 
 
As for dpo's log at 8:20 p.m. on the 3rd, the cache owner Dennis (IFISHAZ), told me that the date should have been the 2nd=
. (dpo is a friend of his and they went to the ca=
che together the evening of the 2nd so dpo c=
ould find it).
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
&nb=
sp;
 
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Brent =
Milner
 
Sent: Tuesday, May 06=
, 2003 9:22 AM
 
To: listserv@=
azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: RE=
: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
 
 
  
Just throwing this idea out there. Do you =
think Morty would be slick enough to post his plunder first, and then go =
out and actually do the deed some time later? This would certainly throw =
us off the scent, although it would be a dirty trick...just like a pirate=
.
 
 =

 
-FroBro=
 Q-Tip
 
&=
nbsp;
 
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
<=
B>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geoc=
aching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND HARDINSent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:45 AM
To: AZ-Geocaching<=
BR>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

 
RE: Morty.  We may be looking for a fairly new whi=
te pickup (possibly an F50).
 
 
 
I arri=
ved at the Pushing Tin cache (GCG1N6) at a l=
ittle before 2:00 on the 3rd.  I parked across the road from the cac=
he in a dirt lot as far NE as I could get to the cache (about 1=
50 ft).  As I was getting out of my van, a white pickup traveling SW=
 came to a quick stop on the road next to me and then suddenly turned rig=
ht (jumping a curb) onto the dirt lot. (Had he traveled another 30 f=
t he wouldn't have needed to jump the curb.)  He then pulled up behi=
nd me, sat there a few seconds and then slowly drove further SW about 600=
 feet.  He then turned his truck so he was facing my direction and p=
arked.  His actions made me think that he was a cacher by the way he=
 handled the truck (stopping suddenly on the road and then turning, =
as if he were checking his GPSr and realized he was at the site).  (=
you know the drill . . . we all do it!  [;-)] )
 
&nbs=
p;
 
I left the site at around 2:20 and the cache had not been p=
lundered yet.  When I arrived home and logged my find (somewhere bet=
ween 5:00 and 6:00) Morty had already logged h=
is find advising us that the cache had been plundered.  His pro=
file was already set up and the nine caches he had plundered&nb=
sp;for the day were already p osted.  The time frame would just abou=
t be right if he plundered the cache at around 2:30.  That woul=
d give him time to drive (home?) and log the nine caches by 6:00 at the l=
atest.
 
 
 
So . . . we may be looking for a fair=
ly new white truck!
 
 
 
Note:  The 8=
:20 p.m., May 3rd posting on the cache page by =
dpo was either a wrong time or dpo was there on the 2nd instead of the 3rd.  Dpo's<=
/U> log entry was already posted when I logged my find between 5=
:00 and 6:00 on the 3rd.  The cache was plundered after dpo found the cache. 
 
 =
  
Rand (RandMan) 
 
 
 
 
-----=
 Original Message -----
 
From: Brent Milner
 
Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:20 PM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pir=
ates
 
 
I agree, it seems to have been planned and th=
en re-planned once all the
anger came to the surface. From reading his=
 profile page, it would seem that
Mortey has n't yet re-hidden the cac=
he bags. We will have to wait to see, I
guess. I agree with what Scott=
 just said, it also almost sounds like Mortey
is someone we =
all know, because we're supposed to figure out his identity.
Eithe=
r that, or we're supposed to go up to complete strangers and ask, "Areyou the Dread Pirate Mortey?" (Princess Bride quote there for you movie<=
BR>buffs.)

Either way, I will be interested to see who is the f=
irst person to spot Mad
Mortey. I will be on the lookout=
. Arrr.

-FroBro Q-Tip

=3D=3D=3D=3D This message and any attachments are conf=
idential. Unauthorized use or disclosure of this message is strictly proh=
ibited, and this message must be destroyed immediately if received by an =
unauthorized recipient. =3D=3D=3D=3D   
<=
/HTML>

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 19:22:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 12:22:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely Different (let's end this)...
References: <20030506162411.4545.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com> <001701c313f8$b56c59e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

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I've never said anything online that I wouldn't have said face to face.  =
More the other way around actually. =20

I get sucker punched alot.  ;-)
 =20

-T.

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Jerry Nelson=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 10:55 AM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely =
Different (let's end this)...


  But we all have so much fun bashing each other, let's not spoil the =
good times. :o)

  I suppose the old barroom rule of no political or religious =
discussions should be followed mostly, but a little banter among friends =
doesn't hurt.  We just need to watch out for the so called "keyboard =
bravado" that makes folks say things they never would  if we were all =
talking face to  face.

  Jerry
  Offtrail
    ----- Original Message -----=20
    From: Ken Akerman=20
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:24 AM
    Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] And Now for Something Completely =
Different (let's end this)...


    I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I already =
get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better shut =
up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I feel that =
I may be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then =
everyone else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.

    Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

    Am in the majority or the minority?  Shall I change my views to =
match those of others I meet, or firmly believe what I do believe =
without waffling?


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I've never said anything online that I =
wouldn't=20
have said face to face.  More the other way around actually. =20



 


I get sucker punched alot.  =
;-)


  


 


-T.


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Jerry=20
  Nelson 
  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
10:55=20
AM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
And Now for=20
  Something Completely Different (let's end this)...

  


  
But we all have so much fun =
bashing each=20
  other, let's not spoil the good times. :o)

  
 

  
I suppose the old barroom rule of no =
political or=20
  religious discussions should be followed mostly, but a little banter =
among=20
  friends doesn't hurt.  We just need to watch out for the so =
called=20
  "keyboard bravado" that makes folks say things they never would  =
if we=20
  were all talking face to  face.

  
 

  
Jerry

  
Offtrail

  

    
----- Original Message ----- 

    From:=20
    Ken=20
    Akerman 
    
    
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
9:24=20
    AM

    
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
And Now=20
    for Something Completely Different (let's end this)...

    


    
I don't want this to turn into a political discussion.  I =
already=20
    get bashed too much for expressing my political views, so I better =
shut=20
    up.  Thefefore, let's end this political discussion because I =
feel that=20
    I may be compelled to respond to something I disagree with, and then =

    everyone else will pummel me with inflamatory replies.

    
 

    
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

    

Am in the majority or the =
minority?  Shall I=20
    change my views to match those of others I meet, or firmly believe =
what I do=20
    believe without=20
waffling?



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 20:48:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Dennis Wodarz)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 13:48:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] FroBro Philosopher
In-Reply-To: <200305051905.MAA01867@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <001401c31410$e65af9e0$0b00a8c0@woodlaptop>

Fellow Geocachers,

I finally completed Offtrail's Why? Cache yesterday. I was riding past
it and decided to check on it and the bees had disappeared. I found it
quickly this time.  Anyway, I was feeling philosophical and wanted to
expand on my answer to why I cache here.

This quote explains it quite well:

"You must learn day by day, year by year to broaden your horizon. The
more things you love, the more you are interested in, the more you
enjoy, the more you are indignant about, the more you have left when
anything happens."
-- Ethel Barrymore (1879-1959), American actress

Geocaching is itself one more thing to love but it also provides a means
of broadening your horizons. You are exposed to new places, new ideas,
new technologies, new people, new problems, new solutions etc.  This
combination makes it so special.

So as we've seen, people lose jobs but they look for new ones and go
Geocaching a lot.  When you break-up with your girlfriend, you go
Geocaching and better yet, bring a potential new girl with you caching.
When your favorite camping spot is marred by a forest fire, Geoaching
gives you several spots just as nice or nicer to replace it with.

So, for me, caching is one of the things I do to ensure that when things
do go wrong, I still have plenty left to be interested in, to enjoy and
to love.

FroBro D-Dubs

PS
"I've always been in the right place 
at the right time. Of course, I steered
myself there." 
--Bob Hope Comedian

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 23:04:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 16:04:41 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Rejected Cache
Message-ID: <003001c31423$e09ea4d0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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Ok, since I have yet to have a cache rejected (only 4 placed so far, =
with a 5th on deck waiting for approval), what happens when =
geocaching.com denies a cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or does =
lightning rain down from the sky?

Brian
Team A.I.
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Ok, since I have yet to have a cache =
rejected (only=20
4 placed so far, with a 5th on deck waiting for approval), what happens =
when=20
geocaching.com denies a cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or =
does=20
lightning rain down from the sky?


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 23:19:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 23:19:46 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
Message-ID: 




I've had computer/hotmail hell today. I've repeatedly tried to post something on DirecTV but even the e-mail I posted from another account is in some sort of non-list moderator limbo.


We've had DirecTV for 7 years. We like it a lot and would never change. The other e-mail which may or may not come through is more detailed.









>From: Brian Cluff 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious 

>Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 08:47:31 -0700 

> 

>I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that 

>my cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, 

>and it's been especially good since they started their own internet 

>business rather than having @home employees and cox employees 

>stepping on each others toes. 

> 

>What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just 

>switched to DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better 

>that cable would be if the signal was perfect. 

> 

>Brian Cluff 

>Team Snaptek 

> 

>gale and mike wrote: 

>>Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what 

>>everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it. 

> 

> 

>____________________________________________________________ 

>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> 

>Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

>http://www.azgeocaching.com 


Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 23:27:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 16:27:57 -0700
Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] Rejected Cache]
Message-ID: <281HeFXb65456S13.1052263677@uwdvg013.cms.usa.net>

I have had three rejected. In each case I was emailed and told why the cache
was rejected and what I needed to provide to get it approved. On the two that
I decided to follow up and supply the additional info, they were very quickly
approved.

Mark, Magical Memories

"Brian Casteel"  wrote:
> --------------------------------------------- 
>	Attachment:  
>	MIME Type: multipart/alternative 
> --------------------------------------------- 
> Ok, since I have yet to have a cache rejected (only 4 placed so far, with a
5th on deck waiting for approval), what happens when geocaching.com denies a
cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or does lightning rain down from the
sky?
> 
> Brian
> Team A.I.




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 21:32:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Jett)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 14:32:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cox/Directv
Message-ID: <20030506213215.82746.qmail@web14809.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-766587323-1052256735=:78411
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that my cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, and it's been especially good since they started their own internet business rather than having @home employees and cox employees stepping on each others toes. 

What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just switched to DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better that cable would be if the signal was perfect. 

Brian Cluff 
Team Snaptek 

gale and mike wrote: 
  
Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it. 


 

The original cable company for my home was a mom and pop bare bones company.Cox bought them out and just last month hooked up my internet. I've had nothing but problems with the connection. Just last Friday my connection was lost 12 times in an hour and a half. I didn't know I knew that many bad words! Cox claims there is no problem but for $50 they'll come out and look...I'll learn to live with it for now.

As for Directv. We've had it for seven years now and we would never change back to cable. We get better channel selection (BBCA and all sorts of music only channels among other usual channels) much clearer reception and instant customer service if we want to change our programming as we usually do in the summer. We've lost reception only a couple of times in a bad storm. The one drawback is that we can't record one channel and watch another, but I believe newer satellite systems can do that. Ours is a Sony, 7 years old and used a lot, no repairs/maintainance.

If you've never seen BBC America, you have no idea what you're missing. Father Ted alone is worth the price of a satellite dish.

 


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!" Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898

---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
--0-766587323-1052256735=:78411
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that my cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, and it's been especially good since they started their own internet business rather than having @home employees and cox employees stepping on each others toes. 

What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just switched to DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better that cable would be if the signal was perfect. 

Brian Cluff 
Team Snaptek 

gale and mike wrote: 






 
 


Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it. 


 


The original cable company for my home was a mom and pop bare bones company.Cox bought them out and just last month hooked up my internet. I've had nothing but problems with the connection. Just last Friday my connection was lost 12 times in an hour and a half. I didn't know I knew that many bad words! Cox claims there is no problem but for $50 they'll come out and look...I'll learn to live with it for now.


As for Directv. We've had it for seven years now and we would never change back to cable. We get better channel selection (BBCA and all sorts of music only channels among other usual channels) much clearer reception and instant customer service if we want to change our programming as we usually do in the summer. We've lost reception only a couple of times in a bad storm. The one drawback is that we can't record one channel and watch another, but I believe newer satellite systems can do that. Ours is a Sony, 7 years old and used a lot, no repairs/maintainance.


If you've never seen BBC America, you have no idea what you're missing. Father Ted alone is worth the price of a satellite dish.


 


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898

Do you Yahoo!?

The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
--0-766587323-1052256735=:78411--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 23:41:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 16:41:41 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Just curious
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EB84835.2000803@snaptek.com>

gale and mike wrote:
> I've had computer/hotmail hell today. I've repeatedly tried to post 
> something on DirecTV but even the e-mail I posted from another account 
> is in some sort of non-list moderator limbo.
> 
> We've had DirecTV for 7 years. We like it a lot and would never change. 
> The other e-mail which may or may not come through is more detailed.

Sorry about that... I just released your message.  It was stuck in a 
huge pile of generic viagra, copy any DVD with a standard CDRW, and 
Nigerian banking scams.   I usually just let the spam pile up in the 
queue till I have a message worth wile to release, and then just delete 
the several dozen spam that piles up over the last day or so.


One thing I want to add to the pro-DirecTV side... most channels on cox 
AREN'T in stereo (ESPN is for some reason... but why in the hell would I 
need stereo to watch sports.. which I don't).  It really sucks big time 
to have to watch stuff on the sci-fi channel in mono.  It made my day 
when I could watch Farscape in stereo.... then they canceled the 
greatest sci-fi show ever. :(

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May  6 23:49:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (HighwayHavoc)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 16:49:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Geocaching in San Diego
In-Reply-To: <3EB84835.2000803@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <20030506234951.78624.qmail@web40502.mail.yahoo.com>

For those interested in Geocaching in San Diego, there
will be a big event along the new 140-mile Sea to Sea
Trail (Salton Sea to Pacific Ocean) on June 7th, which
is National Trails Day. More info can be found at:

http://seatoseatrail.org/index.cfm/Geocaching

Mark A. Pedersen

Never knock on Death's door. Ring the bell and run, he
hates that!


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 00:33:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 17:33:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Rejected Cache
In-Reply-To: <003001c31423$e09ea4d0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030506173259.0198fca8@mail.myblueheaven.com>

--=====================_31142390==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

At 04:04 PM 5/6/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>Ok, since I have yet to have a cache rejected (only 4 placed so far, with 
>a 5th on deck waiting for approval), what happens when geocaching.com 
>denies a cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or does lightning rain down 
>from the sky?

When it happened to mine, which was later approved after appeal, I got a 
log watch notification with the comments from the admin telling me that it 
was not approved.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

--=====================_31142390==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"


At 04:04 PM 5/6/2003 -0700, you wrote:



Ok, since
I have yet to have a cache rejected (only 4 placed so far, with a 5th on
deck waiting for approval), what happens when geocaching.com denies a
cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or does lightning rain down
from the sky?


When it happened to mine, which was later approved after appeal, I got a
log watch notification with the comments from the admin telling me that
it was not approved.







Scott




scott@myblueheaven.com




--=====================_31142390==_.ALT--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 00:42:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 17:42:30 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cox/Directv
In-Reply-To: <20030506213215.82746.qmail@web14809.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030507004230.12419.qmail@web40609.mail.yahoo.com>

non-geocaching info ahead

--- Gale Jett  wrote:

> The original cable company for my home was a mom and
> pop bare bones company.Cox bought them out and just
> last month hooked up my internet. I've had nothing
> but problems with the connection. Just last Friday
> my connection was lost 12 times in an hour and a
> half. I didn't know I knew that many bad words! Cox
> claims there is no problem but for $50 they'll come
> out and look...I'll learn to live with it for now.


Cox has had issues for two-three months both times we
needed the cable setup. Both times, the problem wasn't
on our end, despite their assertions to the contrasry,
but was in the setup between the cable modem and their
equipment. The signals weren't going between the two
very weel. The second time, the tech explained that it
was due to a problem they sometimes have with the
neighborhood connection.

You can check the status and error messages on your
cable modem through a web browser. The cable modem I
had was a surfboard so if yours is different, changes
may be needed. I would enter http://192.168.100.1 into
my web browser and hit the management screen on the
modem. I don't recall the tab, but you could see the
status messages, watch the modem try to connect, see
basic information why it wasn't connecting, etc.

Chances are that if you're losing the connection that
often that the modem is losing the signal to their
equipment and the logs on your modem may be a way to
get them out there doing their jobs.


Eric
Team Dragon

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 00:43:38 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 17:43:38 -0700
Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] Rejected Cache]
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C313F7.06CF3AC0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Brian,

You know, they are gods!  I wouldn't be surprised if the skies do open up=
.  I read earlier they may be vying for the big "G"!  Then you will reall=
y need to learn to take cover!  [:-D]

Rand (RandMan)

*************************************************************************=
************************************************
Ok, since I have yet to have a cache rejected (only 4 placed so far, with=
 a
5th on deck waiting for approval), what happens when geocaching.com denie=
s a
cache?  Are you e-mailed the notice, or does lightning rain down from the
sky?

Brian
Team A.I.



____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C313F7.06CF3AC0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Brian,
 <=
DIV>  
You know, they are gods!  I wouldn't be surpri=
sed if the skies do open up.  I read earlier they may be v=
ying for the big "G"!  Then you will really ne=
ed to learn to take cover!  [:-D]
 
 
 
Rand =
(RandMan)
 
 
 
 
***********************=
*************************************************************************=
*************************
Ok, since I have yet to have a cache rejecte=
d (only 4 placed so far, with a
5th on deck waiting for approval), wha=
t happens when geocaching.com denies a
cache?  Are you e-mailed t=
he notice, or does lightning rain down from the
sky?
 
Brian
Team =
A.I.



_____________________________________________________=
_______
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edi=
t your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeoc=
aching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Res=
ource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C313F7.06CF3AC0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 01:36:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 18:36:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cox/Directv
In-Reply-To: <20030506213215.82746.qmail@web14809.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C313FE.5B6EE100
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

We left Cox and went to DirecTV when they demanded $10 to change my wife's
name on the account from her maiden name to married name. Who cares? We left
it in her maiden name before cancelling. They didn't offer to pay us $10
when they changed their name from Tucson Cablevision.

Father Ted is indeed worth the price. Its a shame Dermot Morgan died a few
years ago.

Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Gale Jett
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 2:32 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cox/Directv


  I've had no problems with my connection since cox figured out that my
cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep disconnecting it, and it's been
especially good since they started their own internet business rather than
having @home employees and cox employees stepping on each others toes.

  What has sucked for me is the actual cable server... so I just switched to
DirecTV and I won't ever go back... it's so much better that cable would be
if the signal was perfect.

  Brian Cluff
  Team Snaptek

  gale and mike wrote:
            Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just wondering
what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.





  The original cable company for my home was a mom and pop bare bones
company.Cox bought them out and just last month hooked up my internet. I've
had nothing but problems with the connection. Just last Friday my connection
was lost 12 times in an hour and a half. I didn't know I knew that many bad
words! Cox claims there is no problem but for $50 they'll come out and
look...I'll learn to live with it for now.

  As for Directv. We've had it for seven years now and we would never change
back to cable. We get better channel selection (BBCA and all sorts of music
only channels among other usual channels) much clearer reception and instant
customer service if we want to change our programming as we usually do in
the summer. We've lost reception only a couple of times in a bad storm. The
one drawback is that we can't record one channel and watch another, but I
believe newer satellite systems can do that. Ours is a Sony, 7 years old and
used a lot, no repairs/maintainance.

  If you've never seen BBC America, you have no idea what you're missing.
Father Ted alone is worth the price of a satellite dish.






  Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
    On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
  "Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
    "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

  Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  Do you Yahoo!?
  The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C313FE.5B6EE100
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







We=20
left Cox and went to DirecTV when they demanded $10 to change my wife's =
name on=20
the account from her maiden name to married name. Who cares? We left it =
in her=20
maiden name before cancelling. They didn't offer to pay us $10 when they =
changed=20
their name from Tucson Cablevision.


 


Father=20
Ted is indeed worth the price. Its a shame Dermot Morgan died a few =
years=20
ago.


 


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of =
Gale=20
  Jett
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 2:32 PM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]=20
  Cox/Directv


  
I've had no problems with my =
connection since=20
  cox figured out that my cable didn't belong to the neighbor and keep=20
  disconnecting it, and it's been especially good since they started =
their own=20
  internet business rather than having @home employees and cox employees =

  stepping on each others toes. 

What has sucked for me is the =
actual=20
  cable server... so I just switched to DirecTV and I won't ever go =
back... it's=20
  so much better that cable would be if the signal was perfect. =


Brian=20
  Cluff 
Team Snaptek 

gale and mike wrote: 

  

    
    

       
       
      
        
Having trouble with my net provider. I use Cox. Just =
wondering=20
        what everyone else uses, and if they like/hate it.=20
      

  
 

  
The original cable company for my home was a =
mom and=20
  pop bare bones company.Cox bought them out and just last =
month hooked up=20
  my internet. I've had nothing but problems with the connection. Just =
last=20
  Friday my connection was lost 12 times in an hour and a half. I didn't =
know I=20
  knew that many bad words! Cox claims there is no problem but for $50 =
they'll=20
  come out and look...I'll learn to live with it for now.

  
As for Directv. We've had it for seven years =
now and we=20
  would never change back to cable. We get better channel selection =
(BBCA=20
  and all sorts of music only channels among other usual =
channels)=20
  much clearer reception and instant customer service if we want to =
change our=20
  programming as we usually do in the summer. We've lost reception =
only a=20
  couple of times in a bad storm. The one drawback is that we can't =
record one=20
  channel and watch another, but I believe newer satellite systems can =
do that.=20
  Ours is a Sony, 7 years old and used a lot, no=20
repairs/maintainance.

  
If you've never seen BBC America, you have no =
idea what=20
  you're missing. Father Ted alone is worth the price of a satellite=20
  dish.

  
 



  
Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang =
interminable=20
  changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- =

  so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the =
Ranges=20
  --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for =
you.=20
  Go!"

  

  
 

  

  
Rudyard Kipling ,   The =
Explorer =20
  1898

  

  

  Do you Yahoo!?
T=
he New=20
  Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.


------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C313FE.5B6EE100--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 05:13:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 22:13:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C3141C.BD340A50
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Well, I got a response from Jeremy - they will get to it sometime after they
move the site to better servers...

So, meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline generator that hopefully is
quick and easy to use. It generates encoded and unencoded text for putting
on the cache page or on a web site.
I don't claim to know or understand many handicap limitations, so comments,
suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a better tool!

http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php
Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Ayre
  Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:18 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


  Well, I would hope that the kind of checkbox rating form for detailed
terrain descriptions would be part of the form you fill in to submit a
cache. Note however that despite the clayjar system being around for a
relatively long time now, the people running geocaching.com haven't even
bothered to make it part of the cache submission process, or produced their
own version.

  I'm going to send Jeremy an Email with my suggestion and ask him for
comments.

  Andy



    -----Original Message-----
    From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale and
mike
    Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:09 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


    That's the clayjar's ratings system from geocaching.com. Problem is, not
everyone uses it consistently. Case in point is a fairly recent cache called
Savanic Mine http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=61648
which the owners have given a 1 * rating to. The cache description tells me
it might be beyond my abilities. People who don't have limitations don't
usually realize the difficulties a cache may present. It's also why I think
something like handicap rating system might be better implemented locally
rather than at geocaching.com. Since too many people already rate a cache
without using their ratings form, what makes anyone think people will use an
updated form or a new one?

    There is definitely a need though. Recently I e-mailed someone whose log
entries included mention of a physically handicapped cacher. I gave them a
list of about 50 caches and compared them to other caches they had been to.
They were very appreciative of the list since the handicapped person had
serious heart problems and several recent hospitalizations.







    >From: "Trisha"
    >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    >Subject: Fwd: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings
    >Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 11:28:04 -0700 (MST)
    >
    >Back a few weeks ago (Mar 25) I posted this post re: cache ratings, a
    >descriptive system that I have been using (supplemented by appropriate
    >wording on my cache pages) This post did not get ONE reply....which is
    >fine, but now that you guys are discussing it, what do you think?
    >
    >Obviously, the difference between a "1", "1.5", and "2" on terrain,
    >when critical to whether someone with some limitations may have
    >trouble accessing that cache, needs to be described on the page in
    >some fashion that you guys appear to be hashing out.
    >
    >When in doubt, I provide hopefully enough description so everybody
    >will have some idea what they are getting into, because I sure
    >appreciate the same in return.
    >
    >Trisha "Lightning"
    >Prescott
    >
    >SEE BELOW
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >------- Start of forwarded message -------
    >
    >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings
    >From: "Trisha"
    >Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:08:15 -0700 (MST)
    >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    >
    >Hi Patrick and all,
    >
    >In regards to rating caches, I have been using a descriptive system
    >that seems to be fairly accurate. I just looked at geocaching.com to
    >see if I could find where this is listed, because I don't remember
    >where I got it from!!!
    >
    >It's not that long, so I will type it out here and hopefully it will
    >help. Obviously, this is subjective (half steps can be used) but it
    >helps me to think of the ratings in these descriptive terms.
    >
    >TERRAIN:
    >
    >1. Handicap Accessible (may be paved, relatively flat, <1/2 mile)
    >
    >2. Suitable for Small Children (likely marked trails, no steep or
    >overgrowth, <2 mile hike)
    >
    >3. Not Suitable for Small Children - Average Adult/Older Child OK
    >depending on physical condition (Likely off trail, may have one or
    >more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep elevation changes,
    > > 2 mile hike)
    >
    >4. Experienced Outdoor Enthusiasts Only - (offtrail, one or more of
    >the following: Heavy Overgrowth, Steep elevation (need use of hands),
    > >10 miles, may be overnight.)
    >
    >5. Requires Special Equipment or Knowledge: (Boat, 4WD, Rock Climbing,
    >SCUBA) or otherwise extremely difficult.
    >
    >Because I feel very strongly that people need to know what they are
    >getting into, esp up here in the mountains or any out-of-the-way
    >place, I will describe pretty clearly if there is a difficult part in
    >getting to the cache. The only thing I don't agree with in this
    >descriptive system is the 4WD = a "5". While 4WD is "special
    >equipment", many have it. If getting to my cache requires 4WD I will
    >put that in the description, with an assessment of how hard the 4WD
    >might be, and rate the cache less than a "5" based upon the rest of
    >the adventure.....:-)
    >
    >
    >DIFFICULTY:
    >
    >1. EASY - plain sight or found in a few minutes
    >
    >2. AVERAGE - Any geocacher can find in less than 30 minutes
    >
    >3. CHALLENGING - Experienced Geocacher will find it challenging and
    >could take a good part of the afternoon
    >
    >4. DIFFICULT - Real challenge for experienced Geocacher. May require
    >special skills/knowledge, or in depth preparation. May need multiple
    >days/trips to find.
    >
    >5. EXTREME - Serious mental/physical challenge. Requires Special
    >knowledge, skills or equipment.
    >
    >As you can see, there is quite a gap between "2" and "3". Guess that
    >is what "2.5" is for!!!
    >
    >LIke I said, I get this over a year ago from.... I thought - the
    >geocaching website. Anyway, I wrote it down and this is what I go by.
    >What do people think? Anybody else using this descriptive system? If
    >most like it maybe it could become the standard?
    >
    >Trisha "Lightning"
    >Prescott
    >
    >
    >
    >On Mon, 24 Mar 2003, "Patrick Brown" wrote:
    >
    > >
    > > I have notised that a lot of people that place Caches use
    >different
    > > ratings. When we place a cache we have been using the suggested
    >Rating
    > > when
    > > we fill out the form (
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs">http://www.
clayjar.com/gcrs/ ).
    > > That is why it looks like we have set some high numbers. These
    > > caches are
    > > a lot easyer than they look. Then again I see some that have a
    >rating
    > > of 2
    > > or 3 that are really tuff. Does anyone else see that?
    > >
    > > Patrick Brown
    > > PANDA77
    > > Check out
    > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.geocaching.com">http://www.ge
ocaching.com/
    > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.
azgeocaching.com/
    > > ____________________________________________________________
    > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
    > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
    > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman
/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/a
z-geocaching
    > >
    > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
    > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.
azgeocaching.com
    >
    >------- End of forwarded message -------
    >____________________________________________________________
    >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
    >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
    >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
    >
    >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
    >http://www.azgeocaching.com


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C3141C.BD340A50
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Well,=20
I got a response from Jeremy - they will get to it sometime after they =
move the=20
site to better servers...


 


So,=20
meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline generator that hopefully is =
quick and=20
easy to use. It generates encoded and unencoded text for putting on the =
cache=20
page or on a web site.


I=20
don't claim to know or understand many handicap limitations, so =
comments,=20
suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a better=20
tool!


 


http://www.b=
ritishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Andrew Ayre
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:18 =
PM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache =

  Ratings


  
Well, I would hope that the kind of checkbox rating form for =
detailed=20
  terrain descriptions would be part of the form you fill in to submit a =
cache.=20
  Note however that despite the clayjar system being around for a =
relatively=20
  long time now, the people running geocaching.com haven't even bothered =
to make=20
  it part of the cache submission process, or produced their own=20
  version.

  
 

  
I'm=20
  going to send Jeremy an Email with my suggestion and ask him for=20
  comments.

  
 

  
Andy

  

  

    
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
    az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf =
Of=20
    gale and mike
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:09=20
    PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject:=20
    [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


    

    

    
That's the clayjar's ratings system from geocaching.com. Problem =
is, not=20
    everyone uses it consistently. Case in point is a fairly recent =
cache called=20
    Savanic Mine htt=
p://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D61648 which =

    the owners have given a 1 * rating to. The cache description tells =
me it=20
    might be beyond my abilities. People who don't have limitations =
don't=20
    usually realize the difficulties a cache may present. It's also why =
I think=20
    something like handicap rating system might be better implemented =
locally=20
    rather than at geocaching.com. Since too many people already rate a =
cache=20
    without using their ratings form, what makes anyone think people =
will use an=20
    updated form or a new one? 

    
There is definitely a need though. Recently I e-mailed someone =
whose log=20
    entries included mention of a physically handicapped cacher. I gave =
them a=20
    list of about 50 caches and compared them to other caches they had =
been to.=20
    They were very appreciative of the list since the handicapped person =
had=20
    serious heart problems and several recent=20
hospitalizations.


    




    

    

    

    
>From: "Trisha" 
    
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    
>Subject: Fwd: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings=20
    
>Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 11:28:04 -0700 (MST)=20
    
>=20
    
>Back a few weeks ago (Mar 25) I posted this post re: =
cache=20
    ratings, a=20
    
>descriptive system that I have been using =
(supplemented by=20
    appropriate=20
    
>wording on my cache pages) This post did not get ONE=20
    reply....which is=20
    
>fine, but now that you guys are discussing it, what =
do you=20
    think?=20
    
>=20
    
>Obviously, the difference between a "1", "1.5", and =
"2" on=20
    terrain,=20
    
>when critical to whether someone with some =
limitations may=20
    have=20
    
>trouble accessing that cache, needs to be described =
on the=20
    page in=20
    
>some fashion that you guys appear to be hashing out.=20
    
>=20
    
>When in doubt, I provide hopefully enough description =
so=20
    everybody=20
    
>will have some idea what they are getting into, =
because I=20
    sure=20
    
>appreciate the same in return.=20
    
>=20
    
>Trisha "Lightning"=20
    
>Prescott=20
    
>=20
    
>SEE BELOW=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>------- Start of forwarded message -------=20
    
>=20
    
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings=20
    
>From: "Trisha" 
    
>Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:08:15 -0700 (MST)=20
    
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    
>=20
    
>Hi Patrick and all,=20
    
>=20
    
>In regards to rating caches, I have been using a =
descriptive=20
    system=20
    
>that seems to be fairly accurate. I just looked at=20
    geocaching.com to=20
    
>see if I could find where this is listed, because I =
don't=20
    remember=20
    
>where I got it from!!!=20
    
>=20
    
>It's not that long, so I will type it out here and =
hopefully=20
    it will=20
    
>help. Obviously, this is subjective (half steps can =
be used)=20
    but it=20
    
>helps me to think of the ratings in these descriptive =
terms.=20
    
>=20
    
>TERRAIN:=20
    
>=20
    
>1. Handicap Accessible (may be paved, relatively =
flat,=20
    <1/2 mile)=20
    
>=20
    
>2. Suitable for Small Children (likely marked trails, =
no=20
    steep or=20
    
>overgrowth, <2 mile hike)=20
    
>=20
    
>3. Not Suitable for Small Children - Average =
Adult/Older=20
    Child OK=20
    
>depending on physical condition (Likely off trail, =
may have=20
    one or=20
    
>more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep =
elevation=20
    changes,=20
    
> > 2 mile hike)=20
    
>=20
    
>4. Experienced Outdoor Enthusiasts Only - (offtrail, =
one or=20
    more of=20
    
>the following: Heavy Overgrowth, Steep elevation =
(need use of=20
    hands),=20
    
> >10 miles, may be overnight.)=20
    
>=20
    
>5. Requires Special Equipment or Knowledge: (Boat, =
4WD, Rock=20
    Climbing,=20
    
>SCUBA) or otherwise extremely difficult.=20
    
>=20
    
>Because I feel very strongly that people need to know =
what=20
    they are=20
    
>getting into, esp up here in the mountains or any=20
    out-of-the-way=20
    
>place, I will describe pretty clearly if there is a =
difficult=20
    part in=20
    
>getting to the cache. The only thing I don't agree =
with in=20
    this=20
    
>descriptive system is the 4WD =3D a "5". While 4WD is =
"special=20
    
>equipment", many have it. If getting to my cache =
requires 4WD=20
    I will=20
    
>put that in the description, with an assessment of =
how hard=20
    the 4WD=20
    
>might be, and rate the cache less than a "5" based =
upon the=20
    rest of=20
    
>the adventure.....:-)=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>DIFFICULTY:=20
    
>=20
    
>1. EASY - plain sight or found in a few minutes=20
    
>=20
    
>2. AVERAGE - Any geocacher can find in less than 30 =
minutes=20
    
>=20
    
>3. CHALLENGING - Experienced Geocacher will find it=20
    challenging and=20
    
>could take a good part of the afternoon=20
    
>=20
    
>4. DIFFICULT - Real challenge for experienced =
Geocacher. May=20
    require=20
    
>special skills/knowledge, or in depth preparation. =
May need=20
    multiple=20
    
>days/trips to find.=20
    
>=20
    
>5. EXTREME - Serious mental/physical challenge. =
Requires=20
    Special=20
    
>knowledge, skills or equipment.=20
    
>=20
    
>As you can see, there is quite a gap between "2" and =
"3".=20
    Guess that=20
    
>is what "2.5" is for!!!=20
    
>=20
    
>LIke I said, I get this over a year ago from.... I =
thought -=20
    the=20
    
>geocaching website. Anyway, I wrote it down and this =
is what=20
    I go by.=20
    
>What do people think? Anybody else using this =
descriptive=20
    system? If=20
    
>most like it maybe it could become the standard?=20
    
>=20
    
>Trisha "Lightning"=20
    
>Prescott=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>=20
    
>On Mon, 24 Mar 2003, "Patrick Brown" wrote:=20
    
>=20
    
> >=20
    
> > I have notised that a lot of people that place =
Caches=20
    use=20
    
>different=20
    
> > ratings. When we place a cache we have been =
using the=20
    suggested=20
    
>Rating=20
    
> > when=20
    
> > we fill out the form ( >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs"&g=
t;http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs/=20
    ).=20
    
> > That is why it looks like we have set some high =

    numbers. These=20
    
> > caches are=20
    
> > a lot easyer than they look. Then again I see =
some that=20
    have a=20
    
>rating=20
    
> > of 2=20
    
> > or 3 that are really tuff. Does anyone else see =
that?=20
    
> >=20
    
> > Patrick Brown=20
    
> > PANDA77=20
    
> > Check out=20
    
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.geocaching.com">=
http://www.geocaching.com/=20

    
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com"&g=
t;http://www.azgeocaching.com/=20

    
> >=20
    ____________________________________________________________=20
    
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list =
listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe =
visit:=20
    
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.c=
om/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/ma=
ilman/listinfo/az-geocaching=20

    
> >=20
    
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource=20
    
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com"&g=
t;http://www.azgeocaching.com=20

    
>=20
    
>------- End of forwarded message -------=20
    =

>__________________________________________________________=
__=20
    
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
    
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: =

    =

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geoca=
ching=20

    
>=20
    
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource=20
    
>http://www.azgeocaching.com=20
    


    

    MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE =
E-MAIL=20
    VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
    ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
    mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, =
subscribe or=20
    unsubscribe visit:=20
    http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
    Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20



------=_NextPart_000_0021_01C3141C.BD340A50--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 06:51:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 23:51:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
Message-ID: <002001c31465$0b1dca60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Thanks for the info guys.  So far I haven't received anything, and the =
cache isn't yet approved.  The odd thing was that at least 22 caches =
submitted AFTER mine have been approved.  I'll wait for a response to =
the e-mail I sent off and see what happens.=20

Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C3142A.5EA37B20
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Thanks for the info guys.  So far =
I haven't=20
received anything, and the cache isn't yet approved.  The odd thing =
was=20
that at least 22 caches submitted AFTER mine have been approved.  =
I'll wait=20
for a response to the e-mail I sent off and see what =
happens. 


 


Brian


Team A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C3142A.5EA37B20--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 13:59:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 06:59:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
References: <002001c31465$0b1dca60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <003801c314a0$e36cff40$d311b83f@fishkiller>

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I think that it is because it is YOU.....

just remember that the cache should be inplace  before it is approved or =
you run the risk of having a very confused cacher looking for a first =
find...
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brian Casteel=20
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 11:51 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache


  Thanks for the info guys.  So far I haven't received anything, and the =
cache isn't yet approved.  The odd thing was that at least 22 caches =
submitted AFTER mine have been approved.  I'll wait for a response to =
the e-mail I sent off and see what happens.=20

  Brian
  Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C31466.361B89E0
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I think that it is because it is=20
YOU.....


 


just remember that the cache should be=20
inplace  before it is approved or you run the risk of having a very =

confused cacher looking for a first find...



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brian =
Casteel=20
  
  
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  

  
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 =
11:51=20
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: =
Rejected=20
  Cache

  


  
Thanks for the info guys.  So =
far I haven't=20
  received anything, and the cache isn't yet approved.  The odd =
thing was=20
  that at least 22 caches submitted AFTER mine have been approved.  =
I'll=20
  wait for a response to the e-mail I sent off and see what=20
  happens. 

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C31466.361B89E0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 14:36:31 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (HighwayHavoc)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 07:36:31 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
In-Reply-To: <003801c314a0$e36cff40$d311b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <20030507143631.31664.qmail@web40512.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Team Evil Fish  wrote:
> just remember that the cache should be inplace 
> before it is approved or you run the risk of having
> a very confused cacher looking for a first find...

(the crowd all turns and looks behind them as a loud
voice belts out...)

HERE, HERE! I AGREE WITH TEAM EVIL FISH!

(Who said that? Perhaps we'll never know as the crowd
mingles together and the speaker becomes lost in the
tangle of humanity.)


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 14:49:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 07:49:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
References: <002001c31465$0b1dca60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <3EB91D06.8030301@uccinc.net>

Brian,

Did you get the conformation that it was submitted? I had one like that 
and for some reason they did not get it.

Tamo

Brian Casteel wrote:

> Thanks for the info guys.  So far I haven't received anything, and the 
> cache isn't yet approved.  The odd thing was that at least 22 caches 
> submitted AFTER mine have been approved.  I'll wait for a response to 
> the e-mail I sent off and see what happens. 
>  
> Brian
> Team A.I.





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 18:39:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 11:39:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030507183935.85109.qmail@web14801.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Andrew Ayre  wrote:
> Well, I got a response from Jeremy - they will get
> to it sometime after they
> move the site to better servers...
> 
> So, meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline
> generator that hopefully is
> quick and easy to use. It generates encoded and
> unencoded text for putting
> on the cache page or on a web site.
> I don't claim to know or understand many handicap
> limitations, so comments,
> suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a
> better tool!
> 
> http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php
> Andy
> 


This actually looks really helpful in forming a more
handicapped description!  I'll be sure to use it when
I finally hide my first cache (hopefully this coming
weekend).  I figured with over 80 finds it was about
time to finally hide one!



=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 22:18:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:18:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
Message-ID: <002201c314e6$a5685e60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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Yes, I did get confirmation that the cache had been submitted.  I've =
been checking the cache page itself to see if it had been approved or =
not.

It turns out that just after I checked my e-mail this morning, the =
archive e-mail was sent.  It was rejected due to the fact that I had =
suggested rotating the final cache container between two locations, =
which has been removed.  There is one other aspect of the cache which =
they may have issue with, but relates ONLY to the clues, not the cache =
itself.  I'm hoping it will be released now.

As for you, Regan, even if I waited until cache approval to place the =
cache, I doubt I would be beat to the cache by a someone looking for a =
first find.  :)  This isn't your typical cache in the middle of =
somewhere.

Brian
Team A.I.
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Yes, I did get confirmation that the =
cache had been=20
submitted.  I've been checking the cache page itself to see if it =
had been=20
approved or not.


 


It turns out that just after I checked =
my e-mail=20
this morning, the archive e-mail was sent.  It was rejected due to =
the fact=20
that I had suggested rotating the final cache container between two =
locations,=20
which has been removed.  There is one other aspect of the cache =
which they=20
may have issue with, but relates ONLY to the clues, not the cache =
itself. =20
I'm hoping it will be released now.


 


As for you, Regan, even if I waited =
until cache=20
approval to place the cache, I doubt I would be beat to the cache by a =
someone=20
looking for a first find.  :)  This isn't your typical cache =
in the=20
middle of somewhere.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 22:37:03 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 15:37:03 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Un-rejected Cache
Message-ID: <004601c314e9$2e3cae10$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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I fired off an e-mail to the admin who rejected/archived the cache =
explaining my position and removed the 'offending' portion of the cache =
description.  All is well, and It...has you (GCG2GC).

Brian
Team A.I.
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I fired off an e-mail to the admin who=20
rejected/archived the cache explaining my position and removed the =
'offending'=20
portion of the cache description.  All is well, and It...has you =
(GCG2GC).


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 23:31:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 16:31:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Geocaching  Rendezvous Event
Message-ID: <016401c314f0$d7ef5a00$1e01a8c0@connie>

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Message
 For those interested, pictures are posted on our web site.


http://members.cox.net/azjeeper/Arizona%20Geocaching%20Rendezvous%20-%202003
.htm

Larry Farquhar
Team "Wyle E"
http://www.happy-wanderers.com


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Message




 


 For =
those=20
interested, pictures are posted on our web=20
site.


 


http://members.cox.net/azjeeper/Arizona%20Geocaching%20R=
endezvous%20-%202003.htm


 


Larry =
Farquhar


Team "Wyle E"


http://www.happy-wanderers.com


 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May  7 23:52:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 16:52:45 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
Message-ID: <20030507165246.26662.h011.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Are you saying I am quiet because you think I am the pirate? You
couldn't be more wrong....if I had TIME and ENERGY to do all this
plundering (IN PHOENIX, everybody knows how I feel about coming down
there) I'd be simply finding caches. 
I am quiet because I am burned out with certain things about
geocaching, (hence the archiving of some of my caches) and having some
serious family problems (daughter) to deal with. Geocaching takes a
back seat to just about every other life issue, unfortuneately.
Trisha 


On Mon, 5 May 2003 17:40:55 -0700, "Andrew Ayre" wrote:

> 
> Hmmmm...Trisha has been a bit quiet on all of this... ;)
> 
> Andy
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
> Scott
> Wood
> Sent: Monday, May 05, 2003 5:14 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates
> 
> 
> At 05:04 PM 5/5/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> 
> >I decided that I can forgive Mortey.  It's a slick concept and kinda
> funny
> >now that I have all the info.  I don't feel bad for being annoyed,
> but I'm
> >not annoyed anymore.
> 
> I agree.  The more I think about this, and after having read the
latest
> profile, I sort of find all this as being very creative.  Speaking
> only for
> myself, after 300 finds there are parts of this game that are
getting a
> little routine.  This could be a spark that adds some excitement to
the
> game again.
> 
> >He should have planned it better and stated the terms of his
> plundering in
> >the first place.  Then it probably would have been better received.
> 
> Agreed again.  As I said in a previous message, my prediction is that
> this
> is someone that most or all of us know, and is a high profile cacher.
> 
> 
> 
> Scott
> 
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 00:20:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 17:20:09 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G
Message-ID: <20030507172010.28622.h011.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Geez, Regan, go back to bed....

On Tue, 6 May 2003 12:14:27 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:

> 
> I will just be quite to the fact that Team Evil Fish no longer shows
> ANY out
> of State finds when there are 5 Member only caches that have in the
> past
> would have shown OUT OF STATE...
> 
> then after taking a nap I wonder if it had anything to do with the
> WISHY
> WASHY nature of the caches being switched from open to all the being
> restricted to open to all then again being restricted then again open
> to all
> then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open
> to
> all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> then
> open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted
> then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then
> being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> all
> then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open
> to
> all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> then
> open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted
> then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then
> being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> all
> then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open
> to
> all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> then
> open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted
> then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
then
> being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> all
> then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
open
> to
> all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Poulter" 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a
> big G
> 
> 
> > forthe record we are not "caching gods"...  that would have to be
> >
> > Wyle "E"... i belive the technical term for us is
> >
> > "cache programming gods"!!
> >
> >
> > what code have we written in the past few days.... may you
enlighten
> us
> > with this information???
> >
> > if we have done some in the past few days... we must be gods
because
> we
> > didn't even have to think about programming anything it just came
> into
> > existence from our subcontious thoughts.... ;)
> >
> > jason
> > "omnipotent one"
> >
> >
> > Team Evil Fish wrote:
> > > Jason and Brian
> > >
> > > I want to thank you in (some fancy word) for the time and effort
> you've
> > > put into writing code over the past few days....
> > >
> > > then Brian, as Jason is to far away, what do you want for lunch??
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 02:21:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 19:21:19 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:  Cache Pirates
Message-ID: 

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Trisha,

Andy brought up a point!  We missed your opinions the last few days.  I h=
ope everything works out well for you.  I can understand needing to take =
a break every once in a while - and the importance of putting family firs=
t.

Take care, =20

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Trisha
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 4:54 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cache Pirates

Are you saying I am quiet because you think I am the pirate? You
couldn't be more wrong....if I had TIME and ENERGY to do all this
plundering (IN PHOENIX, everybody knows how I feel about coming down
there) I'd be simply finding caches. =20
I am quiet because I am burned out with certain things about
geocaching, (hence the archiving of some of my caches) and having some
serious family problems (daughter) to deal with. Geocaching takes a
back seat to just about every other life issue, unfortuneately.
Trisha =20


On Mon, 5 May 2003 17:40:55 -0700, "Andrew Ayre" wrote:

> =20
> Hmmmm...Trisha has been a bit quiet on all of this... ;)
> =20
> Andy

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Trisha,
 =

 
 
Andy brought up a point!  We missed your opin=
ions the last few days.  I hope everything works out well for you.&n=
bsp; I can understand needing to take a break every once in a while - and=
 the importance of putting family first.
 
 
 
Tak=
e care, 
 
 
 
RandMan
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Trisha
 
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 4:54 PM 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=

 
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching=
] Re: Cache Pirates
 
 
Are you saying I am quiet beca=
use you think I am the pirate? You
couldn't be more wrong....if I had =
TIME and ENERGY to do all this
plundering (IN PHOENIX, everybody knows=
 how I feel about coming down
there) I'd be simply finding caches. I am quiet because I am burned out with certain things about
geocachi=
ng, (hence the archiving of some of my caches) and having some
serious=
 family problems (daughter) to deal with. Geocaching takes a
back seat=
 to just about every other life issue, unfortuneately.
Trisha 

=

On Mon, 5 May 2003 17:40:55 -0700, "Andrew Ayre" wrote:

> <=
BR>> Hmmmm...Trisha has been a bit quiet on all of this... ;)
> =

> Andy


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 05:24:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Wed, 7 May 2003 22:24:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: [LOG] Archived: Thompson Peak
In-Reply-To: <20030507204135.C7AFC132CF8@signal.groundspeak.com>
Message-ID: <20030508052404.77773.qmail@web21109.mail.yahoo.com>

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Hello Geocachers,
It appears that hydee (Heidi), one of adminstrators at Groundspeak, has archived my geocache near the summit of Thompson Peak (GC3A94), apparently under the orders of managers of the McDowell Sonoran Desert Preserve who acquired a Premium Membership under the user name MSP Manager (I saw that name in the Audit Log).   According to Heidi's log entry, the cache apparently hasn't been removed yet, but it appears to be my responsibilty to remove the cache soon (or someone from the Preserve may pick it up).  Therefore, I am sending you this note to notify you that you have a last chance to find this cache before I pick it up. I expect to hike to the Thompson Peak cache on Saturday, May 10 or Sunday, May 11 to get the cache.  If anyone wants to join me on either of those two days to claim a "last find", then please contact me. I expect to use the Thompson Peak ammo can for another cache - probably on cache-friendly land like State Trust land.  (Why can't all public land be as cache-friendly as State Trust land?  My $15 State Trust land permit is well worth the cost).  I will then unarchive the Thompson Peak cache and convert it to a virtual cache.  Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
"Geocaching.com Automated Bot"  wrote:Greetings from Geocaching.com.

This is an automated message letting you know that the cache has been archived. In case you plan to unarchive the cache in the future, keep this link for your records:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=14996
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Hello Geocachers,



It appears that hydee (Heidi), one of adminstrators at Groundspeak, has archived my geocache near the summit of Thompson Peak (GC3A94), apparently under the orders of managers of the McDowell Sonoran Desert Preserve who acquired a Premium Membership under the user name MSP Manager (I saw that name in the Audit Log).  


 


According to Heidi's log entry, the cache apparently hasn't been removed yet, but it appears to be my responsibilty to remove the cache soon (or someone from the Preserve may pick it up).  Therefore, I am sending you this note to notify you that you have a last chance to find this cache before I pick it up.


 


I expect to hike to the Thompson Peak cache on Saturday, May 10 or Sunday, May 11 to get the cache.  If anyone wants to join me on either of those two days to claim a "last find", then please contact me.


 


I expect to use the Thompson Peak ammo can for another cache - probably on cache-friendly land like State Trust land.  (Why can't all public land be as cache-friendly as State Trust land?  My $15 State Trust land permit is well worth the cost).  I will then unarchive the Thompson Peak cache and convert it to a virtual cache. 


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)



"Geocaching.com Automated Bot" <newcaches@geocaching.com> wrote:


Greetings from Geocaching.com.

This is an automated message letting you know that the cache has been archived. In case you plan to unarchive the cache in the future, keep this link for your records:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=14996

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 05:40:12 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 22:40:12 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>

If a cache requires a mountain bike, shouldn't it be rated higher than a 1/2?

GCG2G7 was just posted, and I think that the ratings are very misleading 
since the cache description clearly states, in red print, that you must use 
a mountain bike.

Any thoughts?


Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 05:55:03 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 22:55:03 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <3EB9F137.6030004@uccinc.net>

I think this is the case. It seems that some have a different opinion on 
what a level should be. This would include myself. Even though I think 
that I have followed the guild lines and even used the geocaching rating 
system, it needs to be much more uniformed so all will really know what 
to expect. If they had used the rating system on the site when listing 
it, they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special 
equipment)

Tamo

Scott Wood wrote:

> If a cache requires a mountain bike, shouldn't it be rated higher than 
> a 1/2?
>
> GCG2G7 was just posted, and I think that the ratings are very 
> misleading since the cache description clearly states, in red print, 
> that you must use a mountain bike.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 13:26:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 06:26:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030508132606.1106.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com>

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I agree.  In addition, the cache description states "you must travel most of the 17 mile bike course in order to find all 6 stages of this cache."   Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood  wrote:If a cache requires a mountain bike, shouldn't it be rated higher than a 1/2?

GCG2G7 was just posted, and I think that the ratings are very misleading 
since the cache description clearly states, in red print, that you must use 
a mountain bike.

Any thoughts?


Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
--0-939373352-1052400366=:93623
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I agree.  In addition, the cache description states "you must travel most of the 17 mile bike course in order to find all 6 stages of this cache."  


 


Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood <scott@myblueheaven.com> wrote:


If a cache requires a mountain bike, shouldn't it be rated higher than a 1/2?

GCG2G7 was just posted, and I think that the ratings are very misleading 
since the cache description clearly states, in red print, that you must use 
a mountain bike.

Any thoughts?


Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

--0-939373352-1052400366=:93623--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 15:22:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Brown)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:22:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS outfitted grocery cart...
Message-ID: 

                                                                            
 Satellite-guided carts for frustrated shoppers                             
                                                                            
                                                                            
 LONDON, England (Reuters) --For frustrated shoppers who spend hours        
 searching for an elusive item, help is on the way -- in the form of a      
 satellite-guided shopping cart.                                            
                                                                            
                                                                            
 Product designer Murray Laidlaw has fitted a shopping cart with a global   
 positioning system, or GPS, to guide shoppers to their products, the Daily 
 Mail newspaper reported Wednesday.                                         
                                                                            
                                                                            
 GPS, initially designed for the U.S. military, will guide shoppers by      
 showing arrows on a screen that shows them the correct shelf.              
                                                                            
                                                                            
 The device, which will sit on the cart's handle, will also suggest         
 recipes, alert customers to special offers and work out the quickest route 
 around the store.                                                          
                                                                            
                                                                            
 "Lots of people just don't shop in a methodical manner," Laidlaw told the  
 paper. "This device will make shopping trips less confusing and            
 time-consuming."                                                           
                                                                            





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 15:35:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:35:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: <20030508132606.1106.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030508153504.39935.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>

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I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.  Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to ride them.  It's not like scuba diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge to use. Although I have not been on this trail, I rated the cache using Clayjar's Geocache Rating System.  I used the following assumptions:  Length of more than 10 miles A well marked/defined hardpack trail Some light overgrowth Some elevation changes on the trail  "Cache may be very well hidden, may be multi-leg, or may use clues to location." Using these inputs, I got a rating of 3/4.  You can try this by going to Clayjar's Geocache Rating System.
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
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I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.  Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to ride them.  It's not like scuba diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge to use.


 


Although I have not been on this trail, I rated the cache using Clayjar's Geocache Rating System.  I used the following assumptions:


 


 Length of more than 10 miles


 A well marked/defined hardpack trail


 Some light overgrowth


 Some elevation changes on the trail 


 "Cache may be very well hidden, may be multi-leg, or may use clues to location."


 


Using these inputs, I got a rating of 3/4.  You can try this by going to Clayjar's Geocache Rating System.


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 15:46:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 08:46:00 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
References: <002201c314e6$a5685e60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <001701c31579$0cc6ff20$4331b83f@fishkiller>

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I will buy anyone lunch at Stewart Andersons for the final coords....
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brian Casteel=20
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 3:18 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache


  Yes, I did get confirmation that the cache had been submitted.  I've =
been checking the cache page itself to see if it had been approved or =
not.

  It turns out that just after I checked my e-mail this morning, the =
archive e-mail was sent.  It was rejected due to the fact that I had =
suggested rotating the final cache container between two locations, =
which has been removed.  There is one other aspect of the cache which =
they may have issue with, but relates ONLY to the clues, not the cache =
itself.  I'm hoping it will be released now.

  As for you, Regan, even if I waited until cache approval to place the =
cache, I doubt I would be beat to the cache by a someone looking for a =
first find.  :)  This isn't your typical cache in the middle of =
somewhere.

  Brian
  Team A.I.
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I will buy anyone lunch at Stewart =
Andersons for=20
the final coords....



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brian =
Casteel=20
  

  
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  

  
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 =
3:18=20
  PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: =
Rejected=20
  Cache

  


  
Yes, I did get confirmation that the =
cache had=20
  been submitted.  I've been checking the cache page itself to see =
if it=20
  had been approved or not.

  
 

  
It turns out that just after I =
checked my e-mail=20
  this morning, the archive e-mail was sent.  It was rejected due =
to the=20
  fact that I had suggested rotating the final cache container between =
two=20
  locations, which has been removed.  There is one other aspect of =
the=20
  cache which they may have issue with, but relates ONLY to the clues, =
not the=20
  cache itself.  I'm hoping it will be released now.

  
 

  
As for you, Regan, even if I waited =
until cache=20
  approval to place the cache, I doubt I would be beat to the cache by a =
someone=20
  looking for a first find.  :)  This isn't your typical cache =
in the=20
  middle of somewhere.

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C3153E.4064A840--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:00:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:00:43 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but
 not because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: <20030508153504.39935.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20030508132606.1106.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508085614.0124d008@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 08:35 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.  Bicycles are pretty 
>common and most people know how to ride them.  It's not like scuba diving 
>equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge 
>to use.

I disagree.  If a cache requires the use of a piece of equipment, then it 
is special equipment.  You are correct in that most people know how to ride 
a bike, but I don't currently own one.  If I wanted to do this cache I 
would have to either go out and buy, borrow or rent a bike.  In my book, 
that makes it special equipment, no different than if I had to buy, borrow 
or rent scuba or climbing equipment.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:03:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:03:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <20030508132606.1106.qmail@web80207.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090229.01328f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 06:26 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I agree.  In addition, the cache description states "you must travel most 
>of the 17 mile bike course in order to find all 6 stages of this cache."

Guess this is one cache down here that I will most likely never go for.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:02:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:02:11 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <3EB9F137.6030004@uccinc.net>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090118.012757d0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 10:55 PM 5/7/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I think this is the case. It seems that some have a different opinion on 
>what a level should be. This would include myself. Even though I think 
>that I have followed the guild lines and even used the geocaching rating 
>system, it needs to be much more uniformed so all will really know what to 
>expect. If they had used the rating system on the site when listing it, 
>they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special equipment)

That's my point.  I don't currently own a mountain bike, because of that I 
would have to buy, borrow or rent a bike in order to do this cache.  To me, 
that means that it is special equipment.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:21:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:21:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090229.01328f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030508162122.32581.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-848915356-1052410882=:31691
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I'm not sure if bicycles are available to rent in cities (I know they are in resort mountain and seaside communities), but one could probably borrow a bike from someone without too much difficulty.  If I lived near this cache, then I would offer my mountain bike to loan to geocachers if they need one to do this cache. Sounds like a good cache to me.  I've only done two traditional caches in the Tucson area - one on the summit of Mount Lemmon, the other the travel bug hotel near the airport. Ken

Scott Wood  wrote:At 06:26 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I agree. In addition, the cache description states "you must travel most 
>of the 17 mile bike course in order to find all 6 stages of this cache."

Guess this is one cache down here that I will most likely never go for.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
--0-848915356-1052410882=:31691
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I'm not sure if bicycles are available to rent in cities (I know they are in resort mountain and seaside communities), but one could probably borrow a bike from someone without too much difficulty.  If I lived near this cache, then I would offer my mountain bike to loan to geocachers if they need one to do this cache.


 


Sounds like a good cache to me.  I've only done two traditional caches in the Tucson area - one on the summit of Mount Lemmon, the other the travel bug hotel near the airport.


 


Ken

Scott Wood <scott@myblueheaven.com> wrote:


At 06:26 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I agree. In addition, the cache description states "you must travel most 
>of the 17 mile bike course in order to find all 6 stages of this cache."

Guess this is one cache down here that I will most likely never go for.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

--0-848915356-1052410882=:31691--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:30:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:30:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <20030508162122.32581.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090229.01328f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508092838.01350a90@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:21 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I'm not sure if bicycles are available to rent in cities (I know they are 
>in resort mountain and seaside communities), but one could probably borrow 
>a bike from someone without too much difficulty.  If I lived near this 
>cache, then I would offer my mountain bike to loan to geocachers if they 
>need one to do this cache.

I have no doubt that it is a good cache, but I think the rating is 
misleading on it.  If I have to go through the effort to get equipment I 
don't currently have, then it is special equipment.  My understanding of 
the rating system, and how I try to rate my caches, state that anything 
under a 5 doesn't require anything special in order to find the cache.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:32:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:32:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment:  Reserve "5" only for truly difficult caches
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090118.012757d0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030508163242.73763.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1252218204-1052411562=:72150
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

If they had used the rating system on the site when listing it, they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special equipment)

Unless the mountain biking trail is very difficult (like the Slickrock Trail near Moab), then there is no way that it should rank a "5".  The "5" rating should be reserved for only extremely difficult caches only, one that the majority of geocachers would not be able to get (even if they rented or borrowed the equipment needed).  Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either. It's easier to ride a bike 17 miles on a smooth, flat trail than it is to hike a half-mile up a very steep, rocky, and brushy mountain without any trail (like my Granite Mountain cache in northeastern Scottsdale, a true "4").  Therefore, why should the biking cache, with less difficult terrain, be rated higher than the mountain cache? The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently.  The rating of "4" that I calculated still is pretty high, only one step lower. Ken
--0-1252218204-1052411562=:72150
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


If they had used the rating system on the site when listing it, they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special equipment)

Unless the mountain biking trail is very difficult (like the Slickrock Trail near Moab), then there is no way that it should rank a "5".  The "5" rating should be reserved for only extremely difficult caches only, one that the majority of geocachers would not be able to get (even if they rented or borrowed the equipment needed).  Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either.


 


It's easier to ride a bike 17 miles on a smooth, flat trail than it is to hike a half-mile up a very steep, rocky, and brushy mountain without any trail (like my Granite Mountain cache in northeastern Scottsdale, a true "4").  Therefore, why should the biking cache, with less difficult terrain, be rated higher than the mountain cache?


 


The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently.  The rating of "4" that I calculated still is pretty high, only one step lower.


 


Ken

--0-1252218204-1052411562=:72150--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:39:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:39:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
Message-ID: 



I didnt look at the cache description... but, who says you HAVE to use a 
mountain bike? Anywhere you can go on a mountain bike, you can certainly 
hike to. ???

Scott
Team RTW

>From: Scott Wood 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
>Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:02:11 -0700
>
>At 10:55 PM 5/7/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>>I think this is the case. It seems that some have a different opinion on 
>>what a level should be. This would include myself. Even though I think 
>>that I have followed the guild lines and even used the geocaching rating 
>>system, it needs to be much more uniformed so all will really know what to 
>>expect. If they had used the rating system on the site when listing it, 
>>they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special 
>>equipment)
>
>That's my point.  I don't currently own a mountain bike, because of that I 
>would have to buy, borrow or rent a bike in order to do this cache.  To me, 
>that means that it is special equipment.
>
>
>
>Scott

_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online  
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:44:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:44:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment:
 Reserve "5" only for truly difficult caches
In-Reply-To: <20030508163242.73763.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090118.012757d0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508094106.0131bdd0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:32 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently.  The rating of "4" 
>that I calculated still is pretty high, only one step lower.

Actually, my understanding was that 4 was for a cache that was very hard, 
but didn't require anything but the cacher.  If a cache required any 
equipment beyond the cacher, then it was a 5.

Perhaps they should look at having a different, or expanded rating system 
for the terrain of the caches where there is a star rating and then some 
sort of follow on designation for equipment.  Perhaps something like 3B for 
3 star that requires a bike.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:45:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:45:30 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

Except that it is on a mountain bike course where foot traffic is not
allowed....  So, the who that says you HAVE to use a mountain bike are the
operators of the course.

Jim.

On Thu, 8 May 2003, RopingThe Wind wrote:

> I didnt look at the cache description... but, who says you HAVE to use a 
> mountain bike? Anywhere you can go on a mountain bike, you can certainly 
> hike to. ???
> 
> Scott
> Team RTW
> 

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:46:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:46:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508094557.0130e750@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:39 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:



>I didnt look at the cache description... but, who says you HAVE to use a 
>mountain bike? Anywhere you can go on a mountain bike, you can certainly 
>hike to. ???

Except that TPD (Tucson Police Department) will arrest you, atleast from 
what I have been told by biking friends down here that are trying to keep 
that place for themselves.  The signs are clear that you are not allowed to 
hike on the trail.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:51:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:51:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508095032.01379040@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:45 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Except that it is on a mountain bike course where foot traffic is not
>allowed....  So, the who that says you HAVE to use a mountain bike are the
>operators of the course.

I have a friend that is a rabid mountain and street biker.  He is even one 
of those clowns that go out and block traffic with their bikes to make a 
point.  He tells me that they have had a number of people hauled off by TPD 
for being out there without a bike.  They use trespassing laws.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:57:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 09:57:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment:  Reserve "5" only for t
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31548.3F663F80
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Or one could just compromise and go with a four-and-a-half star rating al=
ong with an explanation in the description as to what the cacher can expe=
ct!  [;-)]

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Wood
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 9:49 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment: Reserve=
 "5" only for truly difficult caches

At 09:32 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently.  The rating of "4" =20
>that I calculated still is pretty high, only one step lower.

Actually, my understanding was that 4 was for a cache that was very hard,=
 =20
but didn't require anything but the cacher.  If a cache required any =20
equipment beyond the cacher, then it was a 5.

Perhaps they should look at having a different, or expanded rating system=
 =20
for the terrain of the caches where there is a star rating and then some =20
sort of follow on designation for equipment.  Perhaps something like 3B f=
or =20
3 star that requires a bike.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31548.3F663F80
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Or one could j=
ust compromise and go with a four-and-a-half star rating along =
with an explanation in the description as to what the cacher can expect!&=
nbsp; [;-)]
 
 
 
RandMan
 
 
 =

 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Scott Wood 
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 9:4=
9 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocachi=
ng.com
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geoc=
aching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment: Reserve "5" only for truly d=
ifficult caches
 
 
At 09:32 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wr=
ote:

>The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently. =
; The rating of "4" 
>that I calculated still is pretty high, only =
one step lower.

Actually, my understanding was that 4 was for a ca=
che that was very hard, 
but didn't require anything but the cacher.&n=
bsp; If a cache required any 
equipment beyond the cacher, then it was=
 a 5.

Perhaps they should look at having a different, or expanded =
rating system 
for the terrain of the caches where there is a star rat=
ing and then some 
sort of follow on designation for equipment.  =
Perhaps something like 3B for 
3 star that requires a bike.


Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

_=
___________________________________________________________
Az-Geocach=
ing mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subsc=
ribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/li=
stinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.a=
zgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31548.3F663F80--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 16:59:38 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (jim Stamm)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 09:59:38 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508095032.01379040@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <7457F5C1-8176-11D7-B036-000A959F12C6@Comcast.net>

This cache is getting more and more appealing by the hour.


On Thursday, May 8, 2003, at 09:51  AM, Scott Wood wrote:

> At 09:45 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>> Except that it is on a mountain bike course where foot traffic is not
>> allowed....  So, the who that says you HAVE to use a mountain bike 
>> are the
>> operators of the course.
>
> I have a friend that is a rabid mountain and street biker.  He is even 
> one of those clowns that go out and block traffic with their bikes to 
> make a point.  He tells me that they have had a number of people 
> hauled off by TPD for being out there without a bike.  They use 
> trespassing laws.


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 17:13:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 10:13:28 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Street biker
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3154A.78210920
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Reminds me of my ex-brother-in-law who was killed on his bike about thirt=
y years ago.  He too was one of these bikers who would ride in any lane h=
e felt like riding in.   He was riding along in the middle of a lane, not=
 going the speed limit when someone who didn't see him came up behind him=
 and ran him over.

RandMan

*************************************************************************=
**************************************************
I have a friend that is a rabid mountain and street biker.  He is even on=
e =20
of those clowns that go out and block traffic with their bikes to make a =20
point . . . . =20

  Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3154A.78210920
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Reminds me of =
my ex-brother-in-law who was killed on his bike about thirty years ago.&n=
bsp; He too was one of these bikers who would ride in any lane&=
nbsp;he felt like riding in.   He was riding along in the middl=
e of a lane, not going the speed limit when someone who didn't =
see him came up behind him and ran him over.
 
 
=
 
RandMan
 
 
 
 
*******************=
*************************************************************************=
*******************************
I have a friend that is a rabid mounta=
in and street biker.  He is even one 
of those clowns that=
 go out and block traffic with their bikes to make a 
point . . . .  
 
 
  Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.c=
om



------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3154A.78210920--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 17:58:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 10:58:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090118.012757d0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <002a01c3158b$72e2a7c0$4331b83f@fishkiller>

I agree
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Wood" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


> At 10:55 PM 5/7/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >I think this is the case. It seems that some have a different opinion on
> >what a level should be. This would include myself. Even though I think
> >that I have followed the guild lines and even used the geocaching rating
> >system, it needs to be much more uniformed so all will really know what
to
> >expect. If they had used the rating system on the site when listing it,
> >they would have had a much higher rating (I think a 5 for special
equipment)
>
> That's my point.  I don't currently own a mountain bike, because of that I
> would have to buy, borrow or rent a bike in order to do this cache.  To
me,
> that means that it is special equipment.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 18:55:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 11:55:15 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090229.01328f98@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030508092838.01350a90@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: 

I take the meaning of "special equipment" to mean that you absolutely cannot
get the cache without it.  This cache seems to be EASIER with a mountain
bike, but hardly an ABSOLUTE necessity.  A 17 mile trek, while maybe a pain,
is certainly not impossible on foot.  Might merrit a 4, maybe a 4.5.


-T.


Scott Wood wrote:
> At 09:21 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>> I'm not sure if bicycles are available to rent in cities (I know
>> they are in resort mountain and seaside communities), but one could
>> probably borrow a bike from someone without too much difficulty.  If
>> I lived near this cache, then I would offer my mountain bike to loan
>> to geocachers if they need one to do this cache.
>
> I have no doubt that it is a good cache, but I think the rating is
> misleading on it.  If I have to go through the effort to get
> equipment I don't currently have, then it is special equipment.  My
> understanding of the rating system, and how I try to rate my caches,
> state that anything under a 5 doesn't require anything special in
> order to find the cache.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 19:00:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:00:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <7457F5C1-8176-11D7-B036-000A959F12C6@Comcast.net>
Message-ID: 

That's it.  I'm doin' it...  on foot!  ;-)


-T.


jim Stamm wrote:
> This cache is getting more and more appealing by the hour.
> 
> 
> On Thursday, May 8, 2003, at 09:51  AM, Scott Wood wrote:
> 
>> At 09:45 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>>> Except that it is on a mountain bike course where foot traffic is
>>> not allowed....  So, the who that says you HAVE to use a mountain
>>> bike are the
>>> operators of the course.
>> 
>> I have a friend that is a rabid mountain and street biker.  He is
>> even one of those clowns that go out and block traffic with their
>> bikes to make a point.  He tells me that they have had a number of
>> people hauled off by TPD for being out there without a bike.  They
>> use trespassing laws.
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 19:17:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 12:17:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508090229.01328f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>
 <5.1.0.14.2.20030508092838.01350a90@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508121656.013147d8@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 11:55 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I take the meaning of "special equipment" to mean that you absolutely cannot
>get the cache without it.  This cache seems to be EASIER with a mountain
>bike, but hardly an ABSOLUTE necessity.  A 17 mile trek, while maybe a pain,
>is certainly not impossible on foot.  Might merrit a 4, maybe a 4.5.

However, if there is a prohibition to accessing the area without a mountain 
bike, then it is an absolute necessity.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 19:19:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:19:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <7457F5C1-8176-11D7-B036-000A959F12C6@Comcast.net> 
Message-ID: <005c01c31596$c916d3e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>

Remember, this can be done *legally* only by bicycle.  I understand the
hiking challenge though.  There's one on Bartlett Lake that the description
says can only be reached by boat.  I've mapped out a route from the Beeline
that I'll try on foot someday, even though it's about 20 miles.

Jerry
Offtrail


> That's it.  I'm doin' it...  on foot!  ;-)
>
>
> -T.
>
>
> jim Stamm wrote:
> > This cache is getting more and more appealing by the hour.
> >
> >
> > On Thursday, May 8, 2003, at 09:51  AM, Scott Wood wrote:
> >
> >> At 09:45 AM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >>> Except that it is on a mountain bike course where foot traffic is
> >>> not allowed....  So, the who that says you HAVE to use a mountain
> >>> bike are the
> >>> operators of the course.
> >>
> >> I have a friend that is a rabid mountain and street biker.  He is
> >> even one of those clowns that go out and block traffic with their
> >> bikes to make a point.  He tells me that they have had a number of
> >> people hauled off by TPD for being out there without a bike.  They
> >> use trespassing laws.
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 20:13:52 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 13:13:52 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>

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For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name =
from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy =
the most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of =
such travel is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show =
geocaching as an environmentally friendly activity, which generally it =
is, I'm thinking of changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I =
think it's available.

=20

Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily or =
often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.

=20

So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:

=20

1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about =
nothing?

=20

2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any complications =
at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?

=20

Jerry

Offtrail....for awhile, anyway

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 20:47:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 13:47:05 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
References: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

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1.  Actually, the first thing I thought when I saw your nym was =
"Offtrail?  Eh?".  However I didn't really read that much into it.  I =
like to think I'm smart enough to take it for what is, just a nym.  I'm =
not exactly a big fan of the PC movement, so I just shrugged and moved =
on.  :-) =20

2.  I had no problems when I did it (either recently or back in the =
day), but I'm not terribly well known in the community (I don't think).  =
Being an old Usenet junkie, I'd say it won't be a problem for you as =
long as you post a notice of some sort in ALL of the places you frequent =
so the locals can take note.  An explanation isn't really required, but =
if you want to explain you can.

Keep in mind this is old-school etiquette.  I get the feeling that these =
days nobody cares much.  Back then, nym-shifting was frowned upon =
without adequate notice.


-T.
[aka General Bracket]

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Jerry Nelson=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll


  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name =
from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy =
the most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of =
such travel is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show =
geocaching as an environmentally friendly activity, which generally it =
is, I'm thinking of changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I =
think it's available.

  =20

  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily =
or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.

  =20

  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:

  =20

  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about =
nothing?

  =20

  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any =
complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?

  =20

  Jerry

  Offtrail....for awhile, anyway

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1.  Actually, the first thing I =
thought when I=20
saw your nym was "Offtrail?  Eh?".  However I didn't really =
read that=20
much into it.  I like to think I'm smart enough to take it for what =
is,=20
just a nym.  I'm not exactly a big fan of the PC movement, so =
I just=20
shrugged and moved on.  :-)  


 


2.  I had no problems when I did =
it (either=20
recently or back in the day), but I'm not terribly well known in =
the=20
community (I don't think).  Being an old Usenet junkie, I'd say it =
won't be=20
a problem for you as long as you post a notice of some sort in ALL of =
the places=20
you frequent so the locals can take note.  An explanation isn't =
really=20
required, but if you want to explain you can.


 


Keep in mind this is old-school =
etiquette.  I=20
get the feeling that these days nobody cares much.  Back then, =
nym-shifting=20
was frowned upon without adequate notice.


 


 


-T.


[aka General Bracket]


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Jerry=20
  Nelson 
  
  
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 =
1:13=20
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name =
Poll

  


  

  
For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my =
caching name=20
  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I =
enjoy the=20
  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such =
travel=20
  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as =
an=20
  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking =
of=20
  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's =
available.

  
 

  
Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be =
changed easily=20
  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good =
example.

  
 

  
So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an =
opinion:

  
 

  
1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I =
concerned about=20
  nothing?

  
 

  
2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any=20
  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats,=20
  etc.?

  
 

  
Jerry

  
Offtrail....for awhile,=20
anyway


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 20:53:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
References: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

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Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing were updated to my new nym =
no prob.  It did take a few days though.  If you're patient it seems =
that most, if not all, of your former personality is wiped from =
existence after changing it in your profile at GC.com.  Like I said =
though, it does take a few days.


-T.
[General Bracket]


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Jerry Nelson=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll


  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name =
from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy =
the most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of =
such travel is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show =
geocaching as an environmentally friendly activity, which generally it =
is, I'm thinking of changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I =
think it's available.

  =20

  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily =
or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.

  =20

  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:

  =20

  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about =
nothing?

  =20

  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any =
complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?

  =20

  Jerry

  Offtrail....for awhile, anyway

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Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on =
AZGeocahcing=20
were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a few days =
though. =20
If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of your=20
former personality is wiped from existence after changing it in =
your=20
profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take a few=20
days.


 


 


-T.


[General Bracket]


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Jerry=20
  Nelson 
  
  
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 =
1:13=20
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name =
Poll

  


  

  
For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my =
caching name=20
  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I =
enjoy the=20
  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such =
travel=20
  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as =
an=20
  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking =
of=20
  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's =
available.

  
 

  
Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be =
changed easily=20
  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good =
example.

  
 

  
So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an =
opinion:

  
 

  
1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I =
concerned about=20
  nothing?

  
 

  
2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any=20
  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats,=20
  etc.?

  
 

  
Jerry

  
Offtrail....for awhile,=20
anyway


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 21:01:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 14:01:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
In-Reply-To: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508135918.01346568@mail.myblueheaven.com>

--=====================_10041518==_.ALT
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At 01:13 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:


>1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about 
>nothing?

IMHO, no it doesn't, but many often disagree with me on matters such as these.


>2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any complications 
>at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?

We changed ours early on with no real trouble.  Took a little while for 
things to settle through the system, but that was when the pages were still 
generated regularly.  If there are caches out there that don't see visitors 
often, or are archived, then it is possible that you will have logs under 
both names for a very long time.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

--=====================_10041518==_.ALT
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At 01:13 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:





1.
Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
about nothing?


IMHO, no it doesn't, but many often disagree with me on matters such as
these.





2.
Have others who have changed their name experienced any complications at
the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats,
etc.?


We changed ours early on with no real trouble.  Took a little while
for things to settle through the system, but that was when the pages were
still generated regularly.  If there are caches out there that don't
see visitors often, or are archived, then it is possible that you will
have logs under both names for a very long time.







Scott




scott@myblueheaven.com




--=====================_10041518==_.ALT--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 21:16:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:16:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: <20030508153504.39935.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030508211654.53587.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>

The fact that a bike is legally required does it for
me. Boats are also common and easy to operate but they
are specifically included in the example listed in the
first question. The fact that not everyone has a bike
nor can everyone operate one means that some people
are excluded from seeking this cache. Simply because a
bike is required.


--- Ken Akerman  wrote:
> I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.
>  Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how
> to ride them.  It's not like scuba diving equipment
> or rock climbing equipment, which require training
> and knowledge to use. Although I have not been on
> this trail, I rated the cache using Clayjar's
> Geocache Rating System.  I used the following
> assumptions:  Length of more than 10 miles A well
> marked/defined hardpack trail Some light overgrowth
> Some elevation changes on the trail  "Cache may be
> very well hidden, may be multi-leg, or may use clues
> to location." Using these inputs, I got a rating of
> 3/4.  You can try this by going to Clayjar's
> Geocache Rating System.
> Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 21:17:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:17:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
In-Reply-To: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

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I think you're concerned about nothing. I though "Offtrail" was sort of a
jab at yourself, as if to say you're always "off the trail" of finding the
cache.

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Jerry
Nelson
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:14 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll


For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name from
Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy the most.
I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such travel is
negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as an
environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking of
changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's available.



Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily or
often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.



So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:



1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about
nothing?



2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any complications at
the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?



Jerry

Offtrail....for awhile, anyway



====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====



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I=20
think you're concerned about nothing. I though "Offtrail" was sort of a j=
ab at=20
yourself, as if to say you're always "off the trail" of finding the=20
cache.


 


-FroBro Q-Tip


 


 


-----Original Message-----
From:=20
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Jerry=20
Nelson
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:14 PM
To:=20
listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name=20
Poll





For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching =
name from=20
Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy the mo=
st. I=20
don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such travel is=20
negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as an=20
environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking of=
=20
changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's available.<=
/P>

 


Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed e=
asily or=20
often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.


 


So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:


 


1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned=
 about=20
nothing?


 


2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any compl=
ications=20
at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?


 


Jerry


Offtrail....for awhile, anyway
=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D







------=_NextPart_000_0120_01C3156C.952A3B50--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 21:45:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:45:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
References: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

Because I'm at work and TOTALLY bored stiff right now, I Googled for your
proposed new nym...

Apparently there is someone in this community with that username...
http://appalachia.outdoors.org/bbs/usersearchresults.cfm?keyword=peakbagger

This guy has an email address almost exactly like yours
(peakbagger2@hotmail.com).  Is it you?
www.peakbagger.com/

Camelbak makes a peakbagger...
http://www.camelbak.com/rec/cb_prod.cfm?catid=6&product_id=218

This page has a wierd definition (gotta hunt for it)...
http://www.geocities.com/launcestonwc/article.html

This community has a "peakbagger"...
http://www.viewsfromthetop.com/forums/memberlist.php3?s=18867daf8ea80d30dc4a21bc1ed413a1<r=P

I think you should stay with Offtrail.  Q-Tip makes a good point about
another self-depricating type of meaning.  Offtrail is a good one.

Have fun!


-T.
[General Bracket]






----- Original Message ----- 
From: Jerry Nelson
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll


For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name from
Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy the most.
I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such travel is
negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as an
environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking of
changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's available.

Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily or
often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.

So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:

1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about
nothing?

2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any complications at
the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?

Jerry
Offtrail....for awhile, anyway

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 21:45:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:45:02 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
References: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <02fe01c315ab$169a55b0$319c4094@BILLPC>

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Yep, I'm still bummed about the mountain changing its name.  Must have =
been the Easterners.

Bill
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Jerry Nelson=20
  =20
  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily =
or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.


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Yep, I'm still bummed =
about the=20
mountain changing its name.  Must have been the =
Easterners.


 


Bill



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Jerry=20
  Nelson 
  
 

  

  
Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be =
changed easily=20
  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good=20
  example.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 23:00:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 16:00:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] MO&GO
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508155923.0127c8e0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

I haven't seen many messages on the list lately about teams reaching 
milestones, but I see that only the ever Tucson based team has broke the 
300 mark.  Congratulations MO&GO.  Won't be very long until they are the 
top finder in Tucson.  (I am uniquely qualified to make that prediction.)


Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 23:05:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 16:05:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] MO&GO
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508155923.0127c8e0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508160521.013096a0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 04:00 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I haven't seen many messages on the list lately about teams reaching 
>milestones, but I see that only the ever Tucson based team has broke the 
>300 mark.  Congratulations MO&GO.  Won't be very long until they are the 
>top finder in Tucson.  (I am uniquely qualified to make that prediction.)

That was supposed to say SECOND ONLY team.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May  8 23:54:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 16:54:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: [LOG] Archived: Thompson Peak
In-Reply-To: <20030508052404.77773.qmail@web21109.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030508235404.41926.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-907399381-1052438044=:41184
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Geocachers, The cache atop Thompson Peak has been removed, so please do not go looking for it.  I will move the cache container to another location on more cache-friendly land. Ken

Ken Akerman  wrote:Hello Geocachers,
It appears that hydee (Heidi), one of adminstrators at Groundspeak, has archived my geocache near the summit of Thompson Peak (GC3A94), apparently under the orders of managers of the McDowell Sonoran Desert Preserve who acquired a Premium Membership under the user name MSP Manager (The actual name of that person is Claire Miller).
--0-907399381-1052438044=:41184
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Geocachers,


 


The cache atop Thompson Peak has been removed, so please do not go looking for it.  I will move the cache container to another location on more cache-friendly land.


 


Ken

Ken Akerman <ken@highpointer.com> wrote:




Hello Geocachers,



It appears that hydee (Heidi), one of adminstrators at Groundspeak, has archived my geocache near the summit of Thompson Peak (GC3A94), apparently under the orders of managers of the McDowell Sonoran Desert Preserve who acquired a Premium Membership under the user name MSP Manager (The actual name of that person is Claire Miller).

--0-907399381-1052438044=:41184--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 00:38:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 00:38:54 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: 




1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned about nothing? 






I thought your name refered to you taking the road less traveled or being someone who goes their own way rather than someone who wantonly blazes their own trail through the wilderness. I personally don't think of any negative connotations with the name.


I have no experience with Question 2 so I can't help you there. 



Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 00:46:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 00:46:36 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: 




Just in case anyone is interested, my Navajo husband and in-laws thought the whole name change thing was stupid. There are so many other important things that need changing or help. 








>From: "Bill" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll 

>Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 14:45:02 -0700 

> 

>Yep, I'm still bummed about the mountain changing its name. Must have been the Easterners. 

> 

>Bill 

> ----- Original Message ----- 

> From: Jerry Nelson 

> 

> Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed easily or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example. 

> 


MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 00:53:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 00:53:05 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because
 special equipment is needed
Message-ID: 





Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either.

I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment. Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to ride them. It's not like scuba diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge to use. 



 


 


If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain bike as special equipment, then please note the need to use it on the cache page. Those of us who don't have either of those, like us, would appreciate knowing this in advance. Some of you already do note this, and we appreciate it very much.

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 01:51:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 18:51:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
References: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C31592.D9696F40
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Am I the only one getting two copies of each post?  Is something broken?


-T.
[General Bracket]

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: gale and mike=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 5:53 PM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, =
but not because special equipment is needed



  Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it, =
(hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not =
consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either.



  I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment. Bicycles are =
pretty common and most people know how to ride them. It's not like scuba =
diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and =
knowledge to use.=20


  If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain bike as special equipment, =
then please note the need to use it on the cache page. Those of us who =
don't have either of those, like us, would appreciate knowing this in =
advance. Some of you already do note this, and we appreciate it very =
much.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
  MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. =
____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your =
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: =
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Am I the only one getting two copies of =
each=20
post?  Is something broken?


 


 


-T.


[General Bracket]


 


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  gale and mike 
  
  
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 =
5:53=20
PM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Mountain=20
  biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is=20
needed

  


  

  

  

Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive =
to=20
  it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of =
us do not=20
  consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, =
either.

I=20
  don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment. Bicycles are pretty =
common=20
  and most people know how to ride them. It's not like scuba diving =
equipment or=20
  rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge to use.=20
  

  
 

  
 

  
If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain =
bike as=20
  special equipment, then please note the need to use it on the cache =
page.=20
  Those of us who don't have either of those, like us, would appreciate =
knowing=20
  this in advance. Some of you already do note this, and we appreciate =
it very=20
  much.


  

  MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL=20
  VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
  http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
  Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =


------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C31592.D9696F40--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 02:03:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 19:03:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a day counting coup on a cache
References: <20030507172010.28622.h011.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <001f01c315cf$252e22e0$1e29b83f@fishkiller>

Trisha and others

I have been unable to sleep or really do any caching like I want to as Team
Evil Fish had a log removed by a (insert word) cache owner to show how
mature they handled my making a point......

I have been asked to drop the subject of switching caches  mid way through
their life to "protect them" etc... and well just like Thompson Peak that
will not stop cache removal from unwanted areas...and I found out Land
Managers/Stewards are GIVEN a FREE  charter membership so it becomes a silly
tactic...

here is the splat from the drop

the real thing that has me bothered is should I stoop to this cache owners
level and infer that he deleted my find I should delete his....
or
Just tell everyone on the listserv that IMHO WHERERWEE is a hypocrite for
someone wanting to make caching acceptable for all has a very strange way of
showing it....I would advise others to avoid his caches because if in the
future you appeal to his Grating nature he will without warning or a request
delete your find, and will not reply to a private request to have the find
restored....



Thanks Trish venting done...for now

I can now plan for a caching day and will add this about Highpointer I can
honestly say he is regaining respect...

Offtrail as far as the name change keep it just stop caching :) well until
Rand is further ahead in the finds....

Mountain Bikes follow the rules, Why give 'them' a chance to bad mouth
Geocaching by not?...

and on the new Team  A I  matrix puzzle cache I will up the offer to a
dinner at Ruby Tuesday's




----- Original Message -----
From: "Trisha" 
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a big G


> Geez, Regan, go back to bed....
>
> On Tue, 6 May 2003 12:14:27 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:
>
> >
> > I will just be quite to the fact that Team Evil Fish no longer shows
> > ANY out
> > of State finds when there are 5 Member only caches that have in the
> > past
> > would have shown OUT OF STATE...
> >
> > then after taking a nap I wonder if it had anything to do with the
> > WISHY
> > WASHY nature of the caches being switched from open to all the being
> > restricted to open to all then again being restricted then again open
> > to all
> > then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> > to
> > all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> > open
> > to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> > then
> > open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted
> > then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
> then
> > being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> > all
> > then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> > to
> > all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> > open
> > to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> > then
> > open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted
> > then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
> then
> > being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> > all
> > then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> > to
> > all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> > open
> > to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> > then
> > open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted
> > then open to all then being restricted then open to all then being
> > restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to all
> then
> > being restricted then open to all then being restricted then open to
> > all
> > then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> open
> > to
> > all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted then
> > open
> > to all then being restricted then open to all then being restricted
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jason Poulter" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 9:02 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] The caching gods are making a bid for a
> > big G
> >
> >
> > > forthe record we are not "caching gods"...  that would have to be
> > >
> > > Wyle "E"... i belive the technical term for us is
> > >
> > > "cache programming gods"!!
> > >
> > >
> > > what code have we written in the past few days.... may you
> enlighten
> > us
> > > with this information???
> > >
> > > if we have done some in the past few days... we must be gods
> because
> > we
> > > didn't even have to think about programming anything it just came
> > into
> > > existence from our subcontious thoughts.... ;)
> > >
> > > jason
> > > "omnipotent one"
> > >
> > >
> > > Team Evil Fish wrote:
> > > > Jason and Brian
> > > >
> > > > I want to thank you in (some fancy word) for the time and effort
> > you've
> > > > put into writing code over the past few days....
> > > >
> > > > then Brian, as Jason is to far away, what do you want for lunch??
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > >
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 02:11:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 19:11:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
In-Reply-To: <007201c3159e$581b3520$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <000001c315d0$404cc620$6501a8c0@TABLET>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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1.      Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
about nothing?

 

Anyone who's spent more than about ten minutes in your company (and I
can't log much more than that myself), or who has read your logs, would
negate any negativity immediately.

 

Jerry

Offtrail....for awhile, anyway

 

And to many it will be Squaw Peak for awhile, too.

 

Steve

Team Tierra Buena

(Anglos who live in fear that our team name is offensive in Quintana
Roo)

 


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1.     
Does "Offtrail" have negative
connotations, or am I concerned about nothing?



 



Anyone =
who’s spent
more than about ten minutes in your company (and I can’t log much =
more
than that myself), or who has read your logs, would negate any =
negativity
immediately.



 



Jerry



Offtrail....for awhile, =
anyway



 



And to many it =
will be Squaw =
Peak for awhile, =
too.



 



Steve



Team Tierra =
Buena



(Anglos who live =
in fear that
our team name is offensive in Quintana Roo)



 












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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 02:56:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 19:56:04 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <003201c315d6$885f08a0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C3159B.DC033DE0
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	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I'm only getting one each.  Are they both coming to the same email =
address?
(some of us geeks receive several addresses into a single inbox).  If =
all
else fails, try unsubscribing from each of the messages and then
re-register.
=20
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 6:52 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but =
not
because special equipment is needed


Am I the only one getting two copies of each post?  Is something broken?
=20
=20
-T.
[General Bracket]
=20

----- Original Message -----=20
From: gale and mike  =20
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but =
not
because special equipment is needed



Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it,
(hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not
consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either.



I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment. Bicycles are pretty
common and most people know how to ride them. It's not like scuba diving
equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and =
knowledge
to use.=20
=20
=20
If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain bike as special equipment, then
please note the need to use it on the cache page. Those of us who don't =
have
either of those, like us, would appreciate knowing this in advance. Some =
of
you already do note this, and we appreciate it very much.

  _____ =20

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL   =
VIRUSES.
Get 2 months FREE*.
____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20


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	charset="us-ascii"
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Message






I'm=20
only getting one each.  Are they both coming to the same email=20
address?  (some of us geeks receive several addresses into a=20
single inbox).  If all else fails, try unsubscribing from each =
of the=20
messages and then re-register.


 


CacheLess



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Terry Hernlund
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 6:52=20
  PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
  [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because =
special=20
  equipment is needed


  
Am I the only one getting two copies =
of each=20
  post?  Is something broken?

  
 

  
 

  
-T.

  
[General Bracket]

  
 

  
    
----- Original Message ----- 

    From:=20
    gale and mike =

    
    
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 =
5:53=20
    PM

    
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Mountain=20
    biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is=20
    needed

    


    

    

    

Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to =
drive to=20
    it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of =
us do=20
    not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment,=20
    either.

I don't believe that a bicycle is special=20
    equipment. Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to =
ride them.=20
    It's not like scuba diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, =
which=20
    require training and knowledge to use.=20
    

    
 

    
 

    
If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain =
bike as=20
    special equipment, then please note the need to use it on the cache =
page.=20
    Those of us who don't have either of those, like us, would =
appreciate=20
    knowing this in advance. Some of you already do note this, and we =
appreciate=20
    it very much.


    

    MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL=20
    VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
    ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
    mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, =
subscribe or=20
    unsubscribe visit:=20
    http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
    Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20



------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C3159B.DC033DE0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 03:16:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:16:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
References: <003201c315d6$885f08a0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3159E.C28E7D40
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

MessageHmmm...  I only get dups sometimes.  They're to a Hotmail box so =
maybe that's it.

Sorry for the interuption.  Carry on.  ;-)


-T. =20
[General Bracket]


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Bill Tomlinson=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 7:56 PM
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, =
but not because special equipment is needed


  I'm only getting one each.  Are they both coming to the same email =
address?  (some of us geeks receive several addresses into a single =
inbox).  If all else fails, try unsubscribing from each of the messages =
and then re-register.

  CacheLess
    -----Original Message-----
    From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry Hernlund
    Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 6:52 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, =
but not because special equipment is needed


    Am I the only one getting two copies of each post?  Is something =
broken?


    -T.
    [General Bracket]

      ----- Original Message -----=20
      From: gale and mike=20
      To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 5:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate =
harder, but not because special equipment is needed



      Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to =
it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do =
not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either.



      I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment. Bicycles are =
pretty common and most people know how to ride them. It's not like scuba =
diving equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and =
knowledge to use.=20


      If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain bike as special equipment, =
then please note the need to use it on the cache page. Those of us who =
don't have either of those, like us, would appreciate knowing this in =
advance. Some of you already do note this, and we appreciate it very =
much.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-
      MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. =
____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your =
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: =
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3159E.C28E7D40
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Message






Hmmm...  I only get dups =
sometimes. =20
They're to a Hotmail box so maybe that's it.


 


Sorry for the interuption.  Carry =
on. =20
;-)


 


 


-T.  


[General Bracket]


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Bill=20
  Tomlinson 
  
  
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 =
7:56=20
PM

  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Mountain=20
  biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is=20
needed

  


  
I'm=20
  only getting one each.  Are they both coming to the same email=20
  address?  (some of us geeks receive several addresses into a =

  single inbox).  If all else fails, try unsubscribing from =
each of=20
  the messages and then re-register.

  
 

  
CacheLess

  

    

    
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocachi=
ng-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf =
Of=20
    Terry Hernlund
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 6:52=20
    PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
    [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not =
because=20
    special equipment is needed


    
Am I the only one getting two =
copies of each=20
    post?  Is something broken?

    
 

    
 

    
-T.

    
[General Bracket]

    
 

    
      
----- Original Message ----- =


      From:=20
      gale and mike =

      
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      

      
Sent: Thursday, May 08, =
2003 5:53=20
      PM

      
Subject: Re: =
[Az-Geocaching] Mountain=20
      biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is =

      needed

      


      

      

      

Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to =
drive to=20
      it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most =
of us do=20
      not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment,=20
      either.

I don't believe that a bicycle is special =

      equipment. Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to =
ride=20
      them. It's not like scuba diving equipment or rock climbing =
equipment,=20
      which require training and knowledge to use.=20
      

      
 

      
 

      
If you don't consider a 4WD or mountain =
bike as=20
      special equipment, then please note the need to use it on the =
cache page.=20
      Those of us who don't have either of those, like us, would =
appreciate=20
      knowing this in advance. Some of you already do note this, and we=20
      appreciate it very much.


      

      MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL=20
      VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
      ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
      mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, =
subscribe or=20
      unsubscribe visit:=20
      http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
      Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20



------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3159E.C28E7D40--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 03:35:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 03:35:00 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because
 special equipment is needed
Message-ID: 




No, my hotmail account is not getting duplicates, although I've noticed hotmail has been a little funny the last couple of days.

>From: "Terry Hernlund" 


>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed 

>Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:16:50 -0700 

> 

>MessageHmmm... I only get dups sometimes. They're to a Hotmail box so maybe that's it. 

> 

>Sorry for the interuption. Carry on. ;-) 

> 

> 




MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 03:57:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:57:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Radio Review
Message-ID: <000601c315df$1ceab520$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C315A4.708BDD20
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

An occasionally funny review of some GMRS radios. If you're in the
market you may find this information useful.

 

Steve

Team Tierra Buena

 

====================================

The New York Times

May 8, 2003

Two-Way Radios Reviewed By DAVID POGUE

 

Of all the phrases in English, "up to" is among the most powerful.
Thanks to its implied disclaimer, "up to" provides ironclad truth
protection in almost any kind of statement. You can tell your friends
that you type up to 120 words a minute, that you can bench-press up to
500 pounds, and that you earn up to $2 million a year. Legally, you're
covered. 

 

Few industries capitalize on this linguistic loophole with more gusto
than the walkie-talkie business. Of course, their manufacturers would go
bald in horror to hear the term walkie-talkies; the proper term for
these grown-up products is two-way radios. In the coming weeks, you'll
be able to buy these radios in enhanced editions that purport to offer a
range of seven miles - or rather, "up to" seven miles.

 

I was eager to try out the Audiovox GMRS-7001, Cobra PR 4000 WX
Microtalk and Midland G-225, whose product descriptions boldly declare,
"For up to 7 mile range." I found it peculiar, though, that Motorola, a
pioneer in this category, had nothing to offer in the new seven-mile
category. 

 

The reason, according to a Motorola spokesman, is that there is no such
thing. He pointedly observed that there haven't been any regulatory or
technological breakthroughs since the debut of "five mile" radios. He
went so far as to claim that Motorola's own "up to five miles" radio,
the T7200, would offer better range than its rivals' "up to seven miles"
models.

Some of Motorola's competitors very much doubted it. As a Cobra
spokesman joshingly put it, "Liar, liar, pants on fire."

 

Now, it's easy to appreciate the benefits of two-way radios, even the
older, cheaper "two mile" models. They're ideal for communicating car to
car on road trips, checking in with offspring playing down the street,
and coordinating family movements in malls, theme parks and sports
stadiums. Of course, they're also valuable tools for hikers, campers and
skiers. In short, they're ideal for people who don't need two-way
communication often enough to justify the expense of two cellphones and
their monthly fees - or for people in places where the deer and the
antelope roam, but cellphones still don't. 

 

But a range of seven miles would send these radios into a whole new
realm of usefulness. It would permit communication not just across the
block or the mall, but even across town. When you discover that the
video store is out of the movie you want, you could place a quick radio
call home to discuss a second choice. Coordinating after-school pickups
and errand runs would be infinitely simpler. And as for real estate
agents, sales-force personnel and pizza delivery vans - well, you get
the idea.

 

Each of the four contestants in this radio roundup has a stubby antenna
and a backlighted screen that identifies the current transmission
channel (of the 22 available). Except for the Midland, each has a
built-in weather radio. A set of AA or AAA batteries lasts 12 to 20
hours, depending on the battery type (alkaline or rechargeable) and
other variables. Each radio also offers subcodes: thin frequency slices
of each channel that help prevent crosstalk from other radio owners in
your area.

 

Over the years, the government has created standards for two kinds of
consumer radios. First came the Family Radio Service, or F.R.S., a
low-power (half-watt) mode for very short distances. The higher-powered
General Mobile Radio Service (G.M.R.S.) provides better range but uses
up the battery faster. The Cobra, Audiovox, Midland and Motorola are all
dual-class radios, offering both F.R.S. and G.M.R.S. channels. 

 

You're supposed to obtain an F.C.C. license before you use a G.M.R.S.
radio, which involves completing a form available at
www.fcc.gov/formpage.html and paying a $75 fee. The radio makers
acknowledge, however, that this requirement may be the most universally
ignored regulation since the invention of jaywalking.

 

The Midland and Audiovox radios could be twins wearing different
outfits. Each is very inexpensive ($60 per two-pack for the Midland,
$100 a pair for the Audiovox), and feels it. Each is also tiny, no
bigger than a bar of Ivory. Both are far hissier than their more
expensive rivals, and don't have as much range (more on this in a
moment). 

 

Note, too, that each of these bargain units has a design flaw or two.
The Midland's Monitor button, which is designed to produce continuous
static so that you can adjust the volume, is where the Push-to-Talk
button ought to be. And the Audiovox radio is too easily turned on by
other gear in the same luggage. (At one point during a vacation, it
turned itself on unexpectedly at 3 a.m. and treated me to the loud
voices of a couple of drug dealers inside my backpack.)  The Cobra ($120
for a pair) is a far more substantial, navy-and-black radio that feels
like a sculptured oval brick. The Push to Talk button requires a
surprising amount of force, making you wonder if it shouldn't be
relabeled the Strain-to-Talk button.

 

But surprisingly, the Cobra is the only model in this roundup to include
such obvious outdoorsy tools as an alarm clock, a stopwatch and a
digital compass. It even has a vibrating alert, presumably so that your
fellow hikers can page you without waking up the grizzly bear next to
you. 

 

Finally, Motorola's T7200 ($130 for one) is a heavier, more rugged radio
that accommodates either four AA batteries or a rechargeable battery
pack (included). It comes with interchangeable faceplates for the
fashion-conscious hiker - sunshine yellow, camouflage green and dark
green. But the real beauty of this radio is its sound quality, which
stands head, shoulders and torso above its rivals. Only you can decide
if this far superior sound is worth paying a price that's double the
Cobra's and four times the Midland's.

 

All of that is great, but the real question is, how's the range?

 

Now, the manufacturers admit that they get seven miles only in ideal
conditions, when there are no trees, houses or anything else in between
the two radios being tested - in other words, on the moon. But they also
say that you should still get three miles of range even in terrible
conditions - for example, from inside cars.

 

All I can figure out is that the radio makers and I live in parallel
universes. In my suburban tests, these "seven mile" radios began
introducing heavy static and lost syllables at nine-tenths of a mile
apart, and lost all contact at 1.1 miles. On the highway (but out of the
car), the Midland and Audiovox gave up the ghost at 1.5 miles, and the
beefier radios lost touch at 1.7. 

 

Before releasing the services of my good-natured testing partner ("Geek
Freak to Mama Bird: Can you hear me now?"), I gave the radios a final
test that should have been an easy lob: communicating directly across
open water. In this case, the miniradios managed 2.5 miles, and the
Cobra and Motorola models finally lost all staticky contact at 3.3.  The
manufacturers call these freakishly poor results. They chalked it up to
the kinds of environmental factors that can affect range: humidity,
wires, vegetation, buildings, clouds, hills, airplanes and even
sunspots. (Now there's a high-tech corporate excuse you don't hear every
day.)Don't get the impression that these radios are worthless. True,
that "seven mile" business may be the greatest bit of marketing
hyperbole since P. T. Barnum. But even with only a mile of range that
you can count on (on land, anyway), they're still great for malls, theme
parks, ski slopes, hikes, car caravans, and other short-range
situations. 

 

The two-watt Motorola offers uniformly richer, cleaner sound at
distances greater than most of its three-watt rivals, but it's by far
the most expensive. The Cobra lets thicker static creep in as the
distance increases, but ultimately remains intelligible slightly longer
than even the Motorola. It also offers many more features and costs less
than half as much.  As for the Audiovox and Midland - well, sometimes
you get a pair of what you pay for.

 

No matter which brand you choose, after you buy a pair, you should test
whether the range will be good enough for your purposes and then return
them if the answer is no. (You certainly wouldn't be alone.) And you
never know. As the manufacturers would surely tell you, up to 95 percent
of their customers find happiness with these radios up to 99 percent of
the time.


------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C315A4.708BDD20
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



















An occasionally funny review of some GMRS radios. If =
you’re
in the market you may find this information useful.



 



Steve



Team Tierra Buena



 



=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D



The New York Times



May 8, 2003



Two-Way Radios Reviewed By DAVID =
POGUE



 



Of all the phrases in English, "up to" is =
among the
most powerful. Thanks to its implied disclaimer, "up to" =
provides
ironclad truth protection in almost any kind of statement. You can tell =
your
friends that you type up to 120 words a minute, that you can bench-press =
up to
500 pounds, and that you earn up to $2 million a year. Legally, you're =
covered.




 



Few industries capitalize on this linguistic loophole =
with
more gusto than the walkie-talkie business. Of course, their =
manufacturers
would go bald in horror to hear the term walkie-talkies; the proper term =
for
these grown-up products is two-way radios. In the coming weeks, you'll =
be able
to buy these radios in enhanced editions that purport to offer a range =
of seven
miles - or rather, "up to" seven miles.



 



I was eager to try out the Audiovox GMRS-7001, Cobra =
PR 4000
WX Microtalk and Midland G-225, whose product descriptions boldly =
declare,
"For up to 7 mile range." I found it peculiar, though, that =
Motorola,
a pioneer in this category, had nothing to offer in the new seven-mile
category. 



 



The reason, according to a Motorola spokesman, is =
that there
is no such thing. He pointedly observed that there haven't been any =
regulatory
or technological breakthroughs since the debut of "five mile" =
radios.
He went so far as to claim that Motorola's own "up to five =
miles"
radio, the T7200, would offer better range than its rivals' "up to =
seven
miles" models.



Some of Motorola's competitors very much doubted it. =
As a
Cobra spokesman joshingly put it, "Liar, liar, pants on =
fire."



 



Now, it's easy to appreciate the benefits of two-way =
radios,
even the older, cheaper "two mile" models. They're ideal for
communicating car to car on road trips, checking in with offspring =
playing down
the street, and coordinating family movements in malls, theme parks and =
sports
stadiums. Of course, they're also valuable tools for hikers, campers and
skiers. In short, they're ideal for people who don't need two-way =
communication
often enough to justify the expense of two cellphones and their monthly =
fees -
or for people in places where the deer and the antelope roam, but =
cellphones
still don't. 



 



But a range of seven miles would send these radios =
into a
whole new realm of usefulness. It would permit communication not just =
across
the block or the mall, but even across town. When you discover that the =
video
store is out of the movie you want, you could place a quick radio call =
home to
discuss a second choice. Coordinating after-school pickups and errand =
runs
would be infinitely simpler. And as for real estate agents, sales-force
personnel and pizza delivery vans - well, you get the =
idea.



 



Each of the four contestants in this radio roundup =
has a
stubby antenna and a backlighted screen that identifies the current
transmission channel (of the 22 available). Except for the =
Midland, each has a
built-in weather radio. A set of AA or AAA batteries lasts 12 to 20 =
hours,
depending on the battery type (alkaline or rechargeable) and other =
variables.
Each radio also offers subcodes: thin frequency slices of each channel =
that
help prevent crosstalk from other radio owners in your =
area.



 



Over the years, the government has created standards =
for two
kinds of consumer radios. First came the Family Radio Service, or =
F.R.S., a
low-power (half-watt) mode for very short distances. The higher-powered =
General
Mobile Radio Service (G.M.R.S.) provides better range but uses up the =
battery
faster. The Cobra, Audiovox, Midland and =
Motorola are
all dual-class radios, offering both F.R.S. and G.M.R.S. channels. =




 



You're supposed to obtain an F.C.C. license before =
you use a
G.M.R.S. radio, which involves completing a form available at
www.fcc.gov/formpage.html and paying a $75 fee. The radio makers =
acknowledge,
however, that this requirement may be the most universally ignored =
regulation
since the invention of jaywalking.



 



The Midland and =
Audiovox
radios could be twins wearing different outfits. Each is very =
inexpensive ($60
per two-pack for the Midland, $100 a =
pair for
the Audiovox), and feels it. Each is also tiny, no bigger than a bar of =
Ivory.
Both are far hissier than their more expensive rivals, and don't have as =
much
range (more on this in a moment). 



 



Note, too, that each of these bargain units has a =
design
flaw or two. The Midland's Monitor button, which is =
designed
to produce continuous static so that you can adjust the volume, is where =
the
Push-to-Talk button ought to be. And the Audiovox radio is too easily =
turned on
by other gear in the same luggage. (At one point during a vacation, it =
turned
itself on unexpectedly at 3 a.m. and =
treated me to
the loud voices of a couple of drug dealers inside my backpack.)  =
The Cobra
($120 for a pair) is a far more substantial, navy-and-black radio that =
feels
like a sculptured oval brick. The Push to Talk button requires a =
surprising
amount of force, making you wonder if it shouldn't be relabeled the
Strain-to-Talk button.



 



But surprisingly, the Cobra is the only model in this
roundup to include such obvious outdoorsy tools as an alarm clock, a =
stopwatch
and a digital compass. It even has a vibrating alert, presumably so that =
your
fellow hikers can page you without waking up the grizzly bear next to =
you. 



 



Finally, Motorola's T7200 ($130 for one) is a =
heavier, more
rugged radio that accommodates either four AA batteries or a =
rechargeable
battery pack (included). It comes with interchangeable faceplates for =
the
fashion-conscious hiker - sunshine yellow, camouflage green and dark =
green. But
the real beauty of this radio is its sound quality, which stands head,
shoulders and torso above its rivals. Only you can decide if this far =
superior
sound is worth paying a price that's double the Cobra's and four times =
the Midland's.



 



All of that is great, but the real question is, how's =
the
range?



 



Now, the manufacturers admit that they get seven =
miles only
in ideal conditions, when there are no trees, houses or anything else in
between the two radios being tested - in other words, on the moon. But =
they
also say that you should still get three miles of range even in terrible
conditions - for example, from inside cars.



 



All I can figure out is that the radio makers and I =
live in
parallel universes. In my suburban tests, these "seven mile" =
radios
began introducing heavy static and lost syllables at nine-tenths of a =
mile
apart, and lost all contact at 1.1 miles. On the highway (but out of the =
car),
the Midland and Audiovox gave up the =
ghost at
1.5 miles, and the beefier radios lost touch at 1.7. 



 



Before releasing the services of my good-natured =
testing
partner ("Geek Freak to Mama Bird: Can you hear me now?"), I =
gave the
radios a final test that should have been an easy lob: communicating =
directly
across open water. In this case, the miniradios managed 2.5 miles, and =
the
Cobra and Motorola models finally lost all staticky contact at =
3.3.  The
manufacturers call these freakishly poor results. They chalked it up to =
the
kinds of environmental factors that can affect range: humidity, wires, =
vegetation,
buildings, clouds, hills, airplanes and even sunspots. (Now there's a =
high-tech
corporate excuse you don't hear every day.)Don't get the impression that =
these
radios are worthless. True, that "seven mile" business may be =
the
greatest bit of marketing hyperbole since P. T. Barnum. But even with =
only a
mile of range that you can count on (on land, anyway), they're still =
great for
malls, theme parks, ski slopes, hikes, car caravans, and other =
short-range
situations. 



 



The two-watt Motorola offers uniformly richer, =
cleaner sound
at distances greater than most of its three-watt rivals, but it's by far =
the
most expensive. The Cobra lets thicker static creep in as the distance
increases, but ultimately remains intelligible slightly longer than even =
the Motorola.
It also offers many more features and costs less than half as much. =
 As for the
Audiovox and Midland - well, sometimes you get =
a pair of
what you pay for.



 



No matter which brand you choose, after you buy a =
pair, you
should test whether the range will be good enough for your purposes and =
then
return them if the answer is no. (You certainly wouldn't be alone.) And =
you
never know. As the manufacturers would surely tell you, up to 95 percent =
of
their customers find happiness with these radios up to 99 percent of the =
time.









------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C315A4.708BDD20--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 04:31:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 21:31:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
Message-ID: <3EBB2F33.9080609@mchsi.com>

Ken wrote:

>I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.  Bicycles are pretty 
>>common and most people know how to ride them.  It's not like scuba diving 
>>equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and knowledge 
>>to use.
>
then Scott wrote:

>  
>
>
>I disagree.  If a cache requires the use of a piece of equipment, then it 
>is special equipment.  You are correct in that most people know how to ride 
>a bike, but I don't currently own one.  If I wanted to do this cache I 
>would have to either go out and buy, borrow or rent a bike.  In my book, 
>that makes it special equipment, no different than if I had to buy, borrow 
>or rent scuba or climbing equipment.
>
>
>
>Scott
>

and then Ken wrote:

>Unless the mountain biking trail is very difficult (like the Slickrock Trail near Moab), then there is no way that it should rank a "5".  The "5" rating should be reserved for only extremely difficult caches only, one that the majority of geocachers would not be able to get (even if they rented or borrowed the equipment needed).  Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment, either. It's easier to ride a bike 17 miles on a smooth, flat trail than it is to hike a half-mile up a very steep, rocky, and brushy mountain without any trail (like my Granite Mountain cache in northeastern Scottsdale, a true "4").  Therefore, why should the biking cache, with less difficult terrain, be rated higher than the mountain cache? The "5" rating should be assigned very infrequently.  The rating of "4" that I calculated still is pretty high, only one step !
>lower. Ken
>
I tend to agree with Scott on this one.  A _required_ bicycle is 
'special equipment'.  Especially in this case because, if I'm not 
mistaken, this park does not allow hiking; you _MUST_ ride a bicycle. 
 Since some people don't own bicycles this makes it 'special equipment 
required.'  Also, since you can't just drive by this cache, spot it on 
your GPS and 'go for it' (unless you happen to have a bicycle with you) 
then the required bicycle is 'special equipment' that you wouldn't 
ordinairly have in your car.  The argument that a 4WD is 'special 
equipment' does not hold water.  If there is a road to a cache that can 
be accessed by a 4WD, that's great for those who own a 4WD.  But I can 
still attempt the same cache by using my own two feet and legs. (My 
'standard equipment'.)  A 4WD isn't a must, it just makes things easier. 
 If you adhere to the logic that a 4WD is 'special equipment' then you 
could also say any automobile is 'special equipment' for an urban micro 
cache and we all know the family sedan is not 'special equipment'.  You 
have the option of walking, roller skating, bicycling, or being pulled 
in a little red wagon to this theoretical urban micro cache.  Notice I 
included bicycling.  In this case, a bicycle is not 'special equipment' 
because it is not _required_.  It is merely optional.  If I choose to 
wear SCUBA gear to every cache I find, that doesn't make it 'special 
equipment.'  If a cache is hidden at the bottom of Apache Lake, then 
SCUBA gear would be 'special equipment."   My point is, for the 
particular cache in question, the bicycle trail that the cache is hidden 
on DOES NOT ALLOW foot traffic so, a bicycle is mandatory and hence, 
'SPECIAL EQUIPMENT."

%^)

-- Sprocket




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 04:28:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 21:28:29 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <005c01c31596$c916d3e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
References: <7457F5C1-8176-11D7-B036-000A959F12C6@Comcast.net>
 
 <005c01c31596$c916d3e0$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <2595.172.30.1.10.1052454509.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>

I have done the Bartlett Lake cache (McBartlett I believe
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=26517).

It is really best done by boat. The cache is some 30' from the waterline
and some 12' or so above the bathtub ring. But, it is just .4 miles from
the big sandy camping area directly across the lake. So, a simple boat
ride while fishing or skiing is just the thing for this cache. I did it
with my scout troup on a campout. And it is quite a steep climb to the top
of the hill from there.

But, if you want to do a twenty miler, more power to you!

Steven Stringham
StringCachers


>
> Remember, this can be done *legally* only by bicycle.  I understand the
> hiking challenge though.  There's one on Bartlett Lake that the
> description says can only be reached by boat.  I've mapped out a route
> from the Beeline that I'll try on foot someday, even though it's about
> 20 miles.
>
> Jerry
> Offtrail
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 04:29:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 21:29:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] MO&GO
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508160521.013096a0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030509042954.41411.qmail@web80202.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-148483018-1052454594=:41269
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Scott, Thanks for the acknowledgment.  Last time I checked we were right behind TMBH on the azgeocaching list. Gregg and Maureen (MO & GO) 

Scott Wood  wrote:At 04:00 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I haven't seen many messages on the list lately about teams reaching 
>milestones, but I see that only the ever Tucson based team has broke the 
>300 mark. Congratulations MO&GO. Won't be very long until they are the 
>top finder in Tucson. (I am uniquely qualified to make that prediction.)

That was supposed to say SECOND ONLY team.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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http://www.azgeocaching.com
--0-148483018-1052454594=:41269
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Scott,


 


Thanks for the acknowledgment.  Last time I checked we were right behind TMBH on the azgeocaching list.


 


Gregg and Maureen (MO & GO) 

Scott Wood <scott@myblueheaven.com> wrote:


At 04:00 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I haven't seen many messages on the list lately about teams reaching 
>milestones, but I see that only the ever Tucson based team has broke the 
>300 mark. Congratulations MO&GO. Won't be very long until they are the 
>top finder in Tucson. (I am uniquely qualified to make that prediction.)

That was supposed to say SECOND ONLY team.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

--0-148483018-1052454594=:41269--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 05:03:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 22:03:04 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
References: <3EBB2F33.9080609@mchsi.com>
Message-ID: <002501c315e8$45ed9560$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

The cache in question is rated given that you have a bike. Since,
foot traffic is not allowed you must have a bike to find it. It is
clearly stated what the requirements are on the web page. Therefore,
I feel that the cache is rated appropriately.
-Rob (Wily Javelina)


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Sparks" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 9:31 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment


> Ken wrote:
>
> >I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.  Bicycles are pretty
> >>common and most people know how to ride them.  It's not like scuba
diving
> >>equipment or rock climbing equipment, which require training and
knowledge
> >>to use.
> >
> then Scott wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> >I disagree.  If a cache requires the use of a piece of equipment, then it
> >is special equipment.  You are correct in that most people know how to
ride
> >a bike, but I don't currently own one.  If I wanted to do this cache I
> >would have to either go out and buy, borrow or rent a bike.  In my book,
> >that makes it special equipment, no different than if I had to buy,
borrow
> >or rent scuba or climbing equipment.
> >
> >
> >
> >Scott
> >
>
> and then Ken wrote:
>
> >Unless the mountain biking trail is very difficult (like the Slickrock
Trail near Moab), then there is no way that it should rank a "5".  The "5"
rating should be reserved for only extremely difficult caches only, one that
the majority of geocachers would not be able to get (even if they rented or
borrowed the equipment needed).  Some caches may be in remote lands and you
need a 4WD to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long),
but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be special equipment,
either. It's easier to ride a bike 17 miles on a smooth, flat trail than it
is to hike a half-mile up a very steep, rocky, and brushy mountain without
any trail (like my Granite Mountain cache in northeastern Scottsdale, a true
"4").  Therefore, why should the biking cache, with less difficult terrain,
be rated higher than the mountain cache? The "5" rating should be assigned
very infrequently.  The rating of "4" that I calculated still is pretty
high, only one step!
>  !
> >lower. Ken
> >
> I tend to agree with Scott on this one.  A _required_ bicycle is
> 'special equipment'.  Especially in this case because, if I'm not
> mistaken, this park does not allow hiking; you _MUST_ ride a bicycle.
>  Since some people don't own bicycles this makes it 'special equipment
> required.'  Also, since you can't just drive by this cache, spot it on
> your GPS and 'go for it' (unless you happen to have a bicycle with you)
> then the required bicycle is 'special equipment' that you wouldn't
> ordinairly have in your car.  The argument that a 4WD is 'special
> equipment' does not hold water.  If there is a road to a cache that can
> be accessed by a 4WD, that's great for those who own a 4WD.  But I can
> still attempt the same cache by using my own two feet and legs. (My
> 'standard equipment'.)  A 4WD isn't a must, it just makes things easier.
>  If you adhere to the logic that a 4WD is 'special equipment' then you
> could also say any automobile is 'special equipment' for an urban micro
> cache and we all know the family sedan is not 'special equipment'.  You
> have the option of walking, roller skating, bicycling, or being pulled
> in a little red wagon to this theoretical urban micro cache.  Notice I
> included bicycling.  In this case, a bicycle is not 'special equipment'
> because it is not _required_.  It is merely optional.  If I choose to
> wear SCUBA gear to every cache I find, that doesn't make it 'special
> equipment.'  If a cache is hidden at the bottom of Apache Lake, then
> SCUBA gear would be 'special equipment."   My point is, for the
> particular cache in question, the bicycle trail that the cache is hidden
> on DOES NOT ALLOW foot traffic so, a bicycle is mandatory and hence,
> 'SPECIAL EQUIPMENT."
>
> %^)
>
> -- Sprocket
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 05:37:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 05:37:33 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
Message-ID: 




You wrote:
 The argument that a 4WD is 'special equipment' does not hold water. If there is a road to a cache that can be accessed by a 4WD, that's great for those who own a 4WD. But I can still attempt the same cache by using my own two feet and legs. (My 'standard equipment'.) A 4WD isn't a must, it just makes things easier. If you adhere to the logic that a 4WD is 'special equipment' then you could also say any automobile is 'special equipment' for an urban micro cache and we all know the family sedan is not 'special equipment'. You have the option of walking, 


 


The geocaching website rating system states that specialized equipment includes 4WD.


 


If I don't know that the only road to a cache is 4WD only, and I can only get within a couple of miles of it before I have to walk, then my "standard equipment"-my legs- will not allow me to get that cache. (My "standard equipment" does not work well since an accident 11 years ago.) This is something I would like to know about beforehand so I don't waste gas and time attempting something I'll never be able to get. So if no one wants to rate a cache 5* because it is 4WD, I have no problem with that as long as they state on the cache page that  4WD is recommended or required to drive to it. For existing caches, if I e-mail anyone and ask  if the cache is accessible without a 4WD, please be kind and tell me. I am limited in how far I can walk before the pain in my hip and back make it impossible. 


 

Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 06:05:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 23:05:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I will never remove a legitimate Find log
In-Reply-To: <001f01c315cf$252e22e0$1e29b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <20030509060524.24626.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1402404392-1052460324=:22931
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Thank you, Regan, for your note.  I will never delete a log entry that someone has entered, except for such reasons as:  the cacher reports a find log when they did not find the cache. the cacher did not satisfy the cache requirements (i.e. a person who goes to one of my museum caches in the Phoenix area who does not enter the museum).A duplicate log entry (I'll keep the first one).
For my museum caches, I am not too rigid about claiming credit.  If you get four out of six questions but are having trouble finding one or two, then don't spend too much time looking for the obscure information.  Just enjoy your time at the museum and look for interesting things that I or others may not have noticed..  Also, if you find an exhibit that would provide a topic for a good question, then please suggest it to me.  I may add that question or replace one of the others. I intend to keep most of my traditional caches Members Only (especially until the Cache Pirate goes away),  but I may periodically remove the Members Only designation on some of my caches for a weekend or so, particularly if a cache hasn't been visited in a while.  I know that Members Only designation won't prevent the cache from being removed by determined land managers, but it can help prevent a few undesirable visits by cache pirates, thieves, and plunders.  I've never had a cache lost due to a pirate's plunder, theft by an unscrupulous visitor to Geocaching.com, or a mischevious person who finds it accidentally, so I intend to keep it that way. Look for my ammo can from Thompson Peak to reappear at another location (likely in cache-friendly State Trust land) within the next week. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) 
--0-1402404392-1052460324=:22931
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Thank you, Regan, for your note.  I will never delete a log entry that someone has entered, except for such reasons as:


 


 the cacher reports a find log when they did not find the cache.


 the cacher did not satisfy the cache requirements (i.e. a person who goes to one of my museum caches in the Phoenix area who does not enter the museum).


A duplicate log entry (I'll keep the first one).



For my museum caches, I am not too rigid about claiming credit.  If you get four out of six questions but are having trouble finding one or two, then don't spend too much time looking for the obscure information.  Just enjoy your time at the museum and look for interesting things that I or others may not have noticed..  Also, if you find an exhibit that would provide a topic for a good question, then please suggest it to me.  I may add that question or replace one of the others.


 


I intend to keep most of my traditional caches Members Only (especially until the Cache Pirate goes away),  but I may periodically remove the Members Only designation on some of my caches for a weekend or so, particularly if a cache hasn't been visited in a while.  I know that Members Only designation won't prevent the cache from being removed by determined land managers, but it can help prevent a few undesirable visits by cache pirates, thieves, and plunders.  I've never had a cache lost due to a pirate's plunder, theft by an unscrupulous visitor to Geocaching.com, or a mischevious person who finds it accidentally, so I intend to keep it that way.


 


Look for my ammo can from Thompson Peak to reappear at another location (likely in cache-friendly State Trust land) within the next week.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer) 

--0-1402404392-1052460324=:22931--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 06:47:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 23:47:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030509064739.30089.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott Wood  wrote:
> If a cache requires a mountain bike, shouldn't it be
> rated higher than a 1/2?
> 
> GCG2G7 was just posted, and I think that the ratings
> are very misleading 
> since the cache description clearly states, in red
> print, that you must use 
> a mountain bike.
> 
> Any thoughts?
> 
> 
> Scott


As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
description so just wondering, what kind of hike would
it be?? and that would still be probably rated higher
then a 1/2 you say it is)

=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 07:08:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 00:08:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] MO&GO
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030508155923.0127c8e0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030509070823.32318.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott Wood  wrote:
> I haven't seen many messages on the list lately
> about teams reaching 
> milestones, but I see that only the ever Tucson
> based team has broke the 
> 300 mark.  Congratulations MO&GO.  Won't be very
> long until they are the 
> top finder in Tucson.  (I am uniquely qualified to
> make that prediction.)
> 
> 
> Scott


I knew they were close, REALLY REALLY close when GO
and I went out last Friday but no idea he hit it
during the 7 days between our visits... man... they
don't even tell their own daughter they hit the mark. 
::cheering and clapping for her folks:: YEA!! ya made
300!!!   

=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 07:13:03 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 00:13:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030509071303.50285.qmail@web14801.mail.yahoo.com>

--- gale and mike 
wrote:

---------------------------------


Some caches may be in remote lands and you need a 4WD
to drive to it, (hiking is possible, but the hike may
be long), but most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle
to be special equipment, either.


I don't believe that a bicycle is special equipment.
Bicycles are pretty common and most people know how to
ride them. It's not like scuba diving equipment or
rock climbing equipment, which require training and
knowledge to use.   If you don't consider a 4WD or
mountain bike as special equipment, then please note
the need to use it on the cache page. Those of us who
don't have either of those, like us, would appreciate
knowing this in advance. Some of you already do note
this, and we appreciate it very much.

---------------------------------

I agree with this one, I DO consider a 4WD special
equipment because I don't have one and not everybody
does.  I almost said something in one of my earlier
posts when I was talking about bicycles too.  
Assumptions aren't the best way to rate a cache.

=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 16:27:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 09:27:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
In-Reply-To: <002501c315e8$45ed9560$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
References: <3EBB2F33.9080609@mchsi.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092653.0139c6a8@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 10:03 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>The cache in question is rated given that you have a bike. Since,
>foot traffic is not allowed you must have a bike to find it. It is
>clearly stated what the requirements are on the web page. Therefore,
>I feel that the cache is rated appropriately.

If that were the case, would a cache that requires climbing equipment or 
scuba equipment to reach be rated correctly if it were only a 2 terrain cache?



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 16:30:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 09:30:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <20030509064739.30089.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092946.0127fce0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
>special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
>mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
>that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
>description so just wondering, what kind of hike would
>it be?? and that would still be probably rated higher
>then a 1/2 you say it is)

In this case it would be an illegal hike, since hiking is not allowed in 
this area.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 17:30:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 10:30:57 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030507223852.01c26c38@mail.myblueheaven.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092946.0127fce0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <001b01c31650$c04ef2a0$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

That is exactly the point. Since you cannot reach it by
any other means, as stated on the web page, the rating
is for bikes only. Which implies that it is a relatively
easy approach on a bike, as opposed to a difficult bike
rating. 
-Rob



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott Wood" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


> At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> 
> >As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
> >special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
> >mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
> >that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
> >description so just wondering, what kind of hike would
> >it be?? and that would still be probably rated higher
> >then a 1/2 you say it is)
> 
> In this case it would be an illegal hike, since hiking is not allowed in 
> this area.
> 
> 
> 
> Scott
> 
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 17:34:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 10:34:04 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
References: <3EBB2F33.9080609@mchsi.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092653.0139c6a8@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <002101c31651$2fc7ef60$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

Yes, if it is clearly stated that you must have the special equipement
to get the cache. That in and of itself is a rating or a special
requirement.
Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a difficult
bike cache and an easy one?

-Rob


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Wood" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment


> At 10:03 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >The cache in question is rated given that you have a bike. Since,
> >foot traffic is not allowed you must have a bike to find it. It is
> >clearly stated what the requirements are on the web page. Therefore,
> >I feel that the cache is rated appropriately.
>
> If that were the case, would a cache that requires climbing equipment or
> scuba equipment to reach be rated correctly if it were only a 2 terrain
cache?
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 17:56:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 10:56:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
In-Reply-To: <002101c31651$2fc7ef60$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <000c01c31654$503af190$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

I agree that it would be great to have a rating system as you describe, Rob,
but the reality is we don't.  Until geocaching.com gives us that added level
of flexibility, I think it's more helpful for all of us to be consistent.
Most everyone (at least those that take the time and care) are using the
clayjar system.  Given that, the difficulty is set to designate that special
equipment is required.  The true difficulty using the equipment is then
spelled out in the description.

Frankly, your idea probably makes more sense.  But since the only real
difference is which is specified in the difficulty and which in the
description, and given that many/most are already using clayjar, I think it
would be best if we stuck to that, even if it isn't best.  Either that, or
we all start putting a big notice at the top of our descriptions saying
which system we happened to use.

CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Rob
Brinkerhoff
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:34 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment


Yes, if it is clearly stated that you must have the special equipement to
get the cache. That in and of itself is a rating or a special requirement.
Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a difficult bike
cache and an easy one?

-Rob


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Wood" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment


> At 10:03 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >The cache in question is rated given that you have a bike. Since, 
> >foot traffic is not allowed you must have a bike to find it. It is 
> >clearly stated what the requirements are on the web page. Therefore, 
> >I feel that the cache is rated appropriately.
>
> If that were the case, would a cache that requires climbing equipment 
> or scuba equipment to reach be rated correctly if it were only a 2 
> terrain
cache?
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
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> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
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> http://www.azgeocaching.com


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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 18:07:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:07:57 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
Message-ID: 

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I don't believe our rating system is there to rate how difficult it is to=
 reach the cache by bike.  The rating system is there to let every cacher=
 know what to expect before attempting the cache.  A rating of 5 is telli=
ng us that "special equipment" is required to obtain this cache regardles=
s of how difficult it is to reach with the bike.  In this case, a bike is=
 required thus it is considered "special equipment."

Rand (RandMan)

----- Original Message -----
From: Rob Brinkerhoff
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:40 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment

That is exactly the point. Since you cannot reach it by
any other means, as stated on the web page, the rating
is for bikes only. Which implies that it is a relatively
easy approach on a bike, as opposed to a difficult bike
rating. =20
-Rob



----- Original Message ----- =20
From: "Scott Wood" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


> At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> =20
> >As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
> >special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
> >mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
> >that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
> >description so just wondering, what kind of hike would
> >it be?? and that would still be probably rated higher
> >then a 1/2 you say it is)
> =20
> In this case it would be an illegal hike, since hiking is not allowed i=
n =20
> this area.
> =20
> =20
> =20
> Scott
> =20
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com

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I don't believ=
e our rating system is there to rate how difficult it is to reach the cac=
he by bike.  The rating system is there to let every cacher know wha=
t to expect before attempting the cache.  A rating of 5 is telling u=
s that "special equipment" is required to obtain this cache regard=
less of how difficult it is to reach with the bike.  In this case, a=
 bike is required thus it is considered "special equipment."
=
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Rob Brinkerhoff
 Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:40 AM 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=

 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching=
] Special equipment
 
 
That is exactly the point. Sin=
ce you cannot reach it by
any other means, as stated on the web page, =
the rating
is for bikes only. Which implies that it is a relativelyeasy approach on a bike, as opposed to a difficult bike
rating. 
-=
Rob



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott Wood" &l=
t;scott@myblueheaven.com>
To: <listserv@azgeocaching.com>
=
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Specia=
l equipment


> At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>=
; 
> >As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
&g=
t; >special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
> =
>mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
> >tha=
t is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
> >descri=
ption so just wondering, what kind of hike would
> >it be?? and =
that would still be probably rated higher
> >then a 1/2 you say =
it is)
> 
> In this case it would be an illegal hike, since h=
iking is not allowed in 
> this area.
> 
> 
> > Scott
> 
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.mybluehea=
ven.com



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 18:12:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:12:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?
Message-ID: <20030509181207.57138.qmail@web21109.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1057147431-1052503927=:56844
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How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?
This is a good reason why the cache should not automatically be given a "5" rating just because a bicycle is required.  Let's say there is a cache just off a paved, flat bicycle path where walking is forbidden, and another cache just off the Slickrock Trail near Moab.  One cache has terrain that is easy to travel on, and the other has terrain that is very difficult to negotiate.  Therefore, assigning a terrain rating of "5" to both caches fails to distinguish between the marked differences in difficulty between the two cache routes. Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
--0-1057147431-1052503927=:56844
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How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?


This is a good reason why the cache should not automatically be given a "5" rating just because a bicycle is required.  Let's say there is a cache just off a paved, flat bicycle path where walking is forbidden, and another cache just off the Slickrock Trail near Moab.  One cache has terrain that is easy to travel on, and the other has terrain that is very difficult to negotiate.  Therefore, assigning a terrain rating of "5" to both caches fails to distinguish between the marked differences in difficulty between the two cache routes.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-1057147431-1052503927=:56844--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 18:21:38 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:21:38 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?
In-Reply-To: <20030509181207.57138.qmail@web21109.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

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I'm amazed that there is so much discussion here regarding ratings and
special equipment, yet there was so little discussion regarding a rating
system for handicap accessibility...

Andy


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I'm=20
amazed that there is so much discussion here regarding ratings and =
special=20
equipment, yet there was so little discussion regarding a rating system =
for=20
handicap accessibility...


 


Andy


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 18:26:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:26:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: 
Message-ID: 

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Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating for =
static.


-T.
[General Bracket]

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: RAND HARDIN=20
  To: AZ-Geocaching=20
  Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 11:07 AM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


  I don't believe our rating system is there to rate how difficult it is =
to reach the cache by bike.  The rating system is there to let every =
cacher know what to expect before attempting the cache.  A rating of 5 =
is telling us that "special equipment" is required to obtain this cache =
regardless of how difficult it is to reach with the bike.  In this case, =
a bike is required thus it is considered "special equipment."

  Rand (RandMan)

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Rob Brinkerhoff
    Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 10:40 AM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment

    That is exactly the point. Since you cannot reach it by
    any other means, as stated on the web page, the rating
    is for bikes only. Which implies that it is a relatively
    easy approach on a bike, as opposed to a difficult bike
    rating.=20
    -Rob



    ----- Original Message -----=20
    From: "Scott Wood" 
    To: 
    Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:30 AM
    Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


    > At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
    >=20
    > >As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5 for
    > >special equipment required.  I certainly don't own a
    > >mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it if
    > >that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read the
    > >description so just wondering, what kind of hike would
    > >it be?? and that would still be probably rated higher
    > >then a 1/2 you say it is)
    >=20
    > In this case it would be an illegal hike, since hiking is not =
allowed in=20
    > this area.
    >=20
    >=20
    >=20
    > Scott
    >=20
    > scott@myblueheaven.com
    > www.myblueheaven.com


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Maybe everyone ought to read the description and =
not take=20
the rating for static.


 


 


-T.


[General Bracket]


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  RAND =
HARDIN 
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 =
11:07 AM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Special=20
  equipment

  


  
I don't believe our rating system is there to rate how difficult =
it is to=20
  reach the cache by bike.  The rating system is there to let every =
cacher=20
  know what to expect before attempting the cache.  A rating of 5 =
is=20
  telling us that "special equipment" is required to obtain this =
cache=20
  regardless of how difficult it is to reach with the bike.  In =
this case,=20
  a bike is required thus it is considered "special =
equipment."

  
 

  
Rand (RandMan)

  
 

  
    
----- Original Message -----

    From: Rob=20
    Brinkerhoff
    
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 =
10:40=20
    AM

    
To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

    
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Special=20
    equipment

    
 
That is exactly the point. Since you cannot reach =
it=20
    by
any other means, as stated on the web page, the rating
is =
for bikes=20
    only. Which implies that it is a relatively
easy approach on a =
bike, as=20
    opposed to a difficult bike
rating. 
-Rob



----- =

    Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott Wood"=20
    <scott@myblueheaven.com>
To:=20
    <listserv@azgeocaching.com>
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 9:30 =

    AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


> =
At=20
    11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> 
> >As far as I =
would=20
    be concerned, it should be a 5 for
> >special equipment=20
    required.  I certainly don't own a
> >mountain bike =
anymore so=20
    wouldn't be able to do it if
> >that is what it =
required. =20
    (note, I haven't read the
> >description so just wondering, =
what=20
    kind of hike would
> >it be?? and that would still be =
probably=20
    rated higher
> >then a 1/2 you say it is)
> 
> =
In this=20
    case it would be an illegal hike, since hiking is not allowed in =

>=20
    this area.
> 
> 
> 
> Scott
> 
> =

    scott@myblueheaven.com
>=20
www.myblueheaven.com



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 18:51:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 11:51:04 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
Message-ID: 





>From: "Terry Hernlund" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
>Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 11:26:50 -0700
>
>Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating for 
>static.
>
>
>-T.
>[General Bracket]


I agree. I dont EVER look at the ratings on a cache. I take them with a 
grain of salt and nothing more. I do my own homework as to how hard or easy 
a cache is to get to. All you have to do is open up any mapping/topo 
software and as soon as you see the location, you can pretty much get a good 
idea of how easy or hard it will be to get to that cache. In my opinion, it 
is nearly impossible to fairly rate a cache since there are some cachers who 
find even a small hill to be a strenuous workout, while other's find that 
same hill to be a walk in the park. Everyone should to do their own homework 
to determine the rating of a cache and whether or not they will be able to 
do a cache before seeking a cache out.

Scott
Team RTW

_________________________________________________________________
STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 19:11:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 12:11:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030509191139.3192.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Terry Hernlund  wrote:
> Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not
> take the rating for static.
> 
> -T.
> [General Bracket]


Terrain and Difficulty are often used as filtering
tools. There's no way I'd take my daughter to a cache
rated as a 4 or higher terrain. Maybe you have the
time and inclination to read throughthe descriptions
of, what, is AZ over 1000 caches yet? But I certainly
don't.

If the ratings are consistent, and people stop
branching off on their own, then it becomes a lot
easier to search for caches.  When people do their own
thing and there is no consistency, finding appropriate
caches to go after is more work than fun. 

Think of it this way, would you get upset if you went
to a four step multi-stage, that said you needed to
bring a calculator, with a 1/2 rating and discovered
the last stage required you to do calculus? Sure, the
special equipment requirement was specified but the
level of skill operating that equipment wasn't and the
fact that the equipment was needed anyway, means it
should be listed as a 5.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 19:29:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 12:29:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?
References: 
Message-ID: <003901c31661$527bf500$8331b83f@fishkiller>

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they are the same...
think about it=20
if you use a wheel chair could you ride a bike, ah yes a specialty built =
bike...


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Andrew Ayre=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 11:21 AM
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] How do you distinguish between a =
difficult bike cache and an easy one?


  I'm amazed that there is so much discussion here regarding ratings and =
special equipment, yet there was so little discussion regarding a rating =
system for handicap accessibility...

  Andy


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they are the same...


think about it 


if you use a wheel chair could you ride =
a bike, ah=20
yes a specialty built bike...


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Andrew=20
  Ayre 
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 =
11:21 AM

  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
How do you=20
  distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?

  


  
I'm=20
  amazed that there is so much discussion here regarding ratings and =
special=20
  equipment, yet there was so little discussion regarding a rating =
system for=20
  handicap accessibility...

  
 

  
Andy


------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C31626.A55CDA40--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 19:30:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 12:30:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <20030509191139.3192.qmail@web40614.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

Replies inline...

> Terrain and Difficulty are often used as filtering
> tools. There's no way I'd take my daughter to a cache
> rated as a 4 or higher terrain. Maybe you have the
> time and inclination to read throughthe descriptions
> of, what, is AZ over 1000 caches yet? But I certainly
> don't.
>

Are you saying that you go out for 1000 caches at a time?

> If the ratings are consistent, and people stop
> branching off on their own, then it becomes a lot
> easier to search for caches.  When people do their own
> thing and there is no consistency, finding appropriate
> caches to go after is more work than fun.
>

Agreed, but doesn't speak to my point.

> Think of it this way, would you get upset if you went
> to a four step multi-stage, that said you needed to
> bring a calculator, with a 1/2 rating and discovered
> the last stage required you to do calculus? Sure, the
> special equipment requirement was specified but the
> level of skill operating that equipment wasn't and the
> fact that the equipment was needed anyway, means it
> should be listed as a 5.
>

I was talking about terrain (which unless I'm mistaken is what the thread
was talking about), not difficulty.  The cache you describe would no doubt
be a 5 difficulty, but could very easily be a 1 terrain.

Moot anyway.  I think you misunderstand me.  I'm not knocking the rating
system, I'm simply saying that as difficulty AND terrain rating rise, you
really ought to be reading the description.  If you don't read the
description on a 5-rated cache, you'll likely get as much enjoymentout of it
as research you put in.  None.


-T.
[General Bracket]

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 19:58:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 12:58:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030509195839.86818.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Terry Hernlund  wrote:
> Are you saying that you go out for 1000 caches at a
> time?

We all begin by looking at all of the caches in the
state that we haven't hit and start filtering.

> > If the ratings are consistent, and people stop
> > branching off on their own, then it becomes a lot
> > easier to search for caches.  
> 
> Agreed, but doesn't speak to my point.

I believe it does. You seem to be saying that ratings
don't matter because people should be reading the
descriptions anyway. I say they should be reading the
descriptions of caches they are interested in, not
ones they have filtered out for one reason or another.

> > Think of it this way, would you get upset if you
> went
> > to a four step multi-stage, that said you needed
> to
> > bring a calculator, with a 1/2 rating and
> discovered
> > the last stage required you to do calculus? Sure,
> the
> > special equipment requirement was specified but
> the
> > level of skill operating that equipment wasn't and
> the
> > fact that the equipment was needed anyway, means
> it
> > should be listed as a 5.
> >
> 
> I was talking about terrain (which unless I'm
> mistaken is what the thread
> was talking about), not difficulty.  

What's the difference? They're two sides of the same
coin.

> The cache you describe would no doubt
> be a 5 difficulty, but could very easily be a 1
> terrain.

Not according to some of the arguments pointed out
here. Those comments being that the equipment was
listed in the cache description thus there's no need
for increasing the rating.

> 
> Moot anyway.  I think you misunderstand me.  I'm not
> knocking the rating
> system, I'm simply saying that as difficulty AND
> terrain rating rise, you
> really ought to be reading the description.  If you
> don't read the
> description on a 5-rated cache, you'll likely get as
> much enjoymentout of it
> as research you put in.  None.

I certainly agree with that statement. I think that
anyone who doesn't read the description deserves what
they get. My concern revolves around the ease of
making a decision. While I'd prefer to leave any
special instances out of the terrain and difficulty
ratings, there is no other place to put filtering
information except there.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 20:09:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 13:09:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <001701c31666$d9147e20$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

So, conversely, the lower the difficulty and terrain, the less necessary it
becomes to read the description?  That doesn't hold because under that
system, the cache would be marked easy and hence, I wouldn't know a bicycle
was required.

I don't want to speak for others, but I think the point being made by those
that follow the existing system is that the higher rating does cause one to
read the description more carefully.  Perhaps it really is a 5 or maybe it
needs some special equipment.  The 5 rating signals the need for further
investigation.  A lower rating would put us out in the field before we
discovered the need.  Just my thoughts.

CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Terry
Hernlund

Moot anyway.  I think you misunderstand me.  I'm not knocking the rating
system, I'm simply saying that as difficulty AND terrain rating rise, you
really ought to be reading the description.  If you don't read the
description on a 5-rated cache, you'll likely get as much enjoymentout of it
as research you put in.  None.


-T.
[General Bracket]
____________________________________________________________


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 20:28:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 13:28:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <001701c31666$d9147e20$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: 

Bill Tomlinson wrote:
> So, conversely, the lower the difficulty and terrain, the less
> necessary it becomes to read the description?  That doesn't hold
> because under that system, the cache would be marked easy and hence,
> I wouldn't know a bicycle was required.
>
> I don't want to speak for others, but I think the point being made by
> those that follow the existing system is that the higher rating does
> cause one to read the description more carefully.  Perhaps it really
> is a 5 or maybe it needs some special equipment.  The 5 rating
> signals the need for further investigation.  A lower rating would put
> us out in the field before we discovered the need.  Just my thoughts.

You ought to be reading the description regardless.  As it approaches 5, do
more research.  Maybe I wasn't clear on that, but I really didn't think
anyone would take it to the extreme of not reading the description at all.

Following the rating system?  The rating system currently in use isn't the
whole ball of wax you know.  As Mr. Quinn accurately points out, it's a
guide for narrowing your search.  If you take that guideline as gospel,
you'll be dissappointed more times than not.  It isn't there to do your
thinking for you.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May  9 21:03:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 14:03:02 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000001c3166e$6191e1f0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

I don't believe I said anything about "whole ball of wax" or "gospel".  I
was merely pointing out the flip side of your statement which makes the
portion you actually stated illogical.  The fact of the matter is (and you
will note that if you read my previous post on the subject), I happen to
agree with you completely.  The problem is, it goes against the system that
the majority of users rely on.  I don't think we should make up our own rule
just because the current system is wrong.  That will only cause more
confusion (as this thread clearly illustrates).

So, I hope that you can see I was only trying to make a point.  Please don't
read anything personal into the way I made it.  It's all a word game.  ;-)

CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 1:28 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment


Bill Tomlinson wrote:
> So, conversely, the lower the difficulty and terrain, the less 
> necessary it becomes to read the description?  That doesn't hold 
> because under that system, the cache would be marked easy and hence, I 
> wouldn't know a bicycle was required.
>
> I don't want to speak for others, but I think the point being made by 
> those that follow the existing system is that the higher rating does 
> cause one to read the description more carefully.  Perhaps it really 
> is a 5 or maybe it needs some special equipment.  The 5 rating signals 
> the need for further investigation.  A lower rating would put us out 
> in the field before we discovered the need.  Just my thoughts.

You ought to be reading the description regardless.  As it approaches 5, do
more research.  Maybe I wasn't clear on that, but I really didn't think
anyone would take it to the extreme of not reading the description at all.

Following the rating system?  The rating system currently in use isn't the
whole ball of wax you know.  As Mr. Quinn accurately points out, it's a
guide for narrowing your search.  If you take that guideline as gospel,
you'll be dissappointed more times than not.  It isn't there to do your
thinking for you.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 01:37:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 18:37:55 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
Message-ID: <00cb01c31694$c7915ff0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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Hahahahahahahahah....

Regan,

You made me roflmao when I read your post about StUART Anderson's.  So, =
you'd buy me dinner if I were to give you the coords?  Nothing says I =
will, but I'll entertain the answer.

Brian
Team A.I.
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Hahahahahahahahah....


 


Regan,


 


You made me roflmao when I read your =
post about=20
StUART Anderson's.  So, you'd buy me dinner if I were to give you =
the=20
coords?  Nothing says I will, but I'll entertain the =
answer.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 01:40:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 18:40:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...has you.
Message-ID: <00d401c31695$20c4ea60$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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I must say that I was surprised to see that someone had already e-mailed =
me a set of answers for this cache.  There should be a first find VERY =
soon.

Regan,

I'll buy YOU dinner if you can figure out which cacher has done so =
(**Disclaimer: No answering after first find is made).

Brian
Team A.I.
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I must say that I was surprised to see =
that someone=20
had already e-mailed me a set of answers for this cache.  There =
should be a=20
first find VERY soon.


 


Regan,


 


I'll buy YOU dinner if you can figure =
out which=20
cacher has done so (**Disclaimer: No answering after first find is=20
made).


 


Brian


Team A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_00D1_01C3165A.74491480--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 01:46:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 18:46:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Rendezvous pics
Message-ID: <00e201c31696$0408d8e0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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Larry,

Great pics.  My only suggestion to the page(s) would be to add links =
below each pic for  and .  :)

Brian
Team A.I.
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Larry,


 


Great pics.  My only suggestion to =
the page(s)=20
would be to add links below each pic for <back> and =
<next>. =20
:)


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 02:09:52 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 19:09:52 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Rendezvous pics
In-Reply-To: <00e201c31696$0408d8e0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
References: <00e201c31696$0408d8e0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <3EBC5F70.6050806@snaptek.com>

if larry could get us the pics we could put them up here on the 
azgeocaching site... in the photo album... which has such features...

jason


Brian Casteel wrote:
> Larry,
>  
> Great pics.  My only suggestion to the page(s) would be to add links 
> below each pic for  and .  :)
>  
> Brian
> Team A.I.


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 02:50:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 19:50:09 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
References: <000001c3166e$6191e1f0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: 

> So, I hope that you can see I was only trying to make a point. 
> Please don't read anything personal into the way I made it.  It's all
> a word game.  ;-) 

heh heh

That it is.  ;-)


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 03:49:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 20:49:11 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092946.0127fce0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030510034911.88310.qmail@web14804.mail.yahoo.com>

--- Scott Wood  wrote:
> At 11:47 PM 5/8/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> 
> >As far as I would be concerned, it should be a 5
> for
> >special equipment required.  I certainly don't own
> a
> >mountain bike anymore so wouldn't be able to do it
> if
> >that is what it required.  (note, I haven't read
> the
> >description so just wondering, what kind of hike
> would
> >it be?? and that would still be probably rated
> higher
> >then a 1/2 you say it is)
> 
> In this case it would be an illegal hike, since
> hiking is not allowed in 
> this area.
> 
> 
> 
> Scott


Thanks, yea I got that as I read more postings, I had
a TON to go through... =-)  Guess that's my fault for
not checking my box for 3 or 4 days...  The more I
read though, the more I thought - welp, really sounds
like a 5 to me since I NEED a bike to do it.  Would it
count if I took a toddlers bike and pushed it for the
hike??  I'd have a bike!!

=-)


=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 04:15:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:15:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <20030510034911.88310.qmail@web14804.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509092946.0127fce0@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509211442.02604f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 08:49 PM 5/9/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>read though, the more I thought - welp, really sounds
>like a 5 to me since I NEED a bike to do it.  Would it
>count if I took a toddlers bike and pushed it for the
>hike??  I'd have a bike!!

I was thinking that I would go down to a t-shirt shop and have a plain 
shirt made with the biggest letters I can find that just spell BIKE on the 
front and back.  If I wore that to the cache how could they claim that I 
didn't have a BIKE.  :-)



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 05:38:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:38:02 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
Message-ID: <3EBC903A.7050307@mchsi.com>

> Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a difficult
> bike cache and an easy one?
>
> -Rob



It's been a while since I've done any cycling but here's how I would 
rate them:

Uphill = Difficult
Downhill = Easy


-- Sprocket




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 05:39:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:39:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings)
Message-ID: <3EBC9096.5000804@mchsi.com>

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> Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating 
> for =
> static.
>
>
> -T.
> [General Bracket]



You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the 'star' 
ratings for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine 
if _I_ feel I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the 
time I have, the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other 
activities I might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as 
far as I'm concerned, don't mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to 
be innacurate, anyway.  Some people who think they are really clever 
tend to (difficult) rate their caches higher than they really warrant. 
Others who are very agile and are in peak physical condition  tend to 
set their terrain ratings lower than ordinary human beings  would agree 
with.   Those who get winded walking to the mailbox go overboard with 
their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the park 
(literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if I've 
been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might look 
at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was 
'supposed' to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling 
hike up a steep slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I 
might check the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it 
should have been.  I never look at a rating before-hand and say to 
myself, " Oooh! I can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary 
3.5." In the end, the ratings are usually a figment of someone elses 
imagination.  :-)

-- Sprocket


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Maybe everyone ought to read the description and
not take the rating for = 

 static. 

  

  

 -T. 

 [General Bracket] 

 



 

You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the 'star'  ratings
for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine  if _I_ feel
I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the  time I have, the
vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other  activities I might have
planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as  far as I'm concerned, don't
mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to  be innacurate, anyway.  Some
people who think they are really clever  tend to (difficult) rate their caches
higher than they really warrant.  Others who are very agile and are in peak
physical condition  tend to  set their terrain ratings lower than ordinary
human beings  would agree  with.   Those who get winded walking to the mailbox
go overboard with  their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the
park  (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if I've
 been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might look
 at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was  'supposed'
to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling  hike up a steep
slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I  might check the
terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it  should have been. 
I never look at a rating before-hand and say to  myself, " Oooh! I can't
(or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary  3.5." In the end, the ratings
are usually a figment of someone elses  imagination.  :-)
 

 

-- Sprocket 






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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 07:29:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 00:29:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
Message-ID: <081901c316c5$e18edaf0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

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When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread =
exploded.

http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055

Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...

http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by =
trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care =
for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me =
that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the =
lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say =
that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy =
almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off. =20

On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the =
role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this =
listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
Buena.

Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
little thing I noticed.  ;p

/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to hide a cache.

Brian
Team A.I.
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When this problem first came up, I =
started a thread=20
in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few =
days=20
off, and the thread exploded.


 


http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055

 


Check out this post from Jeremy on the=20
topic...


 


http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555


 


I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
concept of a=20
cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
interesting=20
aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, =
I don't=20
really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if =
it was=20
just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =

remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and =
the lack=20
of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say that I =
believe=20
the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt rectifying =
the=20
situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy almost =
immediately=20
after his e-mail was fired off.  


 


<conspiracy theory>On a side note =
(and=20
hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
Earthlink=20
customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The =
only=20
cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is =
Team=20
Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>


 


Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the=20
cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
;p


 


/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder =
to avoid the=20
stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 09:02:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 02:02:05 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
References: <081901c316c5$e18edaf0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: 

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Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
shtick.  You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of =
all this you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master plan =
was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(

This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
"sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brian Casteel=20
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


  When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums =
to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the =
thread exploded.

  =
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055

  Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...

  =
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

  I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is =
being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game =
by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really =
care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just =
me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the =
lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say =
that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy =
almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off. =20

  On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the =
role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this =
listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
Buena.

  Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
little thing I noticed.  ;p

  /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to hide a cache.

  Brian
  Team A.I.
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Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig =
is=20
up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently been =
squashed=20
by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll never be able =
to carry=20
out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the stuff =
back.  Sorry=20
bud.  :-(


 


This whole cache pirate thing has =
caused me to=20
reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report =
that I=20
have one.   ;-)


 


 


-T.
[General=20
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict bad=20
quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=




  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brian =
Casteel=20
  

  
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  

  
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
12:29=20
  AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache_Pirate=20
  Re-Revisited

  


  
When this problem first came up, I =
started a=20
  thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
took a few=20
  days off, and the thread exploded.

  
 

  
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
  
 

  
Check out this post from Jeremy on =
the=20
  topic...

  
 

  
http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

  
 

  
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
concept of a=20
  cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
interesting=20
  aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
prize, I=20
  don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
sure if=20
  it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
  definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
profiles,=20
  and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
can't say=20
  that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
attempt=20
  rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
Jeremy=20
  almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

  
 

  
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
note (and=20
  hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
Earthlink=20
  customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
The only=20
  cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
is Team=20
  Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

  
 

  
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
the=20
  cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
;p

  
 

  
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
boulder to avoid=20
  the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 15:35:07 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:35:07 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
In-Reply-To: <081901c316c5$e18edaf0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <000601c31709$bc943580$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

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Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read the forums.  Just =
don't
have the time.  I was great reading through all of the posts.  I had =
begun
to think I was the only one that still thought the whole pirate thing =
was a
bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone in noting that a week after =
the
fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen items have been replaced (in =
the
original cache or elsewhere).  It seems the pirate has also not =
contacted
Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more info here or in the forums.  I =
don't
believe there really ever was a good intent.  Any good humored well
intentioned soul would have come clean or corrected the situation by =
now.
=20
I would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are cunning
enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
let
it run on like this without some sort of response.  Then again...   ;-)
=20
CacheLess
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Brian
Casteel
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited



When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
get
some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread
exploded.
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
 &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
=20
Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc

&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
=20
I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
put
to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying =
to
locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having =
the
caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
Jeremy
to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
quickly.
When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
regarding
what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
this
person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
have
been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
off.

=20
On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
mind),
Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the role =
of
the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from =
an
earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
=20
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
little
thing I noticed.  ;p
=20
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to
hide a cache.
=20
Brian
Team A.I.


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Message






Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read =
the=20
forums.  Just don't have the time.  I was great reading =
through all of=20
the posts.  I had begun to think I was the only one that still =
thought the=20
whole pirate thing was a bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone =
in=20
noting that a week after the fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen =
items=20
have been replaced (in the original cache or elsewhere).  It seems =
the=20
pirate has also not contacted Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more =
info here=20
or in the forums.  I don't believe there really ever was a good=20
intent.  Any good humored well intentioned soul would have come =
clean or=20
corrected the situation by now.


 


I=20
would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are =
cunning=20
enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
let it=20
run on like this without some sort of response.  Then =
again...  =20
;-)


 


CacheLess


 


-----Original =
Message-----
From:=20
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Brian=20
Casteel
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
To:=20
az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: =
[Az-Geocaching]=20
Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited




  
When this problem first came up, I =
started a=20
  thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
took a few=20
  days off, and the thread exploded.

  
 

  
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
  
 

  
Check out this post from Jeremy on =
the=20
  topic...

  
 

  
http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

  
 

  
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
concept of a=20
  cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
interesting=20
  aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
prize, I=20
  don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
sure if=20
  it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
  definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
profiles,=20
  and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
can't say=20
  that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
attempt=20
  rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
Jeremy=20
  almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

  
 

  
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
note (and=20
  hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
Earthlink=20
  customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
The only=20
  cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
is Team=20
  Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

  
 

  
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
the=20
  cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
;p

  
 

  
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
boulder to avoid=20
  the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 15:47:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:47:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000d01c3170b$6dddaff0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

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One man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading through the forum,
it's seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are laughing.  I =
happen
to have a sense of humor too, and I think the jokes on you.  A week =
after
the fact and nothing.  No response to Jeremy; no goodies replaced in
original caches; no goodies placed in other caches; no public statement =
of
any kind.  I know it's tough backing the losing team, but it's time to =
let
it go.  The posted "good intentions" were a scam.
=20
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
shtick.
You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of all this
you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master plan was.  Just =
go
put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(
=20
This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
"sense
of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)
=20
=20
-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/


----- Original Message -----=20
From: Brian Casteel  =20
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited

When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
get
some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread
exploded.
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
 &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
=20
Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc

&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
=20
I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
put
to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying =
to
locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having =
the
caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
Jeremy
to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
quickly.
When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
regarding
what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
this
person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
have
been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
off.

=20
On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
mind),
Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the role =
of
the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from =
an
earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
=20
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
little
thing I noticed.  ;p
=20
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to
hide a cache.
=20
Brian
Team A.I.


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Message






One=20
man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading through the =
forum, it's=20
seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are laughing.  I =
happen to=20
have a sense of humor too, and I think the jokes on you.  A week =
after the=20
fact and nothing.  No response to Jeremy; no goodies replaced in =
original=20
caches; no goodies placed in other caches; no public statement of any=20
kind.  I know it's tough backing the losing team, but it's time to =
let it=20
go.  The posted "good intentions" were a scam.


 


CacheLess



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Terry Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02=20
  AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
  [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


  
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the =
jig is=20
  up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently =
been=20
  squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll =
never be=20
  able to carry out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the =
stuff=20
  back.  Sorry bud.  :-(

  
 

  
This whole cache pirate thing has =
caused me to=20
  reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report =
that I=20
  have one.   ;-)

  
 

  
 

  
-T.
[General=20
  =
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict bad=20
  quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=


  

    
----- Original Message ----- 

    From:=20
    Brian =
Casteel=20
    

    
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
    

    
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
12:29=20
    AM

    
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache_Pirate=20
    Re-Revisited

    


    
When this problem first came up, I =
started a=20
    thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
took a=20
    few days off, and the thread exploded.

    
 

    
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
    
 

    
Check out this post from Jeremy on =
the=20
    topic...

    
 

    
http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

    
 

    
I'm thinking it safe to say that =
the concept of=20
    a cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
interesting=20
    aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
prize, I=20
    don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm =
not sure=20
    if it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but =
he=20
    definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
profiles,=20
    and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
can't say=20
    that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
attempt=20
    rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
Jeremy=20
    almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  =


    
 

    
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
note (and=20
    hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
Earthlink=20
    customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
The=20
    only cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail =
address is=20
    Team Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

    
 

    
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
the=20
    cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
;p

    
 

    
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
boulder to avoid=20
    the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

    
 

    
Brian

    
Team=20
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C316D0.C17ED7F0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 15:50:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (skydad)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:50:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited
References: <200305101525.IAA30020@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <000d01c3170b$e0b3e170$6401a8c0@cx288378c>

Just a quick comment on the pirate - The cache pirate has been the only
thing truly fun on these thread for months - By teams responses you can so
easily tell who has a life and who needs to find one.  Although not in the
normal real of geocaching and not one we approve of - it sure spiced things
up for a few weeks - If the pirate is ever uncovered there is a few beer and
margaritas waiting  him/her compliments of The Lunch Club.

Pirate - Should of waited till the Pirates of the Caribbean movie came out -
could of been a great theme cache.

The Lunch Club

----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:25 AM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1169 - 6 msgs


> Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
> az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> az-geocaching-request@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Special equipment (Scott Wood)
>    2. Re: Special Equipment (Scott Sparks)
>    3. Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings) (Scott Sparks)
>    4. Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Brian Casteel)
>    5. Re: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Terry Hernlund)
>    6. RE: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Bill Tomlinson)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:15:51 -0700
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> From: Scott Wood 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> At 08:49 PM 5/9/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>
> >read though, the more I thought - welp, really sounds
> >like a 5 to me since I NEED a bike to do it.  Would it
> >count if I took a toddlers bike and pushed it for the
> >hike??  I'd have a bike!!
>
> I was thinking that I would go down to a t-shirt shop and have a plain
> shirt made with the biggest letters I can find that just spell BIKE on the
> front and back.  If I wore that to the cache how could they claim that I
> didn't have a BIKE.  :-)
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:38:02 -0700
> From: Scott Sparks 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> > Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a difficult
> > bike cache and an easy one?
> >
> > -Rob
>
>
>
> It's been a while since I've done any cycling but here's how I would
> rate them:
>
> Uphill = Difficult
> Downhill = Easy
>
> 
> -- Sprocket
>
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:39:34 -0700
> From: Scott Sparks 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings)
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
> > Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating
> > for =
> > static.
> >
> >
> > -T.
> > [General Bracket]
>
>
>
> You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the 'star'
> ratings for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine
> if _I_ feel I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the
> time I have, the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other
> activities I might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as
> far as I'm concerned, don't mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to
> be innacurate, anyway.  Some people who think they are really clever
> tend to (difficult) rate their caches higher than they really warrant.
> Others who are very agile and are in peak physical condition  tend to
> set their terrain ratings lower than ordinary human beings  would agree
> with.   Those who get winded walking to the mailbox go overboard with
> their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the park
> (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if I've
> been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might look
> at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was
> 'supposed' to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling
> hike up a steep slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I
> might check the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it
> should have been.  I never look at a rating before-hand and say to
> myself, " Oooh! I can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary
> 3.5." In the end, the ratings are usually a figment of someone elses
> imagination.  :-)
>
> -- Sprocket
>
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100
> Content-Type: multipart/related;
>  boundary="------------000709030000080603070204"
>
>
> --------------000709030000080603070204
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> 
> 
> 
>   
>   
> 
> 
> 

> 
Maybe everyone ought to read the description and
> not take the rating for = 

>  static. 

>   

>   

>  -T. 

>  [General Bracket] 

>  

> 

>  

> You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the
'star'  ratings
> for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine  if
_I_ feel
> I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the  time I have, the
> vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other  activities I might have
> planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as  far as I'm concerned,
don't
> mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to  be innacurate,
anyway.  Some
> people who think they are really clever  tend to (difficult) rate their
caches
> higher than they really warrant.  Others who are very agile and are in
peak
> physical condition  tend to  set their terrain ratings lower than
ordinary
> human beings  would agree  with.   Those who get winded
walking to the mailbox
> go overboard with  their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the
> park  (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if
I've
>  been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might look
>  at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was
'supposed'
> to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling  hike up a
steep
> slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I  might check the
> terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it  should have
been. 
> I never look at a rating before-hand and say to  myself, " Oooh! I can't
> (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary  3.5." In the end, the
ratings
> are usually a figment of someone elses  imagination.    src="chrome://editor/content/images/smile_n.gif" alt=":-)"
>  class="moz-txt-smily" height="19" width="19" align="middle">
>  

>  

> -- Sprocket 

> 

> 
> 
>
> --------------000709030000080603070204--
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100--
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> From: "Brian Casteel" 
> To: 
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 00:29:24 -0700
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
> get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread =
> exploded.
>
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
> &m=3D40960055
>
> Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
>
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
> &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
>
> I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
> put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by =
> trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care =
> for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me =
> that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
> remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the =
> lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say =
> that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
> rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy =
> almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off. =20
>
> On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
> mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the =
> role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this =
> listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
> Buena.
>
> Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> little thing I noticed.  ;p
>
> /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> perhaps to hide a cache.
>
> Brian
> Team A.I.
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> 
> 
>  charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a thread=20
> in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few =
> days=20
> off, and the thread exploded.

> 
 

> 
 href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055 V>
> 
 

> 
Check out this post from Jeremy on the=20
> topic...

> 
 

> 
 href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

> 
 

> 
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
> cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
> aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, =
> I don't=20
> really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if =
> it was=20
> just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
>
> remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and =
> the lack=20
> of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say that I =
> believe=20
> the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt rectifying =
> the=20
> situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy almost =
> immediately=20
> after his e-mail was fired off.  

> 
 

> 
<conspiracy theory>On a side note =
> (and=20
> hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
> customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The =
> only=20
> cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is =
> Team=20
> Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

> 
 

> 
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the=20
> cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

> 
 

> 
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder =
> to avoid the=20
> stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

> 
 

> 
Brian

> 
Team A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90--
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> To: 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 02:02:05 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
> shtick.  You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of =
> all this you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master plan =
> was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(
>
> This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
> "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)
>
>
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
>
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
>
>   ----- Original Message -----=20
>   From: Brian Casteel=20
>   To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
>   Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
>
>
>   When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums =
> to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the =
> thread exploded.
>
>   =
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
> &m=3D40960055
>
>   Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
>
>   =
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
> &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
>
>   I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is =
> being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game =
> by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really =
> care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just =
> me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
> remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the =
> lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say =
> that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
> rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy =
> almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off. =20
>
>   On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
> mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the =
> role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this =
> listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
> Buena.
>
>   Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> little thing I noticed.  ;p
>
>   /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> perhaps to hide a cache.
>
>   Brian
>   Team A.I.
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> 
> 
>  charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig =
> is=20
> up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently been =
> squashed=20
> by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll never be able =
> to carry=20
> out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the stuff =
> back.  Sorry=20
> bud.  :-(

> 
 

> 
This whole cache pirate thing has =
> caused me to=20
> reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report =
> that I=20
> have one.   ;-)

> 
 

> 
 

> 
-T.
[General=20
> Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
> 't inflict bad=20
> quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 href=3D"http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/"> face=3DArial=20
> color=3D#000000=20
> size=3D2>http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=
> 

> 
 style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
> BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>   
----- Original Message ----- 

>      style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
> black">From:=20
>   Brian =
> Casteel=20
>   

>   
To:    title=3Daz-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   =
> href=3D"mailto:az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com">az-geocaching@lis=
> tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   

>   
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
> 12:29=20
>   AM

>   
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
> Cache_Pirate=20
>   Re-Revisited

>   


>   
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a=20
>   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> took a few=20
>   days off, and the thread exploded.

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055 V>
>   
 

>   
Check out this post from Jeremy on =
> the=20
>   topic...

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

>   
 

>   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
>   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
>   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> prize, I=20
>   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
> sure if=20
>   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
>   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> profiles,=20
>   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> can't say=20
>   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> attempt=20
>   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> Jeremy=20
>   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

>   
 

>   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> note (and=20
>   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
>   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> The only=20
>   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> is Team=20
>   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

>   
 

>   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> the=20
>   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

>   
 

>   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> boulder to avoid=20
>   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

>   
 

>   
Brian

>   
Team =
> A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860--
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:35:07 -0700
> From: "Bill Tomlinson" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read the forums.  Just =
> don't
> have the time.  I was great reading through all of the posts.  I had =
> begun
> to think I was the only one that still thought the whole pirate thing =
> was a
> bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone in noting that a week after =
> the
> fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen items have been replaced (in =
> the
> original cache or elsewhere).  It seems the pirate has also not =
> contacted
> Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more info here or in the forums.  I =
> don't
> believe there really ever was a good intent.  Any good humored well
> intentioned soul would have come clean or corrected the situation by =
> now.
> =20
> I would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are cunning
> enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
> let
> it run on like this without some sort of response.  Then again...   ;-)
> =20
> CacheLess
> =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
> Brian
> Casteel
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
> To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
>
>
>
> When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
> get
> some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread
> exploded.
> =20
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
>  1&m=3D40960
> 055> &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
> =20
> Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
> =20
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
>  1&m=3D40960
> 055&r=3D70560555#70560555>
> &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
> =20
> I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
> put
> to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying =
> to
> locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having =
> the
> caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
> Jeremy
> to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
> quickly.
> When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
> regarding
> what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
> this
> person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
> have
> been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
> off.
>
> =20
> On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
> mind),
> Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the role =
> of
> the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from =
> an
> earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
> =20
> Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> little
> thing I noticed.  ;p
> =20
> /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> perhaps to
> hide a cache.
> =20
> Brian
> Team A.I.
>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> 
> 
>  charset=3Dus-ascii">
> Message
>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

> size=3D2>Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read =
> the=20
> forums.  Just don't have the time.  I was great reading =
> through all of=20
> the posts.  I had begun to think I was the only one that still =
> thought the=20
> whole pirate thing was a bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone =
> in=20
> noting that a week after the fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen =
> items=20
> have been replaced (in the original cache or elsewhere).  It seems =
> the=20
> pirate has also not contacted Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more =
> info here=20
> or in the forums.  I don't believe there really ever was a good=20
> intent.  Any good humored well intentioned soul would have come =
> clean or=20
> corrected the situation by now.

> 

> size=3D2> 

> 
 size=3D2>I=20
> would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are =
> cunning=20
> enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
> let it=20
> run on like this without some sort of response.  Then =
> again...  =20
> ;-)

> 

> size=3D2> 

> 

> size=3D2>CacheLess

> 

> size=3D2> 

> 
-----Original =
> Message-----
From:=20
> az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
> Brian=20
> Casteel
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
To:=20
> az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: =
> [Az-Geocaching]=20
> Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


> 

>   
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a=20
>   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> took a few=20
>   days off, and the thread exploded.

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055 V>
>   
 

>   
Check out this post from Jeremy on =
> the=20
>   topic...

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

>   
 

>   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
>   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
>   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> prize, I=20
>   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
> sure if=20
>   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
>   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> profiles,=20
>   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> can't say=20
>   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> attempt=20
>   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> Jeremy=20
>   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

>   
 

>   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> note (and=20
>   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
>   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> The only=20
>   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> is Team=20
>   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

>   
 

>   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> the=20
>   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

>   
 

>   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> boulder to avoid=20
>   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

>   
 

>   
Brian

>   
Team =
> A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80--
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list
> listserv@azgeocaching.com
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> End of Az-Geocaching Digest


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 16:07:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:07:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited
In-Reply-To: <000d01c3170b$e0b3e170$6401a8c0@cx288378c>
Message-ID: <001501c3170e$3468cbd0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

Skydad / The Lunch Club,

I'm glad your reading could be spiced up at my expense.  I have to say,
though, that I resent being accused of not having a life.  If you had read
my posts and my profile, you would know that I lead an extremely full life.
In addition to a demanding job, I have a wife and three boys that keep me
very busy.  I am a Boy Scout Scoutmaster and assist with Little League.  As
a matter of fact, my geocaching time has been severely limited recently due
to so many other demands.  As a matter of fact, that was the subject of my
complaint about the pirate.  I was unwillingly drug into mess.  I had parted
with my precious time and some cash to place a cache for you to enjoy.  Now,
because of this fool, I have to part with more time and more cash to restore
my cache.  I might have found it fun too if it happened to someone else and
I didn't have to deal with it.  Please put yourself in the shoes of another
before judging them.

CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of skydad
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:50 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited


Just a quick comment on the pirate - The cache pirate has been the only
thing truly fun on these thread for months - By teams responses you can so
easily tell who has a life and who needs to find one.  Although not in the
normal real of geocaching and not one we approve of - it sure spiced things
up for a few weeks - If the pirate is ever uncovered there is a few beer and
margaritas waiting  him/her compliments of The Lunch Club.

Pirate - Should of waited till the Pirates of the Caribbean movie came out -
could of been a great theme cache.

The Lunch Club

----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:25 AM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1169 - 6 msgs


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>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Special equipment (Scott Wood)
>    2. Re: Special Equipment (Scott Sparks)
>    3. Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings) (Scott Sparks)
>    4. Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Brian Casteel)
>    5. Re: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Terry Hernlund)
>    6. RE: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Bill Tomlinson)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:15:51 -0700
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> From: Scott Wood 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> At 08:49 PM 5/9/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>
> >read though, the more I thought - welp, really sounds
> >like a 5 to me since I NEED a bike to do it.  Would it
> >count if I took a toddlers bike and pushed it for the
> >hike??  I'd have a bike!!
>
> I was thinking that I would go down to a t-shirt shop and have a plain 
> shirt made with the biggest letters I can find that just spell BIKE on 
> the front and back.  If I wore that to the cache how could they claim 
> that I didn't have a BIKE.  :-)
>
>
>
> Scott
>
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:38:02 -0700
> From: Scott Sparks 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> > Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a 
> > difficult bike cache and an easy one?
> >
> > -Rob
>
>
>
> It's been a while since I've done any cycling but here's how I would 
> rate them:
>
> Uphill = Difficult
> Downhill = Easy
>
> 
> -- Sprocket
>
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:39:34 -0700
> From: Scott Sparks 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings)
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100
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>
> > Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating 
> > for = static.
> >
> >
> > -T.
> > [General Bracket]
>
>
>
> You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the 'star' 
> ratings for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine 
> if _I_ feel I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the 
> time I have, the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other 
> activities I might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as 
> far as I'm concerned, don't mean a thing.  Most times I've found them 
> to be innacurate, anyway.  Some people who think they are really 
> clever tend to (difficult) rate their caches higher than they really 
> warrant. Others who are very agile and are in peak physical condition  
> tend to set their terrain ratings lower than ordinary human beings  would
agree
> with.   Those who get winded walking to the mailbox go overboard with
> their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the park
> (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if I've 
> been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might 
> look at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was 
> 'supposed' to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling 
> hike up a steep slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, 
> I might check the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it 
> should have been.  I never look at a rating before-hand and say to 
> myself, " Oooh! I can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big 
> scary 3.5." In the end, the ratings are usually a figment of someone 
> elses imagination.  :-)
>
> -- Sprocket
>
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100
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>
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>  
> 
>   
>   
> 
> 
> 

> 
Maybe everyone ought to read the description and
> not take the rating for = 

>  static. 

>   

>   

>  -T. 

>  [General Bracket] 

>  

> 

>  

> You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the
'star'  ratings
> for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine  
> if
_I_ feel
> I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the  time I have, 
> the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other  activities I 
> might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as  far as 
> I'm concerned,
don't
> mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to  be innacurate,
anyway.  Some
> people who think they are really clever  tend to (difficult) rate 
> their
caches
> higher than they really warrant.  Others who are very agile and are in
peak
> physical condition  tend to  set their terrain ratings lower than
ordinary
> human beings  would agree  with.   Those who get winded
walking to the mailbox
> go overboard with  their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in 
> the park  (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings 
> is if
I've
>  been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might 
> look  at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was
'supposed'
> to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling  hike 
> up a
steep
> slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I  might check 
> the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it  should have
been. 
> I never look at a rating before-hand and say to  myself, " Oooh! I 
> can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary  3.5." In the 
> end, the
ratings
> are usually a figment of someone elses  imagination.   src="chrome://editor/content/images/smile_n.gif" alt=":-)"  
> class="moz-txt-smily" height="19" width="19" align="middle">  

>  

> -- Sprocket 

> 

> 
> 
>
> --------------000709030000080603070204--
>
> --------------040407090801040706010100--
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> From: "Brian Casteel" 
> To: 
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 00:29:24 -0700
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums 
> to = get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the 
> thread = exploded.
>
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> 331=
> &m=3D40960055
>
> Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
>
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> 331=
> &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
>
> I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is 
> being = put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the 
> game by = trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't 
> really care = for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if 
> it was just me = that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he 
> definitely = remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both 
> profiles, and the = lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is 
> going on, I can't say = that I believe the second profile.  If this 
> person was going to attempt = rectifying the situation, an e-mail 
> should have been fired off to Jeremy = almost immediately after his 
> e-mail was fired off. =20
>
> On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in = 
> mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing 
> the = role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to 
> this = listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra = 
> Buena.
>
> Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a = 
> little thing I noticed.  ;p
>
> /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and = 
> perhaps to hide a cache.
>
> Brian
> Team A.I.
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>  
>   charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a thread=20
> in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few =
> days=20
> off, and the thread exploded.

> 
 

> 
 href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> /DI=
> V>
> 
 
 
 face=3DArial size=3D2>Check out this post from Jeremy on the=20 
> topic...
 
 size=3D2> 
 
 href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

> 
 

> 
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
> cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
> aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, =
> I don't=20
> really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if =
> it was=20
> just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
>
> remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and 
> = the lack=20 of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I 
> can't say that I = believe=20
> the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt rectifying =
> the=20
> situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy almost =
> immediately=20
> after his e-mail was fired off.  

> 
 

> 
<conspiracy theory>On a side note =
> (and=20
> hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
> customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The =
> only=20
> cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is =
> Team=20
> Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

> 
 

> 
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the=20
> cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

> 
 

> 
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder =
> to avoid the=20
> stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

> 
 

> 
Brian

> 
Team A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90--
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> To: 
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 02:02:05 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your = 
> shtick.  You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because 
> of = all this you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master 
> plan = was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(
>
> This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
> "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)
>
>
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
>
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix! 
> http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
>
>   ----- Original Message -----=20
>   From: Brian Casteel=20
>   To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
>   Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
>
>
>   When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums 
> = to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the 
> = thread exploded.
>
>   = 
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> 331=
> &m=3D40960055
>
>   Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
>
>   = 
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> 331=
> &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
>
>   I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is = 
> being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the 
> game = by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't 
> really = care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if 
> it was just = me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he 
> definitely = remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both 
> profiles, and the = lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is 
> going on, I can't say = that I believe the second profile.  If this 
> person was going to attempt = rectifying the situation, an e-mail 
> should have been fired off to Jeremy = almost immediately after his 
> e-mail was fired off. =20
>
>   On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in 
> = mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing 
> the = role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to 
> this = listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra = 
> Buena.
>
>   Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a 
> = little thing I noticed.  ;p
>
>   /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and = 
> perhaps to hide a cache.
>
>   Brian
>   Team A.I.
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>  
>   charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig =
> is=20
> up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently been =
> squashed=20
> by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll never be able =
> to carry=20
> out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the stuff =
> back.  Sorry=20
> bud.  :-(

> 
 

> 
This whole cache pirate thing has =
> caused me to=20
> reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report =
> that I=20
> have one.   ;-)

> 
 

> 
 

> 
-T.
[General=20
> Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
> 't inflict bad=20
> quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 href=3D"http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/"> face=3DArial=20
> color=3D#000000=20
> size=3D2>http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=
> 

> 
 style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
> BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>   
----- Original Message ----- 

>      style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
> black">From:=20
>   Brian =
> Casteel=20
>   

>   
To:    title=3Daz-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   =
> href=3D"mailto:az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com">az-geocaching@lis=
> tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
>   

>   
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
> 12:29=20
>   AM

>   
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
> Cache_Pirate=20
>   Re-Revisited

>   


>   
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a=20
>   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> took a few=20
>   days off, and the thread exploded.

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> /DI=
> V>
>   
 

>   
Check out this post from Jeremy on 
> = the=20
>   topic...

>   
 

>   
   = 
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311
> &am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

>   
 

>   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
>   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
>   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> prize, I=20
>   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
> sure if=20
>   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
>   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> profiles,=20
>   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> can't say=20
>   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> attempt=20
>   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> Jeremy=20
>   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

>   
 

>   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> note (and=20
>   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
>   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> The only=20
>   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> is Team=20
>   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

>   
 

>   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> the=20
>   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

>   
 

>   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> boulder to avoid=20
>   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

>   
 

>   
Brian

>   
Team =
> A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860--
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:35:07 -0700
> From: "Bill Tomlinson" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read the forums.  Just 
> = don't have the time.  I was great reading through all of the posts.  
> I had = begun
> to think I was the only one that still thought the whole pirate thing =
> was a
> bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone in noting that a week after =
> the
> fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen items have been replaced (in =
> the
> original cache or elsewhere).  It seems the pirate has also not =
> contacted
> Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more info here or in the forums.  I =
> don't
> believe there really ever was a good intent.  Any good humored well
> intentioned soul would have come clean or corrected the situation by =
> now.
> =20
> I would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are cunning
> enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
> let
> it run on like this without some sort of response.  Then again...   ;-)
> =20
> CacheLess
> =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
> Brian
> Casteel
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
> To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
>
>
>
> When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums 
> to = get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the 
> thread exploded.
> =20
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
>  1&m=3D40960
> 055> &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
> =20
> Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
> =20
> http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
>  833=
> 1&m=3D40960
> 055&r=3D70560555#70560555>
> &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
> =20
> I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
> put
> to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying =
> to
> locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having =
> the
> caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
> Jeremy
> to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
> quickly.
> When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
> regarding
> what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
> this
> person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
> have
> been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
> off.
>
> =20
> On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in = 
> mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing 
> the role = of
> the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from =
> an
> earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
> =20
> Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> little
> thing I noticed.  ;p
> =20
> /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> perhaps to
> hide a cache.
> =20
> Brian
> Team A.I.
>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>  
>   charset=3Dus-ascii">
> Message
>
>  
>  
> 
> 

> size=3D2>Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read 
> = the=20 forums.  Just don't have the time.  I was great 
> reading = through all of=20
> the posts.  I had begun to think I was the only one that still =
> thought the=20
> whole pirate thing was a bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone =
> in=20
> noting that a week after the fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen =
> items=20
> have been replaced (in the original cache or elsewhere).  It seems =
> the=20
> pirate has also not contacted Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more =
> info here=20
> or in the forums.  I don't believe there really ever was a good=20
> intent.  Any good humored well intentioned soul would have come =
> clean or=20
> corrected the situation by now.

> 

> size=3D2> 

> 
 color=3D#0000ff = size=3D2>I=20 would be surprised if it were 
> TTB.  They have proven they are = cunning=20
> enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would =
> let it=20
> run on like this without some sort of response.  Then =
> again...  =20
> ;-)

> 

> size=3D2> 

> 
 color=3D#0000ff =
>
> size=3D2>CacheLess

> 
 color=3D#0000ff =
>
> size=3D2> 

> 
-----Original = 
> Message-----
From:=20 
> az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 
> = Brian=20 Casteel
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 
> AM
To:=20 
> az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: = 
> [Az-Geocaching]=20 Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


> 

>   
When this problem first came up, I =
> started a=20
>   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> took a few=20
>   days off, and the thread exploded.

>   
 

>   
   =
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> /DI=
> V>
>   
 

>   
Check out this post from Jeremy on 
> = the=20
>   topic...

>   
 

>   
   = 
> href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311
> &am=
> p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

>   
 

>   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> concept of a=20
>   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> interesting=20
>   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> prize, I=20
>   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not =
> sure if=20
>   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he=20
>   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> profiles,=20
>   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> can't say=20
>   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> attempt=20
>   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> Jeremy=20
>   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

>   
 

>   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> note (and=20
>   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> Earthlink=20
>   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> The only=20
>   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> is Team=20
>   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

>   
 

>   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> the=20
>   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> ;p

>   
 

>   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> boulder to avoid=20
>   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

>   
 

>   
Brian

>   
Team =
> A.I.

>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80--
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list
> listserv@azgeocaching.com 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> End of Az-Geocaching Digest

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 16:30:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:30:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030509211442.02604f98@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <003501c31711$7eb1a4c0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>

> I was thinking that I would go down to a t-shirt shop and have a plain
> shirt made with the biggest letters I can find that just spell BIKE on
the
> front and back.  If I wore that to the cache how could they claim that
I
> didn't have a BIKE.  :-)

Check your underwear drawer, Scott. Maybe you can save some money: 

http://tinyurl.com/bg0f

Steve
Team Tierra Buena


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 16:30:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:30:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
In-Reply-To: <081901c316c5$e18edaf0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <003801c31711$7f59cba0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>

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On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in
mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the
role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this
listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra
Buena.
 
BUSTED! We confess!
 
We were on the grassy knoll, too. 
 
And we loaned our bulk tape eraser to Rose Mary Woods.
 
In case those references are too ancient for you, we also belong to the
secret cabal that sets retail gasoline prices in Arizona.
 

 
Seriously, all we can do is deny it. We've been too busy to do any
caching at all let alone pull this kind of crap. I've stayed out of the
discussion until now because of lack of time and the fact that others
have already made this point. Permit me to state our position now,
though, just in case someone missed Brian's parenthetic remark above
about taking his remark with humor in mind:
 
The following is from the geocaching.com FAQ page
(http://www.geocaching.com/faq.asp):
 
What are the rules in Geocaching? 
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
simple: 
1. Take something from the cache 
2. Leave something in the cache 
3. Write about it in the logbook 
Where you place a cache is up to you. 
According to the official web site then, there are only three rules. (To
my mind, they kind of rank up there with Newton's laws and Asimov's
Three Laws of Robotics.) If there are only three rules, and the pirate
is violating one of them, it ain't Geocaching.
 
And it ain't us.
 
No offense taken, Brian.
 
Steve
Team Tierra Buena

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<conspiracy
theory>On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in mind), =
Jeremy
identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the role of the =
elusive
cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from an
earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.</conspiracy
theory>






 



BUSTED! =
We
confess!



 



We were =
on the
grassy knoll, too. 



 



And we =
loaned
our bulk tape eraser to Rose Mary Woods.



 



In case =
those
references are too ancient for you, we also belong to the secret cabal =
that
sets retail gasoline prices in Arizona.



 



<Insert
smiley, winking, just-kidding emoticon of =
choice
here>



 



Seriously, all
we can do is deny it. We’ve been too busy to do any caching at all =
let
alone pull this kind of crap. I’ve stayed out of the discussion =
until now
because of lack of time and the fact that others have already made this =
point. Permit
me to state our position now, though, just in case someone missed =
Brian’s
parenthetic remark above about taking his remark with humor in =
mind:



 



The =
following is
from the geocaching.com FAQ page (http://www.geocaching.com/faq.=
asp):



 



What are the rules in =
Geocaching? =




Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. =
Therefore, the
rules are very simple: 



1. Take something from the cache =




2. Leave something in the cache =




3. Write about it in the logbook =




Where you place a cache is up to you. =




According to the
official web site then, there are only three rules.
(To my mind, they kind of rank up there with =
Newton’s
laws and Asimov’s Three Laws of Robotics.) If there are only three =
rules,
and the pirate is violating one of them, it ain’t =
Geocaching.



 



And it =
ain’t
us.



 



No =
offense
taken, Brian.



 



Steve



Team =
Tierra
Buena












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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 17:05:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Terry Hernlund)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 10:05:02 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
References: <000d01c3170b$6dddaff0$6701a8c0@qwest.net>
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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MessageYou're probably right.  I still found it funny to some degree.  =
The whole shtick, scam or not, had me laughing at the end.  Also, in the =
end I was laughing at how it got a rise out of so many people, even me!  =
I found that the funniest bit.  Mortey got the best of me, and I let =
him. =20

I can certainly see how people might get upset, but that's just not me.  =
I have a mortgage and two car payments man!  Why sweat this?  Might as =
well chuckle and move on.  The pirate talk was pretty funny anyway.  =
Seeing it typed out was most of what made it funny.

Before anyone says it...  Yeah.  I would still be saying this if it was =
my cache that got plundered.  For the entertainment I got out of it =
Mortey can have my 3 bucks in party store junk.  Again, that's just me.  =
I'm easy.   ;-)

Cache on kids!  Life is short.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Bill Tomlinson=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:47 AM
  Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


  One man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading through the =
forum, it's seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are laughing.  =
I happen to have a sense of humor too, and I think the jokes on you.  A =
week after the fact and nothing.  No response to Jeremy; no goodies =
replaced in original caches; no goodies placed in other caches; no =
public statement of any kind.  I know it's tough backing the losing =
team, but it's time to let it go.  The posted "good intentions" were a =
scam.

  CacheLess
    -----Original Message-----
    From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry Hernlund
    Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02 AM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


    Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
shtick.  You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of =
all this you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master plan =
was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(

    This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a =
TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)


    -T.
    [General Bracket]

    =
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
    http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

      ----- Original Message -----=20
      From: Brian Casteel=20
      To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
      Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


      When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc =
forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and =
the thread exploded.

      =
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055

      Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...

      =
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331=
&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

      I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is =
being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game =
by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really =
care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just =
me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely =
remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the =
lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say =
that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy =
almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off. =20

      On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor =
in mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing =
the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this =
listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
Buena.

      Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just =
a little thing I noticed.  ;p

      /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to hide a cache.

      Brian
      Team A.I.
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Message






You're probably right.  I still =
found it funny=20
to some degree.  The whole shtick, scam or not, had me laughing at =
the=20
end.  Also, in the end I was laughing at how it got a rise out of =
so many=20
people, even me!  I found that the funniest bit.  Mortey got =
the best=20
of me, and I let him.  


 


I can certainly see how people might =
get upset, but=20
that's just not me.  I have a mortgage and two car payments =
man!  Why=20
sweat this?  Might as well chuckle and move on.  The pirate =
talk was=20
pretty funny anyway.  Seeing it typed out was most of what made it=20
funny.


 


Before anyone says it...  =
Yeah.  I would=20
still be saying this if it was my cache that got plundered.  For =
the=20
entertainment I got out of it Mortey can have my 3 bucks in party store=20
junk.  Again, that's just me.  I'm easy.   =
;-)


 


Cache on kids!  Life is =
short.


 


 


-T.
[General=20
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict bad=20
quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=




  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Bill=20
  Tomlinson 

  
  
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
8:47=20
AM

  
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache_Pirate=20
  Re-Revisited

  


  
One=20
  man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading through the =
forum, it's=20
  seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are laughing.  I =
happen to=20
  have a sense of humor too, and I think the jokes on you.  A week =
after=20
  the fact and nothing.  No response to Jeremy; no goodies replaced =
in=20
  original caches; no goodies placed in other caches; no public =
statement of any=20
  kind.  I know it's tough backing the losing team, but it's time =
to let it=20
  go.  The posted "good intentions" were a =
scam.

  
 

  
CacheLess

  

    

    
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
    az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf =
Of=20
    Terry Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02=20
    AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
    [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


    
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the =
jig is=20
    up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently =
been=20
    squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll =
never be=20
    able to carry out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put =
the stuff=20
    back.  Sorry bud.  :-(

    
 

    
This whole cache pirate thing has =
caused me to=20
    reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to =
report that I=20
    have one.   ;-)

    
 

    
 

    
-T.
[General=20
    =
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict=20
    bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=


    

      
----- Original Message ----- =


      From:=20
      Brian =
Casteel=20
      

      
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      

      
Sent: Saturday, May 10, =
2003 12:29=20
      AM

      
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache_Pirate=20
      Re-Revisited

      


      
When this problem first came up, =
I started a=20
      thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  =
I took a=20
      few days off, and the thread exploded.

      
 

      
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
      
 

      
Check out this post from Jeremy =
on the=20
      topic...

      
 

      
http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

      
 

      
I'm thinking it safe to say that =
the concept=20
      of a cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite =
the=20
      interesting aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the =
field=20
      for a prize, I don't really care for having the caches =
plundered. =20
      Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the =
situation=20
      at first, but he definitely remedied the problem quickly.  =
When I=20
      look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
regarding what=20
      is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  =
If this=20
      person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail =
should=20
      have been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail =
was=20
      fired off.  

      
 

      
<conspiracy theory>On a =
side note (and=20
      hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
Earthlink=20
      customer who was playing the role of the elusive =
cache_pirate.  The=20
      only cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail =
address=20
      is Team Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

      
 

      
Absolutely nothing connects TTB =
to the=20
      cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed. =20
;p

      
 

      
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
boulder to=20
      avoid the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

      
 

      
Brian

      
Team=20
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C316DB.9F78AA40--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 17:39:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Dennis Wodarz)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 10:39:59 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Pirate
In-Reply-To: <200305101540.IAA30129@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <001001c3171b$2dd0a470$0b00a8c0@woodlaptop>


Hmmmm... beer and margaritas?
If I show up wearing an eye patch is 
that enough proof to claim them? :)

FroBro D-Dubs

PS
"It is better to be hated for what you are 
than to be loved for what you are not."
- Andre Gide

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 17:51:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 10:51:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
In-Reply-To: <003501c31711$7eb1a4c0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
References: <003501c31711$7eb1a4c0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>
Message-ID: <3EBD3C1B.8040809@Snaptek.com>

Team Tierra Buena wrote:

> Check your underwear drawer, Scott. Maybe you can save some money: 
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/bg0f

I was going to post a similar message with a similar link, but in the 
end I decided not to go there, and just sent the link to Jason though ICQ :)
I mostly decided to not post it because of all the comments I was going 
to make along the line of having to ride a bike :) ...etc...etc...

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 18:14:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (skydad)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 11:14:20 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Cacheless and The Pirate
References: <200305101600.JAA30245@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <002201c3171f$faa15d10$6401a8c0@cx288378c>

Over the past year we have lost 3 caches due to vandals - so we have been
there.  Our caches are typically located in remote areas that takes effort
to place and replace when stolen.  That's part of the game.  Just found it
quite funny that someone made it at least something that we should all be
able to chuckle about.  If replacing a cache causes one such great pain to
replace then don't replace it.  I find it even more amusing that somehow
Team Tierra Buena is suggested as being the pirates  - of all teams to
accuse that one is the funniest.  Should be quite the conversation piece
next time we all are in Rocky Point.

Maybe the pirate just wanted to make Team Cacheless - cacheless.  We can
only hope the pirate remains on the lose never to be discovered and take
his/her place in the AZ Geocaching  archives for all of us to wonder for
years to come.

The Lunch Club



From: 
To: 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 9:00 AM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1171 - 1 msg


> Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
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>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. RE: Cache Pirate Revisited (Bill Tomlinson)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:07:06 -0700
> From: "Bill Tomlinson" 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> Skydad / The Lunch Club,
>
> I'm glad your reading could be spiced up at my expense.  I have to say,
> though, that I resent being accused of not having a life.  If you had read
> my posts and my profile, you would know that I lead an extremely full
life.
> In addition to a demanding job, I have a wife and three boys that keep me
> very busy.  I am a Boy Scout Scoutmaster and assist with Little League.
As
> a matter of fact, my geocaching time has been severely limited recently
due
> to so many other demands.  As a matter of fact, that was the subject of my
> complaint about the pirate.  I was unwillingly drug into mess.  I had
parted
> with my precious time and some cash to place a cache for you to enjoy.
Now,
> because of this fool, I have to part with more time and more cash to
restore
> my cache.  I might have found it fun too if it happened to someone else
and
> I didn't have to deal with it.  Please put yourself in the shoes of
another
> before judging them.
>
> CacheLess
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of skydad
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:50 AM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited
>
>
> Just a quick comment on the pirate - The cache pirate has been the only
> thing truly fun on these thread for months - By teams responses you can so
> easily tell who has a life and who needs to find one.  Although not in the
> normal real of geocaching and not one we approve of - it sure spiced
things
> up for a few weeks - If the pirate is ever uncovered there is a few beer
and
> margaritas waiting  him/her compliments of The Lunch Club.
>
> Pirate - Should of waited till the Pirates of the Caribbean movie came
out -
> could of been a great theme cache.
>
> The Lunch Club
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:25 AM
> Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1169 - 6 msgs
>
>
> > Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
> > az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > az-geocaching-request@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >    1. Re: Special equipment (Scott Wood)
> >    2. Re: Special Equipment (Scott Sparks)
> >    3. Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings) (Scott Sparks)
> >    4. Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Brian Casteel)
> >    5. Re: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Terry Hernlund)
> >    6. RE: Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited (Bill Tomlinson)
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 21:15:51 -0700
> > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > From: Scott Wood 
> > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equipment
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> > At 08:49 PM 5/9/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >
> > >read though, the more I thought - welp, really sounds
> > >like a 5 to me since I NEED a bike to do it.  Would it
> > >count if I took a toddlers bike and pushed it for the
> > >hike??  I'd have a bike!!
> >
> > I was thinking that I would go down to a t-shirt shop and have a plain
> > shirt made with the biggest letters I can find that just spell BIKE on
> > the front and back.  If I wore that to the cache how could they claim
> > that I didn't have a BIKE.  :-)
> >
> >
> >
> > Scott
> >
> > scott@myblueheaven.com
> > www.myblueheaven.com
> >
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:38:02 -0700
> > From: Scott Sparks 
> > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> > > Only my opinion of course. How do you distinguish between a
> > > difficult bike cache and an easy one?
> > >
> > > -Rob
> >
> >
> >
> > It's been a while since I've done any cycling but here's how I would
> > rate them:
> >
> > Uphill = Difficult
> > Downhill = Easy
> >
> > 
> > -- Sprocket
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 22:39:34 -0700
> > From: Scott Sparks 
> > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment (and cache ratings)
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> >
> > --------------040407090801040706010100
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> >
> >
> > > Maybe everyone ought to read the description and not take the rating
> > > for = static.
> > >
> > >
> > > -T.
> > > [General Bracket]
> >
> >
> >
> > You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the 'star'
> > ratings for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine
> > if _I_ feel I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the
> > time I have, the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other
> > activities I might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as
> > far as I'm concerned, don't mean a thing.  Most times I've found them
> > to be innacurate, anyway.  Some people who think they are really
> > clever tend to (difficult) rate their caches higher than they really
> > warrant. Others who are very agile and are in peak physical condition
> > tend to set their terrain ratings lower than ordinary human beings
would
> agree
> > with.   Those who get winded walking to the mailbox go overboard with
> > their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in the park
> > (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings is if I've
> > been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might
> > look at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was
> > 'supposed' to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling
> > hike up a steep slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws,
> > I might check the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it
> > should have been.  I never look at a rating before-hand and say to
> > myself, " Oooh! I can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big
> > scary 3.5." In the end, the ratings are usually a figment of someone
> > elses imagination.  :-)
> >
> > -- Sprocket
> >
> >
> > --------------040407090801040706010100
> > Content-Type: multipart/related;
> > boundary="------------000709030000080603070204"
> >
> >
> > --------------000709030000080603070204
> > Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> >
> >  
> > 
> >   
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 

> > 
Maybe everyone ought to read the description and
> > not take the rating for = 

> >  static. 

> >   

> >   

> >  -T. 

> >  [General Bracket] 

> >  

> > 

> >  

> > You bring up an interesting point.  I seldom even _look_ at the
> 'star'  ratings
> > for a cache.  I read the description and the logs to determine
> > if
> _I_ feel
> > I can and should attempt it, within the framework of the  time I have,
> > the vehicle I'm in, who else is with me and any other  activities I
> > might have planned (besides geocaching.)  The ratings, as  far as
> > I'm concerned,
> don't
> > mean a thing.  Most times I've found them to  be innacurate,
> anyway.  Some
> > people who think they are really clever  tend to (difficult) rate
> > their
> caches
> > higher than they really warrant.  Others who are very agile and are in
> peak
> > physical condition  tend to  set their terrain ratings lower than
> ordinary
> > human beings  would agree  with.   Those who get winded
> walking to the mailbox
> > go overboard with  their terrain ratings for a simple extended walk in
> > the park  (literally.) About the only time I even look at the ratings
> > is if
> I've
> >  been unable to find a cache in a reasonable period of time, I might
> > look  at the difficulty rating to give me an idea of how hard it was
> 'supposed'
> > to be.  Or, if I've just completed a particularly grueling  hike
> > up a
> steep
> > slope with lots of loose rock and plenty of cat-claws, I  might check
> > the terrain rating to see if it's really what I think it  should have
> been. 
> > I never look at a rating before-hand and say to  myself, " Oooh! I
> > can't (or shouldn't) do this because it's a big scary  3.5." In the
> > end, the
> ratings
> > are usually a figment of someone elses  imagination.   > src="chrome://editor/content/images/smile_n.gif" alt=":-)"
> > class="moz-txt-smily" height="19" width="19" align="middle">  

> >  

> > -- Sprocket 

> > 

> > 
> > 
> >
> > --------------000709030000080603070204--
> >
> > --------------040407090801040706010100--
> >
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 4
> > From: "Brian Casteel" 
> > To: 
> > Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 00:29:24 -0700
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums
> > to = get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the
> > thread = exploded.
> >
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> > 331=
> > &m=3D40960055
> >
> > Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
> >
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> > 331=
> > &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
> >
> > I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is
> > being = put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the
> > game by = trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't
> > really care = for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if
> > it was just me = that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he
> > definitely = remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both
> > profiles, and the = lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is
> > going on, I can't say = that I believe the second profile.  If this
> > person was going to attempt = rectifying the situation, an e-mail
> > should have been fired off to Jeremy = almost immediately after his
> > e-mail was fired off. =20
> >
> > On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
> > mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing
> > the = role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to
> > this = listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
> > Buena.
> >
> > Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> > little thing I noticed.  ;p
> >
> > /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> > perhaps to hide a cache.
> >
> > Brian
> > Team A.I.
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90
> > Content-Type: text/html;
> > charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > 
> >   > charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
When this problem first came up, I =
> > started a thread=20
> > in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few
=
> > days=20
> > off, and the thread exploded.

> > 
 

> > 
 >
href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> >
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> > tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> > /DI=
> > V>
> > 
 
 
 > face=3DArial size=3D2>Check out this post from Jeremy on the=20
> > topic...
 
 > size=3D2> 
 
 >
href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> >
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> >
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> > ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

> > 
 

> > 
I'm thinking it safe to say that the =
> > concept of a=20
> > cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> > interesting=20
> > aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize,
=
> > I don't=20
> > really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if
=
> > it was=20
> > just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely
=
> >
> > remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and
> > = the lack=20 of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I
> > can't say that I = believe=20
> > the second profile.  If this person was going to attempt rectifying
=
> > the=20
> > situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy almost =
> > immediately=20
> > after his e-mail was fired off.  

> > 
 

> > 
<conspiracy theory>On a side note
=
> > (and=20
> > hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> > Earthlink=20
> > customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The
=
> > only=20
> > cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is
=
> > Team=20
> > Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

> > 
 

> > 
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to
the=20
> > cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> > ;p

> > 
 

> > 
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder
=
> > to avoid the=20
> > stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

> > 
 

> > 
Brian

> > 
Team A.I.

> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0816_01C3168B.34E84B90--
> >
> >
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 5
> > From: "Terry Hernlund" 
> > To: 
> > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> > Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 02:02:05 -0700
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
> > shtick.  You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because
> > of = all this you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master
> > plan = was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(
> >
> > This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
> > "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)
> >
> >
> > -T.
> > [General Bracket]
> >
> >
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> > Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> > http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
> >
> >   ----- Original Message -----=20
> >   From: Brian Casteel=20
> >   To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> >   Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
> >   Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> >
> >
> >   When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums
> > = to get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the
> > = thread exploded.
> >
> >   =
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> > 331=
> > &m=3D40960055
> >
> >   Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
> >
> >   =
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058
> > 331=
> > &m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
> >
> >   I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is =
> > being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the
> > game = by trying to locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't
> > really = care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if
> > it was just = me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he
> > definitely = remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both
> > profiles, and the = lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is
> > going on, I can't say = that I believe the second profile.  If this
> > person was going to attempt = rectifying the situation, an e-mail
> > should have been fired off to Jeremy = almost immediately after his
> > e-mail was fired off. =20
> >
> >   On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in
> > = mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing
> > the = role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to
> > this = listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
> > Buena.
> >
> >   Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a
> > = little thing I noticed.  ;p
> >
> >   /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> > perhaps to hide a cache.
> >
> >   Brian
> >   Team A.I.
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860
> > Content-Type: text/html;
> > charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > 
> >   > charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig
=
> > is=20
> > up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently been
=
> > squashed=20
> > by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll never be able
=
> > to carry=20
> > out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the stuff =
> > back.  Sorry=20
> > bud.  :-(

> > 
 

> > 
This whole cache pirate thing has =
> > caused me to=20
> > reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report =
> > that I=20
> > have one.   ;-)

> > 
 

> > 
 

> > 
-T.
[General=20
> >
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> >
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
> > 't inflict bad=20
> > quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 > href=3D"http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/"> > face=3DArial=20
> > color=3D#000000=20
> >
size=3D2>http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=
> > 

> > 
 > style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
> > BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> >   
----- Original Message ----- 

> >    >   style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
> > black">From:=20
> >   Brian =
> > Casteel=20
> >   

> >   
To:  >   title=3Daz-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> >   =
> >
href=3D"mailto:az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com">az-geocaching@lis=
> > tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> >   

> >   
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
> > 12:29=20
> >   AM

> >   
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
> > Cache_Pirate=20
> >   Re-Revisited

> >   


> >   
When this problem first came up, I =
> > started a=20
> >   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> > took a few=20
> >   days off, and the thread exploded.

> >   
 

> >   
 >   =
> >
href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> >
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> > tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> > /DI=
> > V>
> >   
 

> >   
Check out this post from Jeremy on
> > = the=20
> >   topic...

> >   
 

> >   
 >   =
> > href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311
> > &am=
> >
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> >
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> > ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

> >   
 

> >   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the
=
> > concept of a=20
> >   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> > interesting=20
> >   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> > prize, I=20
> >   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not
=
> > sure if=20
> >   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but
he=20
> >   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> > profiles,=20
> >   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> > can't say=20
> >   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> > attempt=20
> >   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> > Jeremy=20
> >   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

> >   
 

> >   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> > note (and=20
> >   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> > Earthlink=20
> >   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> > The only=20
> >   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> > is Team=20
> >   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

> >   
 

> >   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> > the=20
> >   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> > ;p

> >   
 

> >   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> > boulder to avoid=20
> >   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

> >   
 

> >   
Brian

> >   
Team =
> > A.I.

> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31698.27BE7860--
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 08:35:07 -0700
> > From: "Bill Tomlinson" 
> > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> > Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> > This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> > charset="us-ascii"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read the forums.  Just
> > = don't have the time.  I was great reading through all of the posts.
> > I had = begun
> > to think I was the only one that still thought the whole pirate thing =
> > was a
> > bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone in noting that a week after =
> > the
> > fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen items have been replaced (in =
> > the
> > original cache or elsewhere).  It seems the pirate has also not =
> > contacted
> > Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more info here or in the forums.  I =
> > don't
> > believe there really ever was a good intent.  Any good humored well
> > intentioned soul would have come clean or corrected the situation by =
> > now.
> > =20
> > I would be surprised if it were TTB.  They have proven they are cunning
> > enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would
=
> > let
> > it run on like this without some sort of response.  Then again...   ;-)
> > =20
> > CacheLess
> > =20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
> > Brian
> > Casteel
> > Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
> > To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
> >
> >
> >
> > When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums
> > to = get some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the
> > thread exploded.
> > =20
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
> >
 > 1&m=3D40960
> > 055> &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
> > =20
> > Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
> > =20
> > http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
> >  > 833=
> > 1&m=3D40960
> > 055&r=3D70560555#70560555>
> > &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
> > =20
> > I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being
=
> > put
> > to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying
=
> > to
> > locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having
=
> > the
> > caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
> > Jeremy
> > to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
> > quickly.
> > When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
> > regarding
> > what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
> > this
> > person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
> > have
> > been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
> > off.
> >
> > =20
> > On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
> > mind), Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing
> > the role = of
> > the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from
=
> > an
> > earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
> > =20
> > Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
> > little
> > thing I noticed.  ;p
> > =20
> > /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
> > perhaps to
> > hide a cache.
> > =20
> > Brian
> > Team A.I.
> >
> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80
> > Content-Type: text/html;
> > charset="us-ascii"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > 
> >   > charset=3Dus-ascii">
> > Message
> >
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
 >
> > size=3D2>Brian,  Thanks for the links.  I don't usually read
> > = the=20 forums.  Just don't have the time.  I was great
> > reading = through all of=20
> > the posts.  I had begun to think I was the only one that still =
> > thought the=20
> > whole pirate thing was a bad idea.  I also noted that I'm not alone
=
> > in=20
> > noting that a week after the fact, it doesn't appear any of the stolen =
> > items=20
> > have been replaced (in the original cache or elsewhere).  It seems
=
> > the=20
> > pirate has also not contacted Jeremy and certainly hasn't posted more =
> > info here=20
> > or in the forums.  I don't believe there really ever was a good=20
> > intent.  Any good humored well intentioned soul would have come =
> > clean or=20
> > corrected the situation by now.

> > 
 >
> > size=3D2> 

> > 
 > color=3D#0000ff = size=3D2>I=20 would be surprised if it were
> > TTB.  They have proven they are = cunning=20
> > enough to come up with a scheme like this, but I highly doubt they would
=
> > let it=20
> > run on like this without some sort of response.  Then =
> > again...  =20
> > ;-)

> > 
 >
> > size=3D2> 

> > 
 > color=3D#0000ff =
> >
> > size=3D2>CacheLess

> > 
 > color=3D#0000ff =
> >
> > size=3D2> 

> > 
-----Original =
> > Message-----
From:=20
> > az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
> > [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
> > = Brian=20 Casteel
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29
> > AM
To:=20
> > az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: =
> > [Az-Geocaching]=20 Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


> > 

> >   
When this problem first came up, I =
> > started a=20
> >   thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I =
> > took a few=20
> >   days off, and the thread exploded.

> >   
 

> >   
 >   =
> >
href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&am=
> >
>
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055">http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
> > tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055<
> > /DI=
> > V>
> >   
 

> >   
Check out this post from Jeremy on
> > = the=20
> >   topic...

> >   
 

> >   
 >   =
> > href=3D"http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311
> > &am=
> >
p;f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555">http://ubbx.=
> >
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
> > ;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

> >   
 

> >   
I'm thinking it safe to say that the
=
> > concept of a=20
> >   cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the =
> > interesting=20
> >   aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a =
> > prize, I=20
> >   don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not
=
> > sure if=20
> >   it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but
he=20
> >   definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both =
> > profiles,=20
> >   and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I =
> > can't say=20
> >   that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to =
> > attempt=20
> >   rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to =
> > Jeremy=20
> >   almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

> >   
 

> >   
<conspiracy theory>On a side =
> > note (and=20
> >   hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an =
> > Earthlink=20
> >   customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  =
> > The only=20
> >   cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address =
> > is Team=20
> >   Tierra Buena.</conspiracy theory>

> >   
 

> >   
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to =
> > the=20
> >   cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  =
> > ;p

> >   
 

> >   
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
> > boulder to avoid=20
> >   the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

> >   
 

> >   
Brian

> >   
Team =
> > A.I.

> >
> > ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C316CF.10355D80--
> >
> >
> >
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list
> > listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> >
> >
> > End of Az-Geocaching Digest
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list
> listserv@azgeocaching.com
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> End of Az-Geocaching Digest


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 18:33:16 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 11:33:16 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Get a life Evil Fish
References: <20030507172010.28622.h011.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net> <001f01c315cf$252e22e0$1e29b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <012001c31722$9f709bb0$91f50244@cx301817d>

Since Evil Fish has decided to start a flame regarding me here is my
response to his recent post:


> Just tell everyone on the listserv that IMHO WHERERWEE is a hypocrite for
> someone wanting to make caching acceptable for all has a very strange way
of
> showing it....I would advise others to avoid his caches because if in the
> future you appeal to his Grating nature he will without warning or a
request
> delete your find, and will not reply to a private request to have the find
> restored....
>


This was Evil Fish original post when I decided to make my caches members
only to try and offer some limited protection from the cache thief.

> what is frustrating is that I am unable to read my logs on a open to all
cache that has been change.....

>I'm this close to paying the 30 so I can delete them myself

>and avoid such wishy washy caches in the future




So I saved him the $30.00 and honored his request.
Then he e-mailed me with the following:


>yeah ALMOST I made NO request to you to delete a find log
>I will request that you allow me to re add my find to that cache as when it
>was found by Team Evil Fish Aug 10 2002 it was a cache open the ALL.....

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 5:16 PM
Subject: Re: Team Evil Fish contacting you from Geocaching.com


> I deleted the log after making it a members only cache. You made a comment
on the listserve that you were almost willing to pay the $30.00 membership
fee so you could delete the logs yourself. So I honored your request.
>
> I take it you did not mean what you said and want the log restored?
>
>
> Ken
> WhereRwee?
>
>
> >
> > From: "Geocaching.com User Email BOT"
> > Date: 2003/05/06 Tue PM 04:00:46 EDT
> > To:
> > Subject: Team Evil Fish contacting you from Geocaching.com
> >
> > THIS IS AN AUTOMATED EMAIL MESSAGE FROM GEOCACHING.COM
> > This user has given you their email address, so simply reply to this
message to contact them directly. Please send any abuse complaints to
contact@geocaching.com
> > ---------------------------------------------------
> >
> > User Team Evil Fish has contacted you with the following message:
> >
> > howdy
> >
> > Is there a reason our find log at your cache A Sign from the Past II has
been deleted? This cache was found by Team Evil Fish on Aug 8 2002 after
treking over from the near by Beer Can cache....
> >
> >
> > The user has also sent you their email address (or reply to this
message):
> >


You will notice that I then asked for clarification about his statement
about wanting his log deleted and indicate I am willing to let him restore
it.

Fish: I have another life outside of geocaching and consider geocaching a
pretty minor part of it. My life does not revolve around geocaching and am a
little annoyed that you decided to attack me publicly. I am assuming that
your upset because I did not immediately allow you to repost your log. The
reason is simple I have not had the time to change it from a members cache
to a public cache which would allow you to re-post your log.

Today I returned my caches back to public access. It has nothing to do with
Evil Fish's flame towards me and his pathetic life removing around numbers
and loosing sleep over a log that he publicly stated he wanted deleted.
Geocaching is supposed to be a game and fun. If someone decides to steal my
cache it won't be the 1st time. My initial reaction to the cache thief was
to try and protect my remaining caches.

Evil Fish Since you apparently have no life other that geocaching you can
re-post your log and quit whining. I am sorry that you have decided to start
this flame and could not wait a few days for me to return my caches to
public status.

Ken
WhereRwee?



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 18:51:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 11:51:28 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
Message-ID: <20030510115129.23752.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Geez, trying to read thru all those posts on the pirate thread....some
stupid.....gives me a headache!
Reason #23 to back off 
But yes I am still out here
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Sat, 10 May 2003 02:02:05 -0700, "Terry Hernlund" wrote:








Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is 
up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently been squashed 
by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll never be able to carry 
out whatever your master plan was.  Just go put the stuff back.  Sorry 
bud.  :-(
 
This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to 
reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that
I 
have one.   ;-)
 
 
-T.[General 
Bracket]=========================================Don't inflict bad 
quotes on me!  Get
OE-QuoteFix!http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  Brian Casteel 
  
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
  
  Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 
  AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate 
  Re-Revisited
  
  When this problem first came up, I started a 
  thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the matter.  I took
a few 
  days off, and the thread exploded.
   
 
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=40960055
   
  Check out this post from Jeremy on the 
  topic...
   
 
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=4016058331&m=40960055&r=70560555#70560555
   
  I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a 
  cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the
interesting 
  aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her in the field for a
prize, I 
  don't really care for having the caches plundered.  Also, I'm not
sure if 
  it was just me that alerted Jeremy to the situation at first, but he 
  definitely remedied the problem quickly.  When I look at both
profiles, 
  and the lack of a response to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I
can't say 
  that I believe the second profile.  If this person was going to
attempt 
  rectifying the situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to
Jeremy 
  almost immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  
   
  On a side note (and 
  hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is as an
Earthlink 
  customer who was playing the role of the elusive cache_pirate.  The
only 
  cacher posting to this listserv from an earthlink.net e-mail address
is Team 
  Tierra Buena.
   
  Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the 
  cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed.  ;p
   
  /me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid 
  the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.
   
  Brian
  Team A.I.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 18:58:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 11:58:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Pirate Revisited
In-Reply-To: <000d01c3170b$e0b3e170$6401a8c0@cx288378c>
References: <200305101525.IAA30020@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030510115709.02035e30@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 08:50 AM 5/10/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Just a quick comment on the pirate - The cache pirate has been the only
>thing truly fun on these thread for months - By teams responses you can so
>easily tell who has a life and who needs to find one.  Although not in the

I have to agree with you on this one.  This whole thing about a cache 
pirate has sort of rekindled my interest in geocaching, which had been 
waning some lately.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 19:18:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 12:18:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Pirate
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C316EE.47DE89E0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I too want to make a claim on Skydad's offer for beer and margaritas.  (S=
ave a stool at the bar for me too FroBro D-Dubs.)  Maybe I can find an ol=
d pirate's hat someplace and we both can claim the drinks.  Then again, m=
aybe everyone from the listserv will admit they were all in on it too and=
 will show up.  We could make it an event cache!

Bring your credit card Skydad.  [;-)]

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Wodarz
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 11:06 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Pirate



Hmmmm... beer and margaritas?
If I show up wearing an eye patch is =20
that enough proof to claim them? :)

FroBro D-Dubs

PS
"It is better to be hated for what you are =20
than to be loved for what you are not."
- Andre Gide
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C316EE.47DE89E0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


I too want to =
make a claim on Skydad's offer for beer and margaritas.  (Save a sto=
ol at the bar for me too FroBro D-Dubs.)  Maybe I can find=
 an old pirate's hat someplace and we both can claim the drinks.&nbs=
p; Then again, maybe everyone from the listserv will admit they were all =
in on it too and will show up.  We could make it an event cache=
!
 
 
 
Bring your credit card Skydad.  [;-)]=

 
 
 
RandMan
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Dennis Wodarz
 
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 11:06 AM 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com<=
/DIV> 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Pir=
ate
 
 


Hmmmm... beer and margaritas?
If I =
show up wearing an eye patch is 
that enough proof to claim them? :)
FroBro D-Dubs

PS
"It is better to be hated for what you a=
re 
than to be loved for what you are not."
- Andre Gide
_______=
_____________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching ma=
iling list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe o=
r unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo=
/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeoca=
ching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C316EE.47DE89E0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 20:06:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 13:06:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <002b01c3172f$a9624f80$6701a8c0@qwest.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_002C_01C316F4.FD037780
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Good attitude T.  Don't worry, be happy.  I just wish he hadn't hit me =
at
such a bad time.  A week later and I'm just now going to restock my =
cache.
:-(

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 10:05 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


You're probably right.  I still found it funny to some degree.  The =
whole
shtick, scam or not, had me laughing at the end.  Also, in the end I was
laughing at how it got a rise out of so many people, even me!  I found =
that
the funniest bit.  Mortey got the best of me, and I let him. =20
=20
I can certainly see how people might get upset, but that's just not me.  =
I
have a mortgage and two car payments man!  Why sweat this?  Might as =
well
chuckle and move on.  The pirate talk was pretty funny anyway.  Seeing =
it
typed out was most of what made it funny.
=20
Before anyone says it...  Yeah.  I would still be saying this if it was =
my
cache that got plundered.  For the entertainment I got out of it Mortey =
can
have my 3 bucks in party store junk.  Again, that's just me.  I'm easy.
;-)
=20
Cache on kids!  Life is short.
=20
=20
-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/


----- Original Message -----=20
From: Bill   Tomlinson=20
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:47 AM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited

One man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading through the forum,
it's seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are laughing.  I =
happen
to have a sense of humor too, and I think the jokes on you.  A week =
after
the fact and nothing.  No response to Jeremy; no goodies replaced in
original caches; no goodies placed in other caches; no public statement =
of
any kind.  I know it's tough backing the losing team, but it's time to =
let
it go.  The posted "good intentions" were a scam.
=20
CacheLess

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =
Terry
Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  the jig is up.  Nobody seems to get your =
shtick.
You've apparently been squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of all this
you'll never be able to carry out whatever your master plan was.  Just =
go
put the stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(
=20
This whole cache pirate thing has caused me to reflect on what a TRUE =
"sense
of humor" is.  I'm happy to report that I have one.   ;-)
=20
=20
-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
 
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/


----- Original Message -----=20
From: Brian   Casteel=20
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 12:29 AM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited

When this problem first came up, I started a thread in the gc forums to =
get
some opinions on the matter.  I took a few days off, and the thread
exploded.
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc
 &s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
=20
Check out this post from Jeremy on the topic...
=20
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc

&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555
=20
I'm thinking it safe to say that the concept of a cache_pirate is being =
put
to rest by Jeremy.  Despite the interesting aspect of the game by trying =
to
locate him/her in the field for a prize, I don't really care for having =
the
caches plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that alerted =
Jeremy
to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the problem =
quickly.
When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a response to Jeremy =
regarding
what is going on, I can't say that I believe the second profile.  If =
this
person was going to attempt rectifying the situation, an e-mail should =
have
been fired off to Jeremy almost immediately after his e-mail was fired =
off.

=20
On a side note (and hopefully taken with humor in =
mind),
Jeremy identified is as an Earthlink customer who was playing the role =
of
the elusive cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv from =
an
earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra Buena.
=20
Absolutely nothing connects TTB to the cache_pirate, but it's just a =
little
thing I noticed.  ;p
=20
/me dons his REAL looking fake boulder to avoid the stoning...and =
perhaps to
hide a cache.
=20
Brian
Team A.I.


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Message






Good=20
attitude T.  Don't worry, be happy.  I just wish he hadn't hit =
me at=20
such a bad time.  A week later and I'm just now going to restock my =

cache.  :-(



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  Terry Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 10:05=20
  AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
  [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


  
You're probably right.  I still =
found it=20
  funny to some degree.  The whole shtick, scam or not, had me =
laughing at=20
  the end.  Also, in the end I was laughing at how it got a rise =
out of so=20
  many people, even me!  I found that the funniest bit.  =
Mortey got=20
  the best of me, and I let him.  

  
 

  
I can certainly see how people might =
get upset,=20
  but that's just not me.  I have a mortgage and two car payments=20
  man!  Why sweat this?  Might as well chuckle and move =
on.  The=20
  pirate talk was pretty funny anyway.  Seeing it typed out was =
most of=20
  what made it funny.

  
 

  
Before anyone says it...  =
Yeah.  I=20
  would still be saying this if it was my cache that got =
plundered.  For=20
  the entertainment I got out of it Mortey can have my 3 bucks in party =
store=20
  junk.  Again, that's just me.  I'm easy.  =20
;-)

  
 

  
Cache on kids!  Life is =
short.

  
 

  
 

  
-T.
[General=20
  =
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict bad=20
  quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=


  

    
----- Original Message ----- 

    From:=20
    Bill=20
    Tomlinson 

    
    
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 =
8:47=20
    AM

    
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching]=20
    Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited

    


    
One man's humor is another man's pain.  After reading =
through=20
    the forum, it's seems you and "Mortey" are among the few that are=20
    laughing.  I happen to have a sense of humor too, and I think =
the jokes=20
    on you.  A week after the fact and nothing.  No response =
to=20
    Jeremy; no goodies replaced in original caches; no goodies placed in =
other=20
    caches; no public statement of any kind.  I know it's tough =
backing the=20
    losing team, but it's time to let it go.  The posted "good =
intentions"=20
    were a scam.

    
 

    
CacheLess

    

      

      
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
      az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On =
Behalf Of=20
      Terry Hernlund
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 2:02=20
      AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re:=20
      [Az-Geocaching] Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited


      
Mortey, Mortey, Mortey...  =
the jig is=20
      up.  Nobody seems to get your shtick.  You've apparently =
been=20
      squashed by King Jeremy.  And because of all this you'll =
never=20
      be able to carry out whatever your master plan was.  Just go =
put the=20
      stuff back.  Sorry bud.  :-(

      
 

      
This whole cache pirate thing has =
caused me=20
      to reflect on what a TRUE "sense of humor" is.  I'm happy to =
report=20
      that I have one.   ;-)

      
 

      
 

      
-T.
[General=20
      =
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict=20
      bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
=


      

        
----- Original Message ----- =


        From:=20
        Brian=20
        Casteel 

        
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
        

        
Sent: Saturday, May 10, =
2003 12:29=20
        AM

        
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]=20
        Cache_Pirate Re-Revisited

        


        
When this problem first came =
up, I started=20
        a thread in the gc forums to get some opinions on the =
matter.  I=20
        took a few days off, and the thread exploded.

        
 

        
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3D=
tpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&m=3D40960055
        
 

        
Check out this post from Jeremy =
on the=20
        topic...

        
 

        
http://ubbx.=
groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=3Dtpc&s=3D5726007311&f=3D4016058331&=
;m=3D40960055&r=3D70560555#70560555

        
 

        
I'm thinking it safe to say =
that the=20
        concept of a cache_pirate is being put to rest by Jeremy.  =
Despite=20
        the interesting aspect of the game by trying to locate him/her =
in the=20
        field for a prize, I don't really care for having the caches=20
        plundered.  Also, I'm not sure if it was just me that =
alerted=20
        Jeremy to the situation at first, but he definitely remedied the =
problem=20
        quickly.  When I look at both profiles, and the lack of a =
response=20
        to Jeremy regarding what is going on, I can't say that I believe =
the=20
        second profile.  If this person was going to attempt =
rectifying the=20
        situation, an e-mail should have been fired off to Jeremy almost =

        immediately after his e-mail was fired off.  

        
 

        
<conspiracy theory>On a =
side note=20
        (and hopefully taken with humor in mind), Jeremy identified is =
as an=20
        Earthlink customer who was playing the role of the elusive=20
        cache_pirate.  The only cacher posting to this listserv =
from an=20
        earthlink.net e-mail address is Team Tierra =
Buena.</conspiracy=20
        theory>

        
 

        
Absolutely nothing connects TTB =
to the=20
        cache_pirate, but it's just a little thing I noticed. =20
        ;p

        
 

        
/me dons his REAL looking fake =
boulder to=20
        avoid the stoning...and perhaps to hide a cache.

        
 

        
Brian

        
Team=20
  =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_002C_01C316F4.FD037780--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 10 22:52:21 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 15:52:21 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache
References: <00cb01c31694$c7915ff0$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <009201c31746$d1e68180$b030b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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your choice but I upped it to a RUBY TUESDAY's dinner
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brian Casteel=20
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 6:37 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Rejected Cache


  Hahahahahahahahah....

  Regan,

  You made me roflmao when I read your post about StUART Anderson's.  =
So, you'd buy me dinner if I were to give you the coords?  Nothing says =
I will, but I'll entertain the answer.

  Brian
  Team A.I.
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your choice but I upped it to a RUBY =
TUESDAY's=20
dinner



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brian =
Casteel=20
  

  
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  

  
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2003 6:37 =
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: =
Rejected=20
  Cache

  


  
Hahahahahahahahah....

  
 

  
Regan,

  
 

  
You made me roflmao when I read your =
post about=20
  StUART Anderson's.  So, you'd buy me dinner if I were to give you =
the=20
  coords?  Nothing says I will, but I'll entertain the =
answer.

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_008F_01C3170C.24950C20--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 03:43:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 20:43:43 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: <20030510204344.18718.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
"nylon" to "nymph"....?
just wondering...
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

On Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700, "Terry Hernlund" wrote:








Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing 
were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a few days though.  
If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of your 
former personality is wiped from existence after changing it in your 
profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take a few 
days.
 
 
-T.
[General Bracket]
 
 

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  Jerry 
  Nelson 
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 
PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
  
  
  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name 
  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I
enjoy the 
  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of
such travel 
  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as
an 
  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm
thinking of 
  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's
available.
   
  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed
easily 
  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.
   
  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:
   
  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
about 
  nothing?
   
  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any 
  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, 
  etc.?
   
  Jerry
  Offtrail....for awhile, 
anyway

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 04:24:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 21:24:39 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
References: <20030510204344.18718.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <3EBDD087.3000100@pcgraffiti.com>

"What the heck is "nym"?"


A shortened form of the word /pseudo*nym*/, a nym is an anonymous 
invented name that a person can use in e-mail or in online discussions 
arenas, such as chat rooms or news groups.

Aus Dem Kasten


Trisha wrote:

>What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
>"nylon" to "nymph"....?
>just wondering...
>Trisha "Lightning"
>Prescott
>
>On Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700, "Terry Hernlund" wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing 
>were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a few days though.  
>If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of your 
>former personality is wiped from existence after changing it in your 
>profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take a few 
>days.
> 
> 
>-T.
>[General Bracket]
> 
> 
>
>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>  From: 
>  Jerry 
>  Nelson 
>  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 
>PM
>  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
>  
>  
>  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching name 
>  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I
>enjoy the 
>  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of
>such travel 
>  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as
>an 
>  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm
>thinking of 
>  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's
>available.
>   
>  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed
>easily 
>  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.
>   
>  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:
>   
>  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
>about 
>  nothing?
>   
>  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any 
>  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, 
>  etc.?
>   
>  Jerry
>  Offtrail....for awhile, 
>anyway
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>  
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 04:23:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 21:23:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
In-Reply-To: <20030510204344.18718.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <20030511042351.6528.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>

I think he was just talking about his name... at
leasts that's how I read it considering they were
discussing team name changes and etc.   =-)  but it
took me a minute and I had to reread it before it hit
me what he meant.

=-)


--- Trisha  wrote:
> What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and
> it goes from
> "nylon" to "nymph"....?
> just wondering...
> Trisha "Lightning"
> Prescott
> 
> On Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700, "Terry Hernlund"
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing 
> were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a
> few days though.  
> If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of
> your 
> former personality is wiped from existence after
> changing it in your 
> profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take
> a few 
> days.
>  
>  
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
>  
>  
> 
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: 
>   Jerry 
>   Nelson 
>   To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>   Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 
> PM
>   Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
>   
>   
>   For a couple months I've been contemplating
> changing my caching name 
>   from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the
> type of hiking I
> enjoy the 
>   most. I don't hike that way except in places where
> the impact of
> such travel 
>   is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to
> show geocaching as
> an 
>   environmentally friendly activity, which generally
> it is, I'm
> thinking of 
>   changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name. 
> I think it's
> available.
>    
>   Familiar names are important, though, and
> shouldn't be changed
> easily 
>   or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a
> good example.
>    
>   So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an
> opinion:
>    
>   1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or
> am I concerned
> about 
>   nothing?
>    
>   2. Have others who have changed their name
> experienced any 
>   complications at the main site or at azgeocaching
> regarding stats, 
>   etc.?
>    
>   Jerry
>   Offtrail....for awhile, 
> anyway
>
____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe
> visit:
>
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 04:57:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 21:57:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Nyms
Message-ID: <3EBDD834.4040609@mchsi.com>

Trisha wrote:

>>What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
>>"nylon" to "nymph"....?
>>just wondering...
>>Trisha "Lightning"
>>Prescott
>  
>
to which  Aus Dem Kasten replied:

>"What the heck is "nym"?"
>
>
>A shortened form of the word /pseudo*nym*/, a nym is an anonymous 
>invented name that a person can use in e-mail or in online discussions 
>arenas, such as chat rooms or news groups.
>
>Aus Dem Kasten
>  
>
Not to be confused with a  /*nym*conpoop/, something else you often see 
in e-mail, chat rooms, news groups and, yes, even 
listserv@azgeocaching.com.. [:)]

-- Sprocket


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 04:59:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 21:59:09 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: <20030510215909.11660.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Thx, makes sense :-)

On Sat, 10 May 2003 21:24:39 -0700, Aus Dem Kasten wrote:

> 
> "What the heck is "nym"?"
> 
> 
> A shortened form of the word /pseudo*nym*/, a nym is an anonymous 
> invented name that a person can use in e-mail or in online
discussions 
> arenas, such as chat rooms or news groups.
> 
> Aus Dem Kasten
> 
> 
> Trisha wrote:
> 
> >What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
> >"nylon" to "nymph"....?
> >just wondering...
> >Trisha "Lightning"
> >Prescott
> >
> >On Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700, "Terry Hernlund" wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing 
> >were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a few days though.
 
> >If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of your 
> >former personality is wiped from existence after changing it in
your 
> >profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take a few 
> >days.
> > 
> > 
> >-T.
> >[General Bracket]
> > 
> > 
> >
> >  ----- Original Message ----- 
> >  From: 
> >  Jerry 
> >  Nelson 
> >  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
> >  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 
> >PM
> >  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
> >  
> >  
> >  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching
> name 
> >  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I
> >enjoy the 
> >  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of
> >such travel 
> >  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching
as
> >an 
> >  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm
> >thinking of 
> >  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's
> >available.
> >   
> >  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed
> >easily 
> >  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.
> >   
> >  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:
> >   
> >  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
> >about 
> >  nothing?
> >   
> >  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any 
> >  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding
stats, 
> >  etc.?
> >   
> >  Jerry
> >  Offtrail....for awhile, 
> >anyway
> >____________________________________________________________
> >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 05:04:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:04:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
Message-ID: <007001c3177a$dc12e2a0$6401a8c0@DESKTOP>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

For some reason, I think there may be people reading this list who might
be qualified for this position. You'd have to move to Oregon, but I hear
the caching's pretty good up that way.
 
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,86550,00.html
 
Steve
Team Tierra Buena

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For some reason, I think there may be =
people
reading this list who might be qualified for this position. You’d =
have to
move to Oregon, but I =
hear the
caching’s pretty good up that way.



 



http://www.fox=
news.com/story/0,2933,86550,00.html



 



Steve



Team Tierra =
Buena









------=_NextPart_000_0071_01C31740.2FB40AA0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 05:07:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:07:20 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
Message-ID: <20030510220720.17483.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

"Out of the box", huh?
Bestimmt!
Trisha


On Sat, 10 May 2003 21:24:39 -0700, Aus Dem Kasten wrote:

> 
> "What the heck is "nym"?"
> 
> 
> A shortened form of the word /pseudo*nym*/, a nym is an anonymous 
> invented name that a person can use in e-mail or in online
discussions 
> arenas, such as chat rooms or news groups.
> 
> Aus Dem Kasten
> 
> 
> Trisha wrote:
> 
> >What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
> >"nylon" to "nymph"....?
> >just wondering...
> >Trisha "Lightning"
> >Prescott
> >
> >On Thu, 8 May 2003 13:53:06 -0700, "Terry Hernlund" wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Oh... forgot to say...  Stats on AZGeocahcing 
> >were updated to my new nym no prob.  It did take a few days though.
 
> >If you're patient it seems that most, if not all, of your 
> >former personality is wiped from existence after changing it in
your 
> >profile at GC.com.  Like I said though, it does take a few 
> >days.
> > 
> > 
> >-T.
> >[General Bracket]
> > 
> > 
> >
> >  ----- Original Message ----- 
> >  From: 
> >  Jerry 
> >  Nelson 
> >  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
> >  Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 1:13 
> >PM
> >  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
> >  
> >  
> >  For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching
> name 
> >  from Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I
> >enjoy the 
> >  most. I don't hike that way except in places where the impact of
> >such travel 
> >  is negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching
as
> >an 
> >  environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm
> >thinking of 
> >  changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's
> >available.
> >   
> >  Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed
> >easily 
> >  or often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.
> >   
> >  So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an opinion:
> >   
> >  1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I concerned
> >about 
> >  nothing?
> >   
> >  2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any 
> >  complications at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding
stats, 
> >  etc.?
> >   
> >  Jerry
> >  Offtrail....for awhile, 
> >anyway
> >____________________________________________________________
> >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 07:38:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 00:38:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Name Poll
In-Reply-To: <20030510204344.18718.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
References: <20030510204344.18718.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <3EBDFDDE.7090602@Snaptek.com>

I checked another dictionary and found "A" definition... not the one 
you're looking for, but...

The Free On-line Dictionary of Computing (09 FEB 02) [foldoc]

nym

    1.  /nim/ (From the third syllable of
    "anonymous"; or "nym server") A server that functions as an
    anonymous remailer.

    2. A popular hostname for nym servers.

    3. A mail-forwarding account on a nym server.

    (1999-02-26)


Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

Trisha wrote:
> What the heck is "nym"? I look in my dictionary and it goes from
> "nylon" to "nymph"....?
> just wondering...
> Trisha "Lightning"
> Prescott


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 07:43:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 00:43:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not
 because special equipment is needed
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EBDFF24.5060707@Snaptek.com>

Hotmail tends to not like to accept mail, but doesn't have half the 
problems that MSN mail has since it tends to have quite a bit of 
troubles with long dealys and bounces.  Hotmail just seems to have 
problems with them experimenting with different ways to filter spam.
Either way, microsoft seems to really suck at handing their mail.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

gale and mike wrote:
> No, my hotmail account is not getting duplicates, although I've noticed hotmail 
> has been a little funny the last couple of days.
> 
>  >From: "Terry Hernlund"
> 
>  >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>  >To:
>  >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but not 
> because special equipment is needed
>  >Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:16:50 -0700
>  >
>  >MessageHmmm... I only get dups sometimes. They're to a Hotmail box so maybe 
> that's it.
>  >
>  >Sorry for the interuption. Carry on. ;-)
>  >
>  >
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 
> 2 months FREE*.____________________________________________________________ 
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, 
> subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's 
> Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 11:24:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 04:24:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31775.41E5D660
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have MSN.  There have been many instances where I haven't received my e=
mail at all.  I can always tell when I don't receive something from lists=
erv.  It's like coming into the middle of a conversation.  Fortunately, w=
hen someone on listserv responds to a message that I haven't received, th=
e previous message is still attached and I'm able to get caught up.

Rand (RandMan)

----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Cluff
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 12:48 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but n=
otbecause special equipment is needed

Hotmail tends to not like to accept mail, but doesn't have half the =20
problems that MSN mail has since it tends to have quite a bit of =20
troubles with long dealys and bounces.  Hotmail just seems to have =20
problems with them experimenting with different ways to filter spam.
Either way, microsoft seems to really suck at handing their mail.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

gale and mike wrote:
> No, my hotmail account is not getting duplicates, although I've noticed=
 hotmail =20
> has been a little funny the last couple of days.
> =20
>  >From: "Terry Hernlund"
 >Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:16:50 -0700
>  >
>  >MessageHmmm... I only get dups sometimes. They're to a Hotmail box so=
 maybe =20
> that's it.
>  >
>  >Sorry for the interuption. Carry on. ;-)

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I have MSN.&nb=
sp; There have been many instances where I haven't received my email at a=
ll.  I can always tell when I don't receive something from list=
serv.  It's like coming into the middle of a conversation.  For=
tunately, when someone on listserv responds to a message that I=
 haven't received, the previous message is still attached and I'm able to=
 get caught up.
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
&n=
bsp;
 
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Brian =
Cluff
 
Sent: Sunday, May 11, =
2003 12:48 AM
 
To: listserv@a=
zgeocaching.com
 
Subject: Re:=
 [Az-Geocaching] Mountain biking cache may rate harder, but notbecause sp=
ecial equipment is needed
 
 
 
Hotmail tends to not=
 like to accept mail, but doesn't have half the 
problems that MSN mai=
l has since it tends to have quite a bit of 
troubles with long dealys=
 and bounces.  Hotmail just seems to have 
problems with them exp=
erimenting with different ways to filter spam.
Either way, microsoft s=
eems to really suck at handing their mail.

Brian Cluff
Team Sna=
ptek

gale and mike wrote:
> No, my hotmail account is not ge=
tting duplicates, although I've noticed hotmail 
> has been a littl=
e funny the last couple of days.
> 
>  >From: "Terry =
Hernlund"
 
 >Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 20:16:50 -0700
>&n=
bsp; >
>  >MessageHmmm... I only get dups sometimes. The=
y're to a Hotmail box so maybe 
> that's it.
>  >
=
>  >Sorry for the interuption. Carry on. ;-)




------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31775.41E5D660--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 11:45:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 11:45:44 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
Message-ID: 




Then you may never know when we're talking about you Rand. (Just kidding)


I also have a yahoo account. More space for free, less "objectional" spam. And I don't have delays or bounces with it. More importantly, yahoo accepts my real last name on the account, something hotmail never would. You all can ponder that little mystery while I take care of household stuff  for a while. Or not.
















>From: "RAND HARDIN" 


>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: "AZ-Geocaching" 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN 

>Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 04:24:48 -0700 

> 

>I have MSN. There have been many instances where I haven't received my email at all. I can always tell when I don't receive something from listserv. It's like coming into the middle of a conversation. Fortunately, when someone on listserv responds to a message that I haven't received, the previous message is still attached and I'm able to get caught up. 

> 

>Rand (RandMan) 

> 




Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 12:42:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 05:42:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31780.27408B60
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I haven't been happy with MSN since I changed over from AOL a year ago.  =
Unfortunately, I signed a two year contract with MSN.  I was shopping for=
 a digital camera at Best Buy and noticed that if I signed a two year con=
tract, I would receive  $200.00 off the price of the camera.  Right now i=
f I cancelled MSN I would be charged around $100.00.  Sometimes I think i=
t would be worth it though.

I'll have to ask you to explain the last name situation the next time I r=
un into you.  [;-)]

Rand =20

----- Original Message -----
From: gale and mike
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 4:48 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN

Then you may never know when we're talking about you Rand. (Just kidding)
I also have a yahoo account. More space for free, less "objectional" spam=
. And I don't have delays or bounces with it. More importantly, yahoo acc=
epts my real last name on the account, something hotmail never would. You=
 all can ponder that little mystery while I take care of household stuff =
 for a while. Or not.






>From: "RAND HARDIN" =20
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com =20
>To: "AZ-Geocaching" =20
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN =20
>Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 04:24:48 -0700 =20
> =20
>I have MSN. There have been many instances where I haven't received my e=
mail at all. I can always tell when I don't receive something from listse=
rv. It's like coming into the middle of a conversation. Fortunately, when=
 someone on listserv responds to a message that I haven't received, the p=
revious message is still attached and I'm able to get caught up. =20
> =20
>Rand (RandMan) =20
> =20



Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online ____________=
________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing li=
st listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscri=
be visit: http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching=
 Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =20

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31780.27408B60
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


I haven't been=
 happy with MSN since I changed over from AOL a year ago.  Unfortuna=
tely, I signed a two year contract with MSN.  I was shopping for a d=
igital camera at Best Buy and noticed that if I signed a two year contrac=
t, I would receive  $200.00 off the price of the camera.  Right=
 now if I cancelled MSN I would be charged around $100.00.=
  Sometimes I think it would be worth it though.
 
&nb=
sp;
 
I'll have to ask you to explain the last name situation th=
e next time I run into you.  [;-)]
 
 
 
Rand=
 
 
 
 
 
----- Original Message ---=
--
 
From: gale and mike
 
Se=
nt: Sunday, May 11, 2003 4:48 AM
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
 
  
 
 
Then you may never know when we're talking about you Ra=
nd. (Just kidding)
 
I also have a yahoo account. More space for fre=
e, less "objectional" spam. And I don't have delays or bounces with =
it. More importantly, yahoo accepts my real last name on the account, som=
ething hotmail never would. You all can ponder that little mystery while =
I take care of household stuff  for a while. Or not.




 
 
 
=
 
 
 
>From: "RAND HARDIN" 
 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com  
=
>To: "AZ-Geocaching"  
>Subjec=
t: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN  
>Date: Sun, 11 May 2003=
 04:24:48 -0700  
>  
>I have MSN. There have b=
een many instances where I haven't received my email at all. I can always=
 tell when I don't receive something from listserv. It's like coming into=
 the middle of a conversation. Fortunately, when someone on listserv resp=
onds to a message that I haven't received, the previous message is still =
attached and I'm able to get caught up.  
>  
>=
Rand (RandMan)  
>  
 

 
 Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online _____________________=
_______________________________________ Az-Geocaching mailing list listse=
rv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:=
 http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona'=
s Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31780.27408B60--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 17:54:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 10:54:04 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EBE8E3C.7060009@Snaptek.com>

It's not just you, it seems to be everyone that is using MSN.  We get 
error messages back from MSN all the time telling us that everyone's 
mail that was tring to go there is delayed or just plain refused.
I don't know how the quality of the internet service is, but I would 
probably find one of these places that will give me an e-mail box for $2 
a month and go with that, or at very least go with a yahoo account.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

RAND HARDIN wrote:
> I have MSN.  There have been many instances where I haven't received my email at all.  I can always tell when I don't receive something from listserv.  It's like coming into the middle of a conversation.  Fortunately, when someone on listserv responds to a message that I haven't received, the previous message is still attached and I'm able to get caught up.


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 18:45:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 11:45:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
Message-ID: 


>From: "Team Tierra Buena" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: "Arizona Geocaching" 
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
>Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:04:49 -0700
>
>For some reason, I think there may be people reading this list who might
>be qualified for this position. You'd have to move to Oregon, but I hear
>the caching's pretty good up that way.
>
>http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,86550,00.html


hhhmmm. Wyle E, CHUMP, AZSaluki... I think that would be a great opportunity 
for ya'!    ;)

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 19:31:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:31:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C317B9.364B50C0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Who's to say these mental patients actually need to be confined to a hosp=
ital!?  Maybe they're just poor misunderstood souls who choose to speak t=
he language of their choice!  Think about it - if you spoke a language no=
body else understood you too would be looked upon as odd.  I say it's tim=
e for our government to step in and start offering courses in Klingon at =
our schools.  The United States is a country of opportunities.  We cannot=
 discriminate or lock people away based on a language that we don't under=
stand!  [;-)]

RandMan  =20

----- Original Message -----
From: RopingThe Wind
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 11:48 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity



>From: "Team Tierra Buena" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: "Arizona Geocaching" 
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
>Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:04:49 -0700
>
>For some reason, I think there may be people reading this list who might
>be qualified for this position. You'd have to move to Oregon, but I hear
>the caching's pretty good up that way.
>
>http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,86550,00.html


hhhmmm. Wyle E, CHUMP, AZSaluki... I think that would be a great opportun=
ity =20
for ya'!    ;)

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*  =20
http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfeatures/junkmail

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C317B9.364B50C0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Who's to say t=
hese mental patients actually need to be confined to a hospital!?  M=
aybe they're just poor misunderstood souls who choose to speak the langua=
ge of their choice!  Think about it - if you spoke a language nobody=
 else understood you too would be looked upon as odd.  I say it=
's time for our government to step in and start offering courses in K=
lingon at our schools.  The United States is a country of =
opportunities.  We cannot discriminate or lock people away =
;based on a language that we don't understand!  [;-)] 
 
 
RandMan  
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: RopingThe Wind
 Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 11:48 AM 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=

 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching=
] Job Opportunity
 
 


>From: "Team Tierra B=
uena" <teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: listserv@azg=
eocaching.com
>To: "Arizona Geocaching" <az-geocaching@listserv.=
azgeocaching.com>
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
&=
gt;Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:04:49 -0700
>
>For some reason, =
I think there may be people reading this list who might
>be qualifi=
ed for this position. You'd have to move to Oregon, but I hear
>the=
 caching's pretty good up that way.
>
>http://www.foxnews.com=
/story/0,2933,86550,00.html


hhhmmm. Wyle E, CHUMP, AZSaluki...=
 I think that would be a great opportunity 
for ya'!   =
 ;)

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

___________________________=
______________________________________
The new MSN 8: advanced junk ma=
il protection and 2 months FREE*  
http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfe=
atures/junkmail

__________________________________________________=
__________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To =
edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azg=
eocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching =
Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C317B9.364B50C0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 19:37:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:37:43 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...has you.
Message-ID: <003801c317f4$caedff80$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C317BA.1E6901E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Well, I wonder if the e-mail campaign has started from Team EvilFish in =
an effort to obtain the final coords to my new cache.  Two finders so =
far.

Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C317BA.1E6901E0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Well, I wonder if the e-mail campaign =
has started=20
from Team EvilFish in an effort to obtain the final coords to my new=20
cache.  Two finders so far.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_0035_01C317BA.1E6901E0--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 19:53:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 12:53:09 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...has you.
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C317BC.462DC100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

WOW!  After reading Brian's message below, I got this eerie feeling like =
I've read that same exact massage before . . . deja vu!

RandMan



----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Casteel
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 12:42 PM
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...has you.

Well, I wonder if the e-mail campaign has started from Team EvilFish in a=
n effort to obtain the final coords to my new cache.  Two finders so far.

Brian
Team A.I.

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C317BC.462DC100
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


WOW!  After reading Brian's message =
below, I got this eerie feeling like I've read that same exact massa=
ge before . . . deja vu!
 
 
 
RandMan
 
=
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
----- Or=
iginal Message -----
 
From: Brian Casteel
 
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 12:42 PM
 
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...h=
as you.
 
 
    
Well, =
I wonder if the e-mail campaign has started from Team EvilFish in an effo=
rt to obtain the final coords to my new cache.  Two finders so far.<=
/FONT>
 
 
 
Brian
 
Team A.I.


------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C317BC.462DC100--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 20:56:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 13:56:18 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job Opportunity
Message-ID: <20030511135620.5015.h015.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hu'tegh!
(I'd go help out but I'd probably end up hurting the poor Ha'Dlbah!!!!)

Or how about...... "T'kevaidors a skelitus dunt'ryala aikriian
paselitan.....Torital"  Anybody recognize that language?

No?

It's OLD Vulcan.....

Heh heh heh  OK I admit, I'm a Trek fan.....I also write in Tengwar,
the Elven language of Middle Earth (Lord of the Rings)
Languages, a hobby.....

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Sun, 11 May 2003 12:31:14 -0700, "RAND HARDIN" wrote:

Who's to say these mental patients actually need to be confined to a
hospital!?  Maybe they're just poor misunderstood souls who choose to
speak the language of their choice!  Think about it - if you spoke a
language nobody else understood you too would be looked upon as odd. 
I say it's time for our government to step in and start offering
courses in Klingon at our schools.  The United States is a country of
opportunities.  We cannot discriminate or lock people away based on
a language that we don't understand!  [;-)]   RandMan      -----
Original Message ----- From: RopingThe Wind Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003
11:48 AM To: listserv@azgeocaching.com Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching]
Job Opportunity  >From: "Team Tierra Buena"
>Reply-To:
listserv@azgeocaching.com>To: "Arizona Geocaching"
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Job
Opportunity>Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 22:04:49 -0700>>For some reason, I
think there may be people reading this list who might>be qualified for
this position. You'd have to move to Oregon, but I hear>the caching's
pretty good up that
way.>>http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,86550,00.htmlhhhmmm. Wyle E,
CHUMP, AZSaluki... I think that would be a great opportunity for
ya'!    ;)ScottTeam
Ropingthewind_________________________________________________________________The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months
FREE* 
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail____________________________________________________________Az-Geocaching mailing list
listserv@azgeocaching.comTo edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe
visit:http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocachingArizona's Geocaching Resourcehttp://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 11 23:10:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 16:10:09 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
References:  <3EBE8E3C.7060009@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <012c01c31812$7c7adad0$319c4094@BILLPC>

Want another option?  You can register a domain name for about $15 a year.  I know places that
will host it free -- no ads, banners, or popups -- and then you can have reliable email
addresses that don't change just because you change ISPs, and you don't have to live with MSN,
etc.  Just a thought.

We had a good time up on Mt. Graham today, and visited all the caches up there except one where
the road is closed.  Nice weather.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Cluff" 


> It's not just you, it seems to be everyone that is using MSN.  We get
> error messages back from MSN all the time telling us that everyone's
> mail that was tring to go there is delayed or just plain refused.
> I don't know how the quality of the internet service is, but I would
> probably find one of these places that will give me an e-mail box for $2
> a month and go with that, or at very least go with a yahoo account.




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 04:46:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 21:46:10 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
In-Reply-To: <012c01c31812$7c7adad0$319c4094@BILLPC>
References: 
 <3EBE8E3C.7060009@Snaptek.com>
 <012c01c31812$7c7adad0$319c4094@BILLPC>
Message-ID: <1799.172.30.1.10.1052714770.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>

Where?  I am personally hosting my own domain. But, I have friends that
would love this (especially if hosted for free!) if no ads, etc.

Steven Stringham

> Want another option?  You can register a domain name for about $15 a
> year.  I know places that will host it free -- no ads, banners, or
> popups -- and then you can have reliable email addresses that don't
> change just because you change ISPs, and you don't have to live with
> MSN, etc.  Just a thought.
>
> We had a good time up on Mt. Graham today, and visited all the caches up
> there except one where the road is closed.  Nice weather.
>
> Bill
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 05:39:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill)
Date: Sun, 11 May 2003 22:39:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail/MSN
References:         <3EBE8E3C.7060009@Snaptek.com>        <012c01c31812$7c7adad0$319c4094@BILLPC> <1799.172.30.1.10.1052714770.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>
Message-ID: <020b01c31848$da8e32d0$319c4094@BILLPC>

A good choice is www.doteasy.com.  I have been hosting several sites there for a couple of
years now.

Bill

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Stringham" 


> Where?  I am personally hosting my own domain. But, I have friends that
> would love this (especially if hosted for free!) if no ads, etc.
>
> Steven Stringham




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 20:10:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Brown)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 13:10:59 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] "Sorrow" The Blue Devil Duck
Message-ID: 

Sorrow has finally reached his destination and accomplished his task.  Take
a look of a picture of Sorrow and Jeremy at lunch.

http://img.groundspeak.com/track/log/187881_400.jpg

Here's the link for Sorrow's main page

http://www.geocaching.com/track/track_detail.asp?ID=99

Where should he go now?  Hmmm, Maybe to Michigan to visit Team Sand Dollar?

Cody
Team CBX2


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 20:40:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 16:40:27 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
Message-ID: <63F7213D.7F8FD21A.0013DAD2@aol.com>

I got my pictures developed at Costco and I got the images on disk option. I am trying to put up some of them on my logs but the keep coming up pixelated, to the point they are un viewable. I tried to upload them directly, but the files are too large. So I reduced the size, but it was unviewable. The next time i tried to reduce the pixel size and the result was the same. 
any suggestions, or what am I missing?

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 20:44:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 13:44:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] "Sorrow" The Blue Devil Duck
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3188C.A0BC7820
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Cody,

You're fortunate that your duck didn't fly-the-coop on you!  It's short o=
f a miracle when a travel bug does reach its destination.  Congratulation=
s!

Rand (RandMan)    =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Cody Brown
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 1:23 PM
To: az-geocaching@listserv.snaptek.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] "Sorrow" The Blue Devil Duck

Sorrow has finally reached his destination and accomplished his task.  Ta=
ke
a look of a picture of Sorrow and Jeremy at lunch.

http://img.groundspeak.com/track/log/187881_400.jpg

Here's the link for Sorrow's main page

http://www.geocaching.com/track/track_detail.asp?ID=3D99

Where should he go now?  Hmmm, Maybe to Michigan to visit Team Sand Dolla=
r?

Cody
Team CBX2

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3188C.A0BC7820
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Cody,
  
 
You're fortunate that your duck didn't fly-the-coop =
on you!  It's short of a miracle when a travel bug does reach its de=
stination.  Congratulations!
 
 
 
Rand (Rand=
Man)    
 
 
 
 
----- Ori=
ginal Message -----
 
From: Cody Brown
 
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 1:23 PM
 
To: az-geocaching@listserv.snaptek.com
 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] "Sorrow" The B=
lue Devil Duck
 
 
Sorrow has finally reached his dest=
ination and accomplished his task.  Take
a look of a picture of S=
orrow and Jeremy at lunch.

http://img.groundspeak.com/track/log/18=
7881_400.jpg

Here's the link for Sorrow's main page

http://=
www.geocaching.com/track/track_detail.asp?ID=3D99

Where should he =
go now?  Hmmm, Maybe to Michigan to visit Team Sand Dollar?

C=
ody
Team CBX2

_________________________________________________=
___________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To=
 edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.az=
geocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching=
 Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3188C.A0BC7820--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 21:12:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:12:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
In-Reply-To: <63F7213D.7F8FD21A.0013DAD2@aol.com>
Message-ID: 

I have noticed this happening on occasion. In my history, the pictures have
uploaded fine, but there's something screwy with the way the browser reads
it for the first time. After uploading the picture and viewing it for the
first time, I just click "Refresh" and it shows up fine for me.

Can you send us a link of the pictures in question?

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
BBUDCAM@aol.com
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 1:40 PM
To: az-geocaching@listserv.snaptek.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images


I got my pictures developed at Costco and I got the images on disk option. I
am trying to put up some of them on my logs but the keep coming up
pixelated, to the point they are un viewable. I tried to upload them
directly, but the files are too large. So I reduced the size, but it was
unviewable. The next time i tried to reduce the pixel size and the result
was the same.
any suggestions, or what am I missing?
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 21:14:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 14:14:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
In-Reply-To: <63F7213D.7F8FD21A.0013DAD2@aol.com>
References: <63F7213D.7F8FD21A.0013DAD2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <3EC00EC9.8080708@snaptek.com>

I would suggest grabbing the gimp
to install it, download all 3 of the following files and install them in 
this order
ftp://ftp.arnes.si/software/gimp-win/gtk+-1.3.0-20030216-setup.zip
ftp://ftp.arnes.si/software/gimp-win/gimp-1.2.4-20030213-setup.zip
ftp://ftp.arnes.si/software/gimp-win/gimp-1.2.4-20020907-lzw-setup.zip

This will give you a prgram with nearly the same power as photoshop, 
without the $600+ price tag or the guilt of pirating it.

anyway... you can load your picture into the gimp, and then resave it as 
a jpeg, and the saver of the gimp will allow you to tweek all sorts of 
settings for the image and show you exactly what it's going to look like 
in real time.

Give it a try... and for everyone else that I have suggested downloading 
this in the past... I appologize, I just looked at the home page for the 
software and it's extremely confusing as to what you need to grab... 
thats why I included the links in this message.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

BBUDCAM@aol.com wrote:
> I got my pictures developed at Costco and I got the images on disk option. I am trying to put up some of them on my logs but the keep coming up pixelated, to the point they are un viewable. I tried to upload them directly, but the files are too large. So I reduced the size, but it was unviewable. The next time i tried to reduce the pixel size and the result was the same. 
> any suggestions, or what am I missing?
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 22:46:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 18:46:34 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
Message-ID: <122EA92F.50F9ACED.0013DAD2@aol.com>

I clicked refresh and low and behold there I was, crystal clear. I also downloaded the Gimp, but I havn't used it yet. The one I was trying on ( and now succeded) is Give and Take (GC2256)


 http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?id=8790
Thanks for the advice!!

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 22:51:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Bremser)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 15:51:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] How do you distinguish between a difficult bike cache and an easy one?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030512225158.28546.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com>

I agree very much.  I was on a supposed 1.5/2 this
weekend that my wife should have been able to do but
the truck could not get to the location and it was in
VERY rough desert.  2.5/2 would have been better or
adding a message that the 1.5 is over desert.
--- Andrew Ayre  wrote:
> I'm amazed that there is so much discussion here
> regarding ratings and
> special equipment, yet there was so little
> discussion regarding a rating
> system for handicap accessibility...
> 
> Andy
> 
> 


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 22:56:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Bremser)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 15:56:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Bicycles aren't "special" equipment:  Reserve "5" only for truly difficult caches
In-Reply-To: <20030508163242.73763.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030512225615.57591.qmail@web40611.mail.yahoo.com>

A 5 is a 5 that is special equipment required.  I am
nearly 50 and overweight and thoroughly enjoy the
sport and COULD NEVER ride a bike again even if I
wanted to.  It is NOT fair to those of us that have
special needs and not list it as a special need.  It
does not matter what the terrain is what matters is
the equipment.  If not then we should be pushing
towards another rating on sites: Accessablity

Tim (team RR B's)
--- Ken Akerman  wrote:
> If they had used the rating system on the site when
> listing it, they would have had a much higher rating
> (I think a 5 for special equipment)
> 
> Unless the mountain biking trail is very difficult
> (like the Slickrock Trail near Moab), then there is
> no way that it should rank a "5".  The "5" rating
> should be reserved for only extremely difficult
> caches only, one that the majority of geocachers
> would not be able to get (even if they rented or
> borrowed the equipment needed).  Some caches may be
> in remote lands and you need a 4WD to drive to it,
> (hiking is possible, but the hike may be long), but
> most of us do not consider a 4WD vehicle to be
> special equipment, either. It's easier to ride a
> bike 17 miles on a smooth, flat trail than it is to
> hike a half-mile up a very steep, rocky, and brushy
> mountain without any trail (like my Granite Mountain
> cache in northeastern Scottsdale, a true "4"). 
> Therefore, why should the biking cache, with less
> difficult terrain, be rated higher than the mountain
> cache? The "5" rating should be assigned very
> infrequently.  The rating of "4" that I calculated
> still is pretty high, only one step !
> lower. Ken


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 23:10:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 16:10:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
In-Reply-To: <122EA92F.50F9ACED.0013DAD2@aol.com>
Message-ID: 

Yay! I'm glad that worked for you. You wouldn't believe how long it took me
to figure that one out. I'm glad you were able to avoid some of the same
frustrations. :)

-FroBro Q-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
BBUDCAM@aol.com
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 3:47 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images


I clicked refresh and low and behold there I was, crystal clear. I also
downloaded the Gimp, but I havn't used it yet. The one I was trying on ( and
now succeded) is Give and Take (GC2256)


 http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?id=8790
Thanks for the advice!!
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 12 23:19:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 16:19:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] You are never too old to ride a bicycle
In-Reply-To: <20030512225615.57591.qmail@web40611.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030512231945.55685.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-2020397698-1052781585=:55651
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Another geocacher wrote: I am nearly 50 and overweight and thoroughly enjoy the sport and COULD NEVER ride a bike again even if I wanted to. I know many people well over 50 who ride bicycles.  Some of them do century rides (100 miles or more in one day), like the El Tour de Tucson and other perimeter bike rides.  Whenever I do rides like these, it appears to me that the majority of people are older than I am, and I'm not very young (I completed my college degree in the 1980's). Also, bicycling is great exercise for losing weight.  Do not say that you could NEVER ride a bicycle again;  even severely handicapped people can ride specially-made bicycles.  For example, if you read this page you will learn about: 1) A blind cyclist who rode across America,2) A 65-year-old man who circled the perimeter of the United States (13,789 miles in 345 days), and3) A woman triathlete who is 80 years old.
--0-2020397698-1052781585=:55651
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Another geocacher wrote:


 


I am nearly 50 and overweight and thoroughly enjoy the sport and COULD NEVER ride a bike again even if I wanted to.


 


I know many people well over 50 who ride bicycles.  Some of them do century rides (100 miles or more in one day), like the El Tour de Tucson and other perimeter bike rides.  Whenever I do rides like these, it appears to me that the majority of people are older than I am, and I'm not very young (I completed my college degree in the 1980's). Also, bicycling is great exercise for losing weight.  Do not say that you could NEVER ride a bicycle again;  even severely handicapped people can ride specially-made bicycles.  For example, if you read this page you will learn about:


 


1) A blind cyclist who rode across America,


2) A 65-year-old man who circled the perimeter of the United States (13,789 miles in 345 days), and


3) A woman triathlete who is 80 years old.

--0-2020397698-1052781585=:55651--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 00:14:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Bremser)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:14:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] You are never too old to ride a bicycle
In-Reply-To: <20030512231945.55685.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030513001425.56173.qmail@web40607.mail.yahoo.com>

It is not the willingness or the want it is the knees
and balance.   But your chastisment is understood and
accepted.  The fact is that special equipment is
special equipment. Thus if a 5 includes special
equipment required then it is logical to include
bicycles as special equipment.
I think that this would be a moot point if there were
another criteria or code on every site that is
accessablity. Even if the powers-to-be are not willing
to retrofit all existing data in the database with a
new field it should be something considered in the
future for new caches.

Thanks for the chiding
Tim
--- Ken Akerman  wrote:
> Another geocacher wrote: I am nearly 50 and
> overweight and thoroughly enjoy the sport and COULD
> NEVER ride a bike again even if I wanted to. I know
> many people well over 50 who ride bicycles.  Some of
> them do century rides (100 miles or more in one
> day), like the El Tour de Tucson and other perimeter
> bike rides.  Whenever I do rides like these, it
> appears to me that the majority of people are older
> than I am, and I'm not very young (I completed my
> college degree in the 1980's). Also, bicycling is
> great exercise for losing weight.  Do not say that
> you could NEVER ride a bicycle again;  even severely
> handicapped people can ride specially-made bicycles.
>  For example, if you read this page you will learn
> about: 1) A blind cyclist who rode across America,2)
> A 65-year-old man who circled the perimeter of the
> United States (13,789 miles in 345 days), and3) A
> woman triathlete who is 80 years old.


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 00:49:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 12 May 2003 17:49:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C318AE.E7816960
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I frequently have the same problem uploading digital pics.  I usually clo=
se out the window and then reclick to bring it back up again.  It always =
clears up.

Rand (RandMan)
----- Original Message -----
From: Brent Milner
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 4:14 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images

Yay! I'm glad that worked for you. You wouldn't believe how long it took =
me
to figure that one out. I'm glad you were able to avoid some of the same
frustrations. :)

-FroBro Q-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
BBUDCAM@aol.com
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 3:47 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] uploading images


I clicked refresh and low and behold there I was, crystal clear. I also
downloaded the Gimp, but I havn't used it yet. The one I was trying on ( =
and
now succeded) is Give and Take (GC2256)


http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?id=3D8790
Thanks for the advice!!

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C318AE.E7816960
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


I frequently h=
ave the same problem uploading digital pics.  I usually close out th=
e window and then reclick to bring it back up again.  It always clea=
rs up.
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
 
=
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Brent Milner
 
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 4:14 PM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] uploading=
 images
 
 
Yay! I'm glad that worked for you. You wou=
ldn't believe how long it took me
to figure that one out. I'm glad you=
 were able to avoid some of the same
frustrations. :)

-FroBro Q=
-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-adm=
in@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azge=
ocaching.com]On Behalf Of
BBUDCAM@aol.com
Sent: Monday, May 12, 200=
3 3:47 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching=
] uploading images


I clicked refresh and low and behold there =
I was, crystal clear. I also
downloaded the Gimp, but I havn't used it=
 yet. The one I was trying on ( and
now succeded) is Give and Take (GC=
2256)


http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?id=3D8=
790
Thanks for the advice!!


------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C318AE.E7816960--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 18:41:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 11:41:08 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31944.8BA012E0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M.  =20

Hello . . . is anyone out there?  =20

It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through.  Is eve=
ryone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I would a=
ppreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31944.8BA012E0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


May=
 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M.  
 
 
 
=
Hello . . . is anyone out there?  
 
 
 
It's=
 been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through.  Is ev=
eryone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.=
  I would appreciate a response on this if possible.  (Ran=
dMan)



------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31944.8BA012E0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 18:55:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 11:55:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EC13FB6.9080303@snaptek.com>

The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to 
conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just longer 
than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion that goes 
on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if actually spoken

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

RAND HARDIN wrote:
> *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._* 
>  
> Hello . . . is anyone out there? 
>  
> It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through.  Is 
> everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I 
> would appreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)
> 



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 19:05:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 12:05:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31947.F453A240
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Thank you Brian.  The response came through.  I'm curious though - has th=
ere been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Brian Cluff
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test

The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to =20
conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just longer =20
than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion that goes =20
on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if actually spoken

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

RAND HARDIN wrote:
> *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._* =20
>  =20
> Hello . . . is anyone out there? =20
>  =20
> It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through.  Is =20
> everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I =20
> would appreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)
> =20


____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31947.F453A240
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Thank you Bria=
n.  The response came through.  I'm curious though - has there =
been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?
 
&nb=
sp;
 
RandMan
 
 
 
 
----- Orig=
inal Message -----
 
From: Brian Cluff
 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
 <=
DIV> 
The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies t=
o 
conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just l=
onger 
than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion th=
at goes 
on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if actual=
ly spoken

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

RAND HARDIN wrote:> *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._* 
>  
> Hello . . . =
is anyone out there? 
>  
> It's been about 24 hours sin=
ce I last had any email come through.  Is 
> everyone taking a=
 break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I 
> would a=
ppreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)
> 

____________________________________________________________
Az-G=
eocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting,=
 subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mail=
man/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http:/=
/www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31947.F453A240--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 19:49:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Tomlinson)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 12:49:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <002601c31988$bbc01440$6601a8c0@qwest.net>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C3194E.0F613C40
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Nope, no one is home.  ;-)

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of RAND
HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:41 AM
To: AZ-Geocaching
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test


May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M.  
 
Hello . . . is anyone out there?  
 
It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through.  Is
everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I would
appreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)




------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C3194E.0F613C40
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable




Message




Nope, no one =
is=20
home.  ;-)



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of =

  RAND HARDIN
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:41 =
AM
To:=20
  AZ-Geocaching
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email=20
  test


  
May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M.  

  
 

  
Hello . . . is anyone out there?  

  
 

  
It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come =
through. =20
  Is everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing =
up=20
  again.  I would appreciate a response on this if =
possible. =20
  (RandMan)



------=_NextPart_000_0027_01C3194E.0F613C40--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 20:08:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 13:08:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3EC150C0.30601@snaptek.com>

Nope... it's been fairly quiet.  I actually thought the list might be 
down myself... except that I'm getting the usual flood of spam that get 
held up in the moderation system... and deleted.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

Thank you Brian.  The response came through.  I'm curious though - has
> there been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?
>  
> RandMan
>  
> 
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* Brian Cluff
>     *Sent:* Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
>     *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com
>     *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
>      
>     The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to
>     conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just
>     longer
>     than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion that goes
>     on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if actually spoken
> 
>     Brian Cluff
>     Team Snaptek
> 
>     RAND HARDIN wrote:
>      > *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._*
>      > 
>      > Hello . . . is anyone out there?
>      > 
>      > It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come
>     through.  Is
>      > everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again.  I
>      > would appreciate a response on this if possible.  (RandMan)
>      >
> 
> 
>     ____________________________________________________________
>     Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>     To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>     http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
>     Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>     http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 21:30:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (General Bracket)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 14:30:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
References:  <3EC150C0.30601@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <001a01c31996$e82a7030$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>

Well, here's something...

I got my first first find on Team A.I.'s It...has you.  It was a toughy.  It
was such a journey that while telling a friend of mine about it I found
myself making comparisons to The Odessey by Homer.  It was something else.
I doubt anyone else will have the same adventure I had because how I did it
was extremely unorthodox and I had a mistake in one of my answers thaty I
refused to beleive was wrong.  Made for truely epic adventure.  Anyone doing
this one though will surely love it, then hate it, then love it again.
It...has you really will have you.

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=67966

I told the story to Brian.  He seemed to have a laugh.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/



Brian Cluff wrote:
> Nope... it's been fairly quiet.  I actually thought the list might be
> down myself... except that I'm getting the usual flood of spam that
> get
> held up in the moderation system... and deleted.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
> Thank you Brian.  The response came through.  I'm curious though - has
>> there been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?
>>
>> RandMan
>>
>>
>>     ----- Original Message -----
>>     *From:* Brian Cluff
>>     *Sent:* Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
>>     *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>     *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
>>
>>     The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to
>>     conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just
>>     longer
>>     than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion
>>     that goes on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if
>> actually spoken
>>
>>     Brian Cluff
>>     Team Snaptek
>>
>>     RAND HARDIN wrote:
>>      > *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._*
>>      >
>>      > Hello . . . is anyone out there?
>>      >
>>      > It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come
>>     through.  Is
>>      > everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up
>>      again.  I > would appreciate a response on this if possible.
>>      (RandMan) >
>>
>>
>>     ____________________________________________________________
>>     Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>     To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>     http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>     Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>     http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 21:33:36 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (General Bracket)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 14:33:36 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
Message-ID: <002501c31997$4ff072a0$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>

Ooof.  My spelling is horrible.  Time to reactivate the spell checker.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/


General Bracket wrote:
> Well, here's something...
> 
> I got my first first find on Team A.I.'s It...has you.  It was a
> toughy.  It was such a journey that while telling a friend of mine
> about it I found myself making comparisons to The Odessey by Homer. 
> It was something else. I doubt anyone else will have the same
> adventure I had because how I did it was extremely unorthodox and I
> had a mistake in one of my answers thaty I refused to beleive was
> wrong.  Made for truely epic adventure.  Anyone doing this one though
> will surely love it, then hate it, then love it again. It...has you
> really will have you. 
> 
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=67966
> 
> I told the story to Brian.  He seemed to have a laugh.
> 
> 
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
> 
> =========================================
> Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
> 
> 
> 
> Brian Cluff wrote:
>> Nope... it's been fairly quiet.  I actually thought the list might be
>> down myself... except that I'm getting the usual flood of spam that
>> get
>> held up in the moderation system... and deleted.
>> 
>> Brian Cluff
>> Team Snaptek
>> 
>> Thank you Brian.  The response came through.  I'm curious though -
>> has 
>>> there been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?
>>> 
>>> RandMan
>>> 
>>> 
>>>     ----- Original Message -----
>>>     *From:* Brian Cluff
>>>     *Sent:* Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
>>>     *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>>     *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
>>> 
>>>     The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to
>>>     conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's
>>>     just longer
>>>     than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion
>>>     that goes on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if
>>> actually spoken
>>> 
>>>     Brian Cluff
>>>     Team Snaptek
>>> 
>>>     RAND HARDIN wrote:
>>>      > *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._*
>>>      >
>>>      > Hello . . . is anyone out there?
>>>      >
>>>      > It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come
>>>     through.  Is
>>>      > everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up
>>>      again.  I > would appreciate a response on this if possible.
>>>      (RandMan) >
>>> 
>>> 
>>>     ____________________________________________________________
>>>     Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>>     To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>>     http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>> 
>>>     Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>>     http://www.azgeocaching.com
>> 
>> 
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>> 
>> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 21:44:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 14:44:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
References:  <3EC150C0.30601@snaptek.com> <001a01c31996$e82a7030$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>
Message-ID: <003301c31998$e21d4bc0$3529b83f@fishkiller>

and just think of how many emails you will now receive from hungry cachers,
I am reminded of the taste of chicken :)

----- Original Message -----
From: "General Bracket" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test


> Well, here's something...
>
> I got my first first find on Team A.I.'s It...has you.  It was a toughy.
It
> was such a journey that while telling a friend of mine about it I found
> myself making comparisons to The Odessey by Homer.  It was something else.
> I doubt anyone else will have the same adventure I had because how I did
it
> was extremely unorthodox and I had a mistake in one of my answers thaty I
> refused to beleive was wrong.  Made for truely epic adventure.  Anyone
doing
> this one though will surely love it, then hate it, then love it again.
> It...has you really will have you.
>
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=67966
>
> I told the story to Brian.  He seemed to have a laugh.
>
>
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
>
> =========================================
> Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
>
>
>
> Brian Cluff wrote:
> > Nope... it's been fairly quiet.  I actually thought the list might be
> > down myself... except that I'm getting the usual flood of spam that
> > get
> > held up in the moderation system... and deleted.
> >
> > Brian Cluff
> > Team Snaptek
> >
> > Thank you Brian.  The response came through.  I'm curious though - has
> >> there been activity on the listserv since yesterday around noon?
> >>
> >> RandMan
> >>
> >>
> >>     ----- Original Message -----
> >>     *From:* Brian Cluff
> >>     *Sent:* Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:58 AM
> >>     *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >>     *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
> >>
> >>     The list is working... that 7 minute thing that applies to
> >>     conversations, also applies to listserv conversation... it's just
> >>     longer
> >>     than 7 minutes.... of course the amount of actual conversion
> >>     that goes on in a list server would probably fit in 7 minutes if
> >> actually spoken
> >>
> >>     Brian Cluff
> >>     Team Snaptek
> >>
> >>     RAND HARDIN wrote:
> >>      > *_May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M._*
> >>      >
> >>      > Hello . . . is anyone out there?
> >>      >
> >>      > It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come
> >>     through.  Is
> >>      > everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up
> >>      again.  I > would appreciate a response on this if possible.
> >>      (RandMan) >
> >>
> >>
> >>     ____________________________________________________________
> >>     Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >>     To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >>     http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >>
> >>     Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >>     http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 22:06:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 15:06:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Riggs Flat
Message-ID: <003e01c3199b$f09f41a0$3529b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C31961.3D9B0EC0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

just heard the word that the gate that slows this cache from being found =
is scheduled to be opened on May 15...

I see that there are  14 caches that can be found on a day of caching =
out East...
------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C31961.3D9B0EC0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









just heard the word that the gate that =
slows this=20
cache from being found is scheduled to be opened on May =
15...


 


I see that there are  14 caches =
that can be=20
found on a day of caching out East...


------=_NextPart_000_003B_01C31961.3D9B0EC0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 13 22:34:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 15:34:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] It...has you.
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31965.1E53B720
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

General,

Congratulations on the first-find on "It...has you."  I've been working o=
n it since Sunday.  I have most of the answers but some of the questions =
appear ambiguous and I'm not really sure how he wants us to go about solv=
ing them.   I emailed Brian yesterday requesting clarification but haven'=
t heard back yet.  I was hoping to grab a third-find this morning . . . m=
aybe tomorrow if I can put it all together.

You're right about "It...has you," having you.  It won't let go!  [;)]

Rand (RandMan)    =20
----- Original Message -----
From: General Bracket
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 2:34 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test

Well, here's something...

I got my first first find on Team A.I.'s It...has you.  It was a toughy. =
 It
was such a journey that while telling a friend of mine about it I found
myself making comparisons to The Odessey by Homer.  It was something else=
.
I doubt anyone else will have the same adventure I had because how I did =
it
was extremely unorthodox and I had a mistake in one of my answers thaty I
refused to beleive was wrong.  Made for truely epic adventure.  Anyone do=
ing
this one though will surely love it, then hate it, then love it again.
It...has you really will have you.

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D67966

I told the story to Brian.  He seemed to have a laugh.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31965.1E53B720
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


General,
=
 
 
 
Congratulations on the first-find on "It...has yo=
u."  I've been working on it since Sunday.  I have most of the =
answers but some of the questions appear ambiguous and I'm not reall=
y sure how he wants us to go about solving them.   I email=
ed Brian yesterday requesting clarification but haven't heard back y=
et.  I was hoping to grab a third-find this morning . . . maybe tomo=
rrow if I can put it all together.
 
 
 You're right about "It...has you," having you.  It won't let g=
o!  [;)] 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)  &nbs=
p; 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Genera=
l Bracket
 
Sent: Tuesday, May=
 13, 2003 2:34 PM
 
To: listse=
rv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject:=
 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
 
 
Well, here's somet=
hing...

I got my first first find on Team A.I.'s It...has you.&nbs=
p; It was a toughy.  It
was such a journey that while telling a f=
riend of mine about it I found
myself making comparisons to The Odesse=
y by Homer.  It was something else.
I doubt anyone else will have=
 the same adventure I had because how I did it
was extremely unorthodo=
x and I had a mistake in one of my answers thaty I
refused to beleive =
was wrong.  Made for truely epic adventure.  Anyone doing
th=
is one though will surely love it, then hate it, then love it again.
I=
t...has you really will have you.

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/c=
ache_details.aspx?ID=3D67966

I told the story to Brian.  He s=
eemed to have a laugh.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D


------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C31965.1E53B720--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 01:00:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 01:00:09 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
Message-ID: 




Sunspots??? Computers all over town have been acting up. I've been disconnected from the internet most of yesterday and today.  Last time both home and Mike's work internet access acted up like this, there was a solar flare. Anybody know of a website that lists solar flares?











>From: "RAND HARDIN" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: "AZ-Geocaching" 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test 

>Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 11:41:08 -0700 

> 

>May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M. 

> 

>Hello . . . is anyone out there? 

> 

>It's been about 24 hours since I last had any email come through. Is everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) messing up again. I would appreciate a response on this if possible. (RandMan) 


Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 04:38:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 21:38:57 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
References: 
Message-ID: <3EC1C861.3030606@uccinc.net>

Hmmm - I own an ISP and have not seen any problems??? would be 
interested in the solor flare if someone know about it.

gale and mike wrote:

> Sunspots??? Computers all over town have been acting up. I've been 
> disconnected from the internet most of yesterday and today.  Last time 
> both home and Mike's work internet access acted up like this, there 
> was a solar flare. Anybody know of a website that lists solar flares?
>
>
>
>
> >From: "RAND HARDIN" >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: 
> "AZ-Geocaching" >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test >Date: Tue, 13 
> May 2003 11:41:08 -0700 > >May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M. > >Hello . . . 
> is anyone out there? > >It's been about 24 hours since I last had any 
> email come through. Is everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN) 
> messing up again. I would appreciate a response on this if possible. 
> (RandMan)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Protect your PC - Click here  for 
> McAfee.com VirusScan Online 
> ____________________________________________________________ 
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your 
> setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 04:52:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 21:52:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test
In-Reply-To: <3EC1C861.3030606@uccinc.net>
Message-ID: <001501c319d4$9f44e740$6501a8c0@TABLET>

More than you may want to know in the PDF file at: 

http://www.sec.noaa.gov/weekly/pdf/prf1445.pdf. See in particular the
flare report on page 5. There was a C-5 on May 9, but otherwise not a
lot of flare activity of late.

If you have any questions, please contact Jim Scotti. And don't tell him
I sent you.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Marc
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 9:39 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Email test

Hmmm - I own an ISP and have not seen any problems??? would be 
interested in the solor flare if someone know about it.

gale and mike wrote:

> Sunspots??? Computers all over town have been acting up. I've been 
> disconnected from the internet most of yesterday and today.  Last time

> both home and Mike's work internet access acted up like this, there 
> was a solar flare. Anybody know of a website that lists solar flares?
>
>
>
>
> >From: "RAND HARDIN" >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: 
> "AZ-Geocaching" >Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Email test >Date: Tue, 13 
> May 2003 11:41:08 -0700 > >May 13, 2003 at 11:40 A.M. > >Hello . . . 
> is anyone out there? > >It's been about 24 hours since I last had any 
> email come through. Is everyone taking a break or is my provider (MSN)

> messing up again. I would appreciate a response on this if possible. 
> (RandMan)
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Protect your PC - Click here  for

> McAfee.com VirusScan Online 
> ____________________________________________________________ 
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your 
> setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 




____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 06:24:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Tue, 13 May 2003 23:24:28 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Commercial Caches
Message-ID: <3EC1E11C.1090904@uccinc.net>

I recently did a cache that had an interesting twist to in it. This 
brought up a question. What is considered to be a commercial cache?

Would  a fund raising cache be considered commercial?
Would a not for profit cache be considered commercial?
Would any solicitation for any thing, voluntary or not be considered 
commercial?
Would leaving items that promote a company be considered commercial?

Marc

Tamo's Clan'Destiny



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 14:33:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 07:33:35 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Commercial Caches
References: <3EC1E11C.1090904@uccinc.net>
Message-ID: <001a01c31a25$ce782bc0$8f11b83f@fishkiller>

humm will wait for he of the yellow pamphlet answer...
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marc" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2003 11:24 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Commercial Caches


> I recently did a cache that had an interesting twist to in it. This 
> brought up a question. What is considered to be a commercial cache?
> 
> Would  a fund raising cache be considered commercial?
> Would a not for profit cache be considered commercial?
> Would any solicitation for any thing, voluntary or not be considered 
> commercial?
> Would leaving items that promote a company be considered commercial?
> 
> Marc
> 
> Tamo's Clan'Destiny
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 15:23:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 08:23:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What's wrong with some true promotional caches?
In-Reply-To: <3EC1E11C.1090904@uccinc.net>
Message-ID: <20030514152350.46810.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1014704660-1052925830=:46079
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Would leaving items that promote a company be considered commercial?

I don't think so.  Whenever I go to events and companies are giving away promotional materials like keychains, bottle openers, pens, etc., I pick up extra items to put in caches.  Sometimes I ask for extra items by explaining that I would like to put them in geocaches, thereby giving these promotional items additional exposure.
 
What would really be wrong with having some promotional caches, anyway?  Some companies can establish promotional caches in exchange for advertising dollars that can be used to support Geocaching.com.  If a company pays millions of dollars to name a ballpark or stadium after itself or one of its products, then why can't the same company do the same (and pay a far lesser sum) for a cache?
 
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-1014704660-1052925830=:46079
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Would leaving items that promote a company be considered commercial?


I don't think so.  Whenever I go to events and companies are giving away promotional materials like keychains, bottle openers, pens, etc., I pick up extra items to put in caches.  Sometimes I ask for extra items by explaining that I would like to put them in geocaches, thereby giving these promotional items additional exposure.


 


What would really be wrong with having some promotional caches, anyway?  Some companies can establish promotional caches in exchange for advertising dollars that can be used to support Geocaching.com.  If a company pays millions of dollars to name a ballpark or stadium after itself or one of its products, then why can't the same company do the same (and pay a far lesser sum) for a cache?


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-1014704660-1052925830=:46079--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 14 17:28:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 10:28:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] What's wrong with some true promotional caches?
In-Reply-To: <20030514152350.46810.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20030514152350.46810.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3EC27CD1.7080604@snaptek.com>

Ken Akerman wrote:
> What would really be wrong with having some promotional caches, anyway?  
> Some companies can establish promotional caches in exchange for 
> advertising dollars that can be used to support Geocaching.com.  If a 
> company pays millions of dollars to name a ballpark or stadium after 
> itself or one of its products, then why can't the same company do the 
> same (and pay a far lesser sum) for a cache?

	I wouldn't have too much of a problem with them if they were only 
allowed if they were directly supporting geocaching.
At the same time I would hate to see geocaching pick up a whole bunch of 
commercial caches.  It would end up like Ralf with his little orphan 
anne secret decoder pin from "A Christmas Story".... it would all seem 
exciting till you opened up the cache and said a quote from the movie "A 
crummy commercial..... son of a bitch"

	I would bet they made the blanket rule so that it keeps people from 
complaining to the geocacing.com admins about their commercial caches 
not being approved when others were... if you don't approve any of them, 
then you don't have to worry about a ton of extra work.
	A few sponsored caches would be a very cool thing.... garmin could make 
an extremely difficult cache and put a high end GPS in it... that would 
probably do more for advertising to their audience than they could 
possibly do for a LOT more money.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 15 23:24:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 16:24:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
Message-ID: <3EC421BE.1060501@snaptek.com>

Is this thing on!!!???

jason



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 15 23:35:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 19:35:34 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] tresspassing
Message-ID: <212EDC55.7D0B981B.0013DAD2@aol.com>

I was hiding a cache this morning on the south bank of the salt between 7th st and 16th street and a city worker drove up and told me I was tresspassing on City property and I had to leave. I had already hid the ammo can, so now I have to sneak back under the cover of darkness and get it back. I already had the first two stages made and in place, what a gyp. They need to mark their territory better. I walked right through a "gate" onto the land, and there are no signs posted anywhere. 
Just jabbering my jaws

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 00:14:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:14:55 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
References: <3EC421BE.1060501@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <003901c31b40$2dbca320$0500a8c0@one>

It working. Just no one around. I think you need another pirate to get
things going again.

Team Sand Dollar

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Poulter" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 7:24 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...


> Is this thing on!!!???
>
> jason
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 00:45:20 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 17:45:20 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
References: <3EC421BE.1060501@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <003301c31b44$6e3fb1e0$da20b83f@fishkiller>

no we are all involved with getting a life :) such a change from Eat Sleep
Cache with the optional work family thing going on.....


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Poulter" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 4:24 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...


> Is this thing on!!!???
>
> jason
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 00:51:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 17:51:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
Message-ID: 

I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid 
question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your 
GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache.. 
then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore this 
kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have no 
way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these caches. 
I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher to 
get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information from 
the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual 
requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special 
equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not everyone 
has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online  
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 00:37:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:37:08 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References: 
Message-ID: <004c01c31b43$488d89a0$0500a8c0@one>

A cheap digital camera can be gotten for about $40 at target. Not the best
resolution but great for geocaching,

Team Sand Dollar

----- Original Message -----
From: "RopingThe Wind" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 8:51 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
> question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
your
> GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
> then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore this
> kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have no
> way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these
caches.
> I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher to
> get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information
from
> the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
> requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
> equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not everyone
> has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
>
> Scott
> Team Ropingthewind
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 01:23:13 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:23:13 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References:  <004c01c31b43$488d89a0$0500a8c0@one>
Message-ID: <005b01c31b49$b9500ea0$da20b83f@fishkiller>

let me do the quick math

$40 is $10 more than a membership on who's home page states all you NEED is
a GPS and a sense of Adventure... anything beyond a GPS and a sense of
adventure would be very optional and special equipment....but then again you
really don't need a GPS as there are finds without one...

gotta love a day stuck in a car with RTW and even if his birthday is
tomorrow he acts like a( insert own word/s)


Do you know the brand name on the camera and resolution?? what would be a
good resolution??

----- Original Message -----
From: "Loran Wilcox" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 5:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> A cheap digital camera can be gotten for about $40 at target. Not the best
> resolution but great for geocaching,
>
> Team Sand Dollar
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "RopingThe Wind" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 8:51 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
>
>
> > I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
> > question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
> your
> > GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
> > then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore
this
> > kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have
no
> > way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these
> caches.
> > I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher
to
> > get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information
> from
> > the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
> > requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
> > equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not
everyone
> > has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
> >
> > Scott
> > Team Ropingthewind
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 01:29:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 21:29:01 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References:  <004c01c31b43$488d89a0$0500a8c0@one> <005b01c31b49$b9500ea0$da20b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <005401c31b4a$87ed1fa0$0500a8c0@one>

I just found one around Christmas time and got it as a present for my
parents.  They has just starting caching and didn't have a digital camera.
For their needs it was good enough plus it wasn't very large just a little
bigger than a deck of cards. So it quite portable unlike my camera.

I think it had a resolution of 640 by 480 pixel but then for posting on
geocaching we usually reduce pictures down to that anyway. Plus it used the
USB port for transfer and came with software.  I think we found it at Target
and I've seen others in the ads.

As for good resolution my camera will produce a good quality 8 by 11 photo
which is more than adequate,

As for me I would gladly take a daystuck in a car with RTW geocaching in
Arizona.  I have to drive over 60 miles away to do any serious caching as I
have pretty much deleted any closer caches. It's kind of like it is for the
cachers in Tucson who have to go to Phoenix.

Team Sand Dollar


----- Original Message -----
From: "Team Evil Fish" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 9:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> let me do the quick math
>
> $40 is $10 more than a membership on who's home page states all you NEED
is
> a GPS and a sense of Adventure... anything beyond a GPS and a sense of
> adventure would be very optional and special equipment....but then again
you
> really don't need a GPS as there are finds without one...
>
> gotta love a day stuck in a car with RTW and even if his birthday is
> tomorrow he acts like a( insert own word/s)
>
>
> Do you know the brand name on the camera and resolution?? what would be a
> good resolution??
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Loran Wilcox" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 5:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
>
>
> > A cheap digital camera can be gotten for about $40 at target. Not the
best
> > resolution but great for geocaching,
> >
> > Team Sand Dollar
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "RopingThe Wind" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 8:51 PM
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
> >
> >
> > > I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
> > > question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you
and
> > your
> > > GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that
cache..
> > > then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore
> this
> > > kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and
have
> no
> > > way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these
> > caches.
> > > I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a
cacher
> to
> > > get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information
> > from
> > > the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
> > > requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
> > > equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not
> everyone
> > > has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
> > >
> > > Scott
> > > Team Ropingthewind
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> > > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
> > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > >
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 03:13:37 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:13:37 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
Message-ID: 


>From: "Team Evil Fish" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
>Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 18:23:13 -0700
>
>let me do the quick math
>
>$40 is $10 more than a membership on who's home page states all you NEED is
>a GPS and a sense of Adventure... anything beyond a GPS and a sense of
>adventure would be very optional and special equipment....but then again 
>you
>really don't need a GPS as there are finds without one...

Actually, just to let yall know where I stand on this before this thread 
gets out of hand! :) Yes. I have seen them cheap digital cameras and yes I 
do think they would work great and just fine for geocaching. It is just the 
point behind my thread. I think there should be an alternate way to get 
credit on a virtual if you don't have a camera. You must remember, there are 
some people out there who don't have a camera AND along the lines of the 
bicycle thing at that Tucson cache, well, a camera is necessary to log a few 
of these virtuals around here (Hogans Hotel virtual cache in Scottsdale, for 
instance). I have a regular ole' 35mm. But, I hardly ever use it. I cant see 
buying a roll of film for one or two pictures. It would end up sitting for a 
year before I ever use it again and I would never get the pics I needed for 
proof developed! :) I do, however, prefer the paper copies of my pictures 
from the 35mm over the digital camera photos on a disk or something. I will 
probably go get a cheap digital camera eventually and go get all those 
camera caches around here. They will never archive since there is nothing 
there for anyone to steal or plunder. In the meantime, there are plenty of 
coordinates take you to the cache type caches that I can go get! :) HA!

>gotta love a day stuck in a car with RTW and even if his birthday is
>tomorrow he acts like a( insert own word/s)

Hey there EvilFISH.... I am not the (insert own word/s here!) that took a 
lil' ole hyundai (or whatever that lil' thing is you drive!) down some bumpy 
and rocky desert wash/jeep trail!  ;)  :) LOL  HA!  :)  LOL
I would never do that! ;)  (evil grin)

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 03:31:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 20:31:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References: 
Message-ID: <3EC45B9E.C0F32830@usa.net>

But you can get pictures from a regular camera developed and emailed to you or
placed on a CD. Then the only special equipment is a computer, and maybe a
tripod so you can take a picture of yourself.

RopingThe Wind wrote:

> I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
> question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your
> GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
> then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore this
> kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have no
> way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these caches.
> I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher to
> get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information from
> the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
> requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
> equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not everyone
> has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
>
> Scott
> Team Ropingthewind
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 04:49:38 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for uploading pictures to Geocaching.com
Message-ID: <20030516044938.75604.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1477865564-1053060578=:74852
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your 
GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache.. 
 
However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture and post it to Geocaching.com.  You can get a very inexpensive camera (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop them using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like Photoworks.com), 
and upload the online picture to your cache log.  This is what I did for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital camera.
 
This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can obtain the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
 
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)


--0-1477865564-1053060578=:74852
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your 
GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache.. 


 


However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture and post it to Geocaching.com.  You can get a very inexpensive camera (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop them using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like Photoworks.com), 


and upload the online picture to your cache log.  This is what I did for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital camera.


 


This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can obtain the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.


 


Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-1477865564-1053060578=:74852--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 07:10:30 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:10:30 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References:  <3EC45B9E.C0F32830@usa.net>
Message-ID: <3EC48EE6.5000009@pcgraffiti.com>

I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I needed to bring my 
own pen to log my visit.
I don't have many pens around. I'm a computer geek. I do all my bills 
online. I use a PDA for my organizer, bank balance, notes, and even for 
my grocery list. Why would I want to spend any money on a pen that I 
would barely use.

Perhaps this cache I was reading up on should be rated a 5 because 
"special" equipment is required. What if the lower rating had caused me 
to skip reading the cache description assuming I had everything needed. 
Then what would I do if found the cache? I would just be stuck there 
with my GPS and my sense of adventure with no way to physically prove I 
was there...

Okay, maybe I'm taking this too far. My point is that it seems we are 
trying to be too dependant on the star rating. "Special equipment" can 
be interpreted in many ways. If we considered every interpretation of 
terrain and difficulty then almost every cache would be a 5 in terrain 
and a 5 in difficulty. The specific requirements should be written in 
the cache description, not in the stars. If you do not have what is 
needed move on to the next cache.

Aus Dem Kasten


Mark Heitowit wrote:

>But you can get pictures from a regular camera developed and emailed to you or
>placed on a CD. Then the only special equipment is a computer, and maybe a
>tripod so you can take a picture of yourself.
>
>RopingThe Wind wrote:
>
>  
>
>>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
>>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your
>>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
>>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore this
>>kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have no
>>way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these caches.
>>I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher to
>>get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information from
>>the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
>>requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
>>equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not everyone
>>has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
>>
>>Scott
>>Team Ropingthewind
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>>Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
>>http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>    
>>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>  
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 07:45:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jake Olson)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:45:44 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RE: Special equiptment (5 rating?)
Message-ID: <002001c31b7f$2823b090$100a0a0a@akela>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C31B44.7B8F49A0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Well, if any of you are in the market for a cheap digital camera....

I was at Office Max tonight and saw a 'no name' (I don't think it had a =
brand name on it) digital camera.  It was a whole $25!!  So.. for much =
less than a tank of gas, you can get a digital camera. It didn't have =
much in the way of features, but it did include the USB cable.  =
Actually, I think $25 is how much I'd have to pay for a replacement USB =
cable for my Sony digital camera.=20

If prices get any cheaper on digital cameras, I may have to put one into =
a cache as a prize or for recording visitors.

Jake - Team A.I.

------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C31B44.7B8F49A0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Well, if any of you are in the market =
for a cheap=20
digital camera....


 


I was at Office Max tonight and saw a =
'no name' (I=20
don't think it had a brand name on it) digital camera.  It =
was a whole=20
$25!!  So.. for much less than a tank of gas, you can get =
a=20
digital camera. It didn't have much in the way of features, =
but it did=20
include the USB cable.  Actually, I think $25 is how=20
much I'd have to pay for a replacement USB cable for =
my Sony=20
digital camera. 


 


If prices get any cheaper on digital =
cameras, I may=20
have to put one into a cache as a prize or for recording =
visitors.


 


Jake - Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C31B44.7B8F49A0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 09:47:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 02:47:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
In-Reply-To: <3EC48EE6.5000009@pcgraffiti.com>
Message-ID: <20030516094759.18293.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com>

My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
cache then it should be a five. My definition of
special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
able to operate. 

I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
cache. They may be respectively required to log and
provide verification but not to FIND. Special
equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
everything else is just the owner's or the cache
finder's preference.

Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
needed during your cache trip?


Eric
Team Dragon


--- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
> needed to bring my 
> own pen to log my visit.


> >RopingThe Wind wrote:
> >
> >>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
> have a very valid
> >>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
> a picture of you and your
> >>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
> credit for that cache..
> >>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
> equiptment'? 

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 11:21:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 04:21:11 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References:  <3EC45B9E.C0F32830@usa.net> <3EC48EE6.5000009@pcgraffiti.com>
Message-ID: <005201c31b9d$42c184e0$2d00b83f@fishkiller>

I would just be stuck there with my GPS and my sense of adventure with no
way to physically prove I
was there...

read this post that Team Evil Fish made after finding a cache with only our
GPS

We were the people before....

The idea for today was for this to be the fourth cache of the trip but I
erased the final coordinates for LoHi and well we walked the whole thing
again we did this one in between the Low and High, to complicate matters
further when we arrived at this cache back on our way to the High part,
discoverd we had NO writting impliments, there was a debate, as no sign no
find, then another on who would leave the blood, Rock Paper Scissors. I used
a handy cactus needle to spell the T, my finger tip for the E and well was
loosing consciousness from lack of blood so couldn't finish the F but you
could say it looks like a picture of a fish...

Left a Moola Money Lottery ticket took nothing
and if you still doubt that Team Evil Fish was there TEST the DNA :) O- CMV
++

 March 28 by Team Aspen
Neat cache! Took Russian like coin with a five on it. Left ten cent
Malaysain coin. Looks like the people before us left blood on the log.

>The specific requirements should be written in
> the cache description, not in the stars. If you do not have what is
> needed move on to the next cache

"Special equipment" can
> be interpreted in many ways. If we considered every interpretation of
> terrain and difficulty then almost every cache would be a 5 in terrain
> and a 5 in difficulty. The specific requirements should be written in
> the cache description, not in the stars.

that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches involving
say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while another will
"see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their "view" what is
the correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a different
answer it shouldn't be included... but then again some people "try" to be
(insert word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the end IMHO
degrades the cache experience...

then again ESP would be special equipment wouldn't it?


Specialized equipment includes: Boats, 4WD vehicles, rock climbing gear,
SCUBA, etc.

I like this question from the rate your cache page
http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs/

Finding this cache requires very specialized knowledge, skills, or
equipment. This is a serious mental or physical challenge

oh well time to get my hiking shoes on and find more caches with my GPS and
sense of Humor...




----- Original Message -----
From: "Aus Dem Kasten" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I needed to bring my
> own pen to log my visit.
> I don't have many pens around. I'm a computer geek. I do all my bills
> online. I use a PDA for my organizer, bank balance, notes, and even for
> my grocery list. Why would I want to spend any money on a pen that I
> would barely use.
>
> Perhaps this cache I was reading up on should be rated a 5 because
> "special" equipment is required. What if the lower rating had caused me
> to skip reading the cache description assuming I had everything needed.
> Then what would I do if found the cache? I would just be stuck there
> with my GPS and my sense of adventure with no way to physically prove I
> was there...
>
> Okay, maybe I'm taking this too far. My point is that it seems we are
> trying to be too dependant on the star rating. If you do not have what is
> needed move on to the next cache.
>
> Aus Dem Kasten
>
>
> Mark Heitowit wrote:
>
> >But you can get pictures from a regular camera developed and emailed to
you or
> >placed on a CD. Then the only special equipment is a computer, and maybe
a
> >tripod so you can take a picture of yourself.
> >
> >RopingThe Wind wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
> >>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
your
> >>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
> >>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore
this
> >>kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have
no
> >>way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these
caches.
> >>I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher
to
> >>get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information
from
> >>the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
> >>requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
> >>equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not
everyone
> >>has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
> >>
> >>Scott
> >>Team Ropingthewind
> >>
> >>_________________________________________________________________
> >>Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> >>http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
> >>
> >>____________________________________________________________
> >>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >>
> >>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >>http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >>
> >>
> >
> >____________________________________________________________
> >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> >http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 14:16:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 07:16:05 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
References: <3EC421BE.1060501@snaptek.com> <003301c31b44$6e3fb1e0$da20b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <002501c31bb5$b0581920$91f50244@cx301817d>

I've been busy deleting peoples find logs ;)

Delete my log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete
my log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..


Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of Elderberries!
Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time.

WhereRWee?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Team Evil Fish" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...


> no we are all involved with getting a life :) such a change from Eat Sleep
> Cache with the optional work family thing going on.....
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jason Poulter" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 4:24 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
>
>
> > Is this thing on!!!???
> >
> > jason
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 14:21:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 07:21:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References: <20030516094759.18293.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003b01c31bb6$748d9720$91f50244@cx301817d>

Isn't a GPS special equipment? They should all be 5 stars!  ;) 

WhereRwee?


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Eric Quinn" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 2:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
> cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
> cache then it should be a five. My definition of
> special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
> reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
> able to operate. 
> 
> I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
> latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
> and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
> neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
> cache. They may be respectively required to log and
> provide verification but not to FIND. Special
> equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
> everything else is just the owner's or the cache
> finder's preference.
> 
> Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> needed during your cache trip?
> 
> 
> Eric
> Team Dragon
> 
> 
> --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> > I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
> > needed to bring my 
> > own pen to log my visit.
> 
> 
> > >RopingThe Wind wrote:
> > >
> > >>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
> > have a very valid
> > >>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
> > a picture of you and your
> > >>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
> > credit for that cache..
> > >>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
> > equiptment'? 
> 
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 14:51:16 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 07:51:16 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
References: <3EC421BE.1060501@snaptek.com> <003301c31b44$6e3fb1e0$da20b83f@fishkiller> <002501c31bb5$b0581920$91f50244@cx301817d>
Message-ID: <002401c31bba$a0599bc0$9e21b83f@fishkiller>

before you can taunt  me a second time you must visit the ministry of silly
walks and have a spam sandwich.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 7:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...


> I've been busy deleting peoples find logs ;)
>
> Delete my log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my
log..Delete
> my log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..Delete my
> log...No No I did not really mean it..Now undelete my log..
>
>
> Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of Elderberries!
> Now go away or I shall taunt you a second time.
>
> WhereRWee?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Team Evil Fish" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 5:45 PM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
>
>
> > no we are all involved with getting a life :) such a change from Eat
Sleep
> > Cache with the optional work family thing going on.....
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jason Poulter" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2003 4:24 PM
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello... Hello... Hell.. Hel.. He.. H... ...
> >
> >
> > > Is this thing on!!!???
> > >
> > > jason
> > >
> > >
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > >
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 15:08:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 08:08:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References: <20030516094759.18293.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com> <003b01c31bb6$748d9720$91f50244@cx301817d>
Message-ID: <003101c31bbd$01f7ece0$9e21b83f@fishkiller>

Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> needed during your cache trip?

what cache trip?

until a logbook or log sheet is signed I don't count it as a find

after that what else matters? the flowers the killer grackles snakes bees
tossing a golfball down a street and watching it roll past cars getting
yelled at by nosy nighttime neighbors blooming cactus and knowing my
Magellan even without it's mappin details is still better than your Garmin
with it...


nah

I still like the numbers that add up after each experience

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 7:21 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


> Isn't a GPS special equipment? They should all be 5 stars!  ;) 
>
> WhereRwee?
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Quinn" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 2:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
>
>
> > My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
> > cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
> > cache then it should be a five. My definition of
> > special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
> > reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
> > able to operate.
> >
> > I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
> > latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
> > and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
> > neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
> > cache. They may be respectively required to log and
> > provide verification but not to FIND. Special
> > equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
> > everything else is just the owner's or the cache
> > finder's preference.
> >
> > Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> > effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> > finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> > you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> > needed during your cache trip?
> >
> >
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
> >
> >
> > --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> > > I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
> > > needed to bring my
> > > own pen to log my visit.
> >
> >
> > > >RopingThe Wind wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
> > > have a very valid
> > > >>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
> > > a picture of you and your
> > > >>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
> > > credit for that cache..
> > > >>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
> > > equiptment'?
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> > http://search.yahoo.com
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> >
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 15:15:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 08:15:26 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for uploading pictures to Geocaching.com
Message-ID: <20030516081528.356.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with me) I can
take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto my
computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special equipment"
issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the waters! ha ha
ha
I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way to get
pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you will find
a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:

If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your GPS
(or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache.. 
 
However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture and
post it to Geocaching.com.  You can get a very inexpensive camera
(like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop them
using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like
Photoworks.com), 
and upload the online picture to your cache log.  This is what I did
for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital
camera.
 
This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to
wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can obtain
the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive
way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
 
Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 15:27:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 08:27:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
In-Reply-To: <3EC48EE6.5000009@pcgraffiti.com>
Message-ID: 

LOL!

I wish the caches that were outside my walking distance told me I needed a
car to get there....

Geeezz...did some people loose their common sense?

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Aus
Dem Kasten
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:11 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)


I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I needed to bring my
own pen to log my visit.
I don't have many pens around. I'm a computer geek. I do all my bills
online. I use a PDA for my organizer, bank balance, notes, and even for
my grocery list. Why would I want to spend any money on a pen that I
would barely use.

Perhaps this cache I was reading up on should be rated a 5 because
"special" equipment is required. What if the lower rating had caused me
to skip reading the cache description assuming I had everything needed.
Then what would I do if found the cache? I would just be stuck there
with my GPS and my sense of adventure with no way to physically prove I
was there...

Okay, maybe I'm taking this too far. My point is that it seems we are
trying to be too dependant on the star rating. "Special equipment" can
be interpreted in many ways. If we considered every interpretation of
terrain and difficulty then almost every cache would be a 5 in terrain
and a 5 in difficulty. The specific requirements should be written in
the cache description, not in the stars. If you do not have what is
needed move on to the next cache.

Aus Dem Kasten


Mark Heitowit wrote:

>But you can get pictures from a regular camera developed and emailed to you
or
>placed on a CD. Then the only special equipment is a computer, and maybe a
>tripod so you can take a picture of yourself.
>
>RopingThe Wind wrote:
>
>
>
>>I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I have a very valid
>>question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
your
>>GPS (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
>>then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special equiptment'? Therefore this
>>kind of cache should be a 5 rated. I dont own a digital camera and have no
>>way of taking pictures at these caches and therefore cannot do these
caches.
>>I am not sure why some cache owners dont offer another way for a cacher to
>>get credit by answering a question or two or reciting some information
from
>>the virtual cache site.. but, that is another thing. So, if a virtual
>>requires a picture taken.. the rating should be a 5 because special
>>equiptment is required. Just like not everyone has a bicycle, not everyone
>>has a camera either. Just some thoughts I had today.   ;)
>>
>>Scott
>>Team Ropingthewind
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>>Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
>>http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
>



____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 16:00:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 09:00:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
Message-ID: <005f01c31bc4$34f46e00$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

[quote]
that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches =
involving
say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while another will
"see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their "view" what =
is
the correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a =
different
answer it shouldn't be included... but then again some people "try" to =
be
(insert word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the end IMHO
degrades the cache experience...

then again ESP would be special equipment wouldn't it?
[/quote]

My guess is that nobody has provided you with their work yet, and you =
haven't taken the time to sit down and watch it...have you?  :)

Bottom line is this.  There are different types of caches for everyone.  =
Some like locationless, some like virtual.  Some get a thrill out of =
walking through a park looking for words/phrases/numbers to complete a =
'puzzle' in order to find the final location.  Some use cryptography to =
'hide' their cache clue in the cache page, requiring you to figure out =
which method of encryption is to be used to decipher the clue.  Also, =
some have used 'fuzzy' math involving aircraft that one must figure out =
in order to determine the cache coordinates. =20

Stating that if there is any room for a possibility of a different =
answer and not including it for that reason confuses the hell out of me. =
 I look at it this way.  You're sitting in a classroom working on some =
algebra/trig/calc....whatever.  You verify your answers and discover =
that some of them are wrong..or, 'different'.  Does that mean the ones =
you answered 'differently' shouldn't have been included in the mathbook =
because of the possibility that you could have solved the equation with =
a 'different' answer?  What about anyone else in class on any of the =
other equations in the book?

If I am completely off the mark in assuming this statement had to do =
with a certain new cache of mine, then by all means I apologize.  =
However, I know that not everyone is going to try for, or enjoy working =
on this or any of my other caches.  I've come to learn that I can't =
please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and accomplish =
such a monumental feat.  When this cache was created, it took quite a =
bit of time on my part.  In fact, the first find came within 96 hours of =
it being posted, by an individual with very few finds!  One cacher is =
going to make a special trip to Arizona for this cache, and also to =
attend an event cache here at some point in the near future.  Another is =
going to make a trip from Tucson for it.  Apparently, I've found a niche =
with this cache, which leads me to believe I've put it together at least =
somewhat well.

Brian
Team A.I.
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[quote]


that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches=20
involving
say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while =
another=20
will
"see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their =
"view" what=20
is
the correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a=20
different
answer it shouldn't be included... but then again some =
people "try"=20
to be
(insert word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the =
end=20
IMHO
degrades the cache experience...

then again ESP would be =
special=20
equipment wouldn't it?


[/quote]


 


My guess is that nobody has provided =
you with their=20
work yet, and you haven't taken the time to sit down and watch it...have =

you?  :)


 


Bottom line is this.  There are =
different=20
types of caches for everyone.  Some like locationless, some like=20
virtual.  Some get a thrill out of walking through a park looking =
for=20
words/phrases/numbers to complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the final=20
location.  Some use cryptography to 'hide' their cache clue in the =
cache=20
page, requiring you to figure out which method of encryption is to be =
used to=20
decipher the clue.  Also, some have used 'fuzzy' math involving=20
aircraft that one must figure out in order to determine the cache=20
coordinates.  


 


Stating that if there is any room for a =
possibility=20
of a different answer and not including it for that reason confuses the =
hell out=20
of me.  I look at it this way.  You're sitting in a classroom =
working=20
on some algebra/trig/calc....whatever.  You verify your answers and =

discover that some of them are wrong..or, 'different'.  Does that =
mean the=20
ones you answered 'differently' shouldn't have been included in the =
mathbook=20
because of the possibility that you could have solved the equation =
with a=20
'different' answer?  What about anyone else in class on any of =
the=20
other equations in the book?


 


If I am completely off the mark in =
assuming this=20
statement had to do with a certain new cache of mine, then by all means =
I=20
apologize.  However, I know that not everyone is going to try for, =
or enjoy=20
working on this or any of my other caches.  I've come to learn that =
I can't=20
please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and accomplish =
such a=20
monumental feat.  When this cache was created, it took quite a bit =
of time=20
on my part.  In fact, the first find came within 96 hours of it =
being=20
posted, by an individual with very few finds!  One cacher is going =
to make=20
a special trip to Arizona for this cache, and also to attend an event =
cache here=20
at some point in the near future.  Another is going to make a trip =
from=20
Tucson for it.  Apparently, I've found a niche with this cache, =
which leads=20
me to believe I've put it together at least somewhat well.


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 16:07:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 09:07:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for uploading pictures to Geocaching.com
References: <20030516081528.356.h018.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <000d01c31bc5$4b0916e0$c831b83f@fishkiller>

 "Where there is a WILL you will find
> a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> Trisha "Lightning"
 that is like place a cache and they will find it I am reminded of Sand
Dollars Words,,,

ok maybe I need to find it again what were the 3 steps on finding a cache???

maybe we should rename this thread excuses for not caching or finding a
cache...

No MTN bike
no Camera
no pencil
no GPS
no shoes
no shirt
had to work
batteries died
my topo map was blurry
there were to many rocks
Bees
snakes
killer Grackle attacking from above
Homeless bums sittin on it
there was a fence
there was a no trespassing sign
power lines
stubbed toe
no SCUBA gear
no boat
police helicopter had us in the spot light
the container was taken
entered coordinates wrong
was sleepy
was hungry
sun was in my eyes
lunar eclipse
got lost



----- Original Message -----
From: "Trisha" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for uploading
pictures to Geocaching.com


> When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with me) I can
> take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
> alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto my
> computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special equipment"
> issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the waters! ha ha
> ha
> I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way to get
> pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you will find
> a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> Trisha "Lightning"
> Prescott
>
>
> On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:
>
> If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your GPS
> (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that cache..
>
> However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture and
> post it to Geocaching.com. You can get a very inexpensive camera
> (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop them
> using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like
> Photoworks.com),
> and upload the online picture to your cache log. This is what I did
> for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital
> camera.
>
> This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to
> wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can obtain
> the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive
> way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
>
> Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 16:23:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:23:43 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] interesting GPS based technology
Message-ID: <20030516162343.BOOQ11667.fed1mtao04.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>

Check out this announcement of a SUBDERMAL GPS PERSONAL LOCATION DEVICE

http://adsx.com/news/2003/051303.html

"You are the cache container" ??

Tim
Team AZFastFeet



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 16:27:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 09:27:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
References: <005f01c31bc4$34f46e00$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>
Message-ID: <002e01c31bc8$1758a380$c831b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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I have seen the movie and plan on seeing it again and again and again

I suppose that is why with over 2200 cachers with atleast 1 find in AZ =
have placed 1500 AZ caches that have been found at most 115 times =
excluding locationless....

going to my room now


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Brian Casteel=20
  To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 9:00 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special =
Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah


  [quote]
  that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches =
involving
  say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while another =
will
  "see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their "view" =
what is
  the correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a =
different
  answer it shouldn't be included... but then again some people "try" to =
be
  (insert word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the end =
IMHO
  degrades the cache experience...

  then again ESP would be special equipment wouldn't it?
  [/quote]

  My guess is that nobody has provided you with their work yet, and you =
haven't taken the time to sit down and watch it...have you?  :)

  Bottom line is this.  There are different types of caches for =
everyone.  Some like locationless, some like virtual.  Some get a thrill =
out of walking through a park looking for words/phrases/numbers to =
complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the final location.  Some use =
cryptography to 'hide' their cache clue in the cache page, requiring you =
to figure out which method of encryption is to be used to decipher the =
clue.  Also, some have used 'fuzzy' math involving aircraft that one =
must figure out in order to determine the cache coordinates. =20

  Stating that if there is any room for a possibility of a different =
answer and not including it for that reason confuses the hell out of me. =
 I look at it this way.  You're sitting in a classroom working on some =
algebra/trig/calc....whatever.  You verify your answers and discover =
that some of them are wrong..or, 'different'.  Does that mean the ones =
you answered 'differently' shouldn't have been included in the mathbook =
because of the possibility that you could have solved the equation with =
a 'different' answer?  What about anyone else in class on any of the =
other equations in the book?

  If I am completely off the mark in assuming this statement had to do =
with a certain new cache of mine, then by all means I apologize.  =
However, I know that not everyone is going to try for, or enjoy working =
on this or any of my other caches.  I've come to learn that I can't =
please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and accomplish =
such a monumental feat.  When this cache was created, it took quite a =
bit of time on my part.  In fact, the first find came within 96 hours of =
it being posted, by an individual with very few finds!  One cacher is =
going to make a special trip to Arizona for this cache, and also to =
attend an event cache here at some point in the near future.  Another is =
going to make a trip from Tucson for it.  Apparently, I've found a niche =
with this cache, which leads me to believe I've put it together at least =
somewhat well.

  Brian
  Team A.I.
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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I have seen the movie and plan on =
seeing it=20
again and again and again


 


I suppose that is why with over 2200 =
cachers with=20
atleast 1 find in AZ have placed 1500 AZ caches that have been found at =
most 115=20
times excluding locationless....


 


going to my room now


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Brian =
Casteel=20
  
  
To: az-geocaching@lis=
tserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  

  
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 9:00 =
AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: =
Special=20
  Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah

  


  
[quote]

  
that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches =

  involving
say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing =
while=20
  another will
"see" another, then when the owner asks a question on =
their=20
  "view" what is
the correct answer? if there is any room for a =
possibility=20
  of a different
answer it shouldn't be included... but then again =
some=20
  people "try" to be
(insert word) and use it as a trick of =
somesorts, which=20
  in the end IMHO
degrades the cache experience...

then again =
ESP=20
  would be special equipment wouldn't it?

  
[/quote]

  
 

  
My guess is that nobody has provided =
you with=20
  their work yet, and you haven't taken the time to sit down and watch =
it...have=20
  you?  :)

  
 

  
Bottom line is this.  There are =
different=20
  types of caches for everyone.  Some like locationless, some like=20
  virtual.  Some get a thrill out of walking through a park looking =
for=20
  words/phrases/numbers to complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the =
final=20
  location.  Some use cryptography to 'hide' their cache clue in =
the cache=20
  page, requiring you to figure out which method of encryption is to be =
used to=20
  decipher the clue.  Also, some have used 'fuzzy' math involving=20
  aircraft that one must figure out in order to determine the cache =

  coordinates.  

  
 

  
Stating that if there is any room for =
a=20
  possibility of a different answer and not including it for that reason =

  confuses the hell out of me.  I look at it this way.  You're =
sitting=20
  in a classroom working on some algebra/trig/calc....whatever.  =
You verify=20
  your answers and discover that some of them are wrong..or, =
'different'. =20
  Does that mean the ones you answered 'differently' shouldn't have been =

  included in the mathbook because of the possibility that you could=20
  have solved the equation with a 'different' answer?  What =
about=20
  anyone else in class on any of the other equations in the=20
  book?

  
 

  
If I am completely off the mark in =
assuming this=20
  statement had to do with a certain new cache of mine, then by all =
means I=20
  apologize.  However, I know that not everyone is going to try =
for, or=20
  enjoy working on this or any of my other caches.  I've come to =
learn that=20
  I can't please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and =
accomplish=20
  such a monumental feat.  When this cache was created, it took =
quite a bit=20
  of time on my part.  In fact, the first find came within 96 hours =
of it=20
  being posted, by an individual with very few finds!  One cacher =
is going=20
  to make a special trip to Arizona for this cache, and also to attend =
an event=20
  cache here at some point in the near future.  Another is going to =
make a=20
  trip from Tucson for it.  Apparently, I've found a niche with =
this cache,=20
  which leads me to believe I've put it together at least somewhat=20
  well.

  
 

  
Brian

  
Team =
A.I.


------=_NextPart_000_002B_01C31B8D.6A28BFE0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 17:50:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (General Bracket)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 10:50:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)
References: <20030516094759.18293.qmail@web40601.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <002901c31bd3$ab6e7c60$6401a8c0@terry9fe3hpa3o>

Hair-splitting is quickly becoming an art form in here.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=========================================
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/


Eric Quinn wrote:
> My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
> cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
> cache then it should be a five. My definition of
> special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
> reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
> able to operate.
> 
> I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
> latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
> and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
> neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
> cache. They may be respectively required to log and
> provide verification but not to FIND. Special
> equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
> everything else is just the owner's or the cache
> finder's preference.
> 
> Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> needed during your cache trip?
> 
> 
> Eric
> Team Dragon
> 
> 
> --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
>> I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
>> needed to bring my
>> own pen to log my visit.
> 
> 
>>> RopingThe Wind wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
>> have a very valid
>>>> question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
>> a picture of you and your
>>>> GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
>> credit for that cache..
>>>> then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
>> equiptment'?
> 
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 19:32:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:32:01 -0700
Subject: [Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)]
Message-ID: <767HePTGB2864S18.1053113521@uwdvg018.cms.usa.net>

Tried that with a rabbit once. What a mess.

"General Bracket"  wrote:
> Hair-splitting is quickly becoming an art form in here.
> 
> 
> -T.
> [General Bracket]
> 
> =========================================
> Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
> 
> 
> Eric Quinn wrote:
> > My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
> > cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
> > cache then it should be a five. My definition of
> > special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
> > reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
> > able to operate.
> > 
> > I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
> > latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
> > and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
> > neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
> > cache. They may be respectively required to log and
> > provide verification but not to FIND. Special
> > equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
> > everything else is just the owner's or the cache
> > finder's preference.
> > 
> > Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> > effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> > finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> > you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> > needed during your cache trip?
> > 
> > 
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
> > 
> > 
> > --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> >> I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
> >> needed to bring my
> >> own pen to log my visit.
> > 
> > 
> >>> RopingThe Wind wrote:
> >>> 
> >>>> I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
> >> have a very valid
> >>>> question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
> >> a picture of you and your
> >>>> GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
> >> credit for that cache..
> >>>> then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
> >> equiptment'?
> > 
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> > http://search.yahoo.com
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > 
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 20:54:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 13:54:27 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]  Caching excuses; and serious life issues
Message-ID: <20030516135429.20681.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Cute, Evil Fish. Your list looks pretty comprehensive. :-)

But hey, in quoting me, were you agreeing with me, ("If you want to
find the cache, just DO IT and quit whining..."), making fun of me, or
disagreeing with me? I'm just curious.....

Everybody, please pardon my lack of brains this week, I am going thru
the extreme stress of  "Ex-husband causing me HE// and suing me for
custody of my daughter (15) and lying and being a complete A$$ and
making me spend $$$ for an attorney I can't afford" week.....or,
month....

Looks like my oldest daughter, the straight A student and State track
athlete (she just qualified last night for the 4x100 relay finals (an
all-freshman girls team to boot!) in the 4A high school State Track
Championships) will be moving to Texas with her vengeful and lying
"Disneyland Dad". Of course, he is claiming her grades are suffering
and her health is deteriorating....geez, State Finals and her health
is failing?? 4.0 GPA?? Give me a break. But he has to LIE to try and
make a case for her to move....I'm agreeing only because it is what
she says she wants to do....HE's doing it to try and avoid paying
support for her and to mess with me. (guess he'll find out for himself
that she is WAY more expensive than any support he was sending! ha!!!)

Sorry if this is off topic and very personal, but it really has been
awful for me recently. I did go do two (easy) caches south of Prescott
today as a stress relief (got a first find on a new one of Lincoln's,
Yea!) after a visit to my attorney's office....

Anybody want to take compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and
contribute money to my defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't
afford?" 

Oh wait, I forgot, this is probably the wrong bunch to ask, there are
so many who can't afford $30 for.....never mind....

I'll shut up now. Sorry for rambling but I am so very upset, it just
kinda spills out. Please be kind.

thanks
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

PS BEES are a legit excuse for me, I am highly allergic, and those
great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha


On Fri, 16 May 2003 09:07:46 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:

> 
>  "Where there is a WILL you will find
> > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > Trisha "Lightning"
>  that is like place a cache and they will find it I am reminded of
Sand
> Dollars Words,,,
> 
> ok maybe I need to find it again what were the 3 steps on finding a
> cache???
> 
> maybe we should rename this thread excuses for not caching or
finding a
> cache...
> 
> No MTN bike
> no Camera
> no pencil
> no GPS
> no shoes
> no shirt
> had to work
> batteries died
> my topo map was blurry
> there were to many rocks
> Bees
> snakes
> killer Grackle attacking from above
> Homeless bums sittin on it
> there was a fence
> there was a no trespassing sign
> power lines
> stubbed toe
> no SCUBA gear
> no boat
> police helicopter had us in the spot light
> the container was taken
> entered coordinates wrong
> was sleepy
> was hungry
> sun was in my eyes
> lunar eclipse
> got lost
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Trisha" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for
uploading
> pictures to Geocaching.com
> 
> 
> > When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with me) I
> can
> > take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
> > alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto my
> > computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special equipment"
> > issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the waters! ha
> ha
> > ha
> > I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way to
> get
> > pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you will
find
> > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > Trisha "Lightning"
> > Prescott
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:
> >
> > If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your
GPS
> > (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that
cache..
> >
> > However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture
and
> > post it to Geocaching.com. You can get a very inexpensive camera
> > (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop
them
> > using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like
> > Photoworks.com),
> > and upload the online picture to your cache log. This is what I did
> > for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital
> > camera.
> >
> > This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to
> > wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can
> obtain
> > the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive
> > way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
> >
> > Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 21:03:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:03:27 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Prescott NF Fire Restrictions
Message-ID: <20030516140327.22944.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hi all,
The latest I have heard is that Prescott NF (and a couple others) will
institute CAMPFIRE and SMOKING restrictions starting Tuesday, May 20.
In the Prescott area, this will primarily be in the urban/interface
area south of town and the Bradshaws.
It is that time of year to check the website or call the Ranger's
office before planning any trips.
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 21:20:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:20:43 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hey Larry! Help your Dad!!
Message-ID: <20030516142044.24844.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Sounds like Larry's Dad George could have used a little help on his
recent trip to "Two of Seven" near Prescott. I've done this  one, it
is a pretty hard climb.

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=14191

So, Larry, maybe you need to teach him to use the backtrack feature on
the GPS (or get him a GPS that HAS a backtrack feature??) 

George, I am very glad that you made it out OK, and rest assured that
we (Jeep Posse) would have quickly found you if you had remained lost!
(assuming somebody knew where you went....and would call the Sheriff
when you didn't come back...)
:-)

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

www.ycjp.org

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 21:59:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:59:50 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] interesting GPS based technology
Message-ID: <20030516145950.2572.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Yup, interesting, The technology of Revelation 13:16-18 gets more and
more refined and specific (and ready for widespread application).....
Trisha 'Lightning'
Prescott

On Fri, 16 May 2003 12:23:43 -0400, Tim Giron wrote:

> 
> Check out this announcement of a SUBDERMAL GPS PERSONAL LOCATION
DEVICE
> 
> http://adsx.com/news/2003/051303.html
> 
> "You are the cache container" ??
> 
> Tim
> Team AZFastFeet
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 22:16:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:16:35 -0700
Subject: [Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)]
References: <767HePTGB2864S18.1053113521@uwdvg018.cms.usa.net>
Message-ID: <001a01c31bf8$d0e035e0$9821b83f@fishkiller>

did you try it length wise?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark Heitowit" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Re: [Az-Geocaching] Special equiptment (5 rating?)]


> Tried that with a rabbit once. What a mess.
> 
> "General Bracket"  wrote:
> > Hair-splitting is quickly becoming an art form in here.
> > 
> > 
> > -T.
> > [General Bracket]
> > 
> > =========================================
> > Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
> > http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
> > 
> > 
> > Eric Quinn wrote:
> > > My first opinion is that it doesn't matter what the
> > > cost is, if special equipment is required to find the
> > > cache then it should be a five. My definition of
> > > special equipment is equipment that not everyone may
> > > reasonably be expected to own, have access to or be
> > > able to operate.
> > > 
> > > I think that ya'll are missing the point with this
> > > latest thread. Either that or it's incredibly humorous
> > > and my humor skill hasn't kicked in yet. Anyway,
> > > neither a pen or a camera are required to find a
> > > cache. They may be respectively required to log and
> > > provide verification but not to FIND. Special
> > > equipment, IMO, is something needed to find the cache,
> > > everything else is just the owner's or the cache
> > > finder's preference.
> > > 
> > > Pretend numbers don't matter. I know it'll be an
> > > effort for some here  but try. You don't log your
> > > finds in the log book, you don't log them online and
> > > you don't trade items. Now, what special items are
> > > needed during your cache trip?
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Eric
> > > Team Dragon
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- Aus Dem Kasten  wrote:
> > >> I was reading a cache desrciption today that said I
> > >> needed to bring my
> > >> own pen to log my visit.
> > > 
> > > 
> > >>> RopingThe Wind wrote:
> > >>> 
> > >>>> I know this thread just kinda went to rest, but, I
> > >> have a very valid
> > >>>> question:  If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take
> > >> a picture of you and your
> > >>>> GPS (or something like that) in order to receive
> > >> credit for that cache..
> > >>>> then, wouldnt a camera be considered 'special
> > >> equiptment'?
> > > 
> > > __________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> > > http://search.yahoo.com
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > > 
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > 
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 22:18:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:18:22 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]  Caching excuses; and serious life issues
References: <20030516135429.20681.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <002401c31bf9$1102aae0$9821b83f@fishkiller>

YES

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Trisha" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 1:54 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues


> Cute, Evil Fish. Your list looks pretty comprehensive. :-)
> 
> But hey, in quoting me, were you agreeing with me, ("If you want to
> find the cache, just DO IT and quit whining..."), making fun of me, or
> disagreeing with me? I'm just curious.....
> 
> Everybody, please pardon my lack of brains this week, I am going thru
> the extreme stress of  "Ex-husband causing me HE// and suing me for
> custody of my daughter (15) and lying and being a complete A$$ and
> making me spend $$$ for an attorney I can't afford" week.....or,
> month....
> 
> Looks like my oldest daughter, the straight A student and State track
> athlete (she just qualified last night for the 4x100 relay finals (an
> all-freshman girls team to boot!) in the 4A high school State Track
> Championships) will be moving to Texas with her vengeful and lying
> "Disneyland Dad". Of course, he is claiming her grades are suffering
> and her health is deteriorating....geez, State Finals and her health
> is failing?? 4.0 GPA?? Give me a break. But he has to LIE to try and
> make a case for her to move....I'm agreeing only because it is what
> she says she wants to do....HE's doing it to try and avoid paying
> support for her and to mess with me. (guess he'll find out for himself
> that she is WAY more expensive than any support he was sending! ha!!!)
> 
> Sorry if this is off topic and very personal, but it really has been
> awful for me recently. I did go do two (easy) caches south of Prescott
> today as a stress relief (got a first find on a new one of Lincoln's,
> Yea!) after a visit to my attorney's office....
> 
> Anybody want to take compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and
> contribute money to my defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't
> afford?" 
> 
> Oh wait, I forgot, this is probably the wrong bunch to ask, there are
> so many who can't afford $30 for.....never mind....
> 
> I'll shut up now. Sorry for rambling but I am so very upset, it just
> kinda spills out. Please be kind.
> 
> thanks
> Trisha "Lightning"
> Prescott
> 
> PS BEES are a legit excuse for me, I am highly allergic, and those
> great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha
> 
> 
> On Fri, 16 May 2003 09:07:46 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:
> 
> > 
> >  "Where there is a WILL you will find
> > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > Trisha "Lightning"
> >  that is like place a cache and they will find it I am reminded of
> Sand
> > Dollars Words,,,
> > 
> > ok maybe I need to find it again what were the 3 steps on finding a
> > cache???
> > 
> > maybe we should rename this thread excuses for not caching or
> finding a
> > cache...
> > 
> > No MTN bike
> > no Camera
> > no pencil
> > no GPS
> > no shoes
> > no shirt
> > had to work
> > batteries died
> > my topo map was blurry
> > there were to many rocks
> > Bees
> > snakes
> > killer Grackle attacking from above
> > Homeless bums sittin on it
> > there was a fence
> > there was a no trespassing sign
> > power lines
> > stubbed toe
> > no SCUBA gear
> > no boat
> > police helicopter had us in the spot light
> > the container was taken
> > entered coordinates wrong
> > was sleepy
> > was hungry
> > sun was in my eyes
> > lunar eclipse
> > got lost
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Trisha" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:15 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for
> uploading
> > pictures to Geocaching.com
> > 
> > 
> > > When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with me) I
> > can
> > > take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
> > > alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto my
> > > computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special equipment"
> > > issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the waters! ha
> > ha
> > > ha
> > > I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way to
> > get
> > > pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you will
> find
> > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > > Prescott
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:
> > >
> > > If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and your
> GPS
> > > (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that
> cache..
> > >
> > > However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a picture
> and
> > > post it to Geocaching.com. You can get a very inexpensive camera
> > > (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures, develop
> them
> > > using a service that provides you with free pictures online (like
> > > Photoworks.com),
> > > and upload the online picture to your cache log. This is what I did
> > > for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my digital
> > > camera.
> > >
> > > This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have to
> > > wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can
> > obtain
> > > the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an inexpensive
> > > way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
> > >
> > > Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > >
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > 
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > 
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 16 23:07:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Sparks)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:07:15 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special equiptment (5 rating?)
Message-ID: <3EC56F23.7060709@mchsi.com>

>
>
>From: "General Bracket" 
>
>Hair-splitting is quickly becoming an art form in here.
>
>
>-T.
>[General Bracket]
>

I don't have a "hair-splitter!"  Is this some type of new special 
equipment I need to buy?    And if I do, should I buy a digital 
hair-splitter or a hydraulic hair-splitter. Or do I need a 4-wheel-drive 
hair-splitter.   I _do_ have a 'hare'-splitter but I only use it when 
I'm .......... shhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......  be vewy qwiet......  I'm hunting 
wabbits.

-- Sprocket



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 01:45:31 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 18:45:31 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]  Caching excuses; and serious life issues
Message-ID: <20030516184532.15973.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

yeah, that answer was helpful.


On Fri, 16 May 2003 15:18:22 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:

> 
> YES
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Trisha" 
> To: 
> Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 1:54 PM
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues
> 
> 
> > Cute, Evil Fish. Your list looks pretty comprehensive. :-)
> > 
> > But hey, in quoting me, were you agreeing with me, ("If you want to
> > find the cache, just DO IT and quit whining..."), making fun of me,
> or
> > disagreeing with me? I'm just curious.....
> > 
> > Everybody, please pardon my lack of brains this week, I am going
thru
> > the extreme stress of  "Ex-husband causing me HE// and suing me for
> > custody of my daughter (15) and lying and being a complete A$$ and
> > making me spend $$$ for an attorney I can't afford" week.....or,
> > month....
> > 
> > Looks like my oldest daughter, the straight A student and State
track
> > athlete (she just qualified last night for the 4x100 relay finals
(an
> > all-freshman girls team to boot!) in the 4A high school State Track
> > Championships) will be moving to Texas with her vengeful and lying
> > "Disneyland Dad". Of course, he is claiming her grades are
suffering
> > and her health is deteriorating....geez, State Finals and her
health
> > is failing?? 4.0 GPA?? Give me a break. But he has to LIE to try
and
> > make a case for her to move....I'm agreeing only because it is what
> > she says she wants to do....HE's doing it to try and avoid paying
> > support for her and to mess with me. (guess he'll find out for
> himself
> > that she is WAY more expensive than any support he was sending!
> ha!!!)
> > 
> > Sorry if this is off topic and very personal, but it really has
been
> > awful for me recently. I did go do two (easy) caches south of
> Prescott
> > today as a stress relief (got a first find on a new one of
Lincoln's,
> > Yea!) after a visit to my attorney's office....
> > 
> > Anybody want to take compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and
> > contribute money to my defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't
> > afford?" 
> > 
> > Oh wait, I forgot, this is probably the wrong bunch to ask, there
are
> > so many who can't afford $30 for.....never mind....
> > 
> > I'll shut up now. Sorry for rambling but I am so very upset, it
just
> > kinda spills out. Please be kind.
> > 
> > thanks
> > Trisha "Lightning"
> > Prescott
> > 
> > PS BEES are a legit excuse for me, I am highly allergic, and those
> > great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha
> > 
> > 
> > On Fri, 16 May 2003 09:07:46 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > >  "Where there is a WILL you will find
> > > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > >  that is like place a cache and they will find it I am reminded
of
> > Sand
> > > Dollars Words,,,
> > > 
> > > ok maybe I need to find it again what were the 3 steps on
finding a
> > > cache???
> > > 
> > > maybe we should rename this thread excuses for not caching or
> > finding a
> > > cache...
> > > 
> > > No MTN bike
> > > no Camera
> > > no pencil
> > > no GPS
> > > no shoes
> > > no shirt
> > > had to work
> > > batteries died
> > > my topo map was blurry
> > > there were to many rocks
> > > Bees
> > > snakes
> > > killer Grackle attacking from above
> > > Homeless bums sittin on it
> > > there was a fence
> > > there was a no trespassing sign
> > > power lines
> > > stubbed toe
> > > no SCUBA gear
> > > no boat
> > > police helicopter had us in the spot light
> > > the container was taken
> > > entered coordinates wrong
> > > was sleepy
> > > was hungry
> > > sun was in my eyes
> > > lunar eclipse
> > > got lost
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Trisha" 
> > > To: 
> > > Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:15 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for
> > uploading
> > > pictures to Geocaching.com
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with
me)
> I
> > > can
> > > > take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
> > > > alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto
my
> > > > computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special
equipment"
> > > > issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the
waters!
> ha
> > > ha
> > > > ha
> > > > I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way
> to
> > > get
> > > > pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you
will
> > find
> > > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > > > Prescott
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:
> > > >
> > > > If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
your
> > GPS
> > > > (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that
> > cache..
> > > >
> > > > However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a
picture
> > and
> > > > post it to Geocaching.com. You can get a very inexpensive
camera
> > > > (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures,
develop
> > them
> > > > using a service that provides you with free pictures online
(like
> > > > Photoworks.com),
> > > > and upload the online picture to your cache log. This is what I
> did
> > > > for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my
digital
> > > > camera.
> > > >
> > > > This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have
> to
> > > > wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can
> > > obtain
> > > > the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an
> inexpensive
> > > > way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
> > > >
> > > > Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
> > > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > > >
> > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > > 
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > > 
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > 
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 04:09:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:09:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Prescott NF Fire Restrictions
In-Reply-To: <20030516140327.22944.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <547E386A-881D-11D7-815D-000393545682@desertsol.com>

Ya, Apache-Sitgreves and Tonto are joining them.

I actually just talked to Tonto on Wednesday (had to do a pottery 
pitfiring on Thursday morning and wanted to double check fire 
restrictions).  They had hoped to put off the restriction until after 
Memorial Day...but better safe than sorry.

Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 05:28:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:28:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Special equipment (5 rating?)
In-Reply-To: <3EC56F23.7060709@mchsi.com>
Message-ID: <20030517052802.38095.qmail@web80215.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1034223491-1053149282=:29110
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Out of curiosity, has anyone else noticed on the new 360 View (GCC801) cache that the instructions say - While facing south from the coordinates, what significant landmarks do you see to the east and north?  Does that make a mirror special equipment?  Or is it a trick question?   :-)

Gregg of MO & GO
--0-1034223491-1053149282=:29110
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Out of curiosity, has anyone else noticed on the new 360 View (GCC801) cache that the instructions say - While facing south from the coordinates, what significant landmarks do you see to the east and north?  Does that make a mirror special equipment?  Or is it a trick question?   :-)

Gregg of MO & GO

--0-1034223491-1053149282=:29110--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 05:34:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 05:34:04 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
Message-ID: 





Evil Fish wrote:


that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches involving say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while another will "see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their "view" what is the correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a different answer it shouldn't be included... but then again some people "try" to be (insert word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the end IMHO degrades the cache experience...  then again ESP would be special equipment wouldn't it? 








>Brian Team A.I.  wrote: 







Bottom line is this. There are different types of caches for everyone.  Some get a thrill out of walking through a park looking for words/phrases/numbers to complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the final location. 











If I am completely off the mark in assuming this statement had to do with a certain new cache of mine, then by all means I apologize. However, I know that not everyone is going to try for, or enjoy working on this or any of my other caches. I've come to learn that I can't please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and accomplish such a monumental feat. 




My response:




Actually I think it might be a jab at me as well. There's a cache of mine that fits that description that I believe he did not enjoy. Others did enjoy it. Sorry. I make  ones I enjoy doing. No one said you HAVE to go to every cache. 




Maybe I should have been happy the internet was down all day. 

The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 05:47:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 05:47:40 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues
Message-ID: 




Trisha 


 


We are so sorry for your difficulties right now. We'll say prayers for you. If there is anything we can do to make your life easier, let us know.


 


As far as those great tailed grackles...I'm a natural blond, older now so my hair is darker. When I was younger, I would live Hitchcock's "the Birds" every spring. Those stupid birds, and mockingbirds and the occassional house finch would see my long blond hair as the perfect nesting material. They would dive at me and swoop into my hair. One time, when I worked for the Forest Service in Sitka, Alaska , I was chased down the street by a crow. He/she kept swooping at me until I ran upstairs and into my house. The crow crashed into the glass door. My sympathetic roommates were doubled over laughing. I can't wait to tackle Celebration cache. Let's see those grackles attack me!



From: "Trisha" 








" I am going thru  extreme stress of Ex-husband. Anybody want to take compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and contribute money to my defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't afford?"  Sorry for rambling but I am so very upset, it just kinda spills out. Please be kind. 


Those great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha "


 





MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 06:03:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:03:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching]  Caching excuses; and serious life issues
References: <20030516184532.15973.h012.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>
Message-ID: <003901c31c3a$18070520$a929b83f@fishkiller>

send me your private email and I will explain more so

that aside
took your advice

I found it

I ate Spam with a spoon from the can

I drank PowerAid

I have returned from RELOADED and if you stay through all the credits there
is a trailer for REVOLUTIONS

MR. SMITH

----- Original Message -----
From: "Trisha" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues


> yeah, that answer was helpful.
>
>
> On Fri, 16 May 2003 15:18:22 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:
>
> >
> > YES
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Trisha" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 1:54 PM
> > Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues
> >
> >
> > > Cute, Evil Fish. Your list looks pretty comprehensive. :-)
> > >
> > > But hey, in quoting me, were you agreeing with me, ("If you want to
> > > find the cache, just DO IT and quit whining..."), making fun of me,
> > or
> > > disagreeing with me? I'm just curious.....
> > >
> > > Everybody, please pardon my lack of brains this week, I am going
> thru
> > > the extreme stress of  "Ex-husband causing me HE// and suing me for
> > > custody of my daughter (15) and lying and being a complete A$$ and
> > > making me spend $$$ for an attorney I can't afford" week.....or,
> > > month....
> > >
> > > Looks like my oldest daughter, the straight A student and State
> track
> > > athlete (she just qualified last night for the 4x100 relay finals
> (an
> > > all-freshman girls team to boot!) in the 4A high school State Track
> > > Championships) will be moving to Texas with her vengeful and lying
> > > "Disneyland Dad". Of course, he is claiming her grades are
> suffering
> > > and her health is deteriorating....geez, State Finals and her
> health
> > > is failing?? 4.0 GPA?? Give me a break. But he has to LIE to try
> and
> > > make a case for her to move....I'm agreeing only because it is what
> > > she says she wants to do....HE's doing it to try and avoid paying
> > > support for her and to mess with me. (guess he'll find out for
> > himself
> > > that she is WAY more expensive than any support he was sending!
> > ha!!!)
> > >
> > > Sorry if this is off topic and very personal, but it really has
> been
> > > awful for me recently. I did go do two (easy) caches south of
> > Prescott
> > > today as a stress relief (got a first find on a new one of
> Lincoln's,
> > > Yea!) after a visit to my attorney's office....
> > >
> > > Anybody want to take compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and
> > > contribute money to my defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't
> > > afford?"
> > >
> > > Oh wait, I forgot, this is probably the wrong bunch to ask, there
> are
> > > so many who can't afford $30 for.....never mind....
> > >
> > > I'll shut up now. Sorry for rambling but I am so very upset, it
> just
> > > kinda spills out. Please be kind.
> > >
> > > thanks
> > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > > Prescott
> > >
> > > PS BEES are a legit excuse for me, I am highly allergic, and those
> > > great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, 16 May 2003 09:07:46 -0700, "Team Evil Fish" wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >  "Where there is a WILL you will find
> > > > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > > >  that is like place a cache and they will find it I am reminded
> of
> > > Sand
> > > > Dollars Words,,,
> > > >
> > > > ok maybe I need to find it again what were the 3 steps on
> finding a
> > > > cache???
> > > >
> > > > maybe we should rename this thread excuses for not caching or
> > > finding a
> > > > cache...
> > > >
> > > > No MTN bike
> > > > no Camera
> > > > no pencil
> > > > no GPS
> > > > no shoes
> > > > no shirt
> > > > had to work
> > > > batteries died
> > > > my topo map was blurry
> > > > there were to many rocks
> > > > Bees
> > > > snakes
> > > > killer Grackle attacking from above
> > > > Homeless bums sittin on it
> > > > there was a fence
> > > > there was a no trespassing sign
> > > > power lines
> > > > stubbed toe
> > > > no SCUBA gear
> > > > no boat
> > > > police helicopter had us in the spot light
> > > > the container was taken
> > > > entered coordinates wrong
> > > > was sleepy
> > > > was hungry
> > > > sun was in my eyes
> > > > lunar eclipse
> > > > got lost
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Trisha" 
> > > > To: 
> > > > Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 8:15 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Digital camera not necessary for
> > > uploading
> > > > pictures to Geocaching.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > When we don't have Dan's digital camera (like, he isn't with
> me)
> > I
> > > > can
> > > > > take a pic with my good ol' 35 mm....a disposable is a good
> > > > > alternative....and after getting them developed scan them onto
> my
> > > > > computer...OOPS...that brings up a different "special
> equipment"
> > > > > issue, a scanner.....SORRY didn't mean to..... muddy the
> waters!
> > ha
> > > > ha
> > > > > ha
> > > > > I guess my point is that a digital camera, while the easier way
> > to
> > > > get
> > > > > pics online, isn't the only way. "Where there is a WILL you
> will
> > > find
> > > > > a WAY" (and let's hope with a minimum of whining.... :-)
> > > > > Trisha "Lightning"
> > > > > Prescott
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, 15 May 2003 21:49:38 -0700 (PDT), Ken Akerman wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > If a virtual cache REQUIRED you to take a picture of you and
> your
> > > GPS
> > > > > (or something like that) in order to receive credit for that
> > > cache..
> > > > >
> > > > > However, you don't need to use a digital camera to take a
> picture
> > > and
> > > > > post it to Geocaching.com. You can get a very inexpensive
> camera
> > > > > (like a disposable camera for around $5), take pictures,
> develop
> > > them
> > > > > using a service that provides you with free pictures online
> (like
> > > > > Photoworks.com),
> > > > > and upload the online picture to your cache log. This is what I
> > did
> > > > > for virtual and locationless caches before I obtained my
> digital
> > > > > camera.
> > > > >
> > > > > This is not as easy as using a digital camera, and you may have
> > to
> > > > > wait several days after visiting a virtual cache before you can
> > > > obtain
> > > > > the picture and post it to your log entry, but it is an
> > inexpensive
> > > > > way to get a picture for a virtual cache entry.
> > > > >
> > > > > Ken (a.k.a. Highpointer)
> > > > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > > > >
> > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > > >
> > > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > > >
> > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > > ____________________________________________________________
> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > >
> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 06:19:17 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:19:17 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
References: 
Message-ID: <004701c31c3c$3fff0940$a929b83f@fishkiller>

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yes I am a EOO like a EOE but different :)

that is again why not all caches are found by all cachers=20

I myself will never place a Puzzle cache again as I didn't like the =
headaches=20
and yes I am addicted so will find the cache eventually somehow someway =
and with many words maybe it is a revenge thing or a stray gene sunspots =
piss in the corn flakes sick humor or a lack of a good mutton =
sandwich.......


so are your micros ready :)?
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: gale and mike=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 10:34 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special =
Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah



  Evil Fish wrote:

  that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches =
involving say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while =
another will "see" another, then when the owner asks a question on their =
"view" what is the correct answer? if there is any room for a =
possibility of a different answer it shouldn't be included... but then =
again some people "try" to be (insert word) and use it as a trick of =
somesorts, which in the end IMHO degrades the cache experience...  then =
again ESP would be special equipment wouldn't it?=20

  >Brian Team A.I.  wrote:=20
  Bottom line is this. There are different types of caches for everyone. =
 Some get a thrill out of walking through a park looking for =
words/phrases/numbers to complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the final =
location.=20
  If I am completely off the mark in assuming this statement had to do =
with a certain new cache of mine, then by all means I apologize. =
However, I know that not everyone is going to try for, or enjoy working =
on this or any of my other caches. I've come to learn that I can't =
please everyone all the time, and I'm not going to try and accomplish =
such a monumental feat.=20

  My response:

  Actually I think it might be a jab at me as well. There's a cache of =
mine that fits that description that I believe he did not enjoy. Others =
did enjoy it. Sorry. I make  ones I enjoy doing. No one said you HAVE to =
go to every cache.=20

  Maybe I should have been happy the internet was down all day.=20



-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
  The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* =
____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your =
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: =
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com
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yes I am a EOO like a EOE but different =

:)


 


that is again why not all caches are =
found by all=20
cachers 


 


I myself will never place a Puzzle =
cache again as I=20
didn't like the headaches 


and yes I am addicted so will find the =
cache=20
eventually somehow someway and with many words maybe it is a revenge =
thing or a=20
stray gene sunspots piss in the corn flakes sick humor or a lack of a =
good=20
mutton sandwich.......


 


 


so are your micros ready =
:)?


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  gale and mike 
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 =
10:34 PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Special=20
  Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah

  


  

  

  

Evil Fish wrote:

  
that is the problem INTERPRETATION that is why some PUZZLE caches =
involving=20
  say a MOVIE or statue. The owner will "see" one thing while another =
will "see"=20
  another, then when the owner asks a question on their "view" what is =
the=20
  correct answer? if there is any room for a possibility of a different =
answer=20
  it shouldn't be included... but then again some people "try" to be =
(insert=20
  word) and use it as a trick of somesorts, which in the end IMHO =
degrades the=20
  cache experience...  then again ESP would be special equipment =
wouldn't=20
  it? 

  

  

  

  
>Brian Team A.I.  wrote:=20
  

  

  

  
Bottom line is this. There are different types of caches =
for=20
  everyone.  Some get a thrill out of walking through a park =
looking for=20
  words/phrases/numbers to complete a 'puzzle' in order to find the =
final=20
  location.=20
  

  

  

  

  

  
If I am completely off the mark in assuming this statement had to =
do with a=20
  certain new cache of mine, then by all means I apologize. However, I =
know that=20
  not everyone is going to try for, or enjoy working on this or any of =
my other=20
  caches. I've come to learn that I can't please everyone all the time, =
and I'm=20
  not going to try and accomplish such a monumental feat. 

  

  
My response:

  

  
Actually I think it might be a jab at me as =
well.=20
  There's a cache of mine that fits that description that I believe he =
did not=20
  enjoy. Others did enjoy it. Sorry. I make  ones I enjoy doing. No =
one=20
  said you HAVE to go to every cache. 

  

  
Maybe I should have been happy the internet =
was down=20
  all day. 


  

  The new MSN 8: =
smart spam=20
  protection and 2 months FREE*=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
  http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
  Geocaching Resource =
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_000_0044_01C31C01.92BE5CC0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 08:40:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 08:40:58 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
Message-ID: 



















From: "Team Evil Fish" 


Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 


 yes I am a EOO like a EOE but different :) 








I'm not that smart...what are those??


so are your micros ready :)? 


No, real life intervened for the moment (until next Wednesday).  But when they are, you all should be ready. Throwing Down the Gauntlet was designed in one of my meaner moods. And Mike wholeheartedly approved the design (he has a mean streak). It will be a 5* difficulty. But I'm not opposed to giving hints.





MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 12:30:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 08:30:33 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Special Equipment/stars/rants/blah...blah...blah
References: 
Message-ID: <001601c31c70$1c868a40$0500a8c0@one>

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gale and mike wrote:
"No one said you HAVE to go to every cache."

-------

Yes I do. You have to find every cache.

 It's a guy thing. Just ask my wife.

Team Sand Dollar


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gale and=20
mike wrote:

"No one said you HAVE to go to every =
cache."


-------


Yes I do. You have to find every cache.


 It's a guy thing. Just ask =
my=20
wife.


Team Sand =
Dollar


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 17 14:41:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 07:41:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a day after BDAY note
Message-ID: <007c01c31c82$5f4e5080$da29b83f@fishkiller>

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25+ Years difference

1976: Long hair

2002: Longing for hair

1976: The perfect high

2002: The perfect high yield mutual fund

1976: KEG

2002: EKG

1976: Acid rock

2002: Acid reflux

1976: Moving to California because it's cool

2002: Moving to California because it's warm

1976: Trying to look like Marlon Brando or Liz Taylor

2002: Trying NOT to look like Marlon Brando or Liz Taylor

1976: Seeds and stems

2002: Roughage

1976: Killer weed

2002: Weed killer

1976: Hoping for a BMW

2002: Hoping for a BM

1976: Going to a new, hip joint

2002: Receiving a new hip joint

1976: Rolling Stones

2002: Kidney Stones

1976: Being called into the principal's office

2002: Calling the principal's office

1976: Screw the system

2002: Upgrade the system

1976: Disco

2002: Costco

1976: Parents begging you to get your hair cut

2002: Children begging you to get their heads shaved

1976: Passing the drivers' test

2002: Passing the vision test=20

Just in case you weren't feeling too old today, this will certainly =
change things.=20

Each year the staff at Beloit College inWisconsin puts together a list =
to try to give the faculty a sense of the mindset of this year's =
incoming freshmen.=20

Here's this year's list:

The people who are starting college this fall across the nation were =
born in 1983.=20

They are too young to remember the space shuttle blowing up.

Their lifetime has always included AIDS.

Bottle caps have always been screw off and plastic.

The CD was introduced the year they were born.

They have always had an answering machine.

They have always had cable.

They cannot fathom not having a remote control.

Jay Leno has always been on the Tonight Show.

Popcorn has always been cooked in the microwave.

They never took a swim and thought about Jaws.

They can't imagine what hard contact lenses! are.

They don't know who Mork was or where he was from.

They never heard: "Where's the Beef?", "I'd walk a mile for a Camel", or =
"de plane Boss, de plane".

They do not care who shot J. R. and have no idea who J. R. even is.

McDonald's never came in Styrofoam containers.

They don't have a clue how to use a typewriter.
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25+ Years difference

1976: =
Long=20
hair

2002: Longing for hair

1976: The perfect =
high

2002:=20
The perfect high yield mutual fund

1976: KEG

2002:=20
EKG

1976: Acid rock

2002: Acid reflux

1976: Moving =
to=20
California because it's cool

2002: Moving to California because =
it's=20
warm

1976: Trying to look like Marlon Brando or Liz =
Taylor

2002:=20
Trying NOT to look like Marlon Brando or Liz Taylor

1976: Seeds =
and=20
stems

2002: Roughage

1976: Killer weed

2002: Weed=20
killer

1976: Hoping for a BMW

2002: Hoping for a =
BM

1976:=20
Going to a new, hip joint

2002: Receiving a new hip =
joint

1976:=20
Rolling Stones

2002: Kidney Stones

1976: Being called into =
the=20
principal's office

2002: Calling the principal's =
office

1976:=20
Screw the system

2002: Upgrade the system

1976: =
Disco

2002:=20
Costco

1976: Parents begging you to get your hair =
cut

2002:=20
Children begging you to get their heads shaved

1976: Passing the =
drivers'=20
test

2002: Passing the vision test 

Just in case you =
weren't=20
feeling too old today, this will certainly change things. 

Each =
year the=20
staff at Beloit College inWisconsin puts together a list to try to give =
the=20
faculty a sense of the mindset of this year's incoming freshmen. =


Here's=20
this year's list:

The people who are starting college this fall =
across=20
the nation were born in 1983. 

They are too young to remember the =
space=20
shuttle blowing up.

Their lifetime has always included=20
AIDS.

Bottle caps have always been screw off and =
plastic.

The CD=20
was introduced the year they were born.

They have always had an =
answering=20
machine.

They have always had cable.

They cannot fathom =
not having=20
a remote control.

Jay Leno has always been on the Tonight=20
Show.

Popcorn has always been cooked in the =
microwave.

They never=20
took a swim and thought about Jaws.

They can't imagine what hard =
contact=20
lenses! are.

They don't know who Mork was or where he was=20
from.

They never heard: "Where's the Beef?", "I'd walk a mile for =
a=20
Camel", or "de plane Boss, de plane".

They do not care who shot =
J. R. and=20
have no idea who J. R. even is.

McDonald's never came in =
Styrofoam=20
containers.

They don't have a clue how to use a=20
typewriter.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 18 20:29:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 13:29:40 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Travel Bug REALLY travels!!!!
Message-ID: <20030518132941.28644.h015.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hey Everybody!!!

Check out where my "Baseball Fan" Travel Bug went!!!

I started Baseball Fan in January, goal to visit as many Baseball
parks as possible. The same folks have had him for a long time but
finally moved him.....6,000 miles!! The map comes up very cool!! (It
made the wait for him to move worth it, that's for sure!) They did an
AWESOME job with some very cute pics and even created a cache in order
to log him in and out. They will now place him in Florida to begin
travelling around those east coast baseball parks! If "the duck" reads
this list, a PUBLIC thank YOU (!) for making this a neat experience....

If you log onto the TB's page there are all kinds of cool pics...where
he went 6,000 miles away...you'll have to log onto see where!

TB ID TB445, name "Baseball Fan" and #ID=1093.

Pretty cool, huh?

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 18 21:48:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:48:42 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Travel Bug REALLY travels!!!!
Message-ID: <20030518144843.22036.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

OH, I meant to mention.... and forgot... that Baseball Fan had a good
start at the BOB by Geoscape....THANKS for all the cool pics in
Phoneix with my favorite team!
Baseball Fan may be off to a GOOD START...now I just wish the DBacks
would get their act together!
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Sun, 18 May 2003 13:29:40 -0700 (MST), "Trisha" wrote:

> 
> Hey Everybody!!!
> 
> Check out where my "Baseball Fan" Travel Bug went!!!
> 
> I started Baseball Fan in January, goal to visit as many Baseball
> parks as possible. The same folks have had him for a long time but
> finally moved him.....6,000 miles!! The map comes up very cool!! (It
> made the wait for him to move worth it, that's for sure!) They did an
> AWESOME job with some very cute pics and even created a cache in
order
> to log him in and out. They will now place him in Florida to begin
> travelling around those east coast baseball parks! If "the duck"
reads
> this list, a PUBLIC thank YOU (!) for making this a neat
experience....
> 
> If you log onto the TB's page there are all kinds of cool
pics...where
> he went 6,000 miles away...you'll have to log onto see where!
> 
> TB ID TB445, name "Baseball Fan" and #ID=1093.
> 
> Pretty cool, huh?
> 
> Trisha "Lightning"
> Prescott
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 18 21:49:37 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:49:37 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance requested
Message-ID: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-2097514026-1053294577=:89417
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Hello AZ geocachers,
 
Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I dropped my GARMIN eTrex Venture, which I've done before without significant adverse effects. However, this time the position of the output display has been moved upwards in the screen, so I am now unable to see the top of my display view.  I am still able to record latititude and longitude, record and store waypoints and go to a waypoint; however, on the screen where I am mapping my route to the waypoint, I am unable to determine how far (in miles or feet when close) I am from the waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine how close I am to the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot see the menus on the top of my display.  
 
To visualize this, imagine you can't see the top two inches of your computer screen.  That's what I see in the display for my GPS.
 
Therefore, I may have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.  However, this means I will be without my GPS next weekend, which is Memorial Day weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to be geocaching for all three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask fellow GPS enthusiasts and geocachers some questions:
 
1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take my GPS for repairs and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That would be my first option, because I really don't want to be without a GPS next weekend.
 
2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul, then are there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra GPS that they could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some geocachers do own an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded to a newer model but you still have your old GPS sitting around the house.
 
Thank you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to me.  My goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it with full functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes more time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary replacement GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching next weekend, or use a GPS for other hikes that I do.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-2097514026-1053294577=:89417
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Hello AZ geocachers,


 


Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I dropped my GARMIN eTrex Venture, which I've done before without significant adverse effects. However, this time the position of the output display has been moved upwards in the screen, so I am now unable to see the top of my display view.  I am still able to record latititude and longitude, record and store waypoints and go to a waypoint; however, on the screen where I am mapping my route to the waypoint, I am unable to determine how far (in miles or feet when close) I am from the waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine how close I am to the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot see the menus on the top of my display.  


 


To visualize this, imagine you can't see the top two inches of your computer screen.  That's what I see in the display for my GPS.


 


Therefore, I may have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.  However, this means I will be without my GPS next weekend, which is Memorial Day weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to be geocaching for all three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask fellow GPS enthusiasts and geocachers some questions:


 


1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take my GPS for repairs and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That would be my first option, because I really don't want to be without a GPS next weekend.


 


2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul, then are there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra GPS that they could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some geocachers do own an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded to a newer model but you still have your old GPS sitting around the house.


 


Thank you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to me.  My goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it with full functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes more time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary replacement GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching next weekend, or use a GPS for other hikes that I do.


 


Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-2097514026-1053294577=:89417--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 18 21:59:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 14:59:59 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance requested
References: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3EC8025F.E47ACFDF@usa.net>

--------------352FAAFC62202FE2ADBB1D54
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I believe that any repair facility will send it to Garmin for repair.
While Fry's electronics had mine (under the extended warranty) they sent
it to Garmin and it tool them forever (Fry's fault not Garmin). I
finally bought one at Fry's, kept the receipt and returned it under
their 30 return policy when I got mine back. Actually mine got lost in
shipping, and they had me come in to give me a replacement. They would
not let me keep the one I had purchased, I had to return it for a
refund, so they could open up another box to give me a replacement.

So if all else fails go buy one, then return it (just don't drop it and
damage it first.)

Ken Akerman wrote:

> Hello AZ geocachers, Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister
> in Wickenburg, I dropped my GARMIN eTrex Venture, which I've done
> before without significant adverse effects. However, this time the
> position of the output display has been moved upwards in the screen,
> so I am now unable to see the top of my display view.  I am still able
> to record latititude and longitude, record and store waypoints and go
> to a waypoint; however, on the screen where I am mapping my route to
> the waypoint, I am unable to determine how far (in miles or feet when
> close) I am from the waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to
> determine how close I am to the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus
> but I cannot see the menus on the top of my display. To visualize
> this, imagine you can't see the top two inches of your computer
> screen.  That's what I see in the display for my GPS. Therefore, I may
> have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.  However, this
> means I will be without my GPS next weekend, which is Memorial Day
> weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to be geocaching for all
> three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask fellow GPS enthusiasts and
> geocachers some questions: 1) Is there a place in the local area where
> I can take my GPS for repairs and get the work done by Friday, May
> 23?  That would be my first option, because I really don't want to be
> without a GPS next weekend. 2) If I do need to return the GPS to
> Garmin for an overhaul, then are there any members of the Geocaching
> community who have an extra GPS that they could loan to me for use
> next weekend?  I expect some geocachers do own an extra GPS, because
> you may have recently upgraded to a newer model but you still have
> your old GPS sitting around the house. Thank you for any assistance
> and advice that you can provide to me.  My goal is to get my GPS fixed
> at a reasonable price so I can use it with full functionality next
> weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes more time to repair my
> GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary replacement GPS unit so
> I will still be able to go geocaching next weekend, or use a GPS for
> other hikes that I do. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--------------352FAAFC62202FE2ADBB1D54
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I believe that any repair facility will send it to Garmin for repair. While
Fry's electronics had mine (under the extended warranty) they sent it to
Garmin and it tool them forever (Fry's fault not Garmin). I finally bought
one at Fry's, kept the receipt and returned it under their 30 return policy
when I got mine back. Actually mine got lost in shipping, and they had
me come in to give me a replacement. They would not let me keep the one
I had purchased, I had to return it for a refund, so they could open up
another box to give me a replacement.

So if all else fails go buy one, then return it (just don't drop it
and damage it first.)

Ken Akerman wrote:

Hello AZ geocachers, Yesterday, while out caching
with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I dropped my GARMIN
eTrex Venture, which I've done before without significant adverse effects.
However, this time the position of the output display has been moved upwards
in the screen, so I am now unable to see the top of my display view. 
I am still able to record latititude and longitude, record and store waypoints
and go to a waypoint; however, on the screen where I am mapping my route
to the waypoint, I am unable to determine how far (in miles or feet when
close) I am from the waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine
how close I am to the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot
see the menus on the top of my display. To visualize this, imagine
you can't see the top two inches of your computer screen.  That's
what I see in the display for my GPS. Therefore, I may have to send
my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.  However, this means I will
be without my GPS next weekend, which is Memorial Day weekend and thus
a weekend where I would like to be geocaching for all three days. 
Therefore, I would like to ask fellow GPS enthusiasts and geocachers some
questions: 1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take
my GPS for repairs and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That
would be my first option, because I really don't want to be without a GPS
next weekend. 2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul,
then are there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra
GPS that they could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some
geocachers do own an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded
to a newer model but you still have your old GPS sitting around the house. Thank
you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to me.  My
goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it with
full functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes
more time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary replacement
GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching next weekend, or use
a GPS for other hikes that I do. Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)



--------------352FAAFC62202FE2ADBB1D54--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 18 23:10:13 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 16:10:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting Morning
In-Reply-To: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030518231013.66890.qmail@web80214.mail.yahoo.com>

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For a little diversion from the normal list serve posting, take a look at my note on The Peak at the Orthocenter (GCD7AE).  One of the more adventureous outings I've had in quite a while.

Gregg of MO & GO

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For a little diversion from the normal list serve posting, take a look at my note on The Peak at the Orthocenter (GCD7AE).  One of the more adventureous outings I've had in quite a while.


Gregg of MO & GO

--0-2019575444-1053299413=:66861--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 03:20:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:20:00 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting Morning
In-Reply-To: <20030518231013.66890.qmail@web80214.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

Hey Gregg,
   That was a very interesting story.  Thanks for sharing it.  Knowing the
area, I can just see the hawks circling and making a racket.  I didn't see
them the day I did that cache shortly after Wily placed it, but the view must
have been outstanding!  I presume you were coming up from the east/northeast
along that ridge?  The nest must have been pretty close to the top.  You did
the right thing - very noble to give up the goal for the day - you've done
all us cachers proud!

Jim.

On Sun, 18 May 2003, GREGG OBUCH wrote:

> For a little diversion from the normal list serve posting, take a look at
> my note on The Peak at the Orthocenter (GCD7AE).  One of the more
> adventureous outings I've had in quite a while.
> 
> Gregg of MO & GO

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 03:41:03 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 20:41:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting Morning
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030519034103.47210.qmail@web80205.mail.yahoo.com>

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Jim,  You're correct, the view was great this morning!  And yes I was coming up the ENE slope.  I don't think the cache is going anywhere, so I can wait until this fall to go log it. Gregg

Jim Scotti  wrote:Hey Gregg,
That was a very interesting story. Thanks for sharing it. Knowing the
area, I can just see the hawks circling and making a racket. I didn't see
them the day I did that cache shortly after Wily placed it, but the view must
have been outstanding! I presume you were coming up from the east/northeast
along that ridge? The nest must have been pretty close to the top. You did
the right thing - very noble to give up the goal for the day - you've done
all us cachers proud!

Jim.

On Sun, 18 May 2003, GREGG OBUCH wrote:

> For a little diversion from the normal list serve posting, take a look at
> my note on The Peak at the Orthocenter (GCD7AE). One of the more
> adventureous outings I've had in quite a while.
> 
> Gregg of MO & GO

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ 

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
--0-296039674-1053315663=:45271
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Jim, 


 


You're correct, the view was great this morning!  And yes I was coming up the ENE slope.  I don't think the cache is going anywhere, so I can wait until this fall to go log it.


 


Gregg

Jim Scotti <jscotti@pirlserver.lpl.Arizona.EDU> wrote:


Hey Gregg,
That was a very interesting story. Thanks for sharing it. Knowing the
area, I can just see the hawks circling and making a racket. I didn't see
them the day I did that cache shortly after Wily placed it, but the view must
have been outstanding! I presume you were coming up from the east/northeast
along that ridge? The nest must have been pretty close to the top. You did
the right thing - very noble to give up the goal for the day - you've done
all us cachers proud!

Jim.

On Sun, 18 May 2003, GREGG OBUCH wrote:

> For a little diversion from the normal list serve posting, take a look at
> my note on The Peak at the Orthocenter (GCD7AE). One of the more
> adventureous outings I've had in quite a while.
> 
> Gregg of MO & GO

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/ 

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

--0-296039674-1053315663=:45271--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 04:48:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (General Bracket)
Date: Sun, 18 May 2003 21:48:28 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance requested
References: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001901c31dc1$e43b48d0$800101df@terry9fe3hpa3o>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31D87.37BC65B0
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That's a bummer.  That'll certainly wreck your weekend.

You're fairly well-known in the geocaching community so I think I could =
probably lend you my Legend for next weekend in exchange for a photocopy =
of your drivers license.  You gotta promise not to drop it!   ;-)

If you can't find an alternative, email me.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/



  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ken Akerman=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 2:49 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance =
requested


  Hello AZ geocachers,

  Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I =
dropped my GARMIN eTrex Venture, which I've done before without =
significant adverse effects. However, this time the position of the =
output display has been moved upwards in the screen, so I am now unable =
to see the top of my display view.  I am still able to record latititude =
and longitude, record and store waypoints and go to a waypoint; however, =
on the screen where I am mapping my route to the waypoint, I am unable =
to determine how far (in miles or feet when close) I am from the =
waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine how close I am to =
the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot see the menus on =
the top of my display. =20

  To visualize this, imagine you can't see the top two inches of your =
computer screen.  That's what I see in the display for my GPS.

  Therefore, I may have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.  =
However, this means I will be without my GPS next weekend, which is =
Memorial Day weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to be =
geocaching for all three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask fellow =
GPS enthusiasts and geocachers some questions:

  1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take my GPS for =
repairs and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That would be my first =
option, because I really don't want to be without a GPS next weekend.

  2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul, then are =
there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra GPS that =
they could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some geocachers do =
own an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded to a newer =
model but you still have your old GPS sitting around the house.

  Thank you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to me.  =
My goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it =
with full functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it =
takes more time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a =
temporary replacement GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching =
next weekend, or use a GPS for other hikes that I do.

  Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)
------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31D87.37BC65B0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









That's a bummer.  That'll =
certainly wreck your=20
weekend.


 


You're fairly well-known in the =
geocaching=20
community so I think I could probably lend you my Legend for next =
weekend in=20
exchange for a photocopy of your drivers license.  You gotta =
promise not to=20
drop it!   ;-)


 


If you can't find an alternative, email =

me.


 


 


-T.
[General=20
Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don=
't inflict bad=20
quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/<=
/A>


 


 



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Ken =
Akerman=20
  
  
  
Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2003 2:49 =
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN =
Venture=20
  GPS technical assistance requested

  


  
Hello AZ geocachers,

  
 

  
Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I =
dropped=20
  my GARMIN =
eTrex=20
  Venture, which I've done before without significant adverse =
effects.=20
  However, this time the position of the output display has been moved =
upwards=20
  in the screen, so I am now unable to see the top of my display =
view.  I=20
  am still able to record latititude and longitude, record and store =
waypoints=20
  and go to a waypoint; however, on the screen where I am mapping my =
route to=20
  the waypoint, I am unable to determine how far (in miles or feet when =
close) I=20
  am from the waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine how =
close I=20
  am to the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot see =
the menus=20
  on the top of my display.  

  
 

  
To visualize this, imagine you can't see the top two inches =
of your=20
  computer screen.  That's what I see in the display for my =
GPS.

  
 

  
Therefore, I may have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be=20
  overhauled.  However, this means I will be without my GPS next =
weekend,=20
  which is Memorial Day weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to =
be=20
  geocaching for all three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask =
fellow GPS=20
  enthusiasts and geocachers some questions:

  
 

  
1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take my GPS for =
repairs=20
  and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That would be my first =
option,=20
  because I really don't want to be without a GPS next weekend.

  
 

  
2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul, then =
are=20
  there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra GPS =
that they=20
  could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some geocachers =
do own=20
  an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded to a newer model =
but you=20
  still have your old GPS sitting around the house.

  
 

  
Thank you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to =
me. =20
  My goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it =
with full=20
  functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes =
more=20
  time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary =
replacement=20
  GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching next weekend, or use =
a GPS=20
  for other hikes that I do.

  
 

  
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20
  =
Highpointer)


------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C31D87.37BC65B0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 15:21:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 08:21:49 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance requested
In-Reply-To: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20030518214937.94886.qmail@web21101.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1618.172.30.1.10.1053357709.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>

When I got my venture unit, the GPS had 4 build in waypoints. These were
of the various offices of Garmin. One in kansas, one in Asia, and another
in Europe. But, the more interesting one is in South Tempe. Perhaps you
can get some "local" assistance?

Just a thought.

StringCachers
Steven Stringham

> Hello AZ geocachers,
>
> Yesterday, while out caching with Azcachemeister in Wickenburg, I
> dropped my GARMIN eTrex Venture, which I've done before without
> significant adverse effects. However, this time the position of the
> output display has been moved upwards in the screen, so I am now unable
> to see the top of my display view.  I am still able to record latititude
> and longitude, record and store waypoints and go to a waypoint; however,
> on the screen where I am mapping my route to the waypoint, I am unable
> to determine how far (in miles or feet when close) I am from the
> waypoint, which makes it difficult for me to determine how close I am to
> the waypoint.  I can pull down my menus but I cannot see the menus on
> the top of my display.
>
> To visualize this, imagine you can't see the top two inches of your
> computer screen.  That's what I see in the display for my GPS.
>
> Therefore, I may have to send my GPS back to Garmin to be overhauled.
> However, this means I will be without my GPS next weekend, which is
> Memorial Day weekend and thus a weekend where I would like to be
> geocaching for all three days.  Therefore, I would like to ask fellow
> GPS enthusiasts and geocachers some questions:
>
> 1) Is there a place in the local area where I can take my GPS for
> repairs and get the work done by Friday, May 23?  That would be my first
> option, because I really don't want to be without a GPS next weekend.
>
> 2) If I do need to return the GPS to Garmin for an overhaul, then are
> there any members of the Geocaching community who have an extra GPS that
> they could loan to me for use next weekend?  I expect some geocachers do
> own an extra GPS, because you may have recently upgraded to a newer
> model but you still have your old GPS sitting around the house.
>
> Thank you for any assistance and advice that you can provide to me.  My
> goal is to get my GPS fixed at a reasonable price so I can use it with
> full functionality next weekend.  If that is not possible and it takes
> more time to repair my GPS, then I would like to acquire a temporary
> replacement GPS unit so I will still be able to go geocaching next
> weekend, or use a GPS for other hikes that I do.
>
> Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)


Thank you
Steven Stringham



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 15:32:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 08:32:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GARMIN Venture GPS technical assistance requested
In-Reply-To: <1618.172.30.1.10.1053357709.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>
Message-ID: <20030519153209.26447.qmail@web21105.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-2146097908-1053358329=:25696
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Steve,
 
I do recall that waypoint.  I think I deleted it from my GPS, but once when I was close to the waypoint, I drove to the office building that it was pointing to.  I think it actually was in Chandler.  It was at night, and the office building was closed, but I looked at the list of tenants and I couldn't find Garmin listed there.  However, if it is a service facility, it may be under a different name.
 
Ken

Steven Stringham  wrote:
When I got my venture unit, the GPS had 4 build in waypoints. These were of the various offices of Garmin. One in Kansas, one in Asia, and another in Europe. But, the more interesting one is in South Tempe. Perhaps you can get some "local" assistance?
--0-2146097908-1053358329=:25696
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Steve,


 


I do recall that waypoint.  I think I deleted it from my GPS, but once when I was close to the waypoint, I drove to the office building that it was pointing to.  I think it actually was in Chandler.  It was at night, and the office building was closed, but I looked at the list of tenants and I couldn't find Garmin listed there.  However, if it is a service facility, it may be under a different name.


 


Ken

Steven Stringham <sstringh@stringham-family.org> wrote:


When I got my venture unit, the GPS had 4 build in waypoints. These were of the various offices of Garmin. One in Kansas, one in Asia, and another in Europe. But, the more interesting one is in South Tempe. Perhaps you can get some "local" assistance?

--0-2146097908-1053358329=:25696--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 16:47:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 09:47:28 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Caching excuses; and serious life issues
Message-ID: <20030519094729.14589.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hi Mike and Gale,
Thanks so much for your kind words of support. (And for others, on/off
list). It is a tough time....helps to know people in our "family"
sympathize....
But, I am sitting here right now watching 2 female grackles (the male
is nearby) eating the popcorn I threw out on the grass last
night....they grab a kernal, take it to the water bucket and dip it in
before eating it. Cool.
Simple things....geocaching, birds....help with all the stresses....
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Sat, 17 May 2003 05:47:40 +0000, "gale and mike" wrote:


Trisha 
 
We are so sorry for your difficulties right now. We'll say prayers for
you. If there is anything we can do to make your life easier, let us
know.
 
As far as those great tailed grackles...I'm a natural blond, older now
so my hair is darker. When I was younger, I would live Hitchcock's
"the Birds" every spring. Those stupid birds, and mockingbirds and the
occassional house finch would see my long blond hair as the perfect
nesting material. They would dive at me and swoop into my hair. One
time, when I worked for the Forest Service in Sitka, Alaska , I was
chased down the street by a crow. He/she kept swooping at me until I
ran upstairs and into my house. The crow crashed into the glass door.
My sympathetic roommates were doubled over laughing. I can't wait to
tackle Celebration cache. Let's see those grackles attack me!
From: "Trisha" 



" I am going thru  extreme stress of Ex-husband. Anybody want to take
compasssion on an "ex-husband victim" and contribute money to my
defense fund to pay the "attorney I can't afford?"  Sorry for rambling
but I am so very upset, it just kinda spills out. Please be kind. 
Those great-tailed grackles can be really nasty!!! ha ha ha "
 

MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
____________________________________________________________
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 20:32:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Koch, Dan)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 13:32:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
Message-ID: 

Howdy again everyone.

It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
haven't been able to keep up with them all.  

If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done before you
can even attempt to find them, please tell me!

Thanks,
LazyK - Dan

My list so far:
Arrowhead Menace
Be My Valentoid
Bear Down!
bombs away (sort of...)
Cave Creek Recreation Area (sort of...)
Chain Cache (sort of...)
Criss/Cross
Down and Across
Empire Strikes Back Cache
Free Wyle!
Friends
Friends Again
Gadget Man the Geomancer
Glory of the Grizzlies
Gotta Cache 'em All
Hockey Puck
In the Shadow of the Pyramid
It...has you.
It's...Monty Python #1
Magical Mystery
Math Cache
Mission: Almost Impossible
Mission: Looney Tunes
Mission: R.I.P.
Mission: Silica Currency
Nailah's Birthday Cache
Orbis
Phantom Menace Cache
Picnic Leftovers
Picnic Leftovers Returns
Return of the Jedi Cache
Roadrunners Revenge: Grid Locked
Roadrunners Revenge: Net Serve
Rocket Men and Machines Cache
Route 66 Overlook (sort of...)
Rule Britannia!
Runes of Angerthas
Shark Fin
Son of Down and Across
Star Wars Cache
Stat Cache
The Boys of Summer
The Peak at the Orthocenter
Trivial Pursuit
Trivial Pursuit: Citrus Edition
Ultimate Puzzle Cache
Wheel Cipher Cache
Wilbur's Cache
Your Overactive Sprinklers at Work


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 20:51:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 13:51:22 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

"19th Hole" by Tres Hombres is a good puzzle cache.

-FroBro Q-Tip



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Koch,
Dan
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:32 PM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches


Howdy again everyone.

It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
haven't been able to keep up with them all.

If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done before you
can even attempt to find them, please tell me!

Thanks,
LazyK - Dan

My list so far:
Arrowhead Menace
Be My Valentoid
Bear Down!
bombs away (sort of...)
Cave Creek Recreation Area (sort of...)
Chain Cache (sort of...)
Criss/Cross
Down and Across
Empire Strikes Back Cache
Free Wyle!
Friends
Friends Again
Gadget Man the Geomancer
Glory of the Grizzlies
Gotta Cache 'em All
Hockey Puck
In the Shadow of the Pyramid
It...has you.
It's...Monty Python #1
Magical Mystery
Math Cache
Mission: Almost Impossible
Mission: Looney Tunes
Mission: R.I.P.
Mission: Silica Currency
Nailah's Birthday Cache
Orbis
Phantom Menace Cache
Picnic Leftovers
Picnic Leftovers Returns
Return of the Jedi Cache
Roadrunners Revenge: Grid Locked
Roadrunners Revenge: Net Serve
Rocket Men and Machines Cache
Route 66 Overlook (sort of...)
Rule Britannia!
Runes of Angerthas
Shark Fin
Son of Down and Across
Star Wars Cache
Stat Cache
The Boys of Summer
The Peak at the Orthocenter
Trivial Pursuit
Trivial Pursuit: Citrus Edition
Ultimate Puzzle Cache
Wheel Cipher Cache
Wilbur's Cache
Your Overactive Sprinklers at Work

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 20:54:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 16:54:24 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
Message-ID: <707C46AE.0699D600.0013DAD2@aol.com>

The one that is turning my brain into mush and keeping me up at night......
le chiffre indechifferable.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 20:52:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Henson)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 13:52:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

--Apple-Mail-2--91556308
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charset=ISO-8859-1;
	format=flowed


On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:32 PM, Koch, Dan wrote:

> Howdy again everyone.
>
> It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and =
I
> haven't been able to keep up with them all.
>
> If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done=20
> before you
> can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
>

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D51702

P4 Cache
Use waypoint: GCC9F6=A0

DO NOT GO TO THE ABOVE COORDINATES (at least, not for the cache) This=20
is a puzzle-multi- cache, and will require you to gather clue=20
information in the Prescott City area. Basic math (a calculator) and=20
the ability to carefully follow directions is required. YOU MUST ALSO=20
FIND "AID STATION CACHE" for one of the clues. The clues are not in any=20=

particular order.


--Apple-Mail-2--91556308
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/enriched;
	charset=ISO-8859-1



On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:32 PM, Koch, Dan wrote:


Howdy again everyone.


It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I

haven't been able to keep up with them all. =20


If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done
before you

can even attempt to find them, please tell me!




http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D51702

Verdana

P4 Cache

Use waypoint:
GCC9F6=A0Times New Roman =



VerdanaDO NOT GO TO
THE ABOVE COORDINATES (at least, not for the cache) This is a
puzzle-multi- cache, and will require you to gather clue information
in the Prescott City area. Basic math (a calculator) and the ability
to carefully follow directions is required. YOU MUST ALSO FIND "AID
STATION CACHE" for one of the clues. The clues are not in any
particular order.=20




--Apple-Mail-2--91556308--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 21:04:56 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:04:56 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
Message-ID: <20030519140457.16844.h003.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Thank you Lincoln~ ! I was just about to list my P4 cache when I saw
that you already did! :-)
BTW I really liked your newest "Near 305" I think it could become a
good TB exchange location as it is relatively easy to get to.
Did you check out where my Baseball Fan TB went (TB445)? I posted a
note yesterday, just wondered if anybody looked. I was excited! The
pics are very cute....
see ya
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott
www.ycjp.org


On Mon, 19 May 2003 13:52:51 -0700, Ken Henson wrote:

> 
> 
> On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:32 PM, Koch, Dan wrote:
> 
> > Howdy again everyone.
> >
> > It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds
> and I
> > haven't been able to keep up with them all.
> >
> > If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done 
> > before you
> > can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
> >
> 
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=51702
> 
> P4 Cache
> Use waypoint: GCC9F6 
> 
> DO NOT GO TO THE ABOVE COORDINATES (at least, not for the cache)
This 
> is a puzzle-multi- cache, and will require you to gather clue 
> information in the Prescott City area. Basic math (a calculator) and 
> the ability to carefully follow directions is required. YOU MUST
ALSO 
> FIND "AID STATION CACHE" for one of the clues. The clues are not in
> any 
> particular order.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 21:34:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 14:34:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: <707C46AE.0699D600.0013DAD2@aol.com>
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030519143331.01195738@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 04:54 PM 5/19/2003 -0400, you wrote:
>The one that is turning my brain into mush and keeping me up at night......
>le chiffre indechifferable.

I am about 75% done with that one.  I have deciphered everything needed, 
but I am still having trouble with the final location, thus my TWO no find 
logs for that cache.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 19 22:27:03 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 15:27:03 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] solving puzzles
Message-ID: <001701c31e55$c6de0b80$da11b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C31E1B.195A3B80
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I thought along with names of puzzle caches what are ways and means of  =
finding the puzzle cache coordinates?=20

I know that on a few occasions I have sat and used the Dogpile search =
engine then broke down and tried Google even ask Jeeves=20

I have traded for the final coords, I even offered a DINNER for the =
Answer which as things worked out will go to myself...




------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C31E1B.195A3B80
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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I thought along with names of puzzle =
caches what=20
are ways and means of  finding the puzzle cache coordinates? =



 


I know that on a few occasions I have =
sat and used=20
the Dogpile search engine then broke down and tried Google even ask =
Jeeves=20



 


I have traded for the final coords, =
I even offered a DINNER for the Answer which as =
things worked=20
out will go to myself...


 


 


 


 


------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C31E1B.195A3B80--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 00:15:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 17:15:08 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
References: 
Message-ID: <008701c31e64$df04c320$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

The following caches mostly fit the bill:

Blue Ridge Cache (sort of)
Le Chiffre Indechiffrable
Quail Cache
Paddlers Cache at Parker Canyon Lake
Telltale Tetrahedron

-Rob (Wily Javelina)




----- Original Message -----
From: "Koch, Dan" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:32 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches


> Howdy again everyone.
>
> It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
> haven't been able to keep up with them all.
>
> If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done before
you
> can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
>
> Thanks,
> LazyK - Dan
>
> My list so far:
> Arrowhead Menace
> Be My Valentoid
> Bear Down!
> bombs away (sort of...)
> Cave Creek Recreation Area (sort of...)
> Chain Cache (sort of...)
> Criss/Cross
> Down and Across
> Empire Strikes Back Cache
> Free Wyle!
> Friends
> Friends Again
> Gadget Man the Geomancer
> Glory of the Grizzlies
> Gotta Cache 'em All
> Hockey Puck
> In the Shadow of the Pyramid
> It...has you.
> It's...Monty Python #1
> Magical Mystery
> Math Cache
> Mission: Almost Impossible
> Mission: Looney Tunes
> Mission: R.I.P.
> Mission: Silica Currency
> Nailah's Birthday Cache
> Orbis
> Phantom Menace Cache
> Picnic Leftovers
> Picnic Leftovers Returns
> Return of the Jedi Cache
> Roadrunners Revenge: Grid Locked
> Roadrunners Revenge: Net Serve
> Rocket Men and Machines Cache
> Route 66 Overlook (sort of...)
> Rule Britannia!
> Runes of Angerthas
> Shark Fin
> Son of Down and Across
> Star Wars Cache
> Stat Cache
> The Boys of Summer
> The Peak at the Orthocenter
> Trivial Pursuit
> Trivial Pursuit: Citrus Edition
> Ultimate Puzzle Cache
> Wheel Cipher Cache
> Wilbur's Cache
> Your Overactive Sprinklers at Work
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 00:56:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Rob Brinkerhoff)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 17:56:22 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
References:  <008701c31e64$df04c320$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <001401c31e6a$a2004840$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>

I forgot to add  "Agent Polecat", by Team Spike, it is a cipher/multi
cache...one of the best puzzle caches down here in Tucson.

-Rob (Wily Javelina)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Brinkerhoff" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches


> The following caches mostly fit the bill:
>
> Blue Ridge Cache (sort of)
> Le Chiffre Indechiffrable
> Quail Cache
> Paddlers Cache at Parker Canyon Lake
> Telltale Tetrahedron
>
> -Rob (Wily Javelina)
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Koch, Dan" 
> To: 
> Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:32 PM
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
>
>
> > Howdy again everyone.
> >
> > It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
> > haven't been able to keep up with them all.
> >
> > If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done before
> you
> > can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
> >
> > Thanks,
> > LazyK - Dan
> >
> > My list so far:
> > Arrowhead Menace
> > Be My Valentoid
> > Bear Down!
> > bombs away (sort of...)
> > Cave Creek Recreation Area (sort of...)
> > Chain Cache (sort of...)
> > Criss/Cross
> > Down and Across
> > Empire Strikes Back Cache
> > Free Wyle!
> > Friends
> > Friends Again
> > Gadget Man the Geomancer
> > Glory of the Grizzlies
> > Gotta Cache 'em All
> > Hockey Puck
> > In the Shadow of the Pyramid
> > It...has you.
> > It's...Monty Python #1
> > Magical Mystery
> > Math Cache
> > Mission: Almost Impossible
> > Mission: Looney Tunes
> > Mission: R.I.P.
> > Mission: Silica Currency
> > Nailah's Birthday Cache
> > Orbis
> > Phantom Menace Cache
> > Picnic Leftovers
> > Picnic Leftovers Returns
> > Return of the Jedi Cache
> > Roadrunners Revenge: Grid Locked
> > Roadrunners Revenge: Net Serve
> > Rocket Men and Machines Cache
> > Route 66 Overlook (sort of...)
> > Rule Britannia!
> > Runes of Angerthas
> > Shark Fin
> > Son of Down and Across
> > Star Wars Cache
> > Stat Cache
> > The Boys of Summer
> > The Peak at the Orthocenter
> > Trivial Pursuit
> > Trivial Pursuit: Citrus Edition
> > Ultimate Puzzle Cache
> > Wheel Cipher Cache
> > Wilbur's Cache
> > Your Overactive Sprinklers at Work
> >
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> >
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 01:14:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 18:14:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
References:  <008701c31e64$df04c320$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <3EC98175.4090007@uccinc.net>

Here are some more I think fit

You got to be kidding
An educated guess
Clamo's Dyslexic Cache

Marc (Tamo's Clan'Destiny)

Rob Brinkerhoff wrote:

>The following caches mostly fit the bill:
>
>Blue Ridge Cache (sort of)
>Le Chiffre Indechiffrable
>Quail Cache
>Paddlers Cache at Parker Canyon Lake
>Telltale Tetrahedron
>
>-Rob (Wily Javelina)
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Koch, Dan" 
>To: 
>Sent: Monday, May 19, 2003 1:32 PM
>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
>
>
>  
>
>>Howdy again everyone.
>>
>>It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
>>haven't been able to keep up with them all.
>>
>>If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done before
>>    
>>
>you
>  
>
>>can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
>>
>>Thanks,
>>LazyK - Dan
>>
>>My list so far:
>>Arrowhead Menace
>>Be My Valentoid
>>Bear Down!
>>bombs away (sort of...)
>>Cave Creek Recreation Area (sort of...)
>>Chain Cache (sort of...)
>>Criss/Cross
>>Down and Across
>>Empire Strikes Back Cache
>>Free Wyle!
>>Friends
>>Friends Again
>>Gadget Man the Geomancer
>>Glory of the Grizzlies
>>Gotta Cache 'em All
>>Hockey Puck
>>In the Shadow of the Pyramid
>>It...has you.
>>It's...Monty Python #1
>>Magical Mystery
>>Math Cache
>>Mission: Almost Impossible
>>Mission: Looney Tunes
>>Mission: R.I.P.
>>Mission: Silica Currency
>>Nailah's Birthday Cache
>>Orbis
>>Phantom Menace Cache
>>Picnic Leftovers
>>Picnic Leftovers Returns
>>Return of the Jedi Cache
>>Roadrunners Revenge: Grid Locked
>>Roadrunners Revenge: Net Serve
>>Rocket Men and Machines Cache
>>Route 66 Overlook (sort of...)
>>Rule Britannia!
>>Runes of Angerthas
>>Shark Fin
>>Son of Down and Across
>>Star Wars Cache
>>Stat Cache
>>The Boys of Summer
>>The Peak at the Orthocenter
>>Trivial Pursuit
>>Trivial Pursuit: Citrus Edition
>>Ultimate Puzzle Cache
>>Wheel Cipher Cache
>>Wilbur's Cache
>>Your Overactive Sprinklers at Work
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>    
>>
>
>
>____________________________________________________________
>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>  
>




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 02:06:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 19:06:41 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: <001401c31e6a$a2004840$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
References: 
 <008701c31e64$df04c320$07940044@tc.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030519190520.025e2020@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 05:56 PM 5/19/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I forgot to add  "Agent Polecat", by Team Spike, it is a cipher/multi
>cache...one of the best puzzle caches down here in Tucson.

I have never understood why so many people will drive all the way out to 
find Stargazer, which is a GREAT cache, but not take the time to travel 
just a few more miles to the first leg of Agent.  We actually had to make 2 
trips to Agent and it is such a great location that I almost wish I would 
have needed 3 trips.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 04:15:52 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 21:15:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20030519190520.025e2020@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: <20030520041552.3691.qmail@web80204.mail.yahoo.com>

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I have to agree with Scott, Agent Polecat takes you to some really great locations! Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood  wrote:At 05:56 PM 5/19/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I forgot to add "Agent Polecat", by Team Spike, it is a cipher/multi
>cache...one of the best puzzle caches down here in Tucson.

I have never understood why so many people will drive all the way out to 
find Stargazer, which is a GREAT cache, but not take the time to travel 
just a few more miles to the first leg of Agent. We actually had to make 2 
trips to Agent and it is such a great location that I almost wish I would 
have needed 3 trips.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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I have to agree with Scott, Agent Polecat takes you to some really great locations!


 


Gregg of MO & GO

Scott Wood <scott@myblueheaven.com> wrote:


At 05:56 PM 5/19/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>I forgot to add "Agent Polecat", by Team Spike, it is a cipher/multi
>cache...one of the best puzzle caches down here in Tucson.

I have never understood why so many people will drive all the way out to 
find Stargazer, which is a GREAT cache, but not take the time to travel 
just a few more miles to the first leg of Agent. We actually had to make 2 
trips to Agent and it is such a great location that I almost wish I would 
have needed 3 trips.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

--0-1789197019-1053404152=:1391--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 04:26:04 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (GREGG OBUCH)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 21:26:04 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030520042604.73052.qmail@web80201.mail.yahoo.com>

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How about Father Kino (kind of...)

Ken Henson  wrote:
On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:32 PM, Koch, Dan wrote:

> Howdy again everyone.
>
> It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
> haven't been able to keep up with them all.
>
> If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done 
> before you
> can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
>

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=51702

P4 Cache
Use waypoint: GCC9F6 

DO NOT GO TO THE ABOVE COORDINATES (at least, not for the cache) This 
is a puzzle-multi- cache, and will require you to gather clue 
information in the Prescott City area. Basic math (a calculator) and 
the ability to carefully follow directions is required. YOU MUST ALSO 
FIND "AID STATION CACHE" for one of the clues. The clues are not in any 
particular order.


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How about Father Kino (kind of...)




Ken Henson <khenson@cableone.net> wrote:



On Monday, May 19, 2003, at 01:32 PM, Koch, Dan wrote:

> Howdy again everyone.
>
> It seems that the puzzle cache list has grown by leaps and bounds and I
> haven't been able to keep up with them all.
>
> If anyone knows of other caches that require some work to be done 
> before you
> can even attempt to find them, please tell me!
>

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=51702

P4 Cache
Use waypoint: GCC9F6 

DO NOT GO TO THE ABOVE COORDINATES (at least, not for the cache) This 
is a puzzle-multi- cache, and will require you to gather clue 
information in the Prescott City area. Basic math (a calculator) and 
the ability to carefully follow directions is required. YOU MUST ALSO 
FIND "AID STATION CACHE" for one of the clues. The clues are not in any 
particular order.


--0-192376250-1053404764=:69862--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 06:44:46 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 23:44:46 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Puzzle (no, not Puz-Zel) caches
In-Reply-To: <20030520042604.73052.qmail@web80201.mail.yahoo.com>
References: 
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030519234354.0257a438@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 09:26 PM 5/19/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>How about Father Kino (kind of...)

Sort of, but it is more of just a multi than any sort of puzzle.  Granted, 
the first leg does require a bit of detective skills, but nothing like some 
of the newer ones.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 10:46:13 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Steven Stringham)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 03:46:13 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RE: Special equiptment (5 rating?)
In-Reply-To: <002001c31b7f$2823b090$100a0a0a@akela>
References: <002001c31b7f$2823b090$100a0a0a@akela>
Message-ID: <3348.172.30.1.10.1053427573.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>

That $25 camera can be had for $15. I went to the Office Max web site and
saw it for $15 bucks, and said what the heck. It has no LED display of
your pictures, it only has a USB connection for downloading your pitcures,
and takes 19 shots in the "high quality" mode. But, It does take a picture
(352x288x24bit). Not a good one, mind you, but a picture. It takes two AAA
batteries. And, if you take them out, your pictures are gone!

Since I am not ablt to spend the $500 bucks on the nice one I want, and
the 35mm I have is quite nice, I got this for now. That can be concidered
possible for a cache prize, but I would rather use the disposables for
caches for actual pictures of the venturing ones.


http://www.officemax.com/max/solutions/product/prodBlock.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=yes&expansionOID=-536879946&prodBlockOID=536984682

Thanks for the lead to the camera!

Steven Stringham
StringCachers


> Well, if any of you are in the market for a cheap digital camera....
>
> I was at Office Max tonight and saw a 'no name' (I don't think it had a
> brand name on it) digital camera.  It was a whole $25!!  So.. for much
> less than a tank of gas, you can get a digital camera. It didn't have
> much in the way of features, but it did include the USB cable.
> Actually, I think $25 is how much I'd have to pay for a replacement USB
> cable for my Sony digital camera.
>
> If prices get any cheaper on digital cameras, I may have to put one into
> a cache as a prize or for recording visitors.
>
> Jake - Team A.I.





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 13:47:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Henson)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 06:47:59 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Prescott National Forest Announces Fire Restrictions
In-Reply-To: <3348.172.30.1.10.1053427573.squirrel@www.stringham-family.org>
Message-ID: 

--Apple-Mail-4--30648483
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset=WINDOWS-1252;
	format=flowed

Prescott National Forest Announces Fire Restrictions on the Bradshaw=20
Ranger District

PRESCOTT Ariz=97The Bradshaw Ranger District of the Prescott National=20
Forest will go into precautionary fire restrictions on Tuesday, May 20=20=

at 8 a.m. =93We have reached certain key trigger points that warrant=20
taking these restrictive actions. These include four initial attack=20
fires in the past week, the long distance spotting observed with these=20=

fires, and that our fire prevention patrols are picking up three or=20
four abandoned campfiresdaily. The Bradshaw Ranger District has the=20
highest urban-interface concerns; along with the added risk this year=20
due to all the bark beetle infested trees. We will still continue with=20=

many of our hazard reduction projects which could include prescribe=20
fire on the Verde Ranger District,=94 said Prescott National Forest Fire=20=

Management Officer Robert Morales.

These restrictions will be in effect only on the Bradshaw Ranger=20
District of the Prescott National Forest. The Bradshaw Ranger District=20=

includes those areas in the vicinity of Horsethief and Crown King in=20
the south, north thru Sycamore Mesa and Granite Mountain Wilderness=20
north and west of Prescott.

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VerdanaPrescott National Forest
Announces Fire Restrictions on the Bradshaw Ranger District =
Times New =
Roman


=
VerdanaPRE=
SCOTT
ArizVerdana=97The
Bradshaw Ranger District of the Prescott National Forest will go into
precautionary fire restrictions on Tuesday, May 20 at 8 a.m. =93We have
reached certain key trigger points that warrant taking these
restrictive actions. These include four initial attack fires in the
past week, the long distance spotting observed with these fires, and
that our fire prevention patrols are picking up three or four
abandoned campfiresdaily. The Bradshaw Ranger District has the highest
urban-interface concerns; along with the added risk this year due to
all the bark beetle infested trees. We will still continue with many
of our hazard reduction projects which could include prescribe fire on
the Verde Ranger District,=94 said Prescott National Forest Fire
Management Officer Robert Morales.Times =
New Roman


VerdanaThese
restrictions will be in effect only on the Bradshaw
Ranger District of the Prescott National Forest. The Bradshaw Ranger
District includes those areas in the vicinity of Horsethief and Crown
King in the south, north thru Sycamore Mesa and Granite Mountain
Wilderness north and west of =
Prescott.Times New =
Roman

=

--Apple-Mail-4--30648483--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 20 20:07:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Casteel)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 13:07:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re: Fire restrictions
Message-ID: <003901c31f0b$7be93c10$0500a8c0@fbidaemon>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Here's some links to fire restriction information sites for Arizona that =
may be of some benefit to some of you.

http://www.az.blm.gov/fire.htm
http://www.azfireinfo.com/
http://www.fs.fed.us/r3/fire/

Brian
Team A.I.
------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C31ED0.CF6724A0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Here's some links to fire restriction =
information=20
sites for Arizona that may be of some benefit to some of =
you.


 


http://www.az.blm.gov/fire.htm


http://www.azfireinfo.com/=



http://www.fs.fed.us/r3/fire/<=
/FONT>


 


Brian


Team A.I.


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 21 04:52:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:52:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I've created an updated version that incorporates the suggestions people
have given to me - BIG thank you to Gale and Mike!!

http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php

I couldn't think of anything better than "slight incline", so it's still in
there. Suggestions, feedback, etc. welcome.

I'm trying to get Jeremy to put a link to it on the hide a cache
page.............................................

Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Ayre
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 10:14 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator


  Well, I got a response from Jeremy - they will get to it sometime after
they move the site to better servers...

  So, meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline generator that hopefully is
quick and easy to use. It generates encoded and unencoded text for putting
on the cache page or on a web site.
  I don't claim to know or understand many handicap limitations, so
comments, suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a better tool!

  http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php
  Andy



    -----Original Message-----
    From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Ayre
    Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:18 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


    Well, I would hope that the kind of checkbox rating form for detailed
terrain descriptions would be part of the form you fill in to submit a
cache. Note however that despite the clayjar system being around for a
relatively long time now, the people running geocaching.com haven't even
bothered to make it part of the cache submission process, or produced their
own version.

    I'm going to send Jeremy an Email with my suggestion and ask him for
comments.

    Andy



      -----Original Message-----
      From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale and
mike
      Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:09 PM
      To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
      Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


      That's the clayjar's ratings system from geocaching.com. Problem is,
not everyone uses it consistently. Case in point is a fairly recent cache
called Savanic Mine
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=61648 which the owners
have given a 1 * rating to. The cache description tells me it might be
beyond my abilities. People who don't have limitations don't usually realize
the difficulties a cache may present. It's also why I think something like
handicap rating system might be better implemented locally rather than at
geocaching.com. Since too many people already rate a cache without using
their ratings form, what makes anyone think people will use an updated form
or a new one?

      There is definitely a need though. Recently I e-mailed someone whose
log entries included mention of a physically handicapped cacher. I gave them
a list of about 50 caches and compared them to other caches they had been
to. They were very appreciative of the list since the handicapped person had
serious heart problems and several recent hospitalizations.







      >From: "Trisha"
      >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
      >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
      >Subject: Fwd: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings
      >Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 11:28:04 -0700 (MST)
      >
      >Back a few weeks ago (Mar 25) I posted this post re: cache ratings, a
      >descriptive system that I have been using (supplemented by
appropriate
      >wording on my cache pages) This post did not get ONE reply....which
is
      >fine, but now that you guys are discussing it, what do you think?
      >
      >Obviously, the difference between a "1", "1.5", and "2" on terrain,
      >when critical to whether someone with some limitations may have
      >trouble accessing that cache, needs to be described on the page in
      >some fashion that you guys appear to be hashing out.
      >
      >When in doubt, I provide hopefully enough description so everybody
      >will have some idea what they are getting into, because I sure
      >appreciate the same in return.
      >
      >Trisha "Lightning"
      >Prescott
      >
      >SEE BELOW
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >------- Start of forwarded message -------
      >
      >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings
      >From: "Trisha"
      >Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:08:15 -0700 (MST)
      >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
      >
      >Hi Patrick and all,
      >
      >In regards to rating caches, I have been using a descriptive system
      >that seems to be fairly accurate. I just looked at geocaching.com to
      >see if I could find where this is listed, because I don't remember
      >where I got it from!!!
      >
      >It's not that long, so I will type it out here and hopefully it will
      >help. Obviously, this is subjective (half steps can be used) but it
      >helps me to think of the ratings in these descriptive terms.
      >
      >TERRAIN:
      >
      >1. Handicap Accessible (may be paved, relatively flat, <1/2 mile)
      >
      >2. Suitable for Small Children (likely marked trails, no steep or
      >overgrowth, <2 mile hike)
      >
      >3. Not Suitable for Small Children - Average Adult/Older Child OK
      >depending on physical condition (Likely off trail, may have one or
      >more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep elevation changes,
      > > 2 mile hike)
      >
      >4. Experienced Outdoor Enthusiasts Only - (offtrail, one or more of
      >the following: Heavy Overgrowth, Steep elevation (need use of hands),
      > >10 miles, may be overnight.)
      >
      >5. Requires Special Equipment or Knowledge: (Boat, 4WD, Rock
Climbing,
      >SCUBA) or otherwise extremely difficult.
      >
      >Because I feel very strongly that people need to know what they are
      >getting into, esp up here in the mountains or any out-of-the-way
      >place, I will describe pretty clearly if there is a difficult part in
      >getting to the cache. The only thing I don't agree with in this
      >descriptive system is the 4WD = a "5". While 4WD is "special
      >equipment", many have it. If getting to my cache requires 4WD I will
      >put that in the description, with an assessment of how hard the 4WD
      >might be, and rate the cache less than a "5" based upon the rest of
      >the adventure.....:-)
      >
      >
      >DIFFICULTY:
      >
      >1. EASY - plain sight or found in a few minutes
      >
      >2. AVERAGE - Any geocacher can find in less than 30 minutes
      >
      >3. CHALLENGING - Experienced Geocacher will find it challenging and
      >could take a good part of the afternoon
      >
      >4. DIFFICULT - Real challenge for experienced Geocacher. May require
      >special skills/knowledge, or in depth preparation. May need multiple
      >days/trips to find.
      >
      >5. EXTREME - Serious mental/physical challenge. Requires Special
      >knowledge, skills or equipment.
      >
      >As you can see, there is quite a gap between "2" and "3". Guess that
      >is what "2.5" is for!!!
      >
      >LIke I said, I get this over a year ago from.... I thought - the
      >geocaching website. Anyway, I wrote it down and this is what I go by.
      >What do people think? Anybody else using this descriptive system? If
      >most like it maybe it could become the standard?
      >
      >Trisha "Lightning"
      >Prescott
      >
      >
      >
      >On Mon, 24 Mar 2003, "Patrick Brown" wrote:
      >
      > >
      > > I have notised that a lot of people that place Caches use
      >different
      > > ratings. When we place a cache we have been using the suggested
      >Rating
      > > when
      > > we fill out the form (
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs">http://www.
clayjar.com/gcrs/ ).
      > > That is why it looks like we have set some high numbers. These
      > > caches are
      > > a lot easyer than they look. Then again I see some that have a
      >rating
      > > of 2
      > > or 3 that are really tuff. Does anyone else see that?
      > >
      > > Patrick Brown
      > > PANDA77
      > > Check out
      > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.geocaching.com">http://www.ge
ocaching.com/
      > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.
azgeocaching.com/
      > > ____________________________________________________________
      > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
      > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
      > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman
/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/a
z-geocaching
      > >
      > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
      > >
>href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www.
azgeocaching.com
      >
      >------- End of forwarded message -------
      >____________________________________________________________
      >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
      >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
      >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
      >
      >Arizona's Geocaching Resource
      >http://www.azgeocaching.com


--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C31F1A.12C69200
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







I've=20
created an updated version that incorporates the suggestions people =
have=20
given to me - BIG thank you to Gale and Mike!!


 


http://www.b=
ritishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php


 


I=20
couldn't think of anything better than "slight incline", so it's still =
in there.=20
Suggestions, feedback, etc. welcome.


 


I'm=20
trying to get Jeremy to put a link to it on the hide a cache=20
page.............................................


 


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Andrew Ayre
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 10:14 =
PM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap=20
  Accessibility Guideline Generator


  
Well, I got a response from Jeremy - they will get to it =
sometime after=20
  they move the site to better servers...

  
 

  
So,=20
  meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline generator that hopefully is =
quick=20
  and easy to use. It generates encoded and unencoded text for putting =
on the=20
  cache page or on a web site.

  
I=20
  don't claim to know or understand many handicap limitations, so =
comments,=20
  suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a better=20
  tool!

  
 

  
http://www.b=
ritishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php

  
Andy

  

  

    
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
    az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
    [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf =
Of=20
    Andrew Ayre
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:18 =
PM
To:=20
    listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] =
Cache=20
    Ratings


    
Well, I would hope that the kind of checkbox rating form =
for detailed=20
    terrain descriptions would be part of the form you fill in to submit =
a=20
    cache. Note however that despite the clayjar system being around for =
a=20
    relatively long time now, the people running geocaching.com haven't =
even=20
    bothered to make it part of the cache submission process, or =
produced their=20
    own version.

    
 

    
I'm going to send Jeremy an Email with my suggestion and =
ask him for=20
    comments.

    
 

    
Andy

  

    

      
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
      az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
      [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf =
Of=20
      gale and mike
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:09=20
      PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject:=20
      [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings


      

      

      
That's the clayjar's ratings system from geocaching.com. =
Problem is,=20
      not everyone uses it consistently. Case in point is a fairly =
recent cache=20
      called Savanic Mine htt=
p://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D61648 which =

      the owners have given a 1 * rating to. The cache description tells =
me it=20
      might be beyond my abilities. People who don't have limitations =
don't=20
      usually realize the difficulties a cache may present. It's also =
why I=20
      think something like handicap rating system might be better =
implemented=20
      locally rather than at geocaching.com. Since too many people =
already rate=20
      a cache without using their ratings form, what makes anyone think =
people=20
      will use an updated form or a new one? 

      
There is definitely a need though. Recently I e-mailed someone =
whose=20
      log entries included mention of a physically handicapped cacher. I =
gave=20
      them a list of about 50 caches and compared them to other caches =
they had=20
      been to. They were very appreciative of the list since the =
handicapped=20
      person had serious heart problems and several recent=20
      hospitalizations.


      




      

      

      

      
>From: "Trisha" 
      
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      
>Subject: Fwd: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings=20
      
>Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 11:28:04 -0700 (MST)=20
      
>=20
      
>Back a few weeks ago (Mar 25) I posted this post =
re: cache=20
      ratings, a=20
      
>descriptive system that I have been using =
(supplemented by=20
      appropriate=20
      
>wording on my cache pages) This post did not get =
ONE=20
      reply....which is=20
      
>fine, but now that you guys are discussing it, what =
do you=20
      think?=20
      
>=20
      
>Obviously, the difference between a "1", "1.5", and =
"2" on=20
      terrain,=20
      
>when critical to whether someone with some =
limitations may=20
      have=20
      
>trouble accessing that cache, needs to be described =
on the=20
      page in=20
      
>some fashion that you guys appear to be hashing =
out.=20
      
>=20
      
>When in doubt, I provide hopefully enough =
description so=20
      everybody=20
      
>will have some idea what they are getting into, =
because I=20
      sure=20
      
>appreciate the same in return.=20
      
>=20
      
>Trisha "Lightning"=20
      
>Prescott=20
      
>=20
      
>SEE BELOW=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>------- Start of forwarded message -------=20
      
>=20
      
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings=20
      
>From: "Trisha" 
      
>Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:08:15 -0700 (MST)=20
      
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      
>=20
      
>Hi Patrick and all,=20
      
>=20
      
>In regards to rating caches, I have been using a=20
      descriptive system=20
      
>that seems to be fairly accurate. I just looked at=20
      geocaching.com to=20
      
>see if I could find where this is listed, because I =
don't=20
      remember=20
      
>where I got it from!!!=20
      
>=20
      
>It's not that long, so I will type it out here and=20
      hopefully it will=20
      
>help. Obviously, this is subjective (half steps can =
be=20
      used) but it=20
      
>helps me to think of the ratings in these =
descriptive=20
      terms.=20
      
>=20
      
>TERRAIN:=20
      
>=20
      
>1. Handicap Accessible (may be paved, relatively =
flat,=20
      <1/2 mile)=20
      
>=20
      
>2. Suitable for Small Children (likely marked =
trails, no=20
      steep or=20
      
>overgrowth, <2 mile hike)=20
      
>=20
      
>3. Not Suitable for Small Children - Average =
Adult/Older=20
      Child OK=20
      
>depending on physical condition (Likely off trail, =
may have=20
      one or=20
      
>more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep=20
      elevation changes,=20
      
> > 2 mile hike)=20
      
>=20
      
>4. Experienced Outdoor Enthusiasts Only - =
(offtrail, one or=20
      more of=20
      
>the following: Heavy Overgrowth, Steep elevation =
(need use=20
      of hands),=20
      
> >10 miles, may be overnight.)=20
      
>=20
      
>5. Requires Special Equipment or Knowledge: (Boat, =
4WD,=20
      Rock Climbing,=20
      
>SCUBA) or otherwise extremely difficult.=20
      
>=20
      
>Because I feel very strongly that people need to =
know what=20
      they are=20
      
>getting into, esp up here in the mountains or any=20
      out-of-the-way=20
      
>place, I will describe pretty clearly if there is a =

      difficult part in=20
      
>getting to the cache. The only thing I don't agree =
with in=20
      this=20
      
>descriptive system is the 4WD =3D a "5". While 4WD =
is=20
      "special=20
      
>equipment", many have it. If getting to my cache =
requires=20
      4WD I will=20
      
>put that in the description, with an assessment of =
how hard=20
      the 4WD=20
      
>might be, and rate the cache less than a "5" based =
upon the=20
      rest of=20
      
>the adventure.....:-)=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>DIFFICULTY:=20
      
>=20
      
>1. EASY - plain sight or found in a few minutes=20
      
>=20
      
>2. AVERAGE - Any geocacher can find in less than 30 =
minutes=20

      
>=20
      
>3. CHALLENGING - Experienced Geocacher will find it =

      challenging and=20
      
>could take a good part of the afternoon=20
      
>=20
      
>4. DIFFICULT - Real challenge for experienced =
Geocacher.=20
      May require=20
      
>special skills/knowledge, or in depth preparation. =
May need=20
      multiple=20
      
>days/trips to find.=20
      
>=20
      
>5. EXTREME - Serious mental/physical challenge. =
Requires=20
      Special=20
      
>knowledge, skills or equipment.=20
      
>=20
      
>As you can see, there is quite a gap between "2" =
and "3".=20
      Guess that=20
      
>is what "2.5" is for!!!=20
      
>=20
      
>LIke I said, I get this over a year ago from.... I =
thought=20
      - the=20
      
>geocaching website. Anyway, I wrote it down and =
this is=20
      what I go by.=20
      
>What do people think? Anybody else using this =
descriptive=20
      system? If=20
      
>most like it maybe it could become the standard?=20
      
>=20
      
>Trisha "Lightning"=20
      
>Prescott=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>=20
      
>On Mon, 24 Mar 2003, "Patrick Brown" wrote:=20
      
>=20
      
> >=20
      
> > I have notised that a lot of people that =
place Caches=20
      use=20
      
>different=20
      
> > ratings. When we place a cache we have been =
using the=20
      suggested=20
      
>Rating=20
      
> > when=20
      
> > we fill out the form ( >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs"=
>http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs/=20
      ).=20
      
> > That is why it looks like we have set some =
high=20
      numbers. These=20
      
> > caches are=20
      
> > a lot easyer than they look. Then again I see =
some=20
      that have a=20
      
>rating=20
      
> > of 2=20
      
> > or 3 that are really tuff. Does anyone else =
see that?=20

      
> >=20
      
> > Patrick Brown=20
      
> > PANDA77=20
      
> > Check out=20
      
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.geocaching.com"&g=
t;http://www.geocaching.com/=20

      
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com"=
>http://www.azgeocaching.com/=20

      
> >=20
      ____________________________________________________________=20
      
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list =
listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or =
unsubscribe visit:=20

      
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching=
.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/=
mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching=20

      
> >=20
      
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource=20
      
> > >href=3D"http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com"=
>http://www.azgeocaching.com=20

      
>=20
      
>------- End of forwarded message -------=20
      =

>__________________________________________________________=
__=20

      
>Az-Geocaching mailing list =
listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
      
>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe =
visit:=20
      =

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geoca=
ching=20

      
>=20
      
>Arizona's Geocaching Resource=20
      
>http://www.azgeocaching.com=20
      


      

      MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE =
E-MAIL=20
      VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
      ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
      mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, =
subscribe or=20
      unsubscribe visit:=20
      http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
      Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com=20



------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C31F1A.12C69200--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 21 06:09:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 06:09:40 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator
Message-ID: 




Very nice. I hope they use it. If you need extra voices to make your case with Jeremy, let us know.












>From: "Andrew Ayre" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator 

>Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 21:52:14 -0700 

> 

>I've created an updated version that incorporates the suggestions people 

>have given to me - BIG thank you to Gale and Mike!! 

> 

>http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php 

> 

>I couldn't think of anything better than "slight incline", so it's still in 

>there. Suggestions, feedback, etc. welcome. 

> 

>I'm trying to get Jeremy to put a link to it on the hide a cache 

>page............................................. 

> 

>Andy 

> 

> 

> 

> -----Original Message----- 

> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 

>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew 

>Ayre 

> Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 10:14 PM 

> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Handicap Accessibility Guideline Generator 

> 

> 

> Well, I got a response from Jeremy - they will get to it sometime after 

>they move the site to better servers... 

> 

> So, meanwhile I've thrown together a guideline generator that hopefully is 

>quick and easy to use. It generates encoded and unencoded text for putting 

>on the cache page or on a web site. 

> I don't claim to know or understand many handicap limitations, so 

>comments, suggestions, etc. are welcome. Help me to make it a better tool! 

> 

> http://www.britishideas.com/geocaching/handicap.php 

> Andy 

> 

> 

> 

> -----Original Message----- 

> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 

>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew 

>Ayre 

> Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:18 PM 

> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings 

> 

> 

> Well, I would hope that the kind of checkbox rating form for detailed 

>terrain descriptions would be part of the form you fill in to submit a 

>cache. Note however that despite the clayjar system being around for a 

>relatively long time now, the people running geocaching.com haven't even 

>bothered to make it part of the cache submission process, or produced their 

>own version. 

> 

> I'm going to send Jeremy an Email with my suggestion and ask him for 

>comments. 

> 

> Andy 

> 

> 

> 

> -----Original Message----- 

> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 

>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of gale and 

>mike 

> Sent: Friday, April 11, 2003 1:09 PM 

> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings 

> 

> 

> That's the clayjar's ratings system from geocaching.com. Problem is, 

>not everyone uses it consistently. Case in point is a fairly recent cache 

>called Savanic Mine 

>http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=61648 which the owners 

>have given a 1 * rating to. The cache description tells me it might be 

>beyond my abilities. People who don't have limitations don't usually realize 

>the difficulties a cache may present. It's also why I think something like 

>handicap rating system might be better implemented locally rather than at 

>geocaching.com. Since too many people already rate a cache without using 

>their ratings form, what makes anyone think people will use an updated form 

>or a new one? 

> 

> There is definitely a need though. Recently I e-mailed someone whose 

>log entries included mention of a physically handicapped cacher. I gave them 

>a list of about 50 caches and compared them to other caches they had been 

>to. They were very appreciative of the list since the handicapped person had 

>serious heart problems and several recent hospitalizations. 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> 

> >From: "Trisha" 

> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> >Subject: Fwd: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings 

> >Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 11:28:04 -0700 (MST) 

> > 

> >Back a few weeks ago (Mar 25) I posted this post re: cache ratings, a 

> >descriptive system that I have been using (supplemented by 

>appropriate 

> >wording on my cache pages) This post did not get ONE reply....which 

>is 

> >fine, but now that you guys are discussing it, what do you think? 

> > 

> >Obviously, the difference between a "1", "1.5", and "2" on terrain, 

> >when critical to whether someone with some limitations may have 

> >trouble accessing that cache, needs to be described on the page in 

> >some fashion that you guys appear to be hashing out. 

> > 

> >When in doubt, I provide hopefully enough description so everybody 

> >will have some idea what they are getting into, because I sure 

> >appreciate the same in return. 

> > 

> >Trisha "Lightning" 

> >Prescott 

> > 

> >SEE BELOW 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >------- Start of forwarded message ------- 

> > 

> >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Ratings 

> >From: "Trisha" 

> >Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2003 16:08:15 -0700 (MST) 

> >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> > 

> >Hi Patrick and all, 

> > 

> >In regards to rating caches, I have been using a descriptive system 

> >that seems to be fairly accurate. I just looked at geocaching.com to 

> >see if I could find where this is listed, because I don't remember 

> >where I got it from!!! 

> > 

> >It's not that long, so I will type it out here and hopefully it will 

> >help. Obviously, this is subjective (half steps can be used) but it 

> >helps me to think of the ratings in these descriptive terms. 

> > 

> >TERRAIN: 

> > 

> >1. Handicap Accessible (may be paved, relatively flat, <1/2 mile) 

> > 

> >2. Suitable for Small Children (likely marked trails, no steep or 

> >overgrowth, <2 mile hike) 

> > 

> >3. Not Suitable for Small Children - Average Adult/Older Child OK 

> >depending on physical condition (Likely off trail, may have one or 

> >more of the following: some overgrowth, some steep elevation changes, 

> > > 2 mile hike) 

> > 

> >4. Experienced Outdoor Enthusiasts Only - (offtrail, one or more of 

> >the following: Heavy Overgrowth, Steep elevation (need use of hands), 

> > >10 miles, may be overnight.) 

> > 

> >5. Requires Special Equipment or Knowledge: (Boat, 4WD, Rock 

>Climbing, 

> >SCUBA) or otherwise extremely difficult. 

> > 

> >Because I feel very strongly that people need to know what they are 

> >getting into, esp up here in the mountains or any out-of-the-way 

> >place, I will describe pretty clearly if there is a difficult part in 

> >getting to the cache. The only thing I don't agree with in this 

> >descriptive system is the 4WD = a "5". While 4WD is "special 

> >equipment", many have it. If getting to my cache requires 4WD I will 

> >put that in the description, with an assessment of how hard the 4WD 

> >might be, and rate the cache less than a "5" based upon the rest of 

> >the adventure.....:-) 

> > 

> > 

> >DIFFICULTY: 

> > 

> >1. EASY - plain sight or found in a few minutes 

> > 

> >2. AVERAGE - Any geocacher can find in less than 30 minutes 

> > 

> >3. CHALLENGING - Experienced Geocacher will find it challenging and 

> >could take a good part of the afternoon 

> > 

> >4. DIFFICULT - Real challenge for experienced Geocacher. May require 

> >special skills/knowledge, or in depth preparation. May need multiple 

> >days/trips to find. 

> > 

> >5. EXTREME - Serious mental/physical challenge. Requires Special 

> >knowledge, skills or equipment. 

> > 

> >As you can see, there is quite a gap between "2" and "3". Guess that 

> >is what "2.5" is for!!! 

> > 

> >LIke I said, I get this over a year ago from.... I thought - the 

> >geocaching website. Anyway, I wrote it down and this is what I go by. 

> >What do people think? Anybody else using this descriptive system? If 

> >most like it maybe it could become the standard? 

> > 

> >Trisha "Lightning" 

> >Prescott 

> > 

> > 

> > 

> >On Mon, 24 Mar 2003, "Patrick Brown" wrote: 

> > 

> > > 

> > > I have notised that a lot of people that place Caches use 

> >different 

> > > ratings. When we place a cache we have been using the suggested 

> >Rating 

> > > when 

> > > we fill out the form ( 

> >href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs">http://www. 

>clayjar.com/gcrs/ ). 

> > > That is why it looks like we have set some high numbers. These 

> > > caches are 

> > > a lot easyer than they look. Then again I see some that have a 

> >rating 

> > > of 2 

> > > or 3 that are really tuff. Does anyone else see that? 

> > > 

> > > Patrick Brown 

> > > PANDA77 

> > > Check out 

> > > 

> >href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.geocaching.com">http://www.ge 

>ocaching.com/ 

> > > 

> >href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www. 

>azgeocaching.com/ 

> > > ____________________________________________________________ 

> > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

> > > 

> >href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman 

>/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/a 

>z-geocaching 

> > > 

> > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

> > > 

> >href="http://mail.brasher.com/jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www. 

>azgeocaching.com 

> > 

> >------- End of forwarded message ------- 

> >____________________________________________________________ 

> >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

> >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> > 

> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

> >http://www.azgeocaching.com 

> 

> 

>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

> MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*. 

>____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching 

>mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or 

>unsubscribe visit: 

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's 

>Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 


MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service:  2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 21 05:02:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Tue, 20 May 2003 22:02:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Please approve this cache:  Arizona's Most Western Museum
In-Reply-To: <20030521035118.73D00132D68@signal.groundspeak.com>
Message-ID: <20030521050259.16360.qmail@web21104.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-832875234-1053493379=:15588
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Mtn-man,
 
I am writing to you to ask you to reconsider your decision to archive this cache. Please reconsider this decision and approve this virtual cache. 
 
I have 11 museum caches throughout Arizona and in some other states. These caches include:
 
Tempe Historical Museum
Scottsdale Historical Museum
Mesa Historical Museum
Chandler Museum
Gilbert Historical Museum
Arizona Historical Society Museum at Papago Park
Blanding Visitor Center
Kenton Museum
Gila Bend History and Archeology
Cave Creek History
Border Patrol
 
Every one of these caches were approved with no problems whatsover.   The Desert Caballeros Western Museum in Wickenburg is better than the majority of the museums listed above.  It is also not an easy cache to complete - you have to go through the entire museum and answer seven questions.  Some of these answers may be hard to find.
 
The Desert Caballeros Western Museum is the most popular attraction in Wickenburg and it is one of the best small museums in Arizona.  It is definitely a place that all geocachers should be encouraged to visit while in Wickenburg.
 
All of my other museum caches have received high acclaim and are very popular among my fellow geocachers.  In particular, they are popular to visit during the hot summer days in Arizona because the air-conditioned buildings are a respite from the summer heat.  These museums are open to children and people of all ages and are accessible to handicapped geocachers.  This allows everyone in the family to participate in geocaching.
 
In reviewing my previous museum caches, I noted that you approved two of my museum caches, Chandler Museum and Gilbert Historical Museum.  The e-mail addresses of geocachers in the Cc: listing above are other administrators who have approved my museum caches.  Please review this virtual museum cache with these individuals.
 
Please approve this virtual cache. Thank you.
 
Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


"Geocaching.com Automated Bot"  wrote:
Greetings from Geocaching.com.

This is an automated message letting you know that the cache has been archived. In case you plan to unarchive the cache in the future, keep this link for your records:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=70181

Message:
Your virtual cache was archived to prevent blocking of the approval queue. It was archived since it does not conform to the requirements regarding virtual caches. There are several traditional caches nearby and this virtual most likely could be a part of a multi-cache.

http://www.geocaching.com/articles/requirements.asp 

The location should also be a unique and compelling one of the sort that you'd find in a coffee table book, otherwise it would be more suited to posting at www.waypoint.org. Generally virtual caches are placed in locations where a traditional cache would not be allowed or would be inappropriate, since the virtual prevents a later physical cache being placed within a 0.1-mile radius of that spot. It looks like your cache description starts out as an ideal multistage cache hunt leading to a physical cache in the woods, but it just doesn't get there for some reason. 

Often a micro cache can be readily placed at or near the same spot submitted as a virtual cache. That would not only bring people to your special spot but gives them a physical cache to find as well.

Please reference the cache name and ID number when/if you reply via e-mail.

NOTE: do not select reply in your e-mail program if you wish to respond to this message from the geocaching.com mail bot. Go to your cache page and e-mail mtn-man from the archive log there.

Thanks for your understanding,

mtn-man
Geocaching.com ADMIN


If you did not archive this cache, please refer to the cache listing to read the log as to why it was archived and to contact the administrator. Responding directly to this message will not be answered.

Cheers,
Geocaching.com Team

--0-832875234-1053493379=:15588
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii




Mtn-man,


 


I am writing to you to ask you to reconsider your decision to archive this cache. Please reconsider this decision and approve this virtual cache. 


 


I have 11 museum caches throughout Arizona and in some other states. These caches include:


 













 


Every one of these caches were approved with no problems whatsover.   The Desert Caballeros Western Museum in Wickenburg is better than the majority of the museums listed above.  It is also not an easy cache to complete - you have to go through the entire museum and answer seven questions.  Some of these answers may be hard to find.


 


The Desert Caballeros Western Museum is the most popular attraction in Wickenburg and it is one of the best small museums in Arizona.  It is definitely a place that all geocachers should be encouraged to visit while in Wickenburg.


 


All of my other museum caches have received high acclaim and are very popular among my fellow geocachers.  In particular, they are popular to visit during the hot summer days in Arizona because the air-conditioned buildings are a respite from the summer heat.  These museums are open to children and people of all ages and are accessible to handicapped geocachers.  This allows everyone in the family to participate in geocaching.


 


In reviewing my previous museum caches, I noted that you approved two of my museum caches, Chandler Museum and Gilbert Historical Museum.  The e-mail addresses of geocachers in the Cc: listing above are other administrators who have approved my museum caches.  Please review this virtual museum cache with these individuals.


 


Please approve this virtual cache. Thank you.


 


Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)


 


 


 


 


 


 


 




"Geocaching.com Automated Bot" <newcaches@geocaching.com> wrote:


Greetings from Geocaching.com.

This is an automated message letting you know that the cache has been archived. In case you plan to unarchive the cache in the future, keep this link for your records:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=70181

Message:
Your virtual cache was archived to prevent blocking of the approval queue. It was archived since it does not conform to the requirements regarding virtual caches. There are several traditional caches nearby and this virtual most likely could be a part of a multi-cache.

http://www.geocaching.com/articles/requirements.asp 

The location should also be a unique and compelling one of the sort that you'd find in a coffee table book, otherwise it would be more suited to posting at www.waypoint.org. Generally virtual caches are placed in locations where a traditional cache would not be allowed or would be inappropriate, since the virtual prevents a later physical cache being placed within a 0.1-mile radius of that spot. It looks like your cache description starts out as an ideal multistage cache hunt leading to a physical cache in the woods, but it just doesn't get there for some reason. 

Often a micro cache can be readily placed at or near the same spot submitted as a virtual cache. That would not only bring people to your special spot but gives them a physical cache to find as well.

Please reference the cache name and ID number when/if you reply via e-mail.

NOTE: do not select reply in your e-mail program if you wish to respond to this message from the geocaching.com mail bot. Go to your cache page and e-mail mtn-man from the archive log there.

Thanks for your understanding,

mtn-man
Geocaching.com ADMIN


If you did not archive this cache, please refer to the cache listing to read the log as to why it was archived and to contact the administrator. Responding directly to this message will not be answered.

Cheers,
Geocaching.com Team

--0-832875234-1053493379=:15588--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 21 23:12:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 23:12:29 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 


Lonesome Bush Cache near Casa Grande seems to have been abandoned and is missing. Would anyone have any objections to Mike and I replacing  and maintaining the cache?




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 07:19:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 00:19:19 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31FF7.C9CF6020
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Gale and Mike,

Out of curiosity I tried pulling up Lonesome Bush Cache but got nothing. =
 I tried using different keywords.  Are you sure this cache hasn't been a=
rchived already?

Rand (RandMan)
----- Original Message -----
From: gale and mike
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 4:19 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?

Lonesome Bush Cache near Casa Grande seems to have been abandoned and is =
missing. Would anyone have any objections to Mike and I replacing  and ma=
intaining the cache?

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31FF7.C9CF6020
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


 
 <=
DIV>Gale and Mike, 
 
 
Out of curiosity I tried =
pulling up Lonesome Bush Cache but got nothing.  I =
tried using different keywords.  Are you sure this cache hasn't been=
 archived already?
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: gale and mike
=
 
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 4:1=
9 PM
 
To: listserv@azgeocachi=
ng.com
 
Subject: [Az-Geocachi=
ng] Abandoned cache?
 
 
 
 
Lonesome Bu=
sh Cache near Casa Grande seems to have been abandoned and is missing. Wo=
uld anyone have any objections to Mike and I replacing  and maintain=
ing the cache?


 
=


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C31FF7.C9CF6020--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 10:16:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 10:16:24 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 




Not archived. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=32987  It probably would have helped if I gave you the correct name. It's called Lonesome Bush. It's owned by Checkerbutt. Sorry for the inconvenience.









>From: "RAND HARDIN" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: "AZ-Geocaching" 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 00:19:19 -0700 

> 

> 

>Gale and Mike, 

> 

>Out of curiosity I tried pulling up Lonesome Bush Cache but got nothing. I tried using different keywords. Are you sure this cache hasn't been archived already? 

> 

>Rand (RandMan) 

>----- Original Message ----- 

>From: gale and mike 

>Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 4:19 PM 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

> 

>Lonesome Bush Cache near Casa Grande seems to have been abandoned and is missing. Would anyone have any objections to Mike and I replacing and maintaining the cache? 


Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 16:24:42 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:24:42 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030522092338.010d53e0@mail.myblueheaven.com>

--=====================_1207205==.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

At 10:16 AM 5/22/2003 +0000, you wrote:

>Not archived. 
>http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=32987 
>It probably would have helped if I gave you the correct name. It's called 
>Lonesome Bush. It's owned by Checkerbutt. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Have you tried to contact the owner of the cache yet?  Have you contacted 
the admins of the cache and see if they can contact them?  I would 
personally be more comfortable just creating a new cache after this one has 
been archived.

Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

--=====================_1207205==.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"



At 10:16 AM 5/22/2003 +0000, you wrote:



Not archived.
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=32987 
It probably would have helped if I gave you the correct name. It's called
Lonesome Bush. It's owned by Checkerbutt. Sorry for the
inconvenience.


Have you tried to contact the owner of the cache yet?  Have you
contacted the admins of the cache and see if they can contact them? 
I would personally be more comfortable just creating a new cache after
this one has been archived.  





Scott




scott@myblueheaven.com




--=====================_1207205==.ALT--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 20:40:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:40:26 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 





I tried to contact the owner yesterday but I'm not sure how long I should wait until giving up. I  sent him an earlier e-mail in March regarding the cache that he never responded to. Somewhere I remember reading that abandoned caches are sometimes adopted by other cachers. That's why I thought of doing that, but if Az cachers feel this one should be archived and a new one made, I'll do that. We have the container, log and new goodies all ready to go. Thanks for the input.





 








>From: Scott Wood 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:24:42 -0700 

> 



> 



> 

>Have you tried to contact the owner of the cache yet? Have you 

>contacted the admins of the cache and see if they can contact them? 

>I would personally be more comfortable just creating a new cache 

>after this one has been archived. 

> 

>Scott 

> 

>scott@myblueheaven.com 

>www.myblueheaven.com 


MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 20:59:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030522205932.21501.qmail@web21106.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1159693919-1053637172=:21336
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one.  If the cache is not located in a good area, then just move it nearby.  Create a new cache only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache.  Just my opinion.
 
Ken

--0-1159693919-1053637172=:21336
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one.  If the cache is not located in a good area, then just move it nearby.  Create a new cache only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache.  Just my opinion.


 


Ken

--0-1159693919-1053637172=:21336--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 22:10:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:10:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C32074.444D07E0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Gale and Mike,

I agree with Scott to a point.  Every effort should be made by you to con=
tact the cache owner and the administration also needs to try to make a c=
ontact.  =20

I feel there are too many good caches archived when an adoption or simply=
 replacing a stolen or replenishing a plundered cache would keep the cach=
e active.  If every effort is made to contact the cache owner and there i=
s no response, I see no problem adopting the cache if the admin allows it=
.

Rand (RandMan) =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Wood
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?

At 10:16 AM 5/22/2003 +0000, you wrote:


Not archived. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D3298=
7  It probably would have helped if I gave you the correct name. It's cal=
led Lonesome Bush. It's owned by Checkerbutt. Sorry for the inconvenience=
.

Have you tried to contact the owner of the cache yet?  Have you contacted=
 the admins of the cache and see if they can contact them?  I would perso=
nally be more comfortable just creating a new cache after this one has be=
en archived. =20


Scott


scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C32074.444D07E0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Gale and Mike,=

 
 
 
I agree with Scott to a point.  Every =
effort should be made by you to contact the cache owner and the admi=
nistration also needs to try to make a contact.  
 
 <=
/DIV> 
I feel there are too many good caches archived when an ad=
option or simply replacing a stolen or replenishing a plundered cach=
e would keep the cache active.  If every effort is made to contact t=
he cache owner and there is no response, I see no problem adopting the ca=
che if the admin allows it.
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan)&n=
bsp;
 
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----=

 
From: Scott Wood
 
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 AM
 
<=
B>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
 
 At 10:16 AM 5/22/2003 +0000, you wrote:

 
Not archived. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/=
cache_details.aspx?ID=3D32987  It probably would have helped if =
I gave you the correct name. It's called Lonesome Bush. It's owned by Che=
ckerbutt. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Have you tried to =
contact the owner of the cache yet?  Have you contacted the admins o=
f the cache and see if they can contact them?  I would personally be=
 more comfortable just creating a new cache after this one has been archi=
ved. 

 
Scott

 
scott@myblueheaven.com
 www.mybluehe=
aven.com


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C32074.444D07E0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 22 22:26:53 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:26:53 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030522152422.010cc588@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 03:10 PM 5/22/2003 -0700, you wrote:

>I feel there are too many good caches archived when an adoption or simply 
>replacing a stolen or replenishing a plundered cache would keep the cache 
>active.  If every effort is made to contact the cache owner and there is 
>no response, I see no problem adopting the cache if the admin allows it.
>

Actually, I think we agree completely on this one.  I think that every 
possible effort should be made to contact the owner, but if that fails, 
then go ahead and adopt the cache.  My point about replacing it and 
creating a new cache description was just as a shortcut.

At this point, you could just as easily take the new cache out and replace 
it without taking over ownership of it at this point.  I think all of us 
have done cache maintenance for other peoples caches when needed.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 04:34:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:34:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
Message-ID: 





Hi All, 


We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?


Thanks,


Andrew 









>From: Ken Akerman 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my opinion. 

> 

>Ken 


Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 05:09:12 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:09:12 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
References: 
Message-ID: <3ECDACF8.7000502@uccinc.net>

Yes - I have one and are very happy with it.

Marc (aka Tamo's Clan'Destiny)

Andrew Weissman, Psy.D. wrote:

>
> Hi All,
>
> We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to 
> geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the 
> Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Andrew
> >From: Ken Akerman >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com >To: 
> listserv@azgeocaching.com >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned 
> cache? >Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT) > >I prefer 
> keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than 
> archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not 
> located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache 
> only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache. 
> Just my opinion. > >Ken
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection 
>  with MSN 
> 8.____________________________________________________________ 
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your 
> setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 05:15:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:15:44 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000301c320ea$5cf6cc60$6501a8c0@TABLET>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C320AF.B097F460
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Andrew and Debbie,

 

Welcome to Geocaching, and welcome to the list server! It's too bad you
already have your doctorate, Andrew; you could probably write a dozen
dissertations just on what goes on here! :-)

 

I had generally good results with my Vista. The biggest problem I had
was that the adhesive for the external gasket melted after a year or so
of heavy use. I don't think it was really designed for caching in the
desert heat. (Come to think of it, neither am I.) But for casual use
it's probably fine. I suspect the prices have come way down with all of
Garmin's new models.

 

One other caution: You can't really take advantage of the mapping
capabilities of the Vista unless you spring for one or more of Garmin's
proprietary MapSource CDs. Those are hard to find with any significant
discounting, and they ain't no bargain, but they are the only thing that
will work, as far as I know.

 

Steve

Team Tierra Buena

 

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)

 


Hi All, 

We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to
geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the
Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?

Thanks,

Andrew 

>From: Ken Akerman 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT) 

> 

>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather
than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not
located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache
only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache.
Just my opinion. 

> 

>Ken 




  _____  

Tired of spam? Get advanced   junk
mail protection with MSN 8.

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C320AF.B097F460
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



















Andrew and =
Debbie,



 



Welcome to Geocaching, and welcome =
to the
list server! It’s too bad you already have your doctorate, Andrew; =
you
could probably write a dozen dissertations just on what goes on here! =
J



 



I had generally good results with =
my Vista. The biggest =
problem I
had was that the adhesive for the external gasket melted after a year or =
so of
heavy use. I don’t think it was really designed for caching in the =
desert
heat. (Come to think of it, neither am I.) But for casual use it’s
probably fine. I suspect the prices have come way down with all of =
Garmin’s
new models.



 



One other caution: You can’t =
really
take advantage of the mapping capabilities of the Vista unless you =
spring for one
or more of Garmin’s proprietary MapSource CDs. Those are hard to =
find with
any significant discounting, and they ain’t no bargain, but they =
are the
only thing that will work, as far as I know.



 



Steve



Team Tierra Buena



 






-----Original Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Weissman, =
Psy.D.

Sent: Thursday, May 22, =
2003 9:34
PM

To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Hello
Everyone :)



 











Hi All, 



We are
Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to =
geocaching. We
are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the Garmin Etrex =
Vista?
Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?



Thanks,









Andrew 






>From: Ken Akerman 





>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 



>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 



>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? =




>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT) =




> 



>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving =
it,
rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is =
not
located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache =
only if
the new cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my =
opinion. 



> 



>Ken 





















Tired of spam? Get advanced
junk mail protection with MSN 8.











____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C320AF.B097F460--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 05:59:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian LaFrance)
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:59:24 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_00BA_01C320B5.C9F23910
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I'm very happy with my Vista.  If you shop around, the mapping software
isn't too bad either...when you consider the benefit of having it.

Brian (Team AZEvil)

  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Weissman, Psy.D.
  Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)



  Hi All,

  We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to
geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the
Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?

  Thanks,


  Andrew
  >From: Ken Akerman
  >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
  >Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT)
  >
  >I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than
archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not located in a
good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache only if the new
cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my opinion.
  >
  >Ken


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_000_00BA_01C320B5.C9F23910
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







I'm=20
very happy with my Vista.  If you shop around, the mapping software =
isn't=20
too bad either...when you consider the benefit of having =
it.


 


Brian=20
(Team AZEvil)


 



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 =
9:34=20
  PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: =
[Az-Geocaching]=20
  Hello Everyone :)


  

  

  

Hi All, 

  
We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced =
to=20
  geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the =
Garmin=20
  Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?

  
Thanks,

  
Andrew=20
  

  

  

  

  
>From: Ken Akerman 
  
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?=20
  
>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT)=20
  
>=20
  
>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and =
improving it,=20
  rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache =
is not=20
  located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache =
only if=20
  the new cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my =
opinion.=20

  
>=20
  
>Ken=20
  


  

  Tired of spam? Get advanced junk=20
  mail protection with MSN 8.=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:00:56 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:00:56 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_2651_d54_1501
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I agree with Highpointer... if the cache will be replaced and put back in 
pretty much the same place (within a hundred feet or whatever), then it 
should stay the same GC# and just un-archived. I remember a cache in 
Ahwatukee area (It was Fire Closure 2/2A?) that was replaced as a whole new 
GC#, yet the cache was in the exact same place. The old one simply should 
have been un-archived.

If you move it to a new location, then (in my opinion) it should become a 
whole new cache (and GC#).

So I say keep it the same GC# (and save geocaching.com some work and also 
wasting another GC#) if you are going to put it back in the same spot.

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

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I tried to contact the owner yesterday but I'm not sure how long I should wait until giving up. I  sent him an earlier e-mail in March regarding the cache that he never responded to. Somewhere I remember reading that abandoned caches are sometimes adopted by other cachers. That's why I thought of doing that, but if Az cachers feel this one should be archived and a new one made, I'll do that. We have the container, log and new goodies all ready to go. Thanks for the input.





 








>From: Scott Wood 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 09:24:42 -0700 

> 



> 



> 

>Have you tried to contact the owner of the cache yet? Have you 

>contacted the admins of the cache and see if they can contact them? 

>I would personally be more comfortable just creating a new cache 

>after this one has been archived. 

> 

>Scott 

> 

>scott@myblueheaven.com 

>www.myblueheaven.com 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:12:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Virgil Silhanek)
Date: 23 May 2003 10:12:15 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
Message-ID: <1053709935.13109.3.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>

Hey all,

I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
save time?  

If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
coordinates to anyone upon request.

Thanks,
Virgil Silhanek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:14:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Scott Wood)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:14:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS
 Coordinates
In-Reply-To: <1053709935.13109.3.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.2.20030523101359.010d0718@mail.myblueheaven.com>

At 10:12 AM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey all,
>
>I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
>Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
>wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
>save time?

That is a wonderful book and I have had the same thoughts in the past, but 
never got around to doing it.


>If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
>coordinates to anyone upon request.

I would love a copy.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:21:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:21:15 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
Message-ID: 

Howdy and welcome to AZ geocaching!

Just my opinion, but I think the Garmin Etrex Legend or Vista is the best 
bang for your buck when it comes to GPS units. The vista can be found for a 
pretty reasonable price these days on Ebay too.

I have a Legend (pretty much the same as the Vista) and I have been very 
pleased with it. I like it so much, that I have been using it for the past 
year for ballooning competitions (I fly hot air balloons). I also have a 
Garmin 3+ (I did, I sold it) that I used for ballooning, but I like the 
Legend because it is very small and handy and started using it for 
competitions when It was originally purchased for geocaching! Has lots of 
great features (even 1000 waypoints stored). The Legend has all the features 
of the Vista except... the Legend store 8mb map while the Vista has 24mb. 
Also, the Vista has an altimeter and something else on it that the Legend 
does not. I would like to purchase a Vista as well and keep the Legend as my 
backup. These two are the only Etrex models that allow for map downloading.

The only problems I have ever experienced with the Legend/Vista is what has 
already been discussed here... the rubber grip that goes around the side of 
it may start to peel off after a bit of heavy use on hot days. The 
glue/paste on the backside melts away when it gets hot out. I never turned 
mine back in to have this problem fixed and have been using the GPS for 
almost 2 years now since this first happened and the grip is still on there. 
  But, that is the only prob I have experienced with it.

>>>Steve (Team Tierra Buena Wrote):

>One other caution: You can’t really take advantage of the mapping 
>capabilities of the Vista unless you >spring for one or more of Garmin’s 
>proprietary MapSource CDs. Those are hard to find with any >significant 
>discounting, and they ain’t no bargain, but they are the only thing that 
>will work, as far as I >know.

Steve is correct, the base map is very BASic :).  Not much to it. But, you 
will find that with any brand GPS you buy. You simply have to purchase 
mapping software. The Garmin Mapsource is actually the best bargin out there 
really. Mapsource's topo maps cover the entire USA on 2 disks (west and 
east). Each one costs like $116 dollars each (or somewhere around there). 
Any other mapping software I have seen puts each state in a seperate package 
and usually on 4 or 5 disks for each state. Each state is priced at about 
$100 each! Now, go out and buy all 50 states. If you travel around the 
country like I do.. this is not practical! However, the Mapsource is not 
quite as detailed (1:50) as those state map CD's(1:24), but it is plenty 
enough detailed for me.

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:35:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:35:19 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS  Coordinates
In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.2.20030523101359.010d0718@mail.myblueheaven.com>
Message-ID: 

The same thing occurred to me. I looked around and did a web search and
couldn't find anything. I was surprised the publishers didn't offer a
download.

I would love a copy too please! Thanks!

andy at britishideas dot com

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Scott
Wood
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:15 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS
Coordinates


At 10:12 AM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey all,
>
>I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
>Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
>wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
>save time?

That is a wonderful book and I have had the same thoughts in the past, but
never got around to doing it.


>If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
>coordinates to anyone upon request.

I would love a copy.



Scott

scott@myblueheaven.com
www.myblueheaven.com

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:32:17 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Koch, Dan)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:32:17 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinate
 s
Message-ID: 

I have a bunch of them entered as routes for Terrain Navigator.  You are
welcome to the route file if you want it.  I don't know how useful it will
be for just the coords.

The other option is to check the website for the book.  When last I looked,
they had a waypoint file for some of the other states and the site said that
an AZ waypoint file would be coming soon.  It's been probably over a year
since I checked.  I think the website is on the back of the book.

LazyK - Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: Virgil Silhanek [mailto:silhanek@cox.net]
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:12 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates


Hey all,

I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
save time?  

If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
coordinates to anyone upon request.

Thanks,
Virgil Silhanek

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:46:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 10:46:22 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

Dan,

Could you please send me the TN file? Thanks a lot! :)

andy at britishideas dot com

Andy

--
Andrew Ayre          Embedded Systems Academy
aayre@esacademy.com  www.esacademy.com
PGP encrypted Email accepted

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Koch,
Dan
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:32 AM
To: 'listserv@azgeocaching.com'
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS
Coordinates


I have a bunch of them entered as routes for Terrain Navigator.  You are
welcome to the route file if you want it.  I don't know how useful it will
be for just the coords.

The other option is to check the website for the book.  When last I looked,
they had a waypoint file for some of the other states and the site said that
an AZ waypoint file would be coming soon.  It's been probably over a year
since I checked.  I think the website is on the back of the book.

LazyK - Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: Virgil Silhanek [mailto:silhanek@cox.net]
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:12 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates


Hey all,

I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
save time?

If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
coordinates to anyone upon request.

Thanks,
Virgil Silhanek

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
____________________________________________________________
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 17:59:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Virgil Silhanek)
Date: 23 May 2003 10:59:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS  Coordinates
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <1053712764.13109.6.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>

Unfortunately, it still lists the AZ coordinates as coming soon.  Utah
and Colorado are available for download from their site.

Virgil Silhanek


On Fri, 2003-05-23 at 10:35, Andrew Ayre wrote:
> The same thing occurred to me. I looked around and did a web search and
> couldn't find anything. I was surprised the publishers didn't offer a
> download.
> 
> I would love a copy too please! Thanks!
> 
> andy at britishideas dot com
> 
> Andy
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Scott
> Wood
> Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:15 AM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS
> Coordinates
> 
> 
> At 10:12 AM 5/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >Hey all,
> >
> >I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
> >Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
> >wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
> >save time?
> 
> That is a wonderful book and I have had the same thoughts in the past, but
> never got around to doing it.
> 
> 
> >If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
> >coordinates to anyone upon request.
> 
> I would love a copy.
> 
> 
> 
> Scott
> 
> scott@myblueheaven.com
> www.myblueheaven.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 18:03:05 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jim Scotti)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:03:05 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
In-Reply-To: <1053709935.13109.3.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

On 23 May 2003, Virgil Silhanek wrote:

> Hey all,
> 
> I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
> Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
> wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
> save time?  
> 
> If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
> coordinates to anyone upon request.

I'd be interested too.  I wonder if there may already be a website or file by
the author with the coordinates?

Jim.

Jim Scotti
Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
University of Arizona
Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 18:24:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:24:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3ECE6762.4050604@snaptek.com>

if you peoples ever come up with the way points or routes or what ever...

we could host them here on the website for people to beable to download 
a copy...

just email them to us

geocaching@azgeocaching.com

jason
snaptek
azgeocaching.com


Jim Scotti wrote:
> On 23 May 2003, Virgil Silhanek wrote:
> 
> 
>>Hey all,
>>
>>I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
>>Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
>>wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
>>save time?  
>>
>>If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
>>coordinates to anyone upon request.
> 
> 
> I'd be interested too.  I wonder if there may already be a website or file by
> the author with the coordinates?
> 
> Jim.
> 
> Jim Scotti
> Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
> University of Arizona
> Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 19:56:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 12:56:00 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS  Update
Message-ID: 

Just to muddy the water a bit on which is the best GPS to use I thought
that I would let you all know about a new Garmin unit that I have seen on
the web. It is the iOue 3600. It is a PDA that runs on the Palm software
but with  build in GPS. It is not a PDA that you hang a GPS unit on to. It
looks very interesting. Not sure if it is on the market yet. But if you are
in the market for either a new GPS or a PDA this might be the way to go. I
think that I am going to put some money away and get one. I will let you
all know how it works out. That is unless someone out there has already
gotten one. And then I would be interested in your feed back?

Barry



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 20:20:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:20:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Geocache Handicap Guideline Generator
Message-ID: <3ECE827A.2040008@snaptek.com>

there is now a link on the azgeocaching.com site menu, in the links section

so people can access it more easily

jason



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 20:45:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Donn Sanford)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:45:41 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
In-Reply-To: <1053709935.13109.3.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>
Message-ID: 

I'd like a copy, too.

Thanks

Donn

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
Virgil Silhanek
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 10:12 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates


Hey all,

I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
save time?  

If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
coordinates to anyone upon request.

Thanks,
Virgil Silhanek

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 23 21:39:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 14:39:40 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
Message-ID: <20030523143940.25085.h015.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Welcome to geocaching, Andrew and Debbie, and to our "nutty"
extended-email family. In what area do you practice? I need therapy!
:-)

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

On Thu, 22 May 2003 21:34:06 -0700, "Andrew Weissman, Psy.D." wrote:


Hi All, 
We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to
geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the
Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?
Thanks,
Andrew 




>From: Ken Akerman 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache? 
>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT) 
> 
>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather
than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not
located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache
only if the new cache is very much different than the existing cache.
Just my opinion. 
> 
>Ken 
Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 24 04:46:32 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Virgil Silhanek)
Date: 23 May 2003 21:46:32 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arizona Backcountry Adventures GPS Coordinates
In-Reply-To: <3ECE6762.4050604@snaptek.com>
References: 
 <3ECE6762.4050604@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <1053751592.11437.9.camel@ip68-3-80-44.ph.ph.cox.net>

It'll be another week or so before I get everything entered, but I'll be
happy to send a copy to be posted on the website when I'm done.

Virgil Silhanek

On Fri, 2003-05-23 at 11:24, Jason Poulter wrote:
> if you peoples ever come up with the way points or routes or what ever...
> 
> we could host them here on the website for people to beable to download 
> a copy...
> 
> just email them to us
> 
> geocaching@azgeocaching.com
> 
> jason
> snaptek
> azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> Jim Scotti wrote:
> > On 23 May 2003, Virgil Silhanek wrote:
> > 
> > 
> >>Hey all,
> >>
> >>I started typing in the coordinates from the Arizona Backcountry
> >>Adventures book so I could load them into my Magellan GPS.  I was
> >>wondering if anyone has already done this and could send them to me to
> >>save time?  
> >>
> >>If not, once I'm done typing them in, I'd be happy to send the
> >>coordinates to anyone upon request.
> > 
> > 
> > I'd be interested too.  I wonder if there may already be a website or file by
> > the author with the coordinates?
> > 
> > Jim.
> > 
> > Jim Scotti
> > Lunar & Planetary Laboratory
> > University of Arizona
> > Tucson, AZ 85721 USA                 http://www.lpl.arizona.edu/~jscotti/    
> > 
> > ____________________________________________________________
> > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> > 
> > Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> > http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 24 21:36:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:36:39 PDT
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO  SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA
Message-ID: <200305242136.h4OLadZK008822@mx7.sjc.ebay.com>

I heard on KTAR radio today that HOGANS HOTEL is for sale.  Arizona geocachers have a great opportunity to own this virtual geocache.  Perhaps some of us should get together to buy this condo, and turn it into a meeting location for event geocaches.

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

Title of item:	INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO  SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA
Seller:	shawnabwana
Starts:	May-14-03 21:49:20 PDT
Ends:	Jun-13-03 21:49:20 PDT
Price:	Currently $180,000.00
To bid on the item, go to:	http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2323300725


Item Description:		
	
Scottsdale and Crane have long been linked in the public mind.  You have seen the front door of this condominium on numerous unsolved crime specials.  This condo has been owned by the sellers for the past 17 years.  The property is located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona, and for sale to the highest bidder.
This 2 bedroom 2 bathroom condominium was the residence of Bob Crane for the month of June, 1978 before his untimely demise by an unknown assailant while asleep in the bedroom.  The activities that took place here have been documented numerous times, most recently in the Arizona Republic, New York Times, 20/20 and Inside Edition as well as others.  Release of the film Auto Focus, in November 2002, brought renewed interest in Crane who became famous in the 1960s with the starring role of Colonel Hogan in the sit com Hogans Heroes.
This condominium, currently being auctioned for sale, is the place Crane and his friend, John Carpe!
nter, experimented with the “new technology” of video tape.  Stories and reports show that Crane found a bevy of willing partners in his sex adventures while living at Winfield Place and working at a local Scottsdale dinner theatre.
Why is there still interest in the life of Bob Crane?  “Sex sells”  Here we have celebrity, sex and tragedy.  You are bidding on the actual site where it happened; the sex, the videos, the tragic end.
Located adjacent to Chaparral Suites Resort and ˝ block from The Sunburst Resort, Winfield Place is a quiet resort condominium complex of 248 total units located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona approximately a mile north of the city center.  Originally constructed in 1975 as luxury apartments, the units were converted to condominiums in 1979.  There are 2 heated swim pools, spa, 2 saunas and clubhouse.  The grounds are lush and spacious with fountains and a stream meandering through.  The “Bob Crane” condo is located poolside and just steps !
away from the clubhouse with a kitchen window view of Camelback Mountain.  This condo is in very good condition.  Furniture is not included in this sale.
Purchase of this property will require all cash.  The Association CC&Rs do not allow commercial enterprise or business use of the property, however they do allow residential leases of not less than 1 month per period.  Agent represents owner.  Equal opportunity for all protected classes. Offered by West USA Realty. Serious inquiries will be answered.  All appointments to view property will be handled through email at 
ardyhaines@qwest.net
  Showings by appointment only on weekends.  Purchaser must provide ID and verification of ability to purchase upon making appointment for viewing.


	Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 24 22:17:24 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale and mike)
Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:17:24 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS
 BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA
Message-ID: 








Old news. I heard about it 1-2 weeks ago. It would be great to co-own it especially on Halloween or the anniversary of his death to see if it is haunted, but I don't have $1-2000 handy to toss at this. Besides CC&R's (gotta love those HOA's) say no commercial enterprises. The HOA lawyers would probably make a case that geocaching is commmercial.


But then again. Maybe we could take up a collection from national geocachers of $1-10 each and buy it that way. My brother is a lawyer and does real estate on the side. He could draw up the paperwork granting ownership to an association of Arizona geocachers. Perhaps find a way to minimize property taxes...


Sorry. Pain meds are making me a little punchy. : ) LOL










>From: ken@highpointer.com 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA 

>Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:36:39 PDT 

> 

>I heard on KTAR radio today that HOGANS HOTEL is for sale. Arizona geocachers have a great opportunity to own this virtual geocache. Perhaps some of us should get together to buy this condo, and turn it into a meeting location for event geocaches. 

> 

>Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) 

> 

>Title of item: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA 

>Seller: shawnabwana 

>Starts: May-14-03 21:49:20 PDT 

>Ends: Jun-13-03 21:49:20 PDT 

>Price: Currently $180,000.00 

>To bid on the item, go to: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2323300725 

> 

> 

>Item Description: 

> 

Scottsdale and Crane have long been linked in the public mind. You have seen the front door of this condominium on numerous unsolved crime specials. This condo has been owned by the sellers for the past 17 years. The property is located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona, and for sale to the highest bidder.

This 2 bedroom 2 bathroom condominium was the residence of Bob Crane for the month of June, 1978 before his untimely demise by an unknown assailant while asleep in the bedroom. The activities that took place here have been documented numerous times, most recently in the Arizona Republic, New York Times, 20/20 and Inside Edition as well as others. Release of the film Auto Focus, in November 2002, brought renewed interest in Crane who became famous in the 1960s with the starring role of Colonel Hogan in the sit com Hogans Heroes.

This condominium, currently being auctioned for sale, is the place Crane and his friend, John Carpe! 

>nter, experimented with the “new technology” of video tape. Stories and reports show that Crane found a bevy of willing partners in his sex adventures while living at Winfield Place and working at a local Scottsdale dinner theatre.

Why is there still interest in the life of Bob Crane? “Sex sells” Here we have celebrity, sex and tragedy. You are bidding on the actual site where it happened; the sex, the videos, the tragic end.

Located adjacent to Chaparral Suites Resort and ˝ block from The Sunburst Resort, Winfield Place is a quiet resort condominium complex of 248 total units located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona approximately a mile north of the city center. Originally constructed in 1975 as luxury apartments, the units were converted to condominiums in 1979. There are 2 heated swim pools, spa, 2 saunas and clubhouse. The grounds are lush and spacious with fountains and a stream meandering through. The “Bob Crane” condo is located poolside and just steps ! 

>away from the clubhouse with a kitchen window view of Camelback Mountain. This condo is in very good condition. Furniture is not included in this sale.

Purchase of this property will require all cash. The Association CC&Rs do not allow commercial enterprise or business use of the property, however they do allow residential leases of not less than 1 month per period. Agent represents owner. Equal opportunity for all protected classes. Offered by West USA Realty. Serious inquiries will be answered. All appointments to view property will be handled through email at 

ardyhaines@qwest.net
Showings by appointment only on weekends. Purchaser must provide ID and verification of ability to purchase upon making appointment for viewing. 

> 

> 

> Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com 

>____________________________________________________________ 

>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> 

>Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

>http://www.azgeocaching.com 


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 25 00:17:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 17:17:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS
 BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA
Message-ID: 

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Debbie said I can donate a dollar to the cause :) Now all we need is 179,999 more 



















Andrew 
















 
















>From: "gale and mike" 
















>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 















>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 















>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA 















>Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 22:17:24 +0000 















> 






























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Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS
 BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA
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Old news. I heard about it 1-2 weeks ago. It would be great to co-own it especially on Halloween or the anniversary of his death to see if it is haunted, but I don't have $1-2000 handy to toss at this. Besides CC&R's (gotta love those HOA's) say no commercial enterprises. The HOA lawyers would probably make a case that geocaching is commmercial.


But then again. Maybe we could take up a collection from national geocachers of $1-10 each and buy it that way. My brother is a lawyer and does real estate on the side. He could draw up the paperwork granting ownership to an association of Arizona geocachers. Perhaps find a way to minimize property taxes...


Sorry. Pain meds are making me a little punchy. : ) LOL










>From: ken@highpointer.com 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2323300725: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA 

>Date: Sat, 24 May 2003 14:36:39 PDT 

> 

>I heard on KTAR radio today that HOGANS HOTEL is for sale. Arizona geocachers have a great opportunity to own this virtual geocache. Perhaps some of us should get together to buy this condo, and turn it into a meeting location for event geocaches. 

> 

>Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer) 

> 

>Title of item: INFAMOUS BOB CRANE CONDO SCOTTSDALE, ARIZONA 

>Seller: shawnabwana 

>Starts: May-14-03 21:49:20 PDT 

>Ends: Jun-13-03 21:49:20 PDT 

>Price: Currently $180,000.00 

>To bid on the item, go to: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2323300725 

> 

> 

>Item Description: 

> 

Scottsdale and Crane have long been linked in the public mind. You have seen the front door of this condominium on numerous unsolved crime specials. This condo has been owned by the sellers for the past 17 years. The property is located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona, and for sale to the highest bidder.

This 2 bedroom 2 bathroom condominium was the residence of Bob Crane for the month of June, 1978 before his untimely demise by an unknown assailant while asleep in the bedroom. The activities that took place here have been documented numerous times, most recently in the Arizona Republic, New York Times, 20/20 and Inside Edition as well as others. Release of the film Auto Focus, in November 2002, brought renewed interest in Crane who became famous in the 1960s with the starring role of Colonel Hogan in the sit com Hogans Heroes.

This condominium, currently being auctioned for sale, is the place Crane and his friend, John Carpe! 

>nter, experimented with the “new technology” of video tape. Stories and reports show that Crane found a bevy of willing partners in his sex adventures while living at Winfield Place and working at a local Scottsdale dinner theatre.

Why is there still interest in the life of Bob Crane? “Sex sells” Here we have celebrity, sex and tragedy. You are bidding on the actual site where it happened; the sex, the videos, the tragic end.

Located adjacent to Chaparral Suites Resort and ˝ block from The Sunburst Resort, Winfield Place is a quiet resort condominium complex of 248 total units located in the heart of Scottsdale, Arizona approximately a mile north of the city center. Originally constructed in 1975 as luxury apartments, the units were converted to condominiums in 1979. There are 2 heated swim pools, spa, 2 saunas and clubhouse. The grounds are lush and spacious with fountains and a stream meandering through. The “Bob Crane” condo is located poolside and just steps ! 

>away from the clubhouse with a kitchen window view of Camelback Mountain. This condo is in very good condition. Furniture is not included in this sale.

Purchase of this property will require all cash. The Association CC&Rs do not allow commercial enterprise or business use of the property, however they do allow residential leases of not less than 1 month per period. Agent represents owner. Equal opportunity for all protected classes. Offered by West USA Realty. Serious inquiries will be answered. All appointments to view property will be handled through email at 

ardyhaines@qwest.net
Showings by appointment only on weekends. Purchaser must provide ID and verification of ability to purchase upon making appointment for viewing. 

> 

> 

> Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com 

>____________________________________________________________ 

>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

> 

>Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

>http://www.azgeocaching.com 


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____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_000_5f7b_29dd_618d--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sun May 25 19:50:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (HighwayHavoc)
Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 12:50:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Congratulations
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030525195018.42053.qmail@web40504.mail.yahoo.com>

I just happened to notice that RandMan has crossed
over and made it to the first page of the find stats
for Arizona. Congratulations!

Mark A. Pedersen

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 03:14:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Sun, 25 May 2003 20:14:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together
Message-ID: <001701c32334$ef1e7c90$6501a8c0@TABLET>

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Sorry for the last minute notice. A couple of cachers have been
interested in seeing the business we've bought, and I figure I might as
well make it an opportunity for anyone else who is interested and may
have the time. We're meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 10:30 AM at our place
of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite 106. In lieu of a hint you
can call 480.991.1198.

This is not an event cache because there is no way to do it without it
being a "commercial" cache (full disclosure: with any luck on our part
you might actually want to buy something from us, but if you show up
you're under no obligation to buy). No refreshments unless you bring
your own. We'll probably only be there for an hour at most, so you'll
still have plenty of time to make your afternoon barbecues.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena


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Sorry for the last minute notice. A couple of cachers =
have
been interested in seeing the business we’ve bought, and I figure =
I might
as well make it an opportunity for anyone else who is interested and may =
have
the time. We’re meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 10:30 AM at our
place of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite 106. In lieu of
a hint you can call 480.991.1198.



This is not an event cache because there is no way to =
do it
without it being a “commercial” cache (full disclosure: with =
any
luck on our part you might actually want to buy something from us, but =
if you
show up you’re under no obligation to buy). No refreshments unless =
you
bring your own. We’ll probably only be there for an hour at most, =
so you’ll
still have plenty of time to make your afternoon =
barbecues.



Steve

Team Tierra Buena









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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 18:18:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 18:18:02 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Please help this poor guy!
Message-ID: 




See this link http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=2016058331&m=99660895


He posted a "do not find" on a cache on my watch list, Show Me the Quail.  He's a new Phoenix area geocacher. I've sent him 2 e-mails with no response. (I probably scared him!) Anyway, he's looked for 11 caches without any success. I'd hate to see him and his family give up because they don't know how to use the GPS or something.



Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 19:32:35 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:32:35 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Please help this poor guy!
Message-ID: <20030526123236.5881.h016.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

I read the thread. Looks like plenty of folks are willing to help the
newbie out. Any answer from him yet?
Trisha


On Mon, 26 May 2003 18:18:02 +0000, "gale 'Desert Viking'" wrote:


See this link
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=2016058331&m=99660895
He posted a "do not find" on a cache on my watch list, Show Me the
Quail.  He's a new Phoenix area geocacher. I've sent him 2 e-mails
with no response. (I probably scared him!) Anyway, he's looked for 11
caches without any success. I'd hate to see him and his family give up
because they don't know how to use the GPS or something.
Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes  On one
everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:"Something hidden. 
Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --  "Something lost
behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

 

Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898
Protect your PC - Click here for McAfee.com VirusScan Online 
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 20:03:21 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (James and Diane Herr)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:03:21 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Please help this poor guy!
References: <200305261905.MAA16141@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <3ED27309.1010401@cox.net>

I sent him an email with the location of our 'Show me the Quail' cache, 
as well as an offer to meet up with him and help him get a find or two. 
 I think he expects to find all the caches on the ground.  From his log 
entry, it sounds like he was close to the cache, but looking at the 
ground.  I just sent off the email but hopefully it will help him or he 
will take me up on my offer of help.

Jim - Team 8 Feet


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 20:21:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bell, Robert)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:21:08 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together
Message-ID: 

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"

I just want to thank Steve for taking time off his holiday weekend to do
this.  He has
some very cool stuff (of which I have some now) and at closeout prices.  I
bet some
items could be cache prizes and containers too!
 
Thanks Steve!
Rob and Troy, Team CHUMP

-----Original Message-----
From: Team Tierra Buena [mailto:teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net]
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 20:15
To: Arizona Geocaching
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together



Sorry for the last minute notice. A couple of cachers have been interested
in seeing the business we've bought, and I figure I might as well make it an
opportunity for anyone else who is interested and may have the time. We're
meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 10:30 AM at our place of business: N 33 37.431
W 111 55.309. Suite 106. In lieu of a hint you can call 480.991.1198.

This is not an event cache because there is no way to do it without it being
a "commercial" cache (full disclosure: with any luck on our part you might
actually want to buy something from us, but if you show up you're under no
obligation to buy). No refreshments unless you bring your own. We'll
probably only be there for an hour at most, so you'll still have plenty of
time to make your afternoon barbecues.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena


------_=_NextPart_001_01C323C4.57C3FC90
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"











I just 
want to thank Steve for taking time off his holiday weekend to do this.  He 
has


some 
very cool stuff (of which I have some now) and at closeout prices.  I bet 
some


items 
could be cache prizes and containers too!


 


Thanks 
Steve!


Rob 
and Troy, Team CHUMP



  
-----Original Message-----
From: Team Tierra Buena 
  [mailto:teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net]
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 
  20:15
To: Arizona Geocaching
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] 
  Impromptu Get-Together


  

  
Sorry for the last minute notice. 
  A couple of cachers have been interested in seeing the business we've bought, 
  and I figure I might as well make it an opportunity for anyone else who is 
  interested and may have the time. We're meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 
  10:30 AM at our 
  place of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite 
  106. In lieu of a hint you can call 
  480.991.1198.

  
This is not an event cache because 
  there is no way to do it without it being a "commercial" cache (full 
  disclosure: with any luck on our part you might actually want to buy something 
  from us, but if you show up you're under no obligation to buy). No 
  refreshments unless you bring your own. We'll probably only be there for an 
  hour at most, so you'll still have plenty of time to make your afternoon 
  barbecues.

  
Steve
Team Tierra 
  Buena


------_=_NextPart_001_01C323C4.57C3FC90--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 20:35:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 13:35:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together
References: <001701c32334$ef1e7c90$6501a8c0@TABLET>
Message-ID: <002901c323c6$68c2cec0$4428b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Steve=20

so sorry that I wasn't able to attend today I have an excuse really just =
ask Jim of AZsaluki

what will be the normal hours that we can attend on other days?
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Team Tierra Buena=20
  To: Arizona Geocaching=20
  Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 8:14 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together


  Sorry for the last minute notice. A couple of cachers have been =
interested in seeing the business we've bought, and I figure I might as =
well make it an opportunity for anyone else who is interested and may =
have the time. We're meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 10:30 AM at our place =
of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite 106. In lieu of a hint you =
can call 480.991.1198.

  This is not an event cache because there is no way to do it without it =
being a "commercial" cache (full disclosure: with any luck on our part =
you might actually want to buy something from us, but if you show up =
you're under no obligation to buy). No refreshments unless you bring =
your own. We'll probably only be there for an hour at most, so you'll =
still have plenty of time to make your afternoon barbecues.

  Steve
  Team Tierra Buena

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Steve 


 


so sorry that I wasn't able to =
attend today I=20
have an excuse really just ask Jim of AZsaluki


 


what will be the normal hours that we =
can attend on=20
other days?



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Team Tierra Buena =


  
To: Arizona =
Geocaching=20
  

  
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 8:14 =
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Impromptu=20
  Get-Together

  


  

  
Sorry for the last =
minute notice.=20
  A couple of cachers have been interested in seeing the business =
we=92ve bought,=20
  and I figure I might as well make it an opportunity for anyone else =
who is=20
  interested and may have the time. We=92re meeting Monday (tomorrow) at =

  10:30 =
AM at our=20
  place of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite=20
  106. In lieu of a hint you =
can call=20
  480.991.1198.

  
This is not an event =
cache because=20
  there is no way to do it without it being a =93commercial=94 cache =
(full=20
  disclosure: with any luck on our part you might actually want to buy =
something=20
  from us, but if you show up you=92re under no obligation to buy). No=20
  refreshments unless you bring your own. We=92ll probably only be there =
for an=20
  hour at most, so you=92ll still have plenty of time to make your =
afternoon=20
  barbecues.

  
Steve
Team Tierra=20
  Buena


------=_NextPart_000_0026_01C3238B.BB4FC7A0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 22:36:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:36:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
Message-ID: <20030526223625.31853.qmail@web40609.mail.yahoo.com>

Resending, I didn't see it appear onn the list.

> Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced. 
> 
>
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=32062
> 
> I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> thing I ask is that these caches never become
> members
> only. Please email me if you have found either of
> these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.
> 
> 
> Eric
> Team Dragon


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 23:06:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 23:06:51 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Please help this poor guy!
Message-ID: 









No response as yet. Thank you to the Az cachers for offering to help him. Hopefully he'll take someone up on their offer.


 


There's a store called Simbatta at Baseline and Gilbert Rds. NE corner. They are going out of business this week. Although it is primarily a Korean import store, they have some small screw type aluminum containers for 89 cents that are good micros. We got 3 (expect to see those soon).









>From: "Trisha" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Please help this poor guy! 

>Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 12:32:35 -0700 (MST) 

> 

>I read the thread. Looks like plenty of folks are willing to help the 

>newbie out. Any answer from him yet? 

>Trisha 

> 

> 

>On Mon, 26 May 2003 18:18:02 +0000, "gale 'Desert Viking'" wrote: 



>He posted a "do not find" on a cache on my watch list, Show Me the 

>Quail.  He's a new Phoenix area geocacher. I've sent him 2 e-mails 

>with no response. Anyway, he's looked for 11 

>caches without any success. 


Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 22:58:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Joe Brekke)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 15:58:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
References: <20030526223625.31853.qmail@web40609.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001901c323da$423f6740$f950a8c0@default>

We would be happy to take over Picnic Leftover Returns.  We are members, but
will NEVER make a Members Only Cache.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Quinn" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 3:36 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption


> Resending, I didn't see it appear onn the list.
>
> > Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced.
> >
> >
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=32062
> >
> > I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> > Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> > thing I ask is that these caches never become
> > members
> > only. Please email me if you have found either of
> > these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.
> >
> >
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 00:44:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 17:44:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C323AE.7EC7A280
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Eric,

I don't live very far from Arrowhead Menace and would be able to adopt th=
e cache if it is still available.

Rand Hardin
(RandMan)

----- Original Message -----
From: Eric Quinn
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 3:41 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption

Resending, I didn't see it appear onn the list.

> Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced. =20
> =20
>
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D32062
> =20
> I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> thing I ask is that these caches never become
> members
> only. Please email me if you have found either of
> these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.
> =20
> =20
> Eric
> Team Dragon


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

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Eric,
   
I don't live very far from Arrowhead Menace =
and would be able to adopt the cache if it is still available. 
 
 
Rand Hardin
 
(RandMan)
 
&=
nbsp;
 
 ----- Original Message -----
 
From: Eri=
c Quinn
 
Sent: Monday, May 26=
, 2003 3:41 PM
 
To: listserv@=
azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: [A=
z-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
 
&nb=
sp;
Resending, I didn't see it appear onn the list.

> Arro=
whead Menace has been repaired and replaced. 
> 
>
http://=
www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D32062
> 
> I a=
lso need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> Menace and for Pic=
nic Leftovers Returns. The only
> thing I ask is that these caches =
never become
> members
> only. Please email me if you have fo=
und either of
> these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.<=
BR>> 
> 
> Eric
> Team Dragon


___________=
_______________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Fast=
er. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
________________________=
____________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listse=
rv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe vis=
it:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C323AE.7EC7A280--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 03:26:17 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jason Poulter)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 20:26:17 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together
In-Reply-To: <001701c32334$ef1e7c90$6501a8c0@TABLET>
References: <001701c32334$ef1e7c90$6501a8c0@TABLET>
Message-ID: <3ED2DAD9.9000405@snaptek.com>

so whats the business?

jason


Team Tierra Buena wrote:
> Sorry for the last minute notice. A couple of cachers have been 
> interested in seeing the business we’ve bought, and I figure I might as 
> well make it an opportunity for anyone else who is interested and may 
> have the time. We’re meeting Monday (tomorrow) at 10:30 AM at our place 
> of business: N 33 37.431 W 111 55.309. Suite 106. In lieu of a hint you 
> can call 480.991.1198.
> 
> This is not an event cache because there is no way to do it without it 
> being a “commercial” cache (full disclosure: with any luck on our part 
> you might actually want to buy something from us, but if you show up 
> you’re under no obligation to buy). No refreshments unless you bring 
> your own. We’ll probably only be there for an hour at most, so you’ll 
> still have plenty of time to make your afternoon barbecues.
> 
> Steve
> Team Tierra Buena
> 


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 04:48:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:48:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together
Message-ID: <000601c3240b$45436230$6501a8c0@TABLET>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together

> 

> so whats the business?

> 

> Jason

SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM ALERT!

A couple of you asked, so here's a web site I threw together shortly
after we took over to send to our relatives and friends back east:
http://home.earthlink.net/~twelvesquare/

As you can see in the first picture, nominal hours are 10 AM-4 PM
Mon-Fri. We're usually there from 8-ish to 5 or 6 or so. As long as the
door is unlocked, just come in and ask for Steve or Judi.

If you can't get there during the week, call me (480.991.1198) and we
can make an appointment for Saturday or Sunday. We live very close by,
so it's no big deal to get there on the weekend (we've often got weekend
work there anyway, as our recent find count attests).

All Geocachers are welcome any time.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena


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 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu =
Get-Together



> 



> so whats the business?



> 



> Jason



SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM =
ALERT!



A couple of you asked, so here's =
a web site
I threw together shortly after we took over to send to our relatives and
friends back east: http://home.earthlink.n=
et/~twelvesquare/



As you can see in the first =
picture,
nominal hours are 10 AM-4
 PM =
Mon-Fri. We're
usually there from 8-ish to 5 or 6 or so. As long as =
the door is
unlocked, just come in and ask for Steve or Judi.



If you can't get there during the =
week,
call me (480.991.1198) and we can make an appointment for Saturday or =
Sunday. We
live very close by, so it's no big deal to get there on the weekend =
(we've
often got weekend work there anyway, as our recent find count =
attests).



All Geocachers are welcome any time.



Steve

Team Tierra Buena









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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 05:48:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:48:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
In-Reply-To: <000601c3240b$45436230$6501a8c0@TABLET>
Message-ID: <20030527054844.32605.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-891122579-1054014524=:32593
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Steve and Judi,
 
Good luck with your new business.  Perhaps you could hide a micro cache just outside the entrance to your business, which can bring geocachers to the vicinity of your business without making what appears to be a commercial cache.
 
Ken

Team Tierra Buena  wrote:

 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together

> 

> so whats the business?

> 

> Jason

SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM ALERT!

A couple of you asked, so here's a web site I threw together shortly after we took over to send to our relatives and friends back east: http://home.earthlink.net/~twelvesquare/


--0-891122579-1054014524=:32593
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Steve and Judi,


 


Good luck with your new business.  Perhaps you could hide a micro cache just outside the entrance to your business, which can bring geocachers to the vicinity of your business without making what appears to be a commercial cache.


 


Ken

Team Tierra Buena <teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net> wrote:









 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together


> 


> so whats the business?


> 


> Jason


SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM ALERT!


A couple of you asked, so here's a web site I threw together shortly after we took over to send to our relatives and friends back east: http://home.earthlink.net/~twelvesquare/

--0-891122579-1054014524=:32593--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 05:50:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 22:50:10 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache
Message-ID: <20030526225010.7805.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hey, anybody out there remember the good ol' RR Rim Cache that Bob
Renner, CBx2, me, and Snaptek and a few others did at the Campout in
Aug 2001? I've had it on my watch list and recently tried to help by
re-posting the corrected coords in a note after a no-find. Seems
another new team (NAV8OR) didn't see, or doesn't appreciate, the
effort, and also it seems that those cache owners are not active. Take
a look at the recent notes (GC360) and let me know what y'all think.
Geez! YA try to help and.....whatever!
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 06:01:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 23:01:22 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] OK, it's Rim RR Depot......
Message-ID: <20030526230123.26000.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Sorry, for some reason I always want to call that thing RR Rim
cache,,,,,,,it is Rim RR Depot (GC360) but I am sure you won't mistake
it for anything else, it was/is definately ONE of a kind!
Trisha Lightning
Prescott

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 10:18:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 03:18:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C323FE.A1C7D840
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Trisha,

I'm sure NAV8OR appreciated your help.  They're new to geocaching and it =
appears that they've learned a lesson when it comes to not reading previo=
us logs - especially on caches with higher difficulty ratings.  They didn=
't seem to be upset with you from what I read.  I can understand them bei=
ng upset with seniorfrisk & Christy for not updating the coordinates and =
description (especially after the first three initial no-finds and then t=
he helpful posts from the 4-team expedition on Aug. 11, 2001).

It's evident that seniorfrisk & Christy (after five weeks of caching betw=
een Jan 26th and Mar 4th, 2001) are no longer involved in geocaching.  Ma=
ybe it's possible that you (or someone else) could adopt the cache and up=
date the coordinates and description if emails to the owners go unanswere=
d.

RandMan =20

----- Original Message -----
From: Trisha
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 12:05 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache

Hey, anybody out there remember the good ol' RR Rim Cache that Bob
Renner, CBx2, me, and Snaptek and a few others did at the Campout in
Aug 2001? I've had it on my watch list and recently tried to help by
re-posting the corrected coords in a note after a no-find. Seems
another new team (NAV8OR) didn't see, or doesn't appreciate, the
effort, and also it seems that those cache owners are not active. Take
a look at the recent notes (GC360) and let me know what y'all think.
Geez! YA try to help and.....whatever!
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C323FE.A1C7D840
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Trisha,
 =

 
 
I'm sure NAV8OR appreciate=
d your help.  They're new to geocaching and it appears that they've =
learned a lesson when it comes to not reading previous logs - e=
specially on caches with higher difficulty ratings.  They didn'=
t seem to be upset with you from what I read.  I can understand them=
 being upset with seniorfrisk & Christy for n=
ot updating the coordinates and description (especially after the first t=
hree initial no-finds and then the helpful posts from the =
4-team expedition on Aug. 11, 2001).
 
 
 
It's ev=
ident that seniorfrisk & Christy (after five =
weeks of caching between Jan 26th and Mar 4th, 2001) are no longer involv=
ed in geocaching.  Maybe it's possible that you (or someone els=
e) could adopt the cache and update the coordinates and description =
if emails to the owners go unanswered.
 
 
 =

RandMan 
 
 
 
 
----- Original=
 Message -----
 
From: Trisha
 
=
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 12:05 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache
 
 =

Hey, anybody out there remember the good ol' RR Rim Cache that Bob<=
BR>Renner, CBx2, me, and Snaptek and a few others did at the Campout inAug 2001? I've had it on my watch list and recently tried to help byre-posting the corrected coords in a note after a no-find. Seems
anot=
her new team (NAV8OR) didn't see, or doesn't appreciate, the
effort, a=
nd also it seems that those cache owners are not active. Take
a look a=
t the recent notes (GC360) and let me know what y'all think.
Geez! YA =
try to help and.....whatever!
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott
______=
______________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching m=
ailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe =
or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinf=
o/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeoc=
aching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C323FE.A1C7D840--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 10:21:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 03:21:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030527102133.23534.qmail@web40612.mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks Rand! I'll put in the transfer request today.


Eric


--- RAND HARDIN  wrote:
> Eric,
> 
> I don't live very far from Arrowhead Menace and
> would be able to adopt the cache if it is still
> available.
> 
> Rand Hardin
> (RandMan)
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Eric Quinn
> Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 3:41 PM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced
> and Cache Adoption
> 
> Resending, I didn't see it appear onn the list.
> 
> > Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced.  
> >  
> >
>
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=32062
> >  
> > I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> > Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> > thing I ask is that these caches never become
> > members
> > only. Please email me if you have found either of
> > these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.
> >  
> >  
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
> 

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 11:02:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 04:02:10 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Congratulations
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C32404.BF62D3E0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Thank you, Mark.  I didn't have a speech prepared for this honor!  I supp=
ose I should give some recognition though:

First, I should give recognition to our Creator.  If it wasn't for the ma=
ny wonderful sites that our Creator has provided us, we wouldn't have as =
many interesting caches to find.  Next I would like to thank my daughters=
 for their patience and understanding of the many hours that I dedicate t=
o geocaching.  I would also like to recognize all the fellow geocachers t=
hat I have met and have communicated with over this "listserv."  (Without=
 your dedication and concern for this wonderful sport/hobbie, geocaching =
would not be as fun and interesting.)  Furthermore, I would also like to =
. . . .

I don't know . . . maybe I should save the above speech for when and if I=
 ever win something major - like an Academy Award or something.  Maybe a =
simple thank you for the recognition, Mark, would suffice in this situati=
on.

Thank you,

Rand (RandMan) =20

    =20

----- Original Message -----
From: HighwayHavoc
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 12:52 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Congratulations

I just happened to notice that RandMan has crossed
over and made it to the first page of the find stats
for Arizona. Congratulations!

Mark A. Pedersen

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C32404.BF62D3E0
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Thank you, Mar=
k.  I didn't have a speech prepared for this honor!  I suppose =
I should give some recognition though:
 
 
 
First=
, I should give recognition to our Creator.  If it wasn't for the ma=
ny wonderful sites that our Creator has provided us, we wouldn't have as =
many interesting caches to find.  Next I would like to thank my =
;daughters for their patience and understanding of the many hours th=
at I dedicate to geocaching.  I would also like to recognize all the=
 fellow geocachers that I have met and have communicated with over t=
his "listserv."  (Without your dedication and concern for this wonde=
rful sport/hobbie, geocaching would not be as fun and interesting.) =
 Furthermore, I would also like to . . . .
 
 
 
I=
 don't know . . . maybe I should save the above speech for when and =
if I ever win something major - like an Academy Award<=
/EM> or something.  Maybe a simple thank you for the recognitio=
n, Mark, would suffice in this situation.
 
 
 
Th=
ank you,
 
 
 
Rand (RandMan) 
 
&nb=
sp;
 
    
 
 
  
----- Original Message -----
 
From: HighwayHavoc
 
Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 12:52 PM 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cong=
ratulations
 
 
I just happened to notice that RandMan=
 has crossed
over and made it to the first page of the find stats
f=
or Arizona. Congratulations!

Mark A. Pedersen

_____________=
_____________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster=
. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
__________________________=
__________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv=
@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit=
:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
<=
BR>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C32404.BF62D3E0--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 14:42:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 07:42:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
In-Reply-To: <20030527054844.32605.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <001501c3245e$335e7520$6501a8c0@TABLET>

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Thanks for your good wishes, Ken.

I've spent quite some time trying to figure out a worthwhile micro in
the vicinity, but the only thing even remotely worth seeing isn't always
there (and I won't say any more in case I ever to figure out a way to do
it).

I'm also quite concerned with ensuring that people NOT think we are
trying to use Geocaching to increase our business. One of the reasons I
waited so long to issue that invitation for Monday morning was because I
wasn't sure it was the right thing to do. I talked to one of the cachers
who was originally coming over, and he didn't see any problem with my
posting it here, so I went ahead and did it at the last minute.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena

 

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Ken
Akerman
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2003 10:49 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business

 

Steve and Judi,

 

Good luck with your new business.  Perhaps you could hide a micro cache
just outside the entrance to your business, which can bring geocachers
to the vicinity of your business without making what appears to be a
commercial cache.

 

Ken

Team Tierra Buena  wrote:

 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu Get-Together

> 

> so whats the business?

> 

> Jason

SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM ALERT!

A couple of you asked, so here's a web site I threw together shortly
after we took over to send to our relatives and friends back east:
http://home.earthlink.net/~twelvesquare/


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Thanks for your good wishes, =
Ken.



I’ve spent quite some time =
trying to
figure out a worthwhile micro in the vicinity, but the only thing even =
remotely
worth seeing isn’t always there (and I won’t say any more in =
case I
ever to figure out a way to do it).



I’m also quite concerned with
ensuring that people NOT think we are trying to use Geocaching to =
increase our
business. One of the reasons I waited so long to issue that invitation =
for
Monday morning was because I wasn’t sure it was the right thing to =
do. I
talked to one of the cachers who was originally coming over, and he =
didn’t
see any problem with my posting it here, so I went ahead and did it at =
the last
minute.



Steve

Team Tierra Buena



 






-----Original Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]
On Behalf Of Ken =
Akerman

Sent: Monday, May 26, =
2003 10:49
PM

To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
Why not
put a micro cache near your business



 






Steve and Judi,









 









Good luck with your new business.  Perhaps you could hide a =
micro
cache just outside the entrance to your business, which can bring =
geocachers to
the vicinity of your business without making what appears to be a =
commercial
cache.









 









Ken



Team Tierra =
Buena
<teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net> =
wrote:









 Re: [Az-Geocaching] Impromptu =
Get-Together



> 



> so whats the business?



> 



> Jason



SHAMELESS COMMERCIALISM =
ALERT!



A couple of you asked, so here's =
a web
site I threw together shortly after we took over to send to our =
relatives and
friends back east: http://home.earthlink.n=
et/~twelvesquare/















------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C32423.86FF9D20--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:03:09 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:03:09 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
In-Reply-To: <20030527054844.32605.qmail@web21108.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <54770048-9054-11D7-A03C-000393545682@desertsol.com>

I know I really enjoyed "12th Anniversary Cache" by Team Greenspeed 
(GC8B7F).  I love caches that bring me to meet other cachers!  You guys 
definitely should hide a cache nearby.
Then there is me who did it backwards!  I planted the cache 
(Ghostly Ride GC5E96)  then started a business very close 
by less than a year later!  I have only had one cacher stop by to say 
hi while I was working...but look forward to more! Adds a little 
excitement to my day...and at the same time makes me feel guilty for 
not having caching time lately!:)
Just make sure the cache has a primary purpose not linked to the 
business (Team Greenspeed's celebrates their anniversary, mine is in a 
touristy area).    Let's see, do a 4th of July cache or a cache for 
airplane related items (if you have a place to place a full size cache).

Good luck Steve and Judy!  I look forward to coming by and spending 
some money if I ever get a day off!!
C:)

Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:15:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:15:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
References: <54770048-9054-11D7-A03C-000393545682@desertsol.com>
Message-ID: <002d01c32462$dfd9e560$c628b83f@fishkiller>

which shop is yours??
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chelby Geiss" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 8:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business


> I know I really enjoyed "12th Anniversary Cache" by Team Greenspeed 
> (GC8B7F).  I love caches that bring me to meet other cachers!  You guys 
> definitely should hide a cache nearby.
> Then there is me who did it backwards!  I planted the cache 
> (Ghostly Ride GC5E96)  then started a business very close 
> by less than a year later!  I have only had one cacher stop by to say 
> hi while I was working...but look forward to more! Adds a little 
> excitement to my day...and at the same time makes me feel guilty for 
> not having caching time lately!:)
> Just make sure the cache has a primary purpose not linked to the 
> business (Team Greenspeed's celebrates their anniversary, mine is in a 
> touristy area).    Let's see, do a 4th of July cache or a cache for 
> airplane related items (if you have a place to place a full size cache).
> 
> Good luck Steve and Judy!  I look forward to coming by and spending 
> some money if I ever get a day off!!
> C:)
> 
> Team desertSol
> Chelby & Kevin
> +
> Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
> Apache Junction, AZ
> www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:24:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:24:41 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3ED38339.6000106@Snaptek.com>

RAND HARDIN wrote:
> It's evident that seniorfrisk & Christy (after five weeks of caching between Jan 26th and Mar 4th, 2001) are no longer involved in geocaching.

I doubt that anyone will hear anything from them.  They are probably 
even more infamous for being the team that ran off with THE original 
travel bug ( http://www.azgeocaching.com/mrtata/mrtata.html ) that Bob 
Renner came up with.  It's journey was cut extremely short and I am 
still mad at them for doing that.
E-mails went un answered just after them taking the potato head then so 
good luck getting them now.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:19:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Brown)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:19:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Euro GPS Network - One yard accuracy
Message-ID: 

--0__=88BBE7A0DFC7A6C88f9e8a93df938690918c88BBE7A0DFC7A6C8
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                                                                       =
    =20
 Euro GPS network gets green light                                     =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 PARIS, France (CNN) --European governments have given the final go-ahe=
ad  =20
 for the launch of the Galileo satellite navigation network, Europe's  =
    =20
 answer to the U.S.-controlled Global Positioning System.              =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 The long-delayed $3.6 billion (3.2 billion euro) system, Europe's bigg=
est =20
 ever infrastructure project, will be based on 30 satellites and should=
 be =20
 operational by 2008.                                                  =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Final agreement on the network was reached Monday at a meeting in Pari=
s of=20
 members of the European Space Agency (ESA).                           =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Galileo will be used to improve traffic management on land, sea and in=
 the=20
 air around the world, as well as aiding all forms of navigation and   =
    =20
 activities such as oil prospecting, scientific research and even hikin=
g.  =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 "This is a great day for Europe in general and its space community in =
    =20
 particular," ESA director Antonio Rotota said in a statement. "Our mem=
ber =20
 states have reached agreement in the common interest."                =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 ESA says the Galileo program will give a much-needed boost to Europe's=
    =20
 ailing space industry, creating about 140,000 jobs and "a 460 percent =
    =20
 return on investment."                                                =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Unlike the American GPS system, Galileo will be under full civilian   =
    =20
 control.                                                              =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 One meter accuracy                                                    =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 The U.S. satellite network is controlled by the Pentagon, which can   =
    =20
 downgrade or totally disable non-military access during conflicts.    =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Galileo's civilian signal will also give locations accurate to within =
one =20
 meter (one yard) -- a significant improvement on that offered by the G=
PS  =20
 system.                                                               =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 The U.S. regards Galileo as a challenge to its superiority in space   =
    =20
 technology and argues that it duplicates GPS.                         =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Last year Deputy U.S. Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz warned that the=
    =20
 European network would "significantly complicate our ability to ensure=
    =20
 availability of critical military GPS services in a time of crisis, an=
d at=20
 the same time assure that adversary forces are denied similar         =
    =20
 capabilities."                                                        =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 ESA is playing down any rivalry with the American system, saying in it=
s   =20
 statement Monday that Galileo would "complement" the GPS network.     =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 The agency says devices for receiving Galileo's signals will be       =
    =20
 interoperable with equipment used on GPS and GLONASS -- the partially =
    =20
 operable Russian-built network.                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 The first experimental Galileo satellite is due to be launched in 2004=
 and=20
 will act as a test bed for the network's systems.                     =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 When complete Galileo will comprise 30 satellites (27 operational and =
3   =20
 spares) positioned in three circular orbits 23,616 kilometers (14,677 =
    =20
 miles) above the Earth.                                               =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20



                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
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    =20
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    =20
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    =20


                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20
 Find this article at:                                                 =
    =20
 http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/space/05/27/europe.galileo/index.html    =
    =20
                                                                       =
    =20


=

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:39:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brent Milner)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:39:11 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Howdy, Andrew and Debbie! Welcome to Geocaching in Arizona! I hope you guys
will keep us posted of your first find, as well as any adventures along the
way.

My team (FroBros) started out with the Garmin E-Trex brand, but found the
screen was kind of small and the controls were difficult to use. Since then,
we've gone to the Garmin eMap. It didn't cost much more, and it is much
easier for us to use. We got it at Bronco One in North Phoenix. They are one
of the largest Garmin dealers in the nation, and they even have permission
to download the maps on our GPS unit for us. Anytime I travel, I go back to
Bronco One, and they update my GPS and mapping software for free. Can't beat
that deal!

-FroBro Q-Tip


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyone :)



Hi All,

We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to
geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the
Garmin Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?

Thanks,


Andrew
>From: Ken Akerman
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?
>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT)
>
>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving it, rather than
archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is not located in a
good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache only if the new
cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my opinion.
>
>Ken


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com


====
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
====



------=_NextPart_000_0047_01C3242B.727AF400
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Howdy,=20
Andrew and Debbie! Welcome to Geocaching in Arizona! I hope you guys will=
 keep=20
us posted of your first find, as well as any adventures along the=20
way.


 


My=20
team (FroBros) started out with the Garmin E-Trex brand, but found the sc=
reen=20
was kind of small and the controls were difficult to use. Since then, we'=
ve gone=20
to the Garmin eMap. It didn't cost much more, and it is much easier for u=
s to=20
use. We got it at Bronco One in North Phoenix. They are one of the larges=
t=20
Garmin dealers in the nation, and they even have permission to download t=
he maps=20
on our GPS unit for us. Anytime I travel, I go back to Bronco One, and th=
ey=20
update my GPS and mapping software for free. Can't beat that=20
deal!


 


-FroBro Q-Tip


 


 


-----Original Message-----
From:=20
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew=20
Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:34 PM
To:=
=20
listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hello Everyo=
ne=20
:)








Hi All, 


We are Andrew and Debbie (AKA DuhNPookinz) and were just introduced to=
=20
geocaching. We are quite excited to get started. We are looking at the Ga=
rmin=20
Etrex Vista? Does anyone know if this is good unit to purchase?


Thanks,


Andrew=20









>From: Ken Akerman 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Abandoned cache?=20

>Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 13:59:32 -0700 (PDT)=20

>=20

>I prefer keeping an existing cache in place and improving =
it,=20
rather than archiving the cache and creating a new one. If the cache is n=
ot=20
located in a good area, then just move it nearby. Create a new cache only=
 if the=20
new cache is very much different than the existing cache. Just my opinion=
=2E=20

>=20

>Ken=20





Tired of spam? Get adva=
nced junk=20
mail protection with MSN 8.=20
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocachin=
g=20
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or=
=20
unsubscribe visit:=20
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's=
=20
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com 
=3D=3D=3D=3D
This message and any attachments are confidential. Unauthorized use
or disclosure of this message is strictly prohibited, and this message
must be destroyed immediately if received by an unauthorized recipient.
=3D=3D=3D=3D







------=_NextPart_000_0047_01C3242B.727AF400--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 15:23:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Cody Brown)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:23:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache
Message-ID: 

I was up near the cache site 2 weeks ago and from the looks of it, the RR
Rim Cache burned.  The Hi-View Point campsite is still intact despite the
dirt and entire area being covered by several inches of very fine ash.

Cody




|---------+--------------------------------------------->
|         |           Brian Cluff    |
|         |           Sent by:                          |
|         |           az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeo|
|         |           caching.com                       |
|         |                                             |
|         |                                             |
|         |           05/27/2003 08:24 AM               |
|         |           Please respond to listserv        |
|         |                                             |
|---------+--------------------------------------------->
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
  |                                                                                                              |
  |       To:       listserv@azgeocaching.com                                                                    |
  |       cc:                                                                                                    |
  |       bcc:                                                                                                   |
  |       Subject:  Re: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache                                                             |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|




RAND HARDIN wrote:
> It's evident that seniorfrisk & Christy (after five weeks of caching
between Jan 26th and Mar 4th, 2001) are no longer involved in geocaching.

I doubt that anyone will hear anything from them.  They are probably
even more infamous for being the team that ran off with THE original
travel bug ( http://www.azgeocaching.com/mrtata/mrtata.html ) that Bob
Renner came up with.  It's journey was cut extremely short and I am
still mad at them for doing that.
E-mails went un answered just after them taking the potato head then so
good luck getting them now.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 16:04:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 09:04:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
In-Reply-To: <002d01c32462$dfd9e560$c628b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: 

--Apple-Mail-14-582345658
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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	format=flowed


On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 08:15 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:

> which shop is yours??
>

Desert Echoes, I'm near the mine tour.
I can ALMOST see the cache hiding place from my patio!:)


Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching
--Apple-Mail-14-582345658
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 08:15 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:


which shop is yours??




Desert Echoes, I'm near the mine tour.

I can ALMOST see the cache hiding place from my patio!:)



Helvetica3131,0404,FFFFTeam
desertSol

Chelby & Kevin

+

Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)

Apache Junction, AZ

www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching
--Apple-Mail-14-582345658--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 16:45:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 09:45:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
References: 
Message-ID: <001301c3246f$742bc060$c628b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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ok let me be more inquisitive

what are your hours of operation?


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Chelby Geiss=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 9:04 AM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your =
business



  On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 08:15 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:


    which shop is yours??



  Desert Echoes, I'm near the mine tour.
  I can ALMOST see the cache hiding place from my patio!:)


  Team desertSol
  Chelby & Kevin
  +
  Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
  Apache Junction, AZ
  www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching
------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C32434.C6A7F060
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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ok let me be more =
inquisitive


 


what are your hours of =
operation?


 


 


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Chelby=20
  Geiss 

  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 =
9:04 AM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Why not put=20
  a micro cache near your business

  


On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 08:15 AM, Team Evil =
Fish=20
  wrote:


  
which shop is yours??


Desert =
Echoes, I'm=20
  near the mine tour.
I can ALMOST see the cache hiding place from my =

  patio!:)


Team=20
  desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German=20
  Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~c=
helby/geocaching

------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C32434.C6A7F060--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 17:38:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 10:38:25 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Rim RR Depot/RR Rim Whatever it's called cache!
Message-ID: <20030527103828.28875.h006.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Cody,

If you are pretty sure that it (the cache itself) is gone, maybe admin
should archive it? It's interesting that the two last no-finds didn't
mention any fire damage in the area....just that they couldn't find it.

I would not be able to physically take over ownership of the cache if
it still exists, as it is too far away for me to maintain. I was
trying to do what I could "from a distance" in the logs to help and,
well, guess that didn't help much :-)

Thanks for your response and for RAND and Brian, too. I don't know if
NAV8OR reads this list....hopefully they will learn from the
experience. I can certainly understand how frustrated they must be,
since that terrain is so tough!

Take care,
Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Tue, 27 May 2003 08:23:45 -0700, "Cody Brown" wrote:

> 
> 
> I was up near the cache site 2 weeks ago and from the looks of it,
the
> RR
> Rim Cache burned.  The Hi-View Point campsite is still intact despite
> the
> dirt and entire area being covered by several inches of very fine
ash.
> 
> Cody
> 
> 
> 
> 
> |---------+--------------------------------------------->
> |         |           Brian Cluff    |
> |         |           Sent by:                          |
> |         |           az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeo|
> |         |           caching.com                       |
> |         |                                             |
> |         |                                             |
> |         |           05/27/2003 08:24 AM               |
> |         |           Please respond to listserv        |
> |         |                                             |
> |---------+--------------------------------------------->
>  
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
>   |                                                                 
 
>                                           |
>   |       To:       listserv@azgeocaching.com                       
 
>                                           |
>   |       cc:                                                       
 
>                                           |
>   |       bcc:                                                      
 
>                                           |
>   |       Subject:  Re: [Az-Geocaching] RR Rim Cache                
 
>                                           |
>  
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RAND HARDIN wrote:
> > It's evident that seniorfrisk & Christy (after five weeks of
caching
> between Jan 26th and Mar 4th, 2001) are no longer involved in
> geocaching.
> 
> I doubt that anyone will hear anything from them.  They are probably
> even more infamous for being the team that ran off with THE original
> travel bug ( http://www.azgeocaching.com/mrtata/mrtata.html ) that
Bob
> Renner came up with.  It's journey was cut extremely short and I am
> still mad at them for doing that.
> E-mails went un answered just after them taking the potato head then
so
> good luck getting them now.
> 
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 18:02:00 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 11:02:00 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3243F.65D1E560
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Eric,

Thank you.  I will contact you privately and compare with you my answers =
to the four Star War questions and compare my results from visiting the f=
our locations for the alternative option.

Rand

----- Original Message -----
From: Eric Quinn
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 6:32 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption

Thanks Rand! I'll put in the transfer request today.


Eric

*************************************************************************=
*
--- RAND HARDIN  wrote:
> Eric,
> =20
> I don't live very far from Arrowhead Menace and
> would be able to adopt the cache if it is still
> available.
> =20
> Rand Hardin
> (RandMan)
*************************************************************************=
*
> =20
> > Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced.  http://www.geocachi=
ng.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D32062
> >  =20
> > I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> > Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> > thing I ask is that these caches never become
> > members
> > only. Please email me if you have found either of
> > these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.
> >  =20
> >  =20
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
************************************************************************ =20

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Eric,
  
 
Thank you.  I will contact you privately and&nb=
sp;compare with you my answers to the four Star War q=
uestions and compare my results from visiting the four locations for the =
alternative option.
 
 
 
Rand
 
  
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: Eric Quinn 
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 6=
:32 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocac=
hing.com
 
Subject: Re: [Az-Ge=
ocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
 
 <=
/DIV> 
Thanks Rand! I'll put in the transfer request today.


=
Eric

*************************************************************=
*************
--- RAND HARDIN <RHrdn8@msn.com> wrote:
> Er=
ic,
> 
> I don't live very far from Arrowhead Menace and
&=
gt; would be able to adopt the cache if it is still
> available.> 
> Rand Hardin
> (RandMan)
 
*********************=
*****************************************************
> 
> &g=
t; Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced.  http://www.geoca=
ching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D32062
> >  
&g=
t; > I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
> > Me=
nace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
> > thing I ask =
is that these caches never become
> > members
> > only.=
 Please email me if you have found either of
> > these caches an=
d are willing to adopt one or both.
> >  
> > =
; 
> > Eric
> > Team Dragon
************************=
************************************************ 



------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3243F.65D1E560--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Tue May 27 20:21:41 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 20:21:41 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
Message-ID: 






I wish I'd known you had a shop there the three times we looked for Ghostly Ride (not one of our finer moments). Is it pottery? My sister-in-law loves pottery. I shop early for Christmas.














>From: Chelby Geiss 


>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business 

>Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 09:04:33 -0700 

> 

> 

>On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 08:15 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote: 

> 

>>which shop is yours?? 

>> 

> 

>Desert Echoes, I'm near the mine tour. 

>I can ALMOST see the cache hiding place from my patio!:) 

> 

> 

>Team desertSol 

>Chelby & Kevin 

>+ 

>Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds) 

>Apache Junction, AZ 

>www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching 


STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 04:41:21 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss)
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 21:41:21 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
In-Reply-To: <001301c3246f$742bc060$c628b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: 

--Apple-Mail-16-627753805
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 09:45 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:

> ok let me be more inquisitive
> =A0
> what are your hours of operation?
> =A0
>

Sorry Evil, I didn't get your message til after I left for the gallery,=20=

hence the late reply.
(ugh...I didn't mean for this tread to turn into a Chelby plug!)
Desert Echoes is open Tuesday-Sunday 10am-5pm.  But we will probably go=20=

to a Thursday-Sunday schedule closer to baby's due date.  And I have to=20=

admit, I left at 3:30 today.  No a/c and no one around shopping...I=20
gave up.  Our phone number is 480.288.0093 in case you want to check if=20=

we're there.  I am there every Tuesday and Wednesday and this week I=20
have Saturday and Sunday also.

To gale:  We have only been open for about 2.5 months!  So we weren't=20
around when you had your trouble finding ghostly ride!  Yep, it's my=20
pottery and my business partner is a landscape photographer.  Its a=20
small place (only 400 sq ft) so don't expect too much!:)


Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching=

--Apple-Mail-16-627753805
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On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 09:45 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:


Arialok let me be more
inquisitive

=A0

Arialwhat are your hours of
operation?

=A0




Sorry Evil, I didn't get your message til after I left for the
gallery, hence the late reply.

(ugh...I didn't mean for this tread to turn into a Chelby plug!)

Desert Echoes is open Tuesday-Sunday 10am-5pm.  But we will probably
go to a Thursday-Sunday schedule closer to baby's due date.  And I
have to admit, I left at 3:30 today.  No a/c and no one around
shopping...I gave up.  Our phone number is 480.288.0093 in case you
want to check if we're there.  I am there every Tuesday and Wednesday
and this week I have Saturday and Sunday also.


To gale:  We have only been open for about 2.5 months!  So we weren't
around when you had your trouble finding ghostly ride!  Yep, it's my
pottery and my business partner is a landscape photographer.  Its a
small place (only 400 sq ft) so don't expect too much!:)



=
Helvetica3131,0404,FFFFTe=
am
desertSol

Chelby & Kevin

+

Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)

Apache Junction, AZ

www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching=

--Apple-Mail-16-627753805--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 05:27:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 05:27:43 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Maintainance
Message-ID: 




Tonight we went and placed a new cache, log and goodies for Lonesome Bush. We found that we had to move it about 50 south between the benchmark and Bianco Rd. Its original location turned into a party spot with the bush the obvious "focus". Lots of bottles and tire tracks attest to its popularity.


 


For UrbanScape, that should be replaced by Friday at the latest. That too will be moved, about 5 feet away. It is no longer a candy tin.




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 13:42:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (WOLFB8)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 06:42:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
References: 
Message-ID: <002701c3251f$a25e2a80$bfd36844@ph.cox.net>

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received this email today  I have replaced the sender and the cacher he =
is talking about name....has anyone received email like this and have =
you check it out....

here is what I got

There is nothing I hate worse in this game than a cheater.  Some cacher =
is going around claiming 17+ caches every day, by the name of =
XXXXXXXXXXXX.  I just did a cache that he claims to have found, and his =
signature was nowhere on the log sheet.  He always TN/LN/SL for EVERY =
"find", every online log of his is the same.  He claimed one of yours as =
well.  Might want to check. I have notified other cache owners and they =
have deleted his finds as there was no signature on their logbooks. =20

XXXXXXX




We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
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received this email today  I have =
replaced the=20
sender and the cacher he is talking about name....has anyone received =
email like=20
this and have you check it out....


 


here is what I got



There is nothing I hate =
worse in=20
this game than a cheater.  Some cacher is going around claiming 17+ =
caches=20
every day, by the name of XXXXXXXXXXXX.  I just did a cache that he =
claims=20
to have found, and his signature was nowhere on the log sheet.  He =
always=20
TN/LN/SL for EVERY "find", every online log of his is the same.  He =
claimed=20
one of yours as well.  Might want to check. I have notified other =
cache=20
owners and they have deleted his finds as there was no signature on =
their=20
logbooks.  

XXXXXXX


 


 


 


 


We will be known by the tracks we leave behind


------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C324E4.58CA4420--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 14:32:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mark Heitowit)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 07:32:29 -0700
Subject: [[Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people]
Message-ID: <980HeboGd1088S06.1054132349@cmsweb06.cms.usa.net>

Yes, I got this email also. I have not had the chance to check out my cache
yet to verify the log.

"WOLFB8"  wrote:
> --------------------------------------------- 
>	Attachment:  
>	MIME Type: multipart/alternative 
> --------------------------------------------- 
> received this email today  I have replaced the sender and the cacher he is
talking about name....has anyone received email like this and have you check
it out....
> 
> here is what I got
> 
> There is nothing I hate worse in this game than a cheater.  Some cacher is
going around claiming 17+ caches every day, by the name of XXXXXXXXXXXX.  I
just did a cache that he claims to have found, and his signature was nowhere
on the log sheet.  He always TN/LN/SL for EVERY "find", every online log of
his is the same.  He claimed one of yours as well.  Might want to check. I
have notified other cache owners and they have deleted his finds as there was
no signature on their logbooks.  
> 
> XXXXXXX
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We will be known by the tracks we leave behind




From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 17:36:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 13:36:39 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
Message-ID: <57A1957B.50BB0480.0013DAD2@aol.com>

In a message dated 5/28/2003 8:42:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, Wolfb8@cox.net writes:

> 
> 
> 
> 
> received this email today  I have replaced the
> sender and the cacher he is talking about name....has anyone received email like
> this and have you check it out....
>  
> here is what I got
> There is nothing I hate worse in
> this game than a cheater.  Some cacher is going around claiming 17+ caches
> every day, by the name of XXXXXXXXXXXX.  I just did a cache that he claims
> to have found, and his signature was nowhere on the log sheet.  He always
> TN/LN/SL for EVERY "find", every online log of his is the same.  He claimed
> one of yours as well.  Might want to check. I have notified other cache
> owners and they have deleted his finds as there was no 
> signature on their
> logbooks.  XXXXXXX
>  
>  
>  
>  
> We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
> 
> 
>
Yes I did receive this email and it is true.. the cacher in question did NOT sign the logbook in my cache. I decided to not delete his log, I am a nice guy and am giving him the benefit of doubt. I looked at all the caches he has found in the last few months and only recently has there been 17+ a day and not every day at that. there is a picture of this cacher at one cache and lots of shots for virtuals, I think he may be a guy who doesn't like to sign or forgets.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 18:51:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 14:51:44 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
Message-ID: <20030528185150.JDQW18769.fed1mtao04.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>

Perhaps he just has a different interpretation for the "SL" portion of his entries; some possibilities:

saw log

sawed log <- any fresh cut wood nearby?

sold log <- not likely since they appear to still be there

smooched log <- Ewwwww!

signed lightly

sighted legumes <- not likely at every cache

surfed LaJolla <- perhaps a crowning moment in his life

Tim
Team AZFastFeet (headed for the last page of the stats!)



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 19:39:27 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:39:27 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
In-Reply-To: <57A1957B.50BB0480.0013DAD2@aol.com>
Message-ID: 

The same cacher visited two of our caches (GCD2B3, GCD5F4), but the logs
were a bit different:

May 18 by ********** (271 found)
TN/LN/SN

I took this to mean: Took Nothing, Left Nothing, and Signed Nothing

Therefore, I wasn't surprised when I did not find the log entry in the
log books.  We have not decided what to do with the logs as of yet.

Aus Dem Kasten

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
BBUDCAM@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 10:37 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people

In a message dated 5/28/2003 8:42:45 AM Eastern Standard Time,
Wolfb8@cox.net writes:

> 
> 
> 
> 
> received this email today  I have replaced the
> sender and the cacher he is talking about name....has anyone received
email like
> this and have you check it out....
>  
> here is what I got
> There is nothing I hate worse in
> this game than a cheater.  Some cacher is going around claiming 17+
caches
> every day, by the name of XXXXXXXXXXXX.  I just did a cache that he
claims
> to have found, and his signature was nowhere on the log sheet.  He
always
> TN/LN/SL for EVERY "find", every online log of his is the same.  He
claimed
> one of yours as well.  Might want to check. I have notified other
cache
> owners and they have deleted his finds as there was no 
> signature on their
> logbooks.  XXXXXXX
>  
>  
>  
>  
> We will be known by the tracks we leave behind
> 
> 
>
Yes I did receive this email and it is true.. the cacher in question did
NOT sign the logbook in my cache. I decided to not delete his log, I am
a nice guy and am giving him the benefit of doubt. I looked at all the
caches he has found in the last few months and only recently has there
been 17+ a day and not every day at that. there is a picture of this
cacher at one cache and lots of shots for virtuals, I think he may be a
guy who doesn't like to sign or forgets.
____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 20:40:02 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 13:40:02 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your business
References: 
Message-ID: <001e01c32559$515d6c60$b129b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C3251E.A3B06980
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Thanks for the nice break

 BTW

the cache in question is only 1.64 miles away, I picked the wrong cache =
to go to which also lead to my looking at the sun so much a garmin side =
effect :)



  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Chelby Geiss=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 9:41 PM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Why not put a micro cache near your =
business



  On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 09:45 AM, Team Evil Fish wrote:


    ok let me be more inquisitive
    =20
    what are your hours of operation?
    =20



  Sorry Evil, I didn't get your message til after I left for the =
gallery, hence the late reply.
  (ugh...I didn't mean for this tread to turn into a Chelby plug!)
  Desert Echoes is open Tuesday-Sunday 10am-5pm. But we will probably go =
to a Thursday-Sunday schedule closer to baby's due date. And I have to =
admit, I left at 3:30 today. No a/c and no one around shopping...I gave =
up. Our phone number is 480.288.0093 in case you want to check if we're =
there. I am there every Tuesday and Wednesday and this week I have =
Saturday and Sunday also.

  To gale: We have only been open for about 2.5 months! So we weren't =
around when you had your trouble finding ghostly ride! Yep, it's my =
pottery and my business partner is a landscape photographer. Its a small =
place (only 400 sq ft) so don't expect too much!:)


  Team desertSol
  Chelby & Kevin
  +
  Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
  Apache Junction, AZ
  www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching
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Thanks for the nice break


 


 BTW


 


the cache in question is only 1.64 =
miles away, I=20
picked the wrong cache to go to which also lead to my looking at the sun =
so much=20
a garmin side effect :)


 


 


 


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Chelby=20
  Geiss 

  
  
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 =
9:41 PM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
Why not put=20
  a micro cache near your business

  


On Tuesday, May 27, 2003, at 09:45 AM, Team Evil =
Fish=20
  wrote:


  
ok let me be more=20
    =
inquisitive
 
what=20
    are your hours of=20
  =
operation?
 


Sor=
ry=20
  Evil, I didn't get your message til after I left for the gallery, =
hence the=20
  late reply.
(ugh...I didn't mean for this tread to turn into a =
Chelby=20
  plug!)
Desert Echoes is open Tuesday-Sunday 10am-5pm. But we will =
probably=20
  go to a Thursday-Sunday schedule closer to baby's due date. And I have =
to=20
  admit, I left at 3:30 today. No a/c and no one around shopping...I =
gave up.=20
  Our phone number is 480.288.0093 in case you want to check if we're =
there. I=20
  am there every Tuesday and Wednesday and this week I have Saturday and =
Sunday=20
  also.

To gale: We have only been open for about 2.5 months! So =
we=20
  weren't around when you had your trouble finding ghostly ride! Yep, =
it's my=20
  pottery and my business partner is a landscape photographer. Its a =
small place=20
  (only 400 sq ft) so don't expect too =
much!:)


Team=20
  desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German=20
  Shepherds)
Apache Junction, =
AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 20:41:15 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 13:41:15 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
Message-ID: 


My simple rule is the same as the geocaching.com rules...

sign the logbook. No log, no find. If I find a log on the cache page but not 
the actual logbook, I will delete the log. The log in the book is the only 
proof that someone visited my cache. If there is a snake laying on a rock 
next to the cache.. move it or wait for it to move! I have seen logs on the 
internet site that say that "I saw the cache but could not retrieve it" or 
something to that extent, but they consider it a find. That does not hold 
with me. Part of the challenge is getting to the cache and signing the 
logbook. Particularly so with some urban caches. There are many urban caches 
that are easily seen by the trained geocacher eye from several feet away, 
but not to the public. The tough part about a cache like this is physically 
retreiving the cache and signing the logbook. In this situation, anyone 
could say they saw it.

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 20:50:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 20:50:33 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
Message-ID: 


If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry for Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=10655&log=y&decrypt= There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm still looking for it.




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 21:04:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 21:04:06 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] I think his finds may be legit
Message-ID: 




http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=8144 For May 2003. He may just not like signing logs. Most of the ones I looked at  say TN/LN/SN


http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=48216 


http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=44862


http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=33289And these entries verify his finds 


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 21:07:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 14:07:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
References: 
Message-ID: <006101c3255d$2537b560$b129b83f@fishkiller>

maybe this team is trying a shotgun effect

think about it out of the I am sure thousands of cache owners how many
really check the signed logs against the electric ones

on the same note how about those who sign the log but not on line???

----- Original Message -----
From: "RopingThe Wind" 
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 1:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people


>
>
> My simple rule is the same as the geocaching.com rules...
>
> sign the logbook. No log, no find. If I find a log on the cache page but
not
> the actual logbook, I will delete the log. The log in the book is the only
> proof that someone visited my cache. If there is a snake laying on a rock
> next to the cache.. move it or wait for it to move! I have seen logs on
the
> internet site that say that "I saw the cache but could not retrieve it" or
> something to that extent, but they consider it a find. That does not hold
> with me. Part of the challenge is getting to the cache and signing the
> logbook. Particularly so with some urban caches. There are many urban
caches
> that are easily seen by the trained geocacher eye from several feet away,
> but not to the public. The tough part about a cache like this is
physically
> retreiving the cache and signing the logbook. In this situation, anyone
> could say they saw it.
>
> Scott
> Team Ropingthewind
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 22:07:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:07:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C3252A.D7C26000
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Gale,

Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the cache page doesn't m=
ean that the individual found the cache.  In the case of the cache that y=
ou reference, I could look at the map and determine the cache is located =
in a "nice location."

It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the caches witho=
ut actually finding them, but is claiming them as a virtual.

I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at the cac=
he location to claim a find on the web page (unless the cache is actually=
 a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a find).  I have no object=
ion to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no proof that the indi=
vidual actually found the cache.  If there is a question from a cache own=
er, an email to the individual asking to explain where and how the cache =
was found and/or asking for a description of the cache should clear up so=
me doubt.

Rand  =20

----- Original Message -----
From: gale 'Desert Viking'
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 2:10 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater

If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry for =
Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D10655&lo=
g=3Dy&decrypt=3D There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerat=
e him. I'm still looking for it.

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Gale,
  
 
Just because a person states "Nice locatio=
n!" on the cache page doesn't mean that the individual found the cac=
he.  In the case of the cache that you reference, I could look at th=
e map and determine the cache is located in a "nice location."
  
 
It's also possible the individual may be driving to/pa=
st the caches without actually finding them, but is claiming them as=
 a virtual.
 
 
 
I believe it's understood that a=
 log book/sheet must be signed at the cache location to claim a=
 find on the web page (unless the cache is actually a virtual and/or=
 has other rules for claiming a find).  I have no objection to a cac=
he owner deleting an entry if there is no proof that the individual =
actually found the cache.  If there is a question from a cache owner=
, an email to the individual asking to explain where and how the cache wa=
s found and/or asking for a description of the cache should clear up some=
 doubt.
 
 
 
Rand  
 
  
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: gale 'Desert=
 Viking'
 
Sent: Wednesday, Ma=
y 28, 2003 2:10 PM
 
To: lists=
erv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
 
 
 
 
=

If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entr=
y for Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/ca=
che_details.aspx?ID=3D10655&log=3Dy&decrypt=3D There's anothe=
r one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm still looking for it=
.

 



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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 22:18:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket])
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:18:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
References: 
Message-ID: <001501c32567$1e93ae80$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hmmm...  I drive past 3 virtuals every day on my way home.  These =
particular ones I can see from the car very easily (they're big).  Maybe =
I ought to log them.  ;-)


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: RAND HARDIN=20
  To: AZ-Geocaching=20
  Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:07 PM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater


  Gale,

  Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the cache page =
doesn't mean that the individual found the cache.  In the case of the =
cache that you reference, I could look at the map and determine the =
cache is located in a "nice location."

  It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the caches =
without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a virtual.

  I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at the =
cache location to claim a find on the web page (unless the cache is =
actually a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a find).  I have =
no objection to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no proof =
that the individual actually found the cache.  If there is a question =
from a cache owner, an email to the individual asking to explain where =
and how the cache was found and/or asking for a description of the cache =
should clear up some doubt.

  Rand =20

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: gale 'Desert Viking'
    Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 2:10 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater

    If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry =
for Feb/2002. =
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=3D10655&log=3Dy&decr=
ypt=3D There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. =
I'm still looking for it.




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Hmmm...  I drive past 3 virtuals every day =
on my way=20
home.  These particular ones I can see from the car very easily =
(they're=20
big).  Maybe I ought to log them.  ;-)


 


 


-T.
[General Bracket]


 


=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't =
inflict=20
bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in=
.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  RAND =
HARDIN 

  
  
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 =
3:07=20
  PM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
cheater/not=20
  cheater

  


  
Gale,

  
 

  
Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the =
cache=20
  page doesn't mean that the individual found the cache.  In =
the case=20
  of the cache that you reference, I could look at the map and determine =
the=20
  cache is located in a "nice location."

  
 

  
It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the =
caches=20
  without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a =
virtual.

  
 

  
I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at =

  the cache location to claim a find on the web =
page (unless the=20
  cache is actually a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a =
find). =20
  I have no objection to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no =
proof=20
  that the individual actually found the cache.  If there is a =

  question from a cache owner, an email to the individual asking to =
explain=20
  where and how the cache was found and/or asking for a description of =
the cache=20
  should clear up some doubt.

  
 

  
Rand  

  
 

  
    
----- Original Message -----

    From:=20
    gale 'Desert Viking'
    
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 =
2:10=20
    PM

    
To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

    
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
cheater/not=20
    cheater

    
 

    

    
If this is the person you are referring to, check out =
this log=20
    entry for Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=
=3D10655&log=3Dy&decrypt=3D=20
    There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm =
still=20
    looking for it.


    



------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C3252C.7203DB70--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 22:29:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:29:57 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C3252D.FF0E2920
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I assumed (and still do) that Gale was referring to the next entry which
indicates this person went caching with someone else. Gale - is that right?

Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND
HARDIN
  Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:07 PM
  To: AZ-Geocaching
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater


  Gale,

  Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the cache page doesn't
mean that the individual found the cache.  In the case of the cache that you
reference, I could look at the map and determine the cache is located in a
"nice location."

  It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the caches
without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a virtual.

  I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at the
cache location to claim a find on the web page (unless the cache is actually
a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a find).  I have no objection
to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no proof that the individual
actually found the cache.  If there is a question from a cache owner, an
email to the individual asking to explain where and how the cache was found
and/or asking for a description of the cache should clear up some doubt.

  Rand

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: gale 'Desert Viking'
    Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 2:10 PM
    To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
    Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater

    If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry for
Feb/2002.
http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=10655&log=y&decrypt=
There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm still
looking for it.




------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C3252D.FF0E2920
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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I assumed =
(and still do)=20
that Gale was referring to the next entry which indicates this =
person went=20
caching with someone else. Gale - is that right?


 


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of =
RAND=20
  HARDIN
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:07 PM
To:=20
  AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not=20
  cheater


  
Gale,

  
 

  
Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the =
cache=20
  page doesn't mean that the individual found the cache.  In =
the case=20
  of the cache that you reference, I could look at the map and determine =
the=20
  cache is located in a "nice location."

  
 

  
It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the =
caches=20
  without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a =
virtual.

  
 

  
I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at =

  the cache location to claim a find on the web =
page (unless the=20
  cache is actually a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a =
find). =20
  I have no objection to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no =
proof=20
  that the individual actually found the cache.  If there is a =

  question from a cache owner, an email to the individual asking to =
explain=20
  where and how the cache was found and/or asking for a description of =
the cache=20
  should clear up some doubt.

  
 

  
Rand  

  
 

  
    
----- Original Message -----

    From:=20
    gale 'Desert Viking'
    
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 =
2:10=20
    PM

    
To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

    
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] =
cheater/not=20
    cheater

    
 

    

    
If this is the person you are referring to, check out =
this log=20
    entry for Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=
=3D10655&log=3Dy&decrypt=3D=20
    There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm =
still=20
    looking for it.


    



------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C3252D.FF0E2920--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 22:45:34 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:45:34 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C32530.2D9D7E60
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

It's quite possible that this cacher does legitimately find some caches;
but logs many more than he actually found on the site.  Rand's
suggestion to e-mail the cacher with specific questions would probably
the only way to tell.
 
Aus Dem Kasten
 
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Andrew Ayre
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:30 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
 
I assumed (and still do) that Gale was referring to the next entry which
indicates this person went caching with someone else. Gale - is that
right?
 
Andy

  
-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND
HARDIN
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:07 PM
To: AZ-Geocaching
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
Gale,
 
Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the cache page doesn't
mean that the individual found the cache.  In the case of the cache that
you reference, I could look at the map and determine the cache is
located in a "nice location."
 
It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the caches
without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a virtual.
 
I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at the
cache location to claim a find on the web page (unless the cache is
actually a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a find).  I have
no objection to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no proof
that the individual actually found the cache.  If there is a question
from a cache owner, an email to the individual asking to explain where
and how the cache was found and/or asking for a description of the cache
should clear up some doubt.
 
Rand  
 
----- Original Message -----
From: gale 'Desert Viking'
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 2:10 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
 
If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry for
Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=10655
 &log=y&decrypt= There's another one I remember seeing that may
exhonerate him. I'm still looking for it.



------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C32530.2D9D7E60
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	charset="us-ascii"
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It’s quite possible that this =
cacher does legitimately find some caches; but =
logs many
more than he actually found on the site. 
Rand’s suggestion to e-mail the cacher
with specific questions would probably the only way to =
tell.



 



Aus Dem Kasten



 



-----Original =
Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]
On Behalf Of Andrew =
Ayre

Sent: =
Wednesday, May 28, =
2003 3:30 PM

To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

Subject: RE: =
[Az-Geocaching]
cheater/not cheater



 






I assumed (and still do) =
that Gale
was referring to the next entry which indicates this person went =
caching
with someone else. Gale - is that right?









 






Andy



  






-----Original Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com =
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND HARDIN

Sent: =
Wednesday, May 28, =
2003 3:07 PM

To: AZ-Geocaching

Subject: Re: =
[Az-Geocaching]
cheater/not cheater<=
/p>





Gale,









 









Just because a =
person states
"Nice location!" on the cache page doesn't mean that =
the
individual found the cache.  In the case of the cache that you =
reference,
I could look at the map and determine the cache is located in a =
"nice
location."









 









It's also possible the =
individual
may be driving to/past the caches without actually finding them, but
is claiming them as a virtual.









 









I believe it's understood =
that a
log book/sheet must be signed at the cache location to claim a =
find
on the web page (unless the cache is actually a virtual and/or has =
other
rules for claiming a find).  I have no objection to a cache owner =
deleting
an entry if there is no proof that the individual actually found =
the
cache.  If there is a question from a cache owner, an email to the =
individual
asking to explain where and how the cache was found and/or asking for a
description of the cache should clear up some =
doubt.









 









Rand  









 












----- Original Message =
-----









From: gale
'Desert Viking'









Sent: Wednesday, May 28, =
2003 2:10 PM








To:<=
/font> =
listserv@azgeocaching.com









Subject:
[Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater









 









If this is the person you are referring to, check =
out this
log entry for Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=
=3D10655&log=3Dy&decrypt=3D
There's another one I remember seeing that may exhonerate him. I'm still
looking for it.
























------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C32530.2D9D7E60--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Wed May 28 23:47:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:47:43 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
Message-ID: 




Wow, I think I'm finally having the same problems everyone with Hotmail has been having. I obviously missed a couple of e-mails!


 


Yes, I was referring to the next log where he went with someone else. (Assuming you feel that can be trusted.) I have no problem with the cache owner deleting his logs if they want to. Their cache=their rules. I just wanted to point out that some of them are legitimate. The 3 virtuals I looked at show that they weren't just drive by virtuals. He did stop and take the required picture. So far, he hasn't done any of mine. When or if he does, I'll have to decide what is fair not only to him, and us, but to the other cachers who took the time to visit my caches.


How can I change my listserv e-mail to another e-mail address? There were at least 3 e-mails I didn't get today from the listserv at this address.











>From: "Aus Dem Kasten" 

>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: 

>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater 

>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 15:45:34 -0700 

> 

>It's quite possible that this cacher does legitimately find some caches; 

>but logs many more than he actually found on the site. Rand's 

>suggestion to e-mail the cacher with specific questions would probably 

>the only way to tell. 

> 

>Aus Dem Kasten 

> 

>-----Original Message----- 

>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 

>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of 

>Andrew Ayre 

>Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:30 PM 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater 

> 

>I assumed (and still do) that Gale was referring to the next entry which 

>indicates this person went caching with someone else. Gale - is that 

>right? 

> 

>Andy 

> 

> 

>-----Original Message----- 

>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com 

>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of RAND 

>HARDIN 

>Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 3:07 PM 

>To: AZ-Geocaching 

>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater 

>Gale, 

> 

>Just because a person states "Nice location!" on the cache page doesn't 

>mean that the individual found the cache. In the case of the cache that 

>you reference, I could look at the map and determine the cache is 

>located in a "nice location." 

> 

>It's also possible the individual may be driving to/past the caches 

>without actually finding them, but is claiming them as a virtual. 

> 

>I believe it's understood that a log book/sheet must be signed at the 

>cache location to claim a find on the web page (unless the cache is 

>actually a virtual and/or has other rules for claiming a find). I have 

>no objection to a cache owner deleting an entry if there is no proof 

>that the individual actually found the cache. If there is a question 

>from a cache owner, an email to the individual asking to explain where 

>and how the cache was found and/or asking for a description of the cache 

>should clear up some doubt. 

> 

>Rand 

> 

>----- Original Message ----- 

>From: gale 'Desert Viking' 

>Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 2:10 PM 

>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater 

> 

>If this is the person you are referring to, check out this log entry for 

>Feb/2002. http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=10655 

>>t> &log=y&decrypt= There's another one I remember seeing that may 

>exhonerate him. I'm still looking for it. 

> 

> 


MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 00:03:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (gale 'Desert Viking')
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 00:03:48 +0000
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] feel free to ignore this
Message-ID: 


I'm just testing to see which, if any, of my e-mail addresses gets the listserv.




Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898



Add photos to your messages with  MSN 8.  Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 00:09:13 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 17:09:13 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3253B.DC95AA40
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Gale,

I've had the same problems with my email in the past two hours.  It was o=
bvious I didn't receive two listserv posts.  I finally received one about=
 40 minutes later than others - and have not yet received my own note tha=
t was a reply to you at 3:07 p.m. today.

I wonder, do you have MSN?  I am always having problems with my email.

Rand (RandMan)

----- Original Message -----
From: gale 'Desert Viking'
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 4:52 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater

Wow, I think I'm finally having the same problems everyone with Hotmail h=
as been having. I obviously missed a couple of e-mails!
: gale 'Desert Viking' =20

------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3253B.DC95AA40
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Gale,
   
I've had the same problems with my email in the=
 past two hours.  It was obvious I didn't receive two listserv posts=
.  I finally received one about 40 minutes later than others - =
and have not yet received my own note that was a re=
ply to you at 3:07 p.m. today.
 
 
 
I wonder, do =
you have MSN?  I am always having problems with my email.
   
Rand (RandMan)
 
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
 
From: gale 'Desert Viking'
 Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 4:52 PM=
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.c=
om
 
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocachi=
ng] cheater/not cheater
 
 
 
 
 
Wow, I thi=
nk I'm finally having the same problems everyone with Hotmail has been ha=
ving. I obviously missed a couple of e-mails!
 
: gale 'Desert Vikin=
g' 
 


------=_NextPart_001_0001_01C3253B.DC95AA40--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 00:24:52 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Draper)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 17:24:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Hotmail is for the birds
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030529002452.89866.qmail@web14804.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1626376235-1054167892=:89848
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I have cox internet with MSN as my homepage. At one point, I had problems with Hotmail and geocaching.com notifications. I frequently get e-mail in mixed up order (receive replies before the original message). I just switched the listserv to my yahoo e-mail address. It's free and has larger capacity. Once you "tell" it that the listserv isn't junk mail, it works fine. You may want to consider changing over. Go to yahoo.com and click on e-mail. And it accepts my real last name.

RAND HARDIN  wrote:Gale,
 
I've had the same problems with my email in the past two hours.  It was obvious I didn't receive two listserv posts.  I finally received one about 40 minutes later than others - and have not yet received my own note that was a reply to you at 3:07 p.m. today.
 
I wonder, do you have MSN?  I am always having problems with my email.
 
Rand (RandMan)
 
----- Original Message -----
From: gale 'Desert Viking'
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 4:52 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater
 

Wow, I think I'm finally having the same problems everyone with Hotmail has been having. I obviously missed a couple of e-mails!

: gale 'Desert Viking' 






---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1626376235-1054167892=:89848
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


I have cox internet with MSN as my homepage. At one point, I had problems with Hotmail and geocaching.com notifications. I frequently get e-mail in mixed up order (receive replies before the original message). I just switched the listserv to my yahoo e-mail address. It's free and has larger capacity. Once you "tell" it that the listserv isn't junk mail, it works fine. You may want to consider changing over. Go to yahoo.com and click on e-mail. And it accepts my real last name.

RAND HARDIN <RHrdn8@msn.com> wrote:



Gale,


 


I've had the same problems with my email in the past two hours.  It was obvious I didn't receive two listserv posts.  I finally received one about 40 minutes later than others - and have not yet received my own note that was a reply to you at 3:07 p.m. today.


 


I wonder, do you have MSN?  I am always having problems with my email.


 


Rand (RandMan)


 




----- Original Message -----


From: gale 'Desert Viking'


Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 4:52 PM


To: listserv@azgeocaching.com


Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] cheater/not cheater


 






Wow, I think I'm finally having the same problems everyone with Hotmail has been having. I obviously missed a couple of e-mails!


: gale 'Desert Viking' 



Do you Yahoo!?

Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1626376235-1054167892=:89848--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 03:11:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (James and Diane Herr)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 20:11:51 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
References: <200305281905.MAA26506@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <3ED57A77.3050204@cox.net>

I actually had one of these logs on our 'Show Me the Quail cache'.  I 
got over and checked it out today.
There is no cache entry by the team in the log book. (And still no Quail!)

>From: Tim Giron 
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] for the stat worry people
>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 14:51:44 -0400
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>Perhaps he just has a different interpretation for the "SL" portion of his entries; some possibilities:
>
>saw log
>
>sawed log <- any fresh cut wood nearby?
>
>sold log <- not likely since they appear to still be there
>
>smooched log <- Ewwwww!
>
>signed lightly
>
>sighted legumes <- not likely at every cache
>
>surfed LaJolla <- perhaps a crowning moment in his life
>
>Tim
>Team AZFastFeet (headed for the last page of the stats!)
>
Actually, on the logs on our caches, he/she/they always put TN/LN/SN. 
 At first
glance it looks like the standard tag line, but they actually use SN as 
in 'Signed Nothing'.
I really can't imagine the motive behind going and locating a cache, and 
then not doing
the cache owner the favor of writing a few words to commemorate the 
visit, even if it
is only just your team name.  In looking thru our logbook I saw some 
cards inserted in
the log book, team Sprocket has a nice rubber stamp you can't miss, and 
someone
hand wrote some slips of paper which they dated and left in the log.  I 
liked them all.
If the team in question is reading this, please reconsider logging your 
finds in the cache
logbook.... if not to have a complete history for the cache, please do 
it to give something
back to the team that hid it.

--
Jim - Team 8 Feet



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 04:46:26 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 21:46:26 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question
Message-ID: 





Hi All,


I have been doing some reading on longitude and latitude and  how to calculate distances. I came across a Longitude of  -111.xxxx. The question is: does the Minus sign before the 111 mean West? 


Thanks





Andrew 












MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 05:16:37 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:16:37 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Yes, it does in the absence of a 'W'.

Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
Weissman, Psy.D.
  Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:46 PM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question



  Hi All,

  I have been doing some reading on longitude and latitude and  how to
calculate distances. I came across a Longitude of  -111.xxxx. The question
is: does the Minus sign before the 111 mean West?

  Thanks






  Andrew


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

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Yes,=20
it does in the absence of a 'W'.


 


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 =
9:46=20
  PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: =
[Az-Geocaching]=20
  Longitude question


  

  

  

Hi All,

  
I have been doing some reading on longitude and latitude and  =
how to=20
  calculate distances. I came across a Longitude of  -111.xxxx. The =

  question is: does the Minus sign before the 111 mean West? 

  
Thanks




  
Andrew=20
  

  

  

  

  

  


  

  MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL=20
  VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.=20
  ____________________________________________________________ =
Az-Geocaching=20
  mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe =
or=20
  unsubscribe visit:=20
  http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching =
Arizona's=20
  Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com =



------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C32566.CE23F220--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 05:21:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:21:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question
Message-ID: 

Thanks :)

Andrew

>From: "Andrew Ayre" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: 
>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question
>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:16:37 -0700
>
>Yes, it does in the absence of a 'W'.
>
>Andy
>
>
>
>   -----Original Message-----
>   From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Andrew
>Weissman, Psy.D.
>   Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:46 PM
>   To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>   Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Longitude question
>
>
>
>   Hi All,
>
>   I have been doing some reading on longitude and latitude and  how to
>calculate distances. I came across a Longitude of  -111.xxxx. The question
>is: does the Minus sign before the 111 mean West?
>
>   Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   Andrew
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>--
>   MSN 8 helps ELIMINATE E-MAIL VIRUSES. Get 2 months FREE*.
>____________________________________________________________ Az-Geocaching
>mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your setting, subscribe or
>unsubscribe visit:
>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching Arizona's
>Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com

_________________________________________________________________
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 06:17:31 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:17:31 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
Message-ID: <008401c325a9$fce9fe40$6501a8c0@TABLET>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly reminded me
of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has the rather
long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius Who Solved the
Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written by Dava Sobel.
The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like interesting
reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I even knew what
a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your summer vacation.

Steve

Team Tierra Buena


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The exchange between the “Andrews” about
longitude suddenly reminded me of a book I read in the years BC (Before
Caching). It has the rather long title of Longitude:
The True Story of a Lone Genius Who Solved the Greatest Scientific =
Problem of
His Time, and it’s written by Dava Sobel. The title =
pretty much
sums it up. It might not sound like interesting reading, but I =
couldn’t
put it down… and that’s before I even knew what a GPSr is. =
Could be
a good one for you to take on your summer =
vacation.



Steve


Team Tierra =
Buena









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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 13:56:12 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 06:56:12 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
References: <008401c325a9$fce9fe40$6501a8c0@TABLET>
Message-ID: <001e01c325ea$11728a40$5811b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C325AF.63F65B60
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have thought the A&E movie of the same name  that being Longitude was =
a good watch...
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Team Tierra Buena=20
  To: Arizona Geocaching=20
  Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 11:17 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading


  The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly reminded =
me of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has the rather =
long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius Who Solved the =
Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written by Dava Sobel. =
The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like interesting =
reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I even knew what =
a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your summer vacation.

  Steve

  Team Tierra Buena

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I have thought the A&E movie of the =
same=20
name  that being Longitude was a good watch...



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Team Tierra Buena =

  
To: Arizona =
Geocaching=20
  

  
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 =
11:17=20
  PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach=20
  Reading

  


  

  
The exchange between the =
=93Andrews=94=20
  about longitude suddenly reminded me of a book I read in the years BC =
(Before=20
  Caching). It has the rather long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius =
Who=20
  Solved the Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and =
it=92s=20
  written by Dava Sobel. The title pretty much sums =
it up. It=20
  might not sound like interesting reading, but I couldn=92t put it =
down=85 and=20
  that=92s before I even knew what a GPSr is. Could be a good one for =
you to take=20
  on your summer vacation.

  
Steve

  
Team Tierra=20
  Buena


------=_NextPart_000_001B_01C325AF.63F65B60--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 15:10:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:10:55 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
Message-ID: 




Steve,


Do you know the author of the book?


Andrew











>From: "Team Tierra Buena" 


>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com 

>To: "Arizona Geocaching" 

>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading 

>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:17:31 -0700 

> 

>The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly reminded me 

>of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has the rather 

>long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius Who Solved the 

>Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written by Dava Sobel. 

>The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like interesting 

>reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I even knew what 

>a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your summer vacation. 

> 

>Steve 

> 

>Team Tierra Buena 

> 


MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service:  2 months FREE*

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 15:18:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Marc Leitermann)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:18:19 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Message-ID: <20030529151819.DE614299DF@xmxpita.excite.com>

To all who worry:

I would like to thank Jon (Aus Dem Kasten) for telling me about this thread on alleged cheating.  Here’s my thoughts, for what they are worth.

Looking thru the national site, I found this:

“What are the rules in Geocaching? 
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very simple: 
1. Take something from the cache 
2. Leave something in the cache 
3. Write about it in the logbook “

Looking at the on-line log entries for several caches, including several I have logged, you can find any combination of these three ‘rules'.  Several clearly state they did not take something.  Well, how is that really different from not writing in the logbook? I take the use of the word ‘rule’ above as meaning a suggested action.  Certainly nothing engraved in stone.

Signing a log is definite proof the person was at the cache.  However, the reverse is not proof, of anything.  If someone (certainly not me!) wants to list a lot of caches he or she has not actually found, so what? Afraid of someone ‘headed for the last page of the stats’ (as AZFastFeet states) before you? I’m at a modest 270+, and am working to up that number, just as I suppose all of you are.  And although my biggest thrill is actually finding the cache, I also enjoy looking at the numbers.

I generally cache with two different friends – one who loves to dig thru the cache and see what’s there, and write in the book.  However, he quite often does not take and leave, since he forgets to bring something to exchange. 

The other’s point of view is like mine – “he sounds weird because I am sure that lots of people just enjoy finding the cache (like us), not looking at the contents or signing a log - he is missing the point of the game (its suppose to be fun).” (This person is not even registered with the national site).

BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not cluttered up.

Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I’m out to have fun.

Happy caching, wherever you are …………

Marc


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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 15:33:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:33:01 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Message-ID: <20030529153303.SOES27188.fed1mtao07.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>

Um, I just wanted to clarify that my tagline was in reference to the fact that I haven't been caching very much lateley and therefore I am headed in the other direction!

"Afraid of someone ‘headed for the last page of the stats’ (as AZFastFeet states) before you?"



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 15:58:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:58:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000401c325fb$31dc5c50$6501a8c0@TABLET>

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-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 8:11 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading

 

Steve,

Do you know the author of the book?

Andrew

Dava Sobel.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your
setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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-----Original Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Weissman, =
Psy.D.

Sent: Thursday, May
 29, 2003 8:11 =
AM

To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

Subject: Re: =
[Az-Geocaching] Beach
Reading



 









Steve,



Do you
know the author of the book?



Andrew



Dava =
Sobel.



Steve

Team Tierra Buena

















____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 16:20:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:20:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
In-Reply-To: <20030529151819.DE614299DF@xmxpita.excite.com>
References: <20030529151819.DE614299DF@xmxpita.excite.com>
Message-ID: <3ED6335D.2090109@Snaptek.com>

Marc Leitermann wrote:
> “What are the rules in Geocaching? 
> Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very simple: 
> 1. Take something from the cache 
> 2. Leave something in the cache 
> 3. Write about it in the logbook “

> BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not cluttered up.
> 
> Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I’m out to have fun.

I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew 
  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the 
window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't 
think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache 
isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache. 
Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the 
paper logs than there are on the online version.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 16:38:40 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:38:40 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
In-Reply-To: <3ED6335D.2090109@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: 

I think another point that you should understand Marc, is that it is
generally regarded as open to the cache hider the exact rules on recording a
find for that specific cache. A lot of cache hiders when comparing the paper
log to the online log will delete your online log (including me - I will
Email the person first to find out what is going on), so you are running the
risk of having your online record altered/deleted in places. Is that what
you want for not spending literally 30 seconds to write at least your name
on a piece of paper? If you follow the numbers game then I wouldn't think
so. If you are happy with that and just having fun finding then I don't see
a problem with you not signing the log. Just don't start complaining when
people delete your online logs.

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Brian
Cluff
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:21 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater


Marc Leitermann wrote:
> “What are the rules in Geocaching?
> Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
simple:
> 1. Take something from the cache
> 2. Leave something in the cache
> 3. Write about it in the logbook “

> BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
>
> Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I’m out to have fun.

I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
paper logs than there are on the online version.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

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http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 16:44:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Schwarz)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 16:44:55
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
Message-ID: <3.0.5.16.20030529164455.087fd092@pop.mindspring.com>

Bummer!  The powers that be at geocaching.com rejected my idea
for a virtual cache at a thermometer, which is hidden right off
the Groom Creek trail (trail 307), 6 miles south of Prescott!
I thought that would be a cool thing for people to find.  Oh well...

I was up there on May 25, and while stopping at the thermometer
to check the reading, decided to get coordinates, and set it up
as a virtual cache.  This thermometer has been there, on the back
side of a tree, for many years B.C. (before caching), I first
noticed it in 1992.  Who put it there is a mystery.

The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199

Geocaching.com's position was that if you are able to place a
physical cache at a location, then ONLY a physical cache may
be placed there- no virtuals.

If anybody who will be hiking the Groom Creek Trail during the
next several months wishes to see if they can find the thermometer,
it is located at:

N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526

It is on the back side of a tree on the north side of the trail.
If anybody does actually find it, please let me know, by sending
an email to malthusian@mindspring.com, even though you can't log 
a geocaching.com cache find for it.

Mike 
Team Malthusian



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Thu May 29 23:57:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Koch, Dan)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 16:57:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
Message-ID: 

Actually, you could log a find for it.  The site allows logs to be made on
Archived (but viewable) caches.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Schwarz [mailto:malthusian@mindspring.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:45 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected :(


Bummer!  The powers that be at geocaching.com rejected my idea
for a virtual cache at a thermometer, which is hidden right off
the Groom Creek trail (trail 307), 6 miles south of Prescott!
I thought that would be a cool thing for people to find.  Oh well...

I was up there on May 25, and while stopping at the thermometer
to check the reading, decided to get coordinates, and set it up
as a virtual cache.  This thermometer has been there, on the back
side of a tree, for many years B.C. (before caching), I first
noticed it in 1992.  Who put it there is a mystery.

The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199

Geocaching.com's position was that if you are able to place a
physical cache at a location, then ONLY a physical cache may
be placed there- no virtuals.

If anybody who will be hiking the Groom Creek Trail during the
next several months wishes to see if they can find the thermometer,
it is located at:

N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526

It is on the back side of a tree on the north side of the trail.
If anybody does actually find it, please let me know, by sending
an email to malthusian@mindspring.com, even though you can't log 
a geocaching.com cache find for it.

Mike 
Team Malthusian


____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 00:47:44 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Draper)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 17:47:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Omniterranaut crazy???
Message-ID: <20030530004744.62578.qmail@web14811.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-569770887-1054255664=:61443
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I saw this on my watch list today. It was 111* yesterday!!! Congratulations for tying the record. Just kidding (sort of) about the crazy part.


 
omniterranaut has logged a cache on your watch list (Why?). You can 
visit the cache at the following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=52218

User comments:
Today I went caching to break the record for most in a day. I started 
at dawn and went until midnight. I was shooting for 60 finds but all I 
could do was tie for the record. Now I'm sunburnt, blistered and 
exhausted. It was quite an adventure. This was find #9 of the day.
 
 



Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

 

Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-569770887-1054255664=:61443
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii




I saw this on my watch list today. It was 111* yesterday!!! 

Congratulations for tying the record. Just kidding (sort of) about the crazy part.


 


omniterranaut has logged a cache on your watch list (Why?). You can 
visit the cache at the following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=52218

User comments:
Today I went caching to break the record for most in a day. I started 
at dawn and went until midnight. I was shooting for 60 finds but all I 
could do was tie for the record. Now I'm sunburnt, blistered and 
exhausted. It was quite an adventure. This was find #9 of the day.


 


 


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898

Do you Yahoo!?

Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-569770887-1054255664=:61443--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 01:14:22 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Draper)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 18:14:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] UrbanScape enabled again
Message-ID: <20030530011422.25178.qmail@web14808.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-94604079-1054257262=:25026
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Just to let everyone know (especially 2 cachers) we have UrbanScape up and running again. Please read the cache page. We had to move the cache a few feet away from its original location. There is no need to be destructive in order to find it. (Not that any cacher would be.) Happy hunting.


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

 

Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-94604079-1054257262=:25026
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Just to let everyone know (especially 2 cachers) we have UrbanScape up and running again. Please read the cache page. We had to move the cache a few feet away from its original location. There is no need to be destructive in order to find it. (Not that any cacher would be.) Happy hunting.


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898

Do you Yahoo!?

Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-94604079-1054257262=:25026--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 01:19:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:19:19 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Omniterranaut crazy???
References: <20030530004744.62578.qmail@web14811.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003501c32649$7ecf78a0$0500a8c0@one>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think the proper term is dedicated. We need more dedicated cachers out =
there so those of us that are totally crazy won't look so bad. Of course =
I'm lucky now if I can find 10 in a day. Of course I usually have to =
drive 200 miles or more to do it. Looking forward to the day when I can =
return to the land of plenty caches.

Team Sand Dollar
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Gale Draper=20
  To: list=20
  Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 8:47 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is Omniterranaut crazy???


  I saw this on my watch list today. It was 111* yesterday!!!=20
  Congratulations for tying the record. Just kidding (sort of) about the =
crazy part.


  omniterranaut has logged a cache on your watch list (Why?). You can=20
  visit the cache at the following link:

  http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D52218

  User comments:
  Today I went caching to break the record for most in a day. I started=20
  at dawn and went until midnight. I was shooting for 60 finds but all I =

  could do was tie for the record. Now I'm sunburnt, blistered and=20
  exhausted. It was quite an adventure. This was find #9 of the day.





  Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
    On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
  "Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
    "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

  Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-----
  Do you Yahoo!?
  Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C32627.F7518240
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









I think the proper term is dedicated. =
We need more=20
dedicated cachers out there so those of us that are totally crazy won't =
look so=20
bad. Of course I'm lucky now if I can find 10 in a day. Of course I =
usually have=20
to drive 200 miles or more to do it. Looking forward to the day when I =
can=20
return to the land of plenty caches.


 


Team Sand Dollar


  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Gale Draper 
  
To: list 

  
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 =
8:47=20
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Is =
Omniterranaut=20
  crazy???

  


  

  
I saw this on my watch list today. It was =
111*=20
  yesterday!!! 
  
Congratulations for tying the record. Just =
kidding=20
  (sort of) about the crazy part.

  
 

  
omniterranaut has logged a cache on your watch list (Why?). You =
can=20
  
visit the cache at the following link:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=3D522=
18

User=20
  comments:
Today I went caching to break the record for most in a =
day. I=20
  started 
at dawn and went until midnight. I was shooting for 60 =
finds but=20
  all I 
could do was tie for the record. Now I'm sunburnt, blistered =
and=20
  
exhausted. It was quite an adventure. This was find #9 of the =
day.

  
 

  
 



  
Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang =
interminable=20
  changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- =

  so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the =
Ranges=20
  --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for =
you.=20
  Go!"

  

  
 

  

  
Rudyard Kipling ,   The =
Explorer =20
  1898

  

  

  Do you Yahoo!?
Free on=
line=20
  calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).

------=_NextPart_000_0032_01C32627.F7518240--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 01:36:17 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (skydad)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 18:36:17 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c>

Enough already!!  Truly amazing that there is even a topic on "cheating" in
regards to geocaching.  Even more amazing that so many people care.

More interesting topic - - Was the Pirate ever identified?

Thanks for the book suggestion Steve - plan on taking to Rocky Point and
reading over a beer or two . . . ok maybe three.

The Lunch Club


----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 12:05 PM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1210 - 6 msgs


> Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
> az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> az-geocaching-request@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Beach Reading (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
>    2. Cheater / Not Cheater (Marc Leitermann)
>    3. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Tim Giron)
>    4. RE: Beach Reading (Team Tierra Buena)
>    5. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Brian Cluff)
>    6. RE: Cheater / Not Cheater (Andrew Ayre)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> From: "Andrew Weissman, Psy.D." 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:10:55 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> 

> 
Steve,

> 
Do you know the author of the book?

> 
Andrew


> 

> 

> 

> 

> 
>From: "Team Tierra Buena"


> 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> 
>To: "Arizona Geocaching"

> 
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
> 
>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:17:31 -0700
> 
>
> 
>The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly
reminded me
> 
>of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has
the rather
> 
>long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius
Who Solved the
> 
>Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written
by Dava Sobel.
> 
>The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like
interesting
> 
>reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I
even knew what
> 
>a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your
summer vacation.
> 
>
> 
>Steve
> 
>
> 
>Team Tierra Buena
> 
>
> 

MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service:
 2 months FREE*
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> From: "Marc Leitermann" 
> Cc:
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:18:19 -0400 (EDT)
> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>
> To all who worry:
>
> I would like to thank Jon (Aus Dem Kasten) for telling me about this
thread on alleged cheating.  Here's my thoughts, for what they are worth.
>
> Looking thru the national site, I found this:
>
> "What are the rules in Geocaching?
> Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
simple:
> 1. Take something from the cache
> 2. Leave something in the cache
> 3. Write about it in the logbook "
>
> Looking at the on-line log entries for several caches, including several I
have logged, you can find any combination of these three 'rules'.  Several
clearly state they did not take something.  Well, how is that really
different from not writing in the logbook? I take the use of the word 'rule'
above as meaning a suggested action.  Certainly nothing engraved in stone.
>
> Signing a log is definite proof the person was at the cache.  However, the
reverse is not proof, of anything.  If someone (certainly not me!) wants to
list a lot of caches he or she has not actually found, so what? Afraid of
someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet states)
before you? I'm at a modest 270+, and am working to up that number, just as
I suppose all of you are.  And although my biggest thrill is actually
finding the cache, I also enjoy looking at the numbers.
>
> I generally cache with two different friends - one who loves to dig thru
the cache and see what's there, and write in the book.  However, he quite
often does not take and leave, since he forgets to bring something to
exchange.
>
> The other's point of view is like mine - "he sounds weird because I am
sure that lots of people just enjoy finding the cache (like us), not looking
at the contents or signing a log - he is missing the point of the game (its
suppose to be fun)." (This person is not even registered with the national
site).
>
> BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
>
> Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>
> Happy caching, wherever you are ....
>
> Marc
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
> The most personalized portal on the Web!
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> From: Tim Giron 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:33:01 -0400
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> Um, I just wanted to clarify that my tagline was in reference to the fact
that I haven't been caching very much lateley and therefore I am headed in
the other direction!
>
> "Afraid of someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet
states) before you?"
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> From: "Team Tierra Buena" 
> To: 
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:58:48 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
> Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 8:11 AM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
>
>
>
> Steve,
>
> Do you know the author of the book?
>
> Andrew
>
> Dava Sobel.
>
> Steve
> Team Tierra Buena
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your
> setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450
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> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> 
>
> 
>  charset=3Dus-ascii">
>
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 

>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:
> 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:
> 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

>
> 
 0in 4.0pt'>
>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
> font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----

> From:
> az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]  style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of Andrew Weissman, =
> Psy.D.

> Sent:  size=3D2 face=3DTahoma> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Thursday, May
>  29, 2003 style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
> font-family:Tahoma'>   style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>8:11 =
> AM face=3DTahoma>

> To: =
> listserv@azgeocaching.com

> Subject: Re: =
> [Az-Geocaching] Beach
> Reading

>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:
> 12.0pt'> 

>
> 

>
> 

>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Steve,

>
> 
 style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Do you
> know the author of the book?

>
> 
 Roman"> style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Andrew

>
> 
 face=3DArial> style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dava =
> Sobel.

>
> 
 face=3DArial> style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Steve

> Team Tierra Buena

>
> 

>
> 

>
> 

>
> 

>
> 
>
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450--
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:20:45 -0700
> From: Brian Cluff 
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> Marc Leitermann wrote:
> > "What are the rules in Geocaching?
> > Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
simple:
> > 1. Take something from the cache
> > 2. Leave something in the cache
> > 3. Write about it in the logbook "
>
> > BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
> >
> > Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>
> I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
> If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
>   for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
> window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
> think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
> isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
> Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
> paper logs than there are on the online version.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> From: "Andrew Ayre" 
> To: 
> Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
> Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:38:40 -0700
> Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
> I think another point that you should understand Marc, is that it is
> generally regarded as open to the cache hider the exact rules on recording
a
> find for that specific cache. A lot of cache hiders when comparing the
paper
> log to the online log will delete your online log (including me - I will
> Email the person first to find out what is going on), so you are running
the
> risk of having your online record altered/deleted in places. Is that what
> you want for not spending literally 30 seconds to write at least your name
> on a piece of paper? If you follow the numbers game then I wouldn't think
> so. If you are happy with that and just having fun finding then I don't
see
> a problem with you not signing the log. Just don't start complaining when
> people delete your online logs.
>
> Andy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
> [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Brian
> Cluff
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:21 AM
> To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>
>
> Marc Leitermann wrote:
> > "What are the rules in Geocaching?
> > Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
> simple:
> > 1. Take something from the cache
> > 2. Leave something in the cache
> > 3. Write about it in the logbook "
>
> > BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
> number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
> preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
> cluttered up.
> >
> > Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>
> I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
> If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
>   for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
> window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
> think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
> isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
> Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
> paper logs than there are on the online version.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> _______________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list
> listserv@azgeocaching.com
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com
>
>
>
> End of Az-Geocaching Digest


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 03:53:54 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 20:53:54 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net> <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c>
Message-ID: <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com>

--------------070101040007040202080905
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

skydad (The Lunch Club) wrote:

>Enough already!!  Truly amazing that there is even a topic on "cheating" in
>regards to geocaching.  Even more amazing that so many people care.


Thanks for the feedback Skydad, but you might want to skip reading this email.

For the cachers that were interested in this topic:

I followed Rand's advice and contacted Marc with questions regarding his logs on two of our caches.
Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information.  I then explained the situation in more detail and told him about the listserv so that he could be included in the conversation.  I informed him of how I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were some other cachers.

Marc has since sent me two emails describing our two caches.  The descriptions were detailed enough for me to be confident in believing that he did in fact visit the caches and chooses not to sign the logbooks.

So as for cheating, I personally do not think that this is an issue.  Not signing the logbooks will be an issue each cache owner will have to decide for themselves.  In this case I have chosen to leave the logs, but in the furture I may add in my cache descriptions that signing the logbook is required to receive credit for the cache, as I enjoy trying to maintain an accurate log.

Marc - Thank you for being helpful and understanding.

Jon
Aus Dem Kasten

>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: 
>To: 
>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 12:05 PM
>Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1210 - 6 msgs
>
>
>  
>
>>Send Az-Geocaching mailing list submissions to
>>az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>az-geocaching-request@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>You can reach the person managing the list at
>>az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>than "Re: Contents of Az-Geocaching digest..."
>>
>>
>>Today's Topics:
>>
>>   1. Re: Beach Reading (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
>>   2. Cheater / Not Cheater (Marc Leitermann)
>>   3. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Tim Giron)
>>   4. RE: Beach Reading (Team Tierra Buena)
>>   5. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Brian Cluff)
>>   6. RE: Cheater / Not Cheater (Andrew Ayre)
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 1
>>From: "Andrew Weissman, Psy.D." 
>>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:10:55 -0700
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>

>>
Steve,

>>
Do you know the author of the book?

>>
Andrew


>>

>>

>>

>>

>>
>From: "Team Tierra Buena"
>>    
>>
>

>  
>
>>
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>To: "Arizona Geocaching"
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
>>
>Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:17:31 -0700
>>
>
>>
>The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly
>>    
>>
>reminded me
>  
>
>>
>of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has
>>    
>>
>the rather
>  
>
>>
>long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius
>>    
>>
>Who Solved the
>  
>
>>
>Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written
>>    
>>
>by Dava Sobel.
>  
>
>>
>The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like
>>    
>>
>interesting
>  
>
>>
>reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I
>>    
>>
>even knew what
>  
>
>>
>a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your
>>    
>>
>summer vacation.
>  
>
>>
>
>>
>Steve
>>
>
>>
>Team Tierra Buena
>>
>
>>

MSN 8 with >    
>>
>href="http://g.msn.com/8HMJENUS/2740??PS=">e-mail virus protection service:
> 2 months FREE*
>  
>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 2
>>To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>From: "Marc Leitermann" 
>>Cc:
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:18:19 -0400 (EDT)
>>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>
>>To all who worry:
>>
>>I would like to thank Jon (Aus Dem Kasten) for telling me about this
>>    
>>
>thread on alleged cheating.  Here's my thoughts, for what they are worth.
>  
>
>>Looking thru the national site, I found this:
>>
>>"What are the rules in Geocaching?
>>Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
>>    
>>
>simple:
>  
>
>>1. Take something from the cache
>>2. Leave something in the cache
>>3. Write about it in the logbook "
>>
>>Looking at the on-line log entries for several caches, including several I
>>    
>>
>have logged, you can find any combination of these three 'rules'.  Several
>clearly state they did not take something.  Well, how is that really
>different from not writing in the logbook? I take the use of the word 'rule'
>above as meaning a suggested action.  Certainly nothing engraved in stone.
>  
>
>>Signing a log is definite proof the person was at the cache.  However, the
>>    
>>
>reverse is not proof, of anything.  If someone (certainly not me!) wants to
>list a lot of caches he or she has not actually found, so what? Afraid of
>someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet states)
>before you? I'm at a modest 270+, and am working to up that number, just as
>I suppose all of you are.  And although my biggest thrill is actually
>finding the cache, I also enjoy looking at the numbers.
>  
>
>>I generally cache with two different friends - one who loves to dig thru
>>    
>>
>the cache and see what's there, and write in the book.  However, he quite
>often does not take and leave, since he forgets to bring something to
>exchange.
>  
>
>>The other's point of view is like mine - "he sounds weird because I am
>>    
>>
>sure that lots of people just enjoy finding the cache (like us), not looking
>at the contents or signing a log - he is missing the point of the game (its
>suppose to be fun)." (This person is not even registered with the national
>site).
>  
>
>>BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
>>    
>>
>number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
>preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
>cluttered up.
>  
>
>>Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>>
>>Happy caching, wherever you are ....
>>
>>Marc
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
>>The most personalized portal on the Web!
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 3
>>From: Tim Giron 
>>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:33:01 -0400
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>Um, I just wanted to clarify that my tagline was in reference to the fact
>>    
>>
>that I haven't been caching very much lateley and therefore I am headed in
>the other direction!
>  
>
>>"Afraid of someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet
>>    
>>
>states) before you?"
>  
>
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 4
>>From: "Team Tierra Buena" 
>>To: 
>>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:58:48 -0700
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>>
>>------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450
>>Content-Type: text/plain;
>>charset="us-ascii"
>>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
>>Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
>>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 8:11 AM
>>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
>>
>>
>>
>>Steve,
>>
>>Do you know the author of the book?
>>
>>Andrew
>>
>>Dava Sobel.
>>
>>Steve
>>Team Tierra Buena
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com To edit your
>>setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450
>>Content-Type: text/html;
>>charset="us-ascii"
>>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>charset=3Dus-ascii">
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:
>>10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:
>>10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> 

>>
>>
>0in 4.0pt'>
>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
>>font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----

>>From:
>>az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] >style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of Andrew Weissman, =
>>Psy.D.

>>Sent: >size=3D2 face=3DTahoma>>style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Thursday, May
>> 29, 2003>style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
>>font-family:Tahoma'> > style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>8:11 =
>>AM>face=3DTahoma>

>>To: =
>>listserv@azgeocaching.com

>>Subject: Re: =
>>[Az-Geocaching] Beach
>>Reading

>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:
>>12.0pt'> 

>>
>>

>>
>>

>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Steve,

>>
>>
>style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Do you
>>know the author of the book?

>>
>>
>Roman">>style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Andrew

>>
>>
>face=3DArial>>style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dava =
>>Sobel.

>>
>>
>face=3DArial>>style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Steve

>>Team Tierra Buena

>>
>>

>>
>>

>>
>>

>>
>>

>>
>>
>>
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C325C0.857D8450--
>>
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 5
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:20:45 -0700
>>From: Brian Cluff 
>>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>Marc Leitermann wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>"What are the rules in Geocaching?
>>>Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
>>>      
>>>
>simple:
>  
>
>>>1. Take something from the cache
>>>2. Leave something in the cache
>>>3. Write about it in the logbook "
>>>      
>>>
>>>BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
>>>      
>>>
>number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
>preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
>cluttered up.
>  
>
>>>Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>>>      
>>>
>>I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
>>If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
>>  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
>>window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
>>think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
>>isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
>>Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
>>paper logs than there are on the online version.
>>
>>Brian Cluff
>>Team Snaptek
>>
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>Message: 6
>>From: "Andrew Ayre" 
>>To: 
>>Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:38:40 -0700
>>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>
>>I think another point that you should understand Marc, is that it is
>>generally regarded as open to the cache hider the exact rules on recording
>>    
>>
>a
>  
>
>>find for that specific cache. A lot of cache hiders when comparing the
>>    
>>
>paper
>  
>
>>log to the online log will delete your online log (including me - I will
>>Email the person first to find out what is going on), so you are running
>>    
>>
>the
>  
>
>>risk of having your online record altered/deleted in places. Is that what
>>you want for not spending literally 30 seconds to write at least your name
>>on a piece of paper? If you follow the numbers game then I wouldn't think
>>so. If you are happy with that and just having fun finding then I don't
>>    
>>
>see
>  
>
>>a problem with you not signing the log. Just don't start complaining when
>>people delete your online logs.
>>
>>Andy
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
>>[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Brian
>>Cluff
>>Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:21 AM
>>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
>>
>>
>>Marc Leitermann wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>"What are the rules in Geocaching?
>>>Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
>>>      
>>>
>>simple:
>>    
>>
>>>1. Take something from the cache
>>>2. Leave something in the cache
>>>3. Write about it in the logbook "
>>>      
>>>
>>>BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
>>>      
>>>
>>number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
>>preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
>>cluttered up.
>>    
>>
>>>Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
>>>      
>>>
>>I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
>>If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
>>  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
>>window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
>>think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
>>isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
>>Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
>>paper logs than there are on the online version.
>>
>>Brian Cluff
>>Team Snaptek
>>
>>____________________________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>>http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>>Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>>http://www.azgeocaching.com
>>
>>
>>
>>--__--__--
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Az-Geocaching mailing list
>>listserv@azgeocaching.com
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skydad (The Lunch Club) wrote:

   

>Enough already!!  Truly amazing that there is even a topic on "cheating" in
>regards to geocaching.  Even more amazing that so many people care.


Thanks for the feedback Skydad, but you might want to skip reading this email.

For the cachers that were interested in this topic:

I followed Rand's advice and contacted Marc with questions regarding his logs on two of our caches.
Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information.  I then explained the situation in more detail and told him about the listserv so that he could be included in the conversation.  I informed him of how I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were some other cachers.

Marc has since sent me two emails describing our two caches.  The descriptions were detailed enough for me to be confident in believing that he did in fact visit the caches and chooses not to sign the logbooks.

So as for cheating, I personally do not think that this is an issue.  Not signing the logbooks will be an issue each cache owner will have to decide for themselves.  In this case I have chosen to leave the logs, but in the furture I may add in my cache descriptions that signing the logbook is required to receive credit for the cache, as I enjoy trying to maintain an accurate log.

Marc - Thank you for being helpful and understanding.

Jon
Aus Dem Kasten



  

----- Original Message -----
From: <az-geocaching-request@listserv.azgeocaching.com>
To: <az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 12:05 PM
Subject: Az-Geocaching digest, Vol 1 #1210 - 6 msgs


  

  

    
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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Beach Reading (Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.)
   2. Cheater / Not Cheater (Marc Leitermann)
   3. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Tim Giron)
   4. RE: Beach Reading (Team Tierra Buena)
   5. Re: Cheater / Not Cheater (Brian Cluff)
   6. RE: Cheater / Not Cheater (Andrew Ayre)

--__--__--

Message: 1
From: "Andrew Weissman, Psy.D." <psydaz@hotmail.com>
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:10:55 -0700
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV>
<P>Steve,</P>
<P>Do you know the author of the book?</P>
<P>Andrew<BR><BR></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>&gt;From: "Team Tierra Buena"
    

  

  
<TEAMTIERRABUENA@EARTHLINK.NET></DIV>
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
<DIV></DIV>&gt;To: "Arizona Geocaching"
    

  

  
<AZ-GEOCACHING@LISTSERV.AZGEOCACHING.COM>
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 23:17:31 -0700
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;The exchange between the "Andrews" about longitude suddenly
    

  

  
reminded me
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;of a book I read in the years BC (Before Caching). It has
    

  

  
the rather
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;long title of Longitude: The True Story of a Lone Genius
    

  

  
Who Solved the
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Greatest Scientific Problem of His Time, and it's written
    

  

  
by Dava Sobel.
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;The title pretty much sums it up. It might not sound like
    

  

  
interesting
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;reading, but I couldn't put it down. and that's before I
    

  

  
even knew what
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;a GPSr is. Could be a good one for you to take on your
    

  

  
summer vacation.
  

  

    
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Steve
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV>&gt;Team Tierra Buena
<DIV></DIV>&gt;
<DIV></DIV></div><br clear=all><hr>MSN 8 with <a
    

  

  
href="http://g.msn.com/8HMJENUS/2740??PS=">e-mail virus protection service:
</a> 2 months FREE*</html>
  

  

    
--__--__--

Message: 2
To: az-geocaching@listserv.azgeocaching.com
From: "Marc Leitermann" <marc_54140@excite.com>
Cc:
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:18:19 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com


To all who worry:

I would like to thank Jon (Aus Dem Kasten) for telling me about this
    

  

  
thread on alleged cheating.  Here's my thoughts, for what they are worth.
  

  

    
Looking thru the national site, I found this:

"What are the rules in Geocaching?
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
    

  

  
simple:
  

  

    
1. Take something from the cache
2. Leave something in the cache
3. Write about it in the logbook "

Looking at the on-line log entries for several caches, including several I
    

  

  
have logged, you can find any combination of these three 'rules'.  Several
clearly state they did not take something.  Well, how is that really
different from not writing in the logbook? I take the use of the word 'rule'
above as meaning a suggested action.  Certainly nothing engraved in stone.
  

  

    
Signing a log is definite proof the person was at the cache.  However, the
    

  

  
reverse is not proof, of anything.  If someone (certainly not me!) wants to
list a lot of caches he or she has not actually found, so what? Afraid of
someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet states)
before you? I'm at a modest 270+, and am working to up that number, just as
I suppose all of you are.  And although my biggest thrill is actually
finding the cache, I also enjoy looking at the numbers.
  

  

    
I generally cache with two different friends - one who loves to dig thru
    

  

  
the cache and see what's there, and write in the book.  However, he quite
often does not take and leave, since he forgets to bring something to
exchange.
  

  

    
The other's point of view is like mine - "he sounds weird because I am
    

  

  
sure that lots of people just enjoy finding the cache (like us), not looking
at the contents or signing a log - he is missing the point of the game (its
suppose to be fun)." (This person is not even registered with the national
site).
  

  

    
BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
    

  

  
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
  

  

    
Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.

Happy caching, wherever you are ....

Marc


_______________________________________________
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

--__--__--

Message: 3
From: Tim Giron <tgiron@cox.net>
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 11:33:01 -0400
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

Um, I just wanted to clarify that my tagline was in reference to the fact
    

  

  
that I haven't been caching very much lateley and therefore I am headed in
the other direction!
  

  

    
"Afraid of someone 'headed for the last page of the stats' (as AZFastFeet
    

  

  
states) before you?"
  

  

    

--__--__--

Message: 4
From: "Team Tierra Buena" <teamtierrabuena@earthlink.net>
To: <listserv@azgeocaching.com>
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 08:58:48 -0700
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

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-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] On Behalf Of
Andrew Weissman, Psy.D.
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 8:11 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Beach Reading



Steve,

Do you know the author of the book?

Andrew

Dava Sobel.

Steve
Team Tierra Buena

____________________________________________________________
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setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy face=3DArial><span =
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style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

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0in 4.0pt'>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com] <b><span
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Andrew Weissman, =
Psy.D.<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> </span></font><font =
size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>Thursday, May
 29, 2003</span></font><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma'> </span></font><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span
 style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>8:11 =
AM</span></font><font size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> =
listserv@azgeocaching.com<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: =
[Az-Geocaching] Beach
Reading</span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<div>

<div>

<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Steve,</span></font></p>

<p><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Do you
know the author of the book?</span></font></p>

<p style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>Andrew</span></font></p>

<p style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D3 color=3Dnavy =
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dava =
Sobel.</span></font></p>

<p style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3D2 color=3Dnavy =
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Steve<br>
Team Tierra Buena</span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</div>

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--__--__--

Message: 5
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:20:45 -0700
From: Brian Cluff <brian@Snaptek.com>
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

Marc Leitermann wrote:
    

    

      
"What are the rules in Geocaching?
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
      

    

  

  
simple:
  

  

    

      
1. Take something from the cache
2. Leave something in the cache
3. Write about it in the logbook "
      

    

    

      
BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
      

    

  

  
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
  

  

    

      
Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
      

    

    
I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
paper logs than there are on the online version.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


--__--__--

Message: 6
From: "Andrew Ayre" <andy@britishideas.com>
To: <listserv@azgeocaching.com>
Subject: RE: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:38:40 -0700
Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com

I think another point that you should understand Marc, is that it is
generally regarded as open to the cache hider the exact rules on recording
    

  

  
a
  

  

    
find for that specific cache. A lot of cache hiders when comparing the
    

  

  
paper
  

  

    
log to the online log will delete your online log (including me - I will
Email the person first to find out what is going on), so you are running
    

  

  
the
  

  

    
risk of having your online record altered/deleted in places. Is that what
you want for not spending literally 30 seconds to write at least your name
on a piece of paper? If you follow the numbers game then I wouldn't think
so. If you are happy with that and just having fun finding then I don't
    

  

  
see
  

  

    
a problem with you not signing the log. Just don't start complaining when
people delete your online logs.

Andy


-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Brian
Cluff
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:21 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cheater / Not Cheater


Marc Leitermann wrote:
    

    

      
"What are the rules in Geocaching?
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very
      

    

    
simple:
    

    

      
1. Take something from the cache
2. Leave something in the cache
3. Write about it in the logbook "
      

    

    

      
BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a
      

    

    
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not
cluttered up.
    

    

      
Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I'm out to have fun.
      

    

    
I think you seem to be missing the point of the person hiding the cache.
If I just wanted my stuff to sit in the desert and didn't care if I knew
  for a fact that people were visiting it I would just throw it out the
window.  The logs are what makes the cache worth hiding.  And I don't
think you will find anyone that will argue that the log IN the cache
isn't the authoritative list of people that have been to the cache.
Especially since there are usually 1/3 or more cachers listed in the
paper logs than there are on the online version.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

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http://www.azgeocaching.com



--__--__--

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listserv@azgeocaching.com
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http://www.azgeocaching.com



End of Az-Geocaching Digest
    

  

  

____________________________________________________________
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To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

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http://www.azgeocaching.com
  










--------------070101040007040202080905--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 04:38:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:38:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.16.20030529164455.087fd092@pop.mindspring.com>
References: <3.0.5.16.20030529164455.087fd092@pop.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: <3ED6E036.7030908@Snaptek.com>

Mike Schwarz wrote:
> The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
> be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:
> 
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199

> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526

Looks like it won't let anyone but you view the cache, even if you are 
logged in.  I was going to add it to the list of archived caches, so 
that people could get credit for logging it.
Oh well.. It seemed interesting to me.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 04:46:49 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:46:49 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
In-Reply-To: <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com>
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net> <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c> <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com>
Message-ID: <3ED6E239.2020709@Snaptek.com>

Aus Dem Kasten wrote:
> Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information.  I then 
> explained the situation in more detail and told him about the listserv 
> so that he could be included in the conversation.  I informed him of how 
> I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were some other cachers.

You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, and 
then he unsubscribed eariler tonight, so there is not point in anything 
speaking TO him though the list.

Oh well... it is only a stupid game/hobby/sport/reason to get 
outside/workout in disguise/reason to 4x4 in new places/family 
activity/adventure...etc...etc... but I do hate when people decide that 
they are going to play their game different than everyone else, just 
because they can.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 05:34:48 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Aus Dem Kasten)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 22:34:48 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net> <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c> <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com> <3ED6E239.2020709@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <3ED6ED78.5010802@pcgraffiti.com>

  Brian Cluff wrote:

 >You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight.

I did in fact miss this information considering " /The subscribers list 
is only available to the list administrator./" Is there some other way 
that I could find out who is a current member of the listserv and who is 
not?

Also, I might completely disagree with his outlook on the game, but he 
did take the time to respond, prove that he did visit the cache, and 
share his viewpoint no matter how different it might be.

Jon
Aus Dem Kasten

> Aus Dem Kasten wrote:
>
>> Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information. I 
>> then explained the situation in more detail and told him about the 
>> listserv so that he could be included in the conversation. I informed 
>> him of how I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were 
>> some other cachers.
>
>
> You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
> and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight, so there is not point in 
> anything speaking TO him though the list.
>
> Oh well... it is only a stupid game/hobby/sport/reason to get 
> outside/workout in disguise/reason to 4x4 in new places/family 
> activity/adventure...etc...etc... but I do hate when people decide 
> that they are going to play their game different than everyone else, 
> just because they can.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com





From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 05:31:12 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jonathan D. Martin)
Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 22:31:12 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net> <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c> <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com> <3ED6E239.2020709@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <3ED6ECA0.7090008@uccinc.net>

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Brian Cluff wrote:

 >You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight.

I did in fact miss this information considering " /The subscribers list 
is only available to the list administrator./" Is there some other way 
that I could find out who is a current member of the listserv and who is 
not?

Also, I might completely disagree with his outlook on the game, but he 
did take the time to respond, prove that he did visit the cache, and 
share his viewpoint no matter how different it might be.

Jon
Aus Dem Kasten

> Aus Dem Kasten wrote:
>
>> Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information. I 
>> then explained the situation in more detail and told him about the 
>> listserv so that he could be included in the conversation. I informed 
>> him of how I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were 
>> some other cachers.
>
>
> You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
> and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight, so there is not point in 
> anything speaking TO him though the list.
>
> Oh well... it is only a stupid game/hobby/sport/reason to get 
> outside/workout in disguise/reason to 4x4 in new places/family 
> activity/adventure...etc...etc... but I do hate when people decide 
> that they are going to play their game different than everyone else, 
> just because they can.
>
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com




--------------080002030408000008010505
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Brian Cluff wrote:



>You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace,
and  then he unsubscribed eariler tonight.



    I did in fact miss this information considering " 	The subscribers
list is only available to the list administrator."  Is there some other
way that I could find out who is a current member of the listserv and who
is not?



Also, I might completely disagree with his outlook on the game, but he did
take the time to respond, prove that he did visit the cache, and share his
viewpoint no matter how different it might be.



Jon

Aus Dem Kasten


Aus Dem Kasten
wrote: 

  
Marc responded curious to know why I requested
the information.  I then  explained the situation in more detail and told
him about the listserv  so that he could be included in the conversation. 
I informed him of how  I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as
were some other cachers. 

  

 

You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, and
 then he unsubscribed eariler tonight, so there is not point in anything
 speaking TO him though the list. 

 

Oh well... it is only a stupid game/hobby/sport/reason to get  outside/workout
in disguise/reason to 4x4 in new places/family  activity/adventure...etc...etc...
but I do hate when people decide that  they are going to play their game
different than everyone else, just  because they can. 

 

Brian Cluff 

Team Snaptek 

 

____________________________________________________________ 

Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com 

To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: 

http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching 

 

Arizona's Geocaching Resource 

http://www.azgeocaching.com 










--------------080002030408000008010505--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 07:36:43 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 00:36:43 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Re:Cheater/Not Cheater
In-Reply-To: <3ED6ED78.5010802@pcgraffiti.com>
References: <200305291905.MAA32135@ns2.sequoia.net> <001601c3264b$dd47aa90$6401a8c0@cx288378c> <3ED6D5D2.4010706@pcgraffiti.com> <3ED6E239.2020709@Snaptek.com> <3ED6ED78.5010802@pcgraffiti.com>
Message-ID: <3ED70A0B.7010707@Snaptek.com>

Aus Dem Kasten wrote:
>  Brian Cluff wrote:
> 
>  >You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
> and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight.
> 
> I did in fact miss this information considering " /The subscribers list 
> is only available to the list administrator./"

I didn't expect you to notice that he left, thats why I mentioned it... 
but he did post a message to the list (reposted below), I was just 
surprised that you didn't notice it.

 > Is there some other way
> that I could find out who is a current member of the listserv and who is 
> not?

We protect the privacy of the members of this mailing list, so I'm sorry 
there is no way to get a list of members.  We've only sent one message 
in the history of azgeocaching.com to the list of mailing list members 
that wasn't a list message... and the end result was really funny :)
( http://azgeocaching.com/story.html?story=15 )

This is what he said... It would have been nice if he had stuck around 
for a while and gotten to know some of us... oh well..

--recap of yesterdays message from marc_54140 for those that missed it--
To all who worry:

I would like to thank Jon (Aus Dem Kasten) for telling me about this 
thread on alleged cheating.  Here’s my thoughts, for what they are worth.

Looking thru the national site, I found this:

“What are the rules in Geocaching?
Geocaching is a relatively new phenomenon. Therefore, the rules are very 
simple:
1. Take something from the cache
2. Leave something in the cache
3. Write about it in the logbook “

Looking at the on-line log entries for several caches, including several 
I have logged, you can find any combination of these three ‘rules'. 
Several clearly state they did not take something.  Well, how is that 
really different from not writing in the logbook? I take the use of the 
word ‘rule’ above as meaning a suggested action.  Certainly nothing 
engraved in stone.

Signing a log is definite proof the person was at the cache.  However, 
the reverse is not proof, of anything.  If someone (certainly not me!) 
wants to list a lot of caches he or she has not actually found, so what? 
Afraid of someone ‘headed for the last page of the stats’ (as AZFastFeet 
states) before you? I’m at a modest 270+, and am working to up that 
number, just as I suppose all of you are.  And although my biggest 
thrill is actually finding the cache, I also enjoy looking at the numbers.

I generally cache with two different friends – one who loves to dig thru 
the cache and see what’s there, and write in the book.  However, he 
quite often does not take and leave, since he forgets to bring something 
to exchange.

The other’s point of view is like mine – “he sounds weird because I am 
sure that lots of people just enjoy finding the cache (like us), not 
looking at the contents or signing a log - he is missing the point of 
the game (its suppose to be fun).” (This person is not even registered 
with the national site).

BTW, I list only caches I find.  Anything I cannot find (and there are a 
number)I do not list, nor do I make notes, etc.  This is my personal 
preference, so that when I look at my on-line listings, they are not 
cluttered up.

Do I plan on changing?  I do not believe I will.  I’m out to have fun.

Happy caching, wherever you are …………

Marc

>> Aus Dem Kasten wrote:
>>
>>> Marc responded curious to know why I requested the information. I 
>>> then explained the situation in more detail and told him about the 
>>> listserv so that he could be included in the conversation. I informed 
>>> him of how I was a bit skeptical when it came to his finds as were 
>>> some other cachers.
>>
>>
>>
>> You must have missed when he signed up for the list, said his peace, 
>> and then he unsubscribed eariler tonight, so there is not point in 
>> anything speaking TO him though the list.
>>
>> Oh well... it is only a stupid game/hobby/sport/reason to get 
>> outside/workout in disguise/reason to 4x4 in new places/family 
>> activity/adventure...etc...etc... but I do hate when people decide 
>> that they are going to play their game different than everyone else, 
>> just because they can.
>>
>> Brian Cluff
>> Team Snaptek
>>
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
>> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
>> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>>
>> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
>> http://www.azgeocaching.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 08:08:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Draper)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 01:08:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] West O' the Pecos and other coyote lore
In-Reply-To: <3ED70A0B.7010707@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <20030530080819.9422.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1765312973-1054282099=:9208
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Thank you for that link. I've been wanting to read about this legendary prank for some time, but couldn't find any reference to it on your website. I wish I'd been a cacher back then.

Brian Cluff  wrote:

 We've only sent one message in the history of azgeocaching.com to the list of mailing list members that wasn't a list message... and the end result was really funny :)
( http://azgeocaching.com/story.html?story=15 )




---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1765312973-1054282099=:9208
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Thank you for that link. I've been wanting to read about this legendary prank for some time, but couldn't find any reference to it on your website. I wish I'd been a cacher back then.

Brian Cluff <brian@snaptek.com> wrote:



 We've only sent one message in the history of azgeocaching.com to the list of mailing list members that wasn't a list message... and the end result was really funny :)
( http://azgeocaching.com/story.html?story=15 )


Do you Yahoo!?

Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1765312973-1054282099=:9208--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 11:17:58 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 04:17:58 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a solid record
Message-ID: <003601c3269d$27aee480$fc00b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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I want to congratulate Omniterranaut on his recent day of caching it =
looks like a real record lets see how the final numbers come out.
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I want to congratulate Omniterranaut on =
his recent=20
day of caching it looks like a real record lets see how the final =
numbers come=20
out.


------=_NextPart_000_0033_01C32662.73968280--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 14:44:23 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Jerry Nelson)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 07:44:23 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
Message-ID: <000d01c326b9$f68ac280$23fb6a44@ph.cox.net>

Looks like omniterraunt may have broken the record instead of only tied it.

Jerry
Offtrail

-----> omniterranaut has logged a cache on your watch list (EMERALD). You
can visit the cache at the following link:
>
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=67421
>
> User comments:
> Today I went caching to break the record for most in a day. I started at
dawn and went until midnight. I was shooting for 60 finds but didn't quite
make it. GOOD NEWS!!! (not for my math teacher)  I made an error in counting
and I believe I actually DID break the record though! Now I'm sunburnt,
blistered and exhausted but happy none the less. It was quite an adventure.
This was find #54 of the day.
>
> This will take you to the cache page. If you would like to modify your
cache list, please visit www.geocaching.com.
>
> Cheers,
> Geocaching.com Team
>



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 14:59:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RAND HARDIN)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 07:59:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
Message-ID: 

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C32681.6815C640
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Congratulations Omniterraunt.  My memory is short . . . what was the prev=
ious record and how many caches did you find Wednesday?

RandMan

----- Original Message -----
From: Jerry Nelson
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 7:48 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification

Looks like omniterraunt may have broken the record instead of only tied i=
t.

Jerry
Offtrail

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C32681.6815C640
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Congratulation=
s Omniterraunt.  My memory is short . . . what was the previous reco=
rd and how many caches did you find Wednesday?
 
 
 RandMan 
 
 

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From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 16:47:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 09:47:19 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
Message-ID: <3ED78B17.7040804@Snaptek.com>

RAND HARDIN wrote:
> Congratulations Omniterraunt.  My memory is short . . . what was the previous record and how many caches did you find Wednesday?

http://www.azgeocaching.com/max_totals.php?search=found&tspan=Day

Looks like He hasn't gotten them all entered yet, or for some reason 
they haven't regestered on AzGeocaching.com.  Anyway, the above link 
will give you the run down of the previous record holders.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 17:00:14 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 10:00:14 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] West O' the Pecos and other coyote lore
In-Reply-To: <20030530080819.9422.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20030530080819.9422.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3ED78E1E.3090708@Snaptek.com>

Gale Draper wrote:
> Thank you for that link. I've been wanting to read about this legendary prank for some time, but couldn't find any reference to it on your website. I wish I'd been a cacher back then.

Good times... good times...

My story posting, browsing, and reading software leave a lot to be 
desired, but I'm still working on it.  Most of the bits and pieces are 
there (as can be seen by the more attentive people wondering where this 
story.html page came from as there is nothing that links to it), I just 
need to put them together in some way that is usefull.

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 17:16:47 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (listserv@azgeocaching.com)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 10:16:47 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] West O' the Pecos and other coyote lore
In-Reply-To: <3ED78E1E.3090708@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <001001c326cf$405369c0$1e01a8c0@connie>

Brian,
Oh memories. Thank you for the good laugh, again.
Good times then, good times yet to be had, with good people.
--Connie
Team "Wyle E"

> 

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 18:15:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Burkett)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:15:18 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: <20030530004744.62578.qmail@web14811.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial airliner?
I don't want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don't want hassles with
security, either.

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Has anyone had any problems taking =
a GPS
receiver on a commercial airliner? 
I don’t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I =
don’t want hassles with
security, either.









------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C3269C.C092B6A0--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Mon May 26 17:57:39 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Eric Quinn)
Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 10:57:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Arrowhead Menace Replaced and Cache Adoption
Message-ID: <20030526175739.40290.qmail@web40606.mail.yahoo.com>

Arrowhead Menace has been repaired and replaced. 

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=32062

I also need to find adoptive owners for Arrowhead
Menace and for Picnic Leftovers Returns. The only
thing I ask is that these caches never become members
only. Please email me if you have found either of
these caches and are willing to adopt one or both.


Eric
Team Dragon

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 18:44:11 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Chelby Geiss)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:44:11 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

--Apple-Mail-33-851124179
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	charset=WINDOWS-1252;
	format=flowed

I know my hubby has taken his a couple times since 9-11.  He leaves it=20=

in one of the pockets of his laptop case and just lets it run through=20
xray.  They have never looked twice at it.

On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett wrote:

> Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial=20
> airliner?=A0I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I =
don=92t=20
> want hassles with security, either.
>
>
Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching

--Apple-Mail-33-851124179
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charset=WINDOWS-1252

I know my hubby has taken his a couple times since 9-11.  He leaves it
in one of the pockets of his laptop case and just lets it run through
xray.  They have never looked twice at it.


On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett wrote:


Times New =
Roman0000,0000,8080Has
anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial
airliner?=A0I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don=92t
want hassles with security, either.



=
Helvetica3131,0404,FFFF=
Team
desertSol

Chelby & Kevin

+

Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)

Apache Junction, AZ

www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching


--Apple-Mail-33-851124179--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 18:58:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 11:58:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="Windows-1252"
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Same here. They were more interested in the spare AA batteries I had loose
in my laptop case.

Andy



  -----Original Message-----
  From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Chelby
Geiss
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:44 AM
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?


  I know my hubby has taken his a couple times since 9-11. He leaves it in
one of the pockets of his laptop case and just lets it run through xray.
They have never looked twice at it.

  On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett wrote:


    Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial
airliner? I don’t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don’t want
hassles with security, either.



  Team desertSol
  Chelby & Kevin
  +
  Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
  Apache Junction, AZ
  www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching

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Same=20
here. They were more interested in the spare AA batteries I had loose in =
my=20
laptop case.


 


Andy

  



  
-----Original Message-----
From:=20
  az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com=20
  [mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of=20
  Chelby Geiss
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:44 =
AM
To:=20
  listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS =
on=20
  Commercial Airliner?

I know my hubby has taken his =
a=20
  couple times since 9-11. He leaves it in one of the pockets of his =
laptop case=20
  and just lets it run through xray. They have never looked twice at=20
  it.

On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett =
wrote:


  
Has=20
    anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial=20
    airliner? I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I =
don=92t=20
    want hassles with security,=20
  =
either.


Team=20
  desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German=20
  Shepherds)
Apache Junction, =
AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching


------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C326A2.C6B89990--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 19:03:19 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket])
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:03:19 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
References: 
Message-ID: <003001c326de$2281e840$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C326A3.75FFF7E0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I took mine on a Southwest flight to and from Las Vegas last August.  =
They didn't give me any hassles, but I didn't hang it out there for =
everyone to see.  It was just buried in my carry-on.  On the plane I =
pulled it out and just did my thing. =20

While on the flight I saw in the magazine (not Skymall, but the other =
one) that Southwest defined what you can and can't goof with while on =
the ground, during take off, and in-flight.  For example, no cell phones =
except while on the ground.  GPS receivers were listed as being =
acceptable after takeoff (in-flight).  This was nearly a year after 9/11 =
so I'd think it would be up-to-date policy.

I hate to say it, but in airports these days there is alot of racial =
profiling.  If you...  fit the profile, I'd think carefully about =
the GPSr just to save yourself the grief.  However if you're =
stand-up-for-my-rights-no-matter-what type person, hell... go for it.  =
I'm with you!  ;-)

In any event, depending on the airline (America West has a strict policy =
against GPSr's), just pack it in your carry-on like the rest of your =
stuff.  Don't act suspicious and you won't be placed under suspicion.  =
See this link...

http://gpsinformation.net/airgps/airgps.htm

On the technical side, I had to put it RIGHT against the window (eTrex =
Legend).  Take it away for a second and you'll loose signal (if you were =
lucky enough to get it in the first place).  If you have a unit with a =
QH antenna you may have better luck.  I found that after about 20 =
minutes it wasn't so much fun anymore.


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Bill Burkett=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:15 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?


  Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial =
airliner?  I don't want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don't =
want hassles with security, either.

------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C326A3.75FFF7E0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable











I took mine on a Southwest flight to =
and from Las=20
Vegas last August.  They didn't give me any hassles, but I didn't =
hang it=20
out there for everyone to see.  It was just buried in my =
carry-on.  On=20
the plane I pulled it out and just did my thing.  


 


While on the flight I saw in the =
magazine (not=20
Skymall, but the other one) that Southwest defined what you can and =
can't goof=20
with while on the ground, during take off, and in-flight.  For =

example, no cell phones except while on the ground.  GPS receivers =
were=20
listed as being acceptable after takeoff (in-flight).  This was =
nearly a=20
year after 9/11 so I'd think it would be up-to-date =
policy.


 


I hate to say it, but in airports these =
days there=20
is alot of racial profiling.  If you... <ahem> fit the =
profile,=20
I'd think carefully about the GPSr just to save yourself the =
grief. =20
However if you're stand-up-for-my-rights-no-matter-what type person, =
hell... go=20
for it.  I'm with you!  ;-)


 


In any event, depending on the airline =
(America=20
West has a strict policy against GPSr's), just pack it in your carry-on =
like the=20
rest of your stuff.  Don't act suspicious and you won't be =
placed=20
under suspicion.  See this link...


 


http://gpsinformatio=
n.net/airgps/airgps.htm


 


On the technical side, I had to put it =
RIGHT=20
against the window (eTrex Legend).  Take it away for a second and =
you'll=20
loose signal (if you were lucky enough to get it in the first =
place).  If=20
you have a unit with a QH antenna you may have better luck.  I =
found that=20
after about 20 minutes it wasn't so much fun anymore.


 


 


-T.
[General Bracket]


 


=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't=20
inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in=
.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Bill =
Burkett=20
  
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 =
11:15 AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on =

  Commercial Airliner?

  


  

  
Has anyone had any problems =
taking a GPS=20
  receiver on a commercial airliner? =20
  I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don=92t =
want hassles=20
  with security, either.


------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C326A3.75FFF7E0--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 19:31:57 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Ken Akerman)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:31:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <20030530193157.65075.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-632680813-1054323117=:63509
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


This is a timely topic for me because I am flying to Connecticut on Saturday, May 31.  I will take my GPS with me and I intend to put it in the bottom of my daypack, which is my carry-on bag.  I don't expect to be using it while flying, so it wouldn't be a problem for me to put it in my checked-in luggage.

I will be flying on Delta Airlines.  I didn't know there have been any problems with GPS on airplanes.  Many of the travel bugs that I track go across North America or to other continents.  I have six travel bugs with me from Arizona caches that I intend to move to caches in Connecticut, New Jersey, or other eastern states, plus a moving cache that I acquired in Canal Park in Tempe that I will relocate to Connecticut.

Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)


--0-632680813-1054323117=:63509
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii






This is a timely topic for me because I am flying to Connecticut on Saturday, May 31.  I will take my GPS with me and I intend to put it in the bottom of my daypack, which is my carry-on bag.  I don't expect to be using it while flying, so it wouldn't be a problem for me to put it in my checked-in luggage.


I will be flying on Delta Airlines.  I didn't know there have been any problems with GPS on airplanes.  Many of the travel bugs that I track go across North America or to other continents.  I have six travel bugs with me from Arizona caches that I intend to move to caches in Connecticut, New Jersey, or other eastern states, plus a moving cache that I acquired in Canal Park in Tempe that I will relocate to Connecticut.


Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

--0-632680813-1054323117=:63509--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 19:33:50 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Bill Burkett)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:33:50 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C326A7.B9180960
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Cool.  Thanks, Chelby (and everyone else!) for your quick responses.

-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Chelby
Geiss
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:44 AM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?

I know my hubby has taken his a couple times since 9-11. He leaves it in one
of the pockets of his laptop case and just lets it run through xray. They
have never looked twice at it.

On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett wrote:
Has
anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial airliner? I
don’t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don’t want hassles with
security, either.


Team desertSol
Chelby & Kevin
+
Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)
Apache Junction, AZ
www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching

------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C326A7.B9180960
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	charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



















Co=
ol.=A0 Thanks, Chelby (and everyone =
else!) for your
quick responses.



 



-----Original Message-----

From:
az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of Chelby Geiss

Sent: Friday, May 30, =
2003 11:44
AM

To: =
listserv@azgeocaching.com

Subject: Re: =
[Az-Geocaching] GPS
on Commercial Airliner?



 



I =
know my
hubby has taken his a couple times since 9-11. He leaves it in one of =
the
pockets of his laptop case and just lets it run through xray. They have =
never
looked twice at it.



On Friday, May 30, 2003, at 11:15 AM, Bill Burkett =
wrote:<=
/p>


Has
anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial =
airliner? I
don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don=92t want hassles =
with
security, either.







Team
desertSol

Chelby & Kevin

+

Kiva and Lancer (German Shepherds)

Apache Junction, AZ

www.desertsol.com/~chelby/geocaching=
<=
/p>








------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C326A7.B9180960--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 19:46:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket])
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:46:29 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
References: <20030530193157.65075.qmail@web21107.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <004f01c326e4$2a3f0d00$2464a8c0@gblaw.com>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hey buddy!  Don't get it taken.  It's mine.    ;-)


-T.
[General Bracket]

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Ken Akerman=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 12:31 PM
  Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?


    This is a timely topic for me because I am flying to Connecticut on =
Saturday, May 31.  I will take my GPS with me and I intend to put it in =
the bottom of my daypack, which is my carry-on bag.  I don't expect to =
be using it while flying, so it wouldn't be a problem for me to put it =
in my checked-in luggage.

    I will be flying on Delta Airlines.  I didn't know there have been =
any problems with GPS on airplanes.  Many of the travel bugs that I =
track go across North America or to other continents.  I have six travel =
bugs with me from Arizona caches that I intend to move to caches in =
Connecticut, New Jersey, or other eastern states, plus a moving cache =
that I acquired in Canal Park in Tempe that I will relocate to =
Connecticut.

    Ken Akerman (a.k.a. Highpointer)

------=_NextPart_000_004C_01C326A9.7DB70220
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









Hey buddy!  Don't get it =
taken.  It's=20
mine.  <heh heh heh>  ;-)


 


 


-T.
[General Bracket]


 


=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Don't=20
inflict bad quotes on me!  Get OE-QuoteFix!
http://home.in=
.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Ken =
Akerman=20
  
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 =
12:31 PM

  
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] =
GPS on=20
  Commercial Airliner?

  


  

  
    
This is a timely topic for me because I am flying to Connecticut =
on=20
    Saturday, May 31.  I will take my GPS with me and I intend to =
put it in=20
    the bottom of my daypack, which is my carry-on bag.  I don't =
expect to=20
    be using it while flying, so it wouldn't be a problem for me to put =
it in my=20
    checked-in luggage.

    
I will be flying on Delta Airlines.  I didn't know there =
have been=20
    any problems with GPS on airplanes.  Many of the travel bugs =
that I=20
    track go across North America or to other continents.  I have =
six=20
    travel bugs with me from Arizona caches that I intend to move to =
caches in=20
    Connecticut, New Jersey, or other eastern states, plus a moving =
cache that I=20
    acquired in Canal Park in Tempe that I will relocate to =
Connecticut.

    
Ken Akerman (a.k.a.=20
    =
Highpointer)


------=_NextPart_000_004C_01C326A9.7DB70220--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 20:04:25 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Cache-Quest)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:04:25 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
References: 
Message-ID: <004001c326e6$ab81cd10$8301a8c0@JERRY>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C326AB.FEED6620
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I travel a lot on business and I normally take my GPS with me. I've also =
had trips out of the country twice this year with no problems (except =
lost luggage). I just stick it in with all my other electronic stuff in =
my backpack (I use a backpack instead of a brief case).  It is almost =
never searched.  I don't normally sit by the window, but when I do, I =
often get the GPS out and play with it.  I basically have to hold it =
right against the window to get a signal, but it is fun to see where you =
are and how fast you are going.  I've never been questioned by a Flight =
Attendant except to put it away for landing.

Jerry
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Bill Burkett=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:15 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?


  Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial =
airliner?  I don't want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don't =
want hassles with security, either.

------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C326AB.FEED6620
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable











I travel a lot on business and I =
normally take my=20
GPS with me. I've also had trips out of the country twice this year =
with no=20
problems (except lost luggage). I just stick it in with all my =
other=20
electronic stuff in my backpack (I use a backpack instead of a brief=20
case).  It is almost never searched.  I don't normally sit by =
the=20
window, but when I do, I often get the GPS out and play with it.  I =

basically have to hold it right against the window to get a signal, but =
it is=20
fun to see where you are and how fast you are going.  I've never =
been=20
questioned by a Flight Attendant except to put it away for =
landing.


 


Jerry



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Bill =
Burkett=20
  
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 =
11:15 AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on =

  Commercial Airliner?

  


  

  
Has anyone had any problems =
taking a GPS=20
  receiver on a commercial airliner? =20
  I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don=92t =
want hassles=20
  with security, either.


------=_NextPart_000_003D_01C326AB.FEED6620--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 20:43:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 13:43:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
In-Reply-To: <3ED78B17.7040804@Snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <20030530204310.58285.qmail@web14807.mail.yahoo.com>

http://www.azgeocaching.com/max_totals.php?search=found&tspan=Day
> 
> Looks like He hasn't gotten them all entered yet, or
> for some reason 
> they haven't regestered on AzGeocaching.com. 
> Anyway, the above link 
> will give you the run down of the previous record
> holders.
> 
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek


Hey wow... I'm actually in the top 15 of that list...
I never knew that... shows how much I care about
numbers doesn't it.  =-)  I was more curious about the
total found but when I saw my name it was like.. oh
hey.. that's me!  =-)     




=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 21:55:59 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 14:55:59 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
Message-ID: 


>From: "Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket]" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
>Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:03:19 -0700
>
>In any event, depending on the airline (America West has a strict policy 
>against GPSr's), just pack it in >your carry-on like the rest of your 
>stuff.  Don't act suspicious and you won't be placed under >suspicion.

That is interesting.. because they have all kinds of GPS equiptment in the 
cockpit!

I fly hot air balloons (FAA certified aircraft) and I always use GPS on 
board. An interesting note I thought yall might be interested in:  I use two 
way radio communication with my ground crew. The radios are Motorola VHF 
radios. When my radio is turned on, I lose GPS sattelite reception. This has 
happened with all my GPS's.. my Magellan 300, my Garmin 3+ and my Garmin 
Etrex Legend. So, when I am flying in competitions where my GPS is being 
used constantly, I cannot have my radio on and talk to my ground crew as my 
GPS will stop tracking! I havent really tried changing frequencies in my 
radio's to see if that would fix the problem. But, have been wanting to try 
that (my crew if good and I rarely have to talk to them anyways except when 
getting ready to land). On the other hand, my aircraft radio (ICOM IC-A22), 
which operates on higher frequencies, has no effect on my GPS. Interesting!

On the flip side of the coin.. my GPS's have no effect on the radio's or any 
other instruments at all.

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online  
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 22:09:33 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Andrew Ayre)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:09:33 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

The most frequent reason for not allowing cell phones, GPSs, etc, is
supposedly because aircraft have limited RF interference shielding for the
electronics, the cockpit GPS units being one of those systems they want to
avoid inteference affecting.
However, this seems more silly all the time. Some airlines are performing
trial runs of wireless ethernet, plus PDAs with a built in cell phone (or is
it the other way around? ;)) are not banned by the FAA.

http://news.com.com/2100-1034_3-1010231.html

Andy



-----Original Message-----
From: az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com
[mailto:az-geocaching-admin@listserv.azgeocaching.com]On Behalf Of
RopingThe Wind
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 2:56 PM
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?




>From: "Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket]" 
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>To: 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
>Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:03:19 -0700
>
>In any event, depending on the airline (America West has a strict policy
>against GPSr's), just pack it in >your carry-on like the rest of your
>stuff.  Don't act suspicious and you won't be placed under >suspicion.

That is interesting.. because they have all kinds of GPS equiptment in the
cockpit!

I fly hot air balloons (FAA certified aircraft) and I always use GPS on
board. An interesting note I thought yall might be interested in:  I use two
way radio communication with my ground crew. The radios are Motorola VHF
radios. When my radio is turned on, I lose GPS sattelite reception. This has
happened with all my GPS's.. my Magellan 300, my Garmin 3+ and my Garmin
Etrex Legend. So, when I am flying in competitions where my GPS is being
used constantly, I cannot have my radio on and talk to my ground crew as my
GPS will stop tracking! I havent really tried changing frequencies in my
radio's to see if that would fix the problem. But, have been wanting to try
that (my crew if good and I rarely have to talk to them anyways except when
getting ready to land). On the other hand, my aircraft radio (ICOM IC-A22),
which operates on higher frequencies, has no effect on my GPS. Interesting!

On the flip side of the coin.. my GPS's have no effect on the radio's or any
other instruments at all.

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 22:14:45 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:14:45 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a solid record
References: <003601c3269d$27aee480$fc00b83f@fishkiller>
Message-ID: <007601c326f8$e16148e0$9411b83f@fishkiller>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0073_01C326BE.33C38840
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

He was logging the finds during the early morning so not all were in the =
system when AZ GEOCACHING did it's update the final numbers should be in =
the system next update...
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Team Evil Fish=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 4:17 AM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a solid record


  I want to congratulate Omniterranaut on his recent day of caching it =
looks like a real record lets see how the final numbers come out.
------=_NextPart_000_0073_01C326BE.33C38840
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable









He was logging the finds during the =
early morning=20
so not all were in the system when AZ GEOCACHING did it's update the =
final=20
numbers should be in the system next update...



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Team Evil=20
  Fish 
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 4:17 =
AM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] a =
solid=20
  record

  


  
I want to congratulate Omniterranaut =
on his=20
  recent day of caching it looks like a real record lets see how the =
final=20
  numbers come out.


------=_NextPart_000_0073_01C326BE.33C38840--


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 22:29:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (RopingThe Wind)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 15:29:55 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Very first cache?
Message-ID: 

Howdy,

Does anyone know if that very first cache has an actual GC number (this is 
the cache that was hidden when GPS accuracy was improved, I believe it was 
in Washington or Oregon?). Is it in the geocaching.com system and if so is 
it still active?

If not what is the very first geocache to appear in the geocaching.com 
system? I tried a search by using GC1, GC001, GC0001, etc and couldnt bring 
anything up. Maybe it has been archived?

I would think that very first cache would always be preserved and kept 
active.

Anyways, just curious!

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 23:01:18 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Tim Giron)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 19:01:18 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Very first cache?
Message-ID: <20030530230122.EBQM18778.fed1mtao02.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>

This appears to be the lowest number recognized by the system:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=4


and this one is the first stash:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=15

Tim
TeamAZFastFeet

============================================================
From: "RopingThe Wind" 
Date: 2003/05/30 Fri PM 06:29:55 EDT
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Very first cache?

Howdy,

Does anyone know if that very first cache has an actual GC number (this is 
the cache that was hidden when GPS accuracy was improved, I believe it was 
in Washington or Oregon?). Is it in the geocaching.com system and if so is 
it still active?

If not what is the very first geocache to appear in the geocaching.com 
system? I tried a search by using GC1, GC001, GC0001, etc and couldnt bring 
anything up. Maybe it has been archived?

I would think that very first cache would always be preserved and kept 
active.

Anyways, just curious!

Scott
Team Ropingthewind

_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail

____________________________________________________________
Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching

Arizona's Geocaching Resource
http://www.azgeocaching.com
============================================================



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Fri May 30 17:12:08 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Schwarz)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 17:12:08
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description
Message-ID: <3.0.5.16.20030530171208.2a5f0c4a@pop.mindspring.com>

Well, looks like the powers that be at geocaching.com set it up
so nobody but me can see it, even if you ARE logged in.  Drats.

Here's the text of the description I submitted, just to satisfy
any curiousity anyone may have about my ill-fated virtual cache.  
Or if anyone wants to try to locate the thermometer, even though you
won't increase your numbers for anything by doing so.  This does
require a 2 mile round trip hike, with 500 feet of elevation gain.
Unless you're doing more of the Groom Creek trail.  Again, if
anyone does locate it, let me know via an email.  And if someone
who lives in the Prescott area wishes to place a physical cache 
near it, that would be great:

NAME: What's the Temperature?

N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526

---------------------------------------------------

Get a little workout, make a weather observation, and score a cache.

---------------------------------------------------

RATING: 1.5/2.5

---------------------------------------------------

This is probably the first cache in Arizona that asks you to make a
meteorological observation!

I don't like to have people driving around in circles trying to figure out
where to park, and contributing to air pollution.  So, drive south from
Prescott on the paved Senator Highway, go about 6 miles, and park at the
Groom Creek trailhead parking lot, at N 34 27.881, W 112 26.448.  There is
a 2 dollar forest service fee there.  Then put on your hiking boots and
walk just over a mile up the 307 trail, with about 500 feet of elevation
gain, to a thermometer in the middle of nowhere.

What is a thermometer doing HERE, of all places?  Beats me.  I didn't place
it here, but it's been here for over 10 years.  I first noticed it after
relieving myself in the early 1990's, long before geocaching started, just
north of the the trail.  As I walked back, the white color of the
instrument caught my eye.  It is located on the back side of a tree within
10 feet of the trail.

I'm sure at least a few other people have spotted this thermometer, but no
one has removed it during the 11 years or so I've known of its existence;
and for all I know, it may have been there for years before the early
1990's.  It is NOT in a wilderness area, just a regular National forest
area, so it doesn't violate any wilderness ethics.  The numbers showing 50,
60, 70, 80 degrees have definitely faded with time, but are still readable.

You will need to look at 2 words on the thermometer.  At the top there is
one word (probably brand name); write that down.  In the lower left, below
minus 60 degrees (doubt it ever gets anywhere near that cold here), is a
word followed by 3 initials (probably the company name); write that down.
This item in the lower left is faded and a bit hard to read, so I will
accept reasonable fascimiles of what it says.  The word on top is still
very clear, however.

To get credit for this virtual cache, you will need to email me (Mike) with
the word at the top, and the word plus 3 initials on the lower left of the
thermometer.  Make sure you do NOT post your answers here, even if encrypted.

Then, note the temperature reading on the thermometer, and please DO post
that with your log, along with the time of day.  It will be interesting to
see how the readings vary with whether its early morning or afternoon,
whether its rained recently, and of course, the time of year.  For the
record, it read 73 degrees at 5 PM on 5/25/2003.

When you get to the listed coordinates, at about 6920 feet elevation, look
on the back side of a tree within 10 feet of the trail, on the north side
of the trail.  This is a ponderosa pine forest, and even though the trees
aren't real tall here, GPS signals can be degraded some.  If you don't find
the thermometer right away, search in a 40-foot radius.  The trail isn't
too high-traffic, but in case a group of hikers or horseback riders comes
by when you are at the thermometer, be discrete and try not to draw
attention to it until they pass.  As with a physical cache container, we
don't want those who don't currently know about the thermometer to know of
its existence, and possibly decide to remove it.

If you feel so inclined, and have the time, continue on up the trail to the
summit of Spruce Mtn.  This will be a 6 mile roundtrip hike, with 1400 feet
of elevation gain total.  Or, if you're really ambitious, do the full 9
mile loop hike clockwise.  If you haven't been to the Spruce "Wild
Goose" Cache yet, that cache awaits you near the summit, just 1.5 miles
from here!  So, score 2 caches on this hike, not just this one!

Have fun contributing to the climatic records for Arizona!

---------------------------------------------------

HINT:
Some shrubbery guards the approach to the back side of the tree; it's not
very open there.  However, I have yet to wear long pants on this trail.

---------------------------------------------------

Mike
Team Malthusian

Brian wrote:
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:38:14 -0700
>From: Brian Cluff 
>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>Mike Schwarz wrote:
>> The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
>> be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:
>> 
>> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199
>
>> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
>
>Looks like it won't let anyone but you view the cache, even if you are 
>logged in.  I was going to add it to the list of archived caches, so 
>that people could get credit for logging it.
>Oh well.. It seemed interesting to me.
>
>Brian Cluff
>Team Snaptek
>
>
>--__--__--
>
>


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 00:10:51 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Loran  Wilcox)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 20:10:51 -0400
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
References: 
Message-ID: <004101c32709$1922b600$0500a8c0@one>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C326E7.91AC60C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I've carried mine on planes with no problem. You don't think I would =
leave home without it.

Loran (Team Sand Dollar)
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Bill Burkett=20
  To: listserv@azgeocaching.com=20
  Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 2:15 PM
  Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?


  Has anyone had any problems taking a GPS receiver on a commercial =
airliner?  I don't want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don't =
want hassles with security, either.

------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C326E7.91AC60C0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable











I've carried mine on planes with no =
problem. You=20
don't think I would leave home without it.


 


Loran (Team Sand Dollar)



  
----- Original Message ----- 

  From:=20
  Bill =
Burkett=20
  
  
  
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 2:15 =
PM

  
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on =

  Commercial Airliner?

  


  

  
Has anyone had any problems =
taking a GPS=20
  receiver on a commercial airliner? =20
  I don=92t want to put it in my checked baggage, but I don=92t =
want hassles=20
  with security, either.


------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C326E7.91AC60C0--



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 01:01:01 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Brian Cluff)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:01:01 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
In-Reply-To: <20030530204310.58285.qmail@web14807.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20030530204310.58285.qmail@web14807.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <3ED7FECD.2090101@snaptek.com>

xWaterLilyx wrote:
> Hey wow... I'm actually in the top 15 of that list...
> I never knew that... shows how much I care about
> numbers doesn't it.  =-)  I was more curious about the
> total found but when I saw my name it was like.. oh
> hey.. that's me!  =-)     

You might also want to take a look at the other records that can be 
generated by the same code.
On most any page of AzGeocacihng.com, just look at the "Team Records" 
and "Cache Records" in the bottom half of the "Geocaching Stats" menu. 
They allow you to dial your own records with any combination of "found, 
hidden, lost, notes, removes" and "day, month, year"

Brian Cluff
Team Snaptek



From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 01:16:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Evil Fish)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:16:55 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description
References: <3.0.5.16.20030530171208.2a5f0c4a@pop.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: <001b01c32712$54d44d40$7830b83f@fishkiller>

Velcro an ALTOIDS and make it a non virtual cache

just a thought


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Schwarz" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 5:12 PM
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description


> Well, looks like the powers that be at geocaching.com set it up
> so nobody but me can see it, even if you ARE logged in.  Drats.
>
> Here's the text of the description I submitted, just to satisfy
> any curiousity anyone may have about my ill-fated virtual cache.
> Or if anyone wants to try to locate the thermometer, even though you
> won't increase your numbers for anything by doing so.  This does
> require a 2 mile round trip hike, with 500 feet of elevation gain.
> Unless you're doing more of the Groom Creek trail.  Again, if
> anyone does locate it, let me know via an email.  And if someone
> who lives in the Prescott area wishes to place a physical cache
> near it, that would be great:
>
> NAME: What's the Temperature?
>
> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> Get a little workout, make a weather observation, and score a cache.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> RATING: 1.5/2.5
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> This is probably the first cache in Arizona that asks you to make a
> meteorological observation!
>
> I don't like to have people driving around in circles trying to figure out
> where to park, and contributing to air pollution.  So, drive south from
> Prescott on the paved Senator Highway, go about 6 miles, and park at the
> Groom Creek trailhead parking lot, at N 34 27.881, W 112 26.448.  There is
> a 2 dollar forest service fee there.  Then put on your hiking boots and
> walk just over a mile up the 307 trail, with about 500 feet of elevation
> gain, to a thermometer in the middle of nowhere.
>
> What is a thermometer doing HERE, of all places?  Beats me.  I didn't
place
> it here, but it's been here for over 10 years.  I first noticed it after
> relieving myself in the early 1990's, long before geocaching started, just
> north of the the trail.  As I walked back, the white color of the
> instrument caught my eye.  It is located on the back side of a tree within
> 10 feet of the trail.
>
> I'm sure at least a few other people have spotted this thermometer, but no
> one has removed it during the 11 years or so I've known of its existence;
> and for all I know, it may have been there for years before the early
> 1990's.  It is NOT in a wilderness area, just a regular National forest
> area, so it doesn't violate any wilderness ethics.  The numbers showing
50,
> 60, 70, 80 degrees have definitely faded with time, but are still
readable.
>
> You will need to look at 2 words on the thermometer.  At the top there is
> one word (probably brand name); write that down.  In the lower left, below
> minus 60 degrees (doubt it ever gets anywhere near that cold here), is a
> word followed by 3 initials (probably the company name); write that down.
> This item in the lower left is faded and a bit hard to read, so I will
> accept reasonable fascimiles of what it says.  The word on top is still
> very clear, however.
>
> To get credit for this virtual cache, you will need to email me (Mike)
with
> the word at the top, and the word plus 3 initials on the lower left of the
> thermometer.  Make sure you do NOT post your answers here, even if
encrypted.
>
> Then, note the temperature reading on the thermometer, and please DO post
> that with your log, along with the time of day.  It will be interesting to
> see how the readings vary with whether its early morning or afternoon,
> whether its rained recently, and of course, the time of year.  For the
> record, it read 73 degrees at 5 PM on 5/25/2003.
>
> When you get to the listed coordinates, at about 6920 feet elevation, look
> on the back side of a tree within 10 feet of the trail, on the north side
> of the trail.  This is a ponderosa pine forest, and even though the trees
> aren't real tall here, GPS signals can be degraded some.  If you don't
find
> the thermometer right away, search in a 40-foot radius.  The trail isn't
> too high-traffic, but in case a group of hikers or horseback riders comes
> by when you are at the thermometer, be discrete and try not to draw
> attention to it until they pass.  As with a physical cache container, we
> don't want those who don't currently know about the thermometer to know of
> its existence, and possibly decide to remove it.
>
> If you feel so inclined, and have the time, continue on up the trail to
the
> summit of Spruce Mtn.  This will be a 6 mile roundtrip hike, with 1400
feet
> of elevation gain total.  Or, if you're really ambitious, do the full 9
> mile loop hike clockwise.  If you haven't been to the Spruce "Wild
> Goose" Cache yet, that cache awaits you near the summit, just 1.5
miles
> from here!  So, score 2 caches on this hike, not just this one!
>
> Have fun contributing to the climatic records for Arizona!
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> HINT:
> Some shrubbery guards the approach to the back side of the tree; it's not
> very open there.  However, I have yet to wear long pants on this trail.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> Mike
> Team Malthusian
>
> Brian wrote:
> >
> >Message: 1
> >Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:38:14 -0700
> >From: Brian Cluff 
> >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> >Mike Schwarz wrote:
> >> The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
> >> be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:
> >>
> >> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199
> >
> >> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
> >
> >Looks like it won't let anyone but you view the cache, even if you are
> >logged in.  I was going to add it to the list of archived caches, so
> >that people could get credit for logging it.
> >Oh well.. It seemed interesting to me.
> >
> >Brian Cluff
> >Team Snaptek
> >
> >
> >--__--__--
> >
> >
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
>
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 01:41:55 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:41:55 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] GPS and Radio and Interference
Message-ID: <20030530184156.25426.h017.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Hi Scott,

That is interesting.....if all satellites are being interfered with,
then probably the oscillator in your Motorola is interfering with the
GPS's IF (Intermediate Frequency). The 'IF' is a step down from the
satellite frequency in the gigahertz range to something that is used
internally to eventually have the readout display. (Complicated)

Not the first time a Motorola radio has caused interference to other
RF sensitive devices! *grin*
If that is *Greek* to you......**bigger GRIN**  just feel assured that
you are not alone.....some people have conflicts like this with
certain equipment. Annoying if it happens to you!

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott



On Fri, 30 May 2003 14:55:59 -0700, "RopingThe Wind" wrote:

> 
> 
> 
> >From: "Teryr Hernlund - [General Bracket]" 
> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >To: 
> >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] GPS on Commercial Airliner?
> >Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 12:03:19 -0700
> >
> >In any event, depending on the airline (America West has a strict
> policy 
> >against GPSr's), just pack it in >your carry-on like the rest of
your 
> >stuff.  Don't act suspicious and you won't be placed under
>suspicion.
> 
> That is interesting.. because they have all kinds of GPS equiptment
in
> the 
> cockpit!
> 
> I fly hot air balloons (FAA certified aircraft) and I always use GPS
> on 
> board. An interesting note I thought yall might be interested in:  I
> use two 
> way radio communication with my ground crew. The radios are Motorola
> VHF 
> radios. When my radio is turned on, I lose GPS sattelite reception.
> This has 
> happened with all my GPS's.. my Magellan 300, my Garmin 3+ and my
> Garmin 
> Etrex Legend. So, when I am flying in competitions where my GPS is
> being 
> used constantly, I cannot have my radio on and talk to my ground crew
> as my 
> GPS will stop tracking! I havent really tried changing frequencies in
> my 
> radio's to see if that would fix the problem. But, have been wanting
> to try 
> that (my crew if good and I rarely have to talk to them anyways
except
> when 
> getting ready to land). On the other hand, my aircraft radio (ICOM
> IC-A22), 
> which operates on higher frequencies, has no effect on my GPS.
> Interesting!
> 
> On the flip side of the coin.. my GPS's have no effect on the radio's
> or any 
> other instruments at all.
> 
> Scott
> Team Ropingthewind
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online  
> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 02:14:28 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (xWaterLilyx)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 19:14:28 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
In-Reply-To: <3ED7FECD.2090101@snaptek.com>
Message-ID: <20030531021428.68670.qmail@web14809.mail.yahoo.com>

> You might also want to take a look at the other
> records that can be 
> generated by the same code.
> On most any page of AzGeocacihng.com, just look at
> the "Team Records" 
> and "Cache Records" in the bottom half of the
> "Geocaching Stats" menu. 
> They allow you to dial your own records with any
> combination of "found, 
> hidden, lost, notes, removes" and "day, month, year"
> 
> Brian Cluff
> Team Snaptek
> 

Yea I knew I could look up all sorts of numbers, but
as I tend to shy away from numbers of any kind I don't
generally go looking them up.  =-)  Which, when you
think about the fact I work for a bank and deal with
numbers all day I suppose it makes sense in a strange
way.  

I just thought it was kind of cool to realize I was
that high on the list.  Of course, I blame Team MO &
GO entirely since they were the only reason I went
caching that day and had already done some of the
caches they were finding that day.

=-)  Man.. do you know how hot a 3rd floor apartments
gets without air on in the middle of the day!! 
Sheesh... the cat is sleeping in the dryer because
it's cooler!!  sorry.. just had to share!!

=====
xWaterLilyx & RTF
Team H20
Phoenix, AZ (Ahwatukee)

Geocaching Site:  http://www.geocities.com/xwaterlilyxrtf

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 03:24:13 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Gale Draper)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 20:24:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification
In-Reply-To: <20030531021428.68670.qmail@web14809.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20030531032413.74649.qmail@web14803.mail.yahoo.com>

--0-1360055430-1054351453=:74534
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Oh please tell me that poor cat was not in the apartment alone with no air on today. One of my cats has figured out which vent has the most air coming out of it and she lays directly underneath it.
 

xWaterLilyx  wrote:
=-) Man.. do you know how hot a 3rd floor apartments
gets without air on in the middle of the day!! 
Sheesh... the cat is sleeping in the dryer because
it's cooler!! sorry.. just had to share!!


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"

 

Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898


---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1360055430-1054351453=:74534
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii


Oh please tell me that poor cat was not in the apartment alone with no air on today. One of my cats has figured out which vent has the most air coming out of it and she lays directly underneath it.


 



xWaterLilyx <xwaterlilyxrtf@yahoo.com> wrote:


=-) Man.. do you know how hot a 3rd floor apartments
gets without air on in the middle of the day!! 
Sheesh... the cat is sleeping in the dryer because
it's cooler!! sorry.. just had to share!!


Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable changes
  On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so:
"Something hidden.  Go and find it. Go and look behind the Ranges --
  "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go!"




 




Rudyard Kipling ,   The Explorer  1898

Do you Yahoo!?

Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
--0-1360055430-1054351453=:74534--

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 03:48:06 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Team Tierra Buena)
Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 20:48:06 -0700
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Very first cache?
In-Reply-To: <20030530230122.EBQM18778.fed1mtao02.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net>
Message-ID: <000001c32727$728ac250$6501a8c0@TABLET>

> and this one is the first stash:
> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?ID=15

Except that they've since munged the coordinates on that page to put the
cache in the middle of the Arctic Ocean. The original coordinates were N
45 17.46 W 122 24.80, which puts it just off a trail in Milo McIver
State Park, southeast of Portland, OR.
Steve
Team Tierra Buena


From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 17:15:10 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Trisha)
Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 10:15:10 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description
Message-ID: <20030531101512.28736.h011.c000.wm@mail.brasher.com.criticalpath.net>

Thank you Mike for posting the text of your un-approved (but very
interesting) cache!
I vote for Lincoln or DDJT (or....?) to put a physical cache with a
weather theme at this site (I would but it's a bit too much hiking for
me....besides, I have the cache at the top still active)
I think it would be fun if whoever put a physical cache there would
include a print out of your virtual cache description in the cache as
a memorial to all the unapproved but deserving caches in the world.....

Trisha "Lightning"
Prescott


On Fri, 30 May 2003 17:12:08, Mike Schwarz wrote:

> 
> Well, looks like the powers that be at geocaching.com set it up
> so nobody but me can see it, even if you ARE logged in.  Drats.
> 
> Here's the text of the description I submitted, just to satisfy
> any curiousity anyone may have about my ill-fated virtual cache.  
> Or if anyone wants to try to locate the thermometer, even though you
> won't increase your numbers for anything by doing so.  This does
> require a 2 mile round trip hike, with 500 feet of elevation gain.
> Unless you're doing more of the Groom Creek trail.  Again, if
> anyone does locate it, let me know via an email.  And if someone
> who lives in the Prescott area wishes to place a physical cache 
> near it, that would be great:
> 
> NAME: What's the Temperature?
> 
> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> Get a little workout, make a weather observation, and score a cache.
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> RATING: 1.5/2.5
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> This is probably the first cache in Arizona that asks you to make a
> meteorological observation!
> 
> I don't like to have people driving around in circles trying to
figure
> out
> where to park, and contributing to air pollution.  So, drive south
from
> Prescott on the paved Senator Highway, go about 6 miles, and park at
> the
> Groom Creek trailhead parking lot, at N 34 27.881, W 112 26.448. 
> There is
> a 2 dollar forest service fee there.  Then put on your hiking boots
and
> walk just over a mile up the 307 trail, with about 500 feet of
> elevation
> gain, to a thermometer in the middle of nowhere.
> 
> What is a thermometer doing HERE, of all places?  Beats me.  I didn't
> place
> it here, but it's been here for over 10 years.  I first noticed it
> after
> relieving myself in the early 1990's, long before geocaching started,
> just
> north of the the trail.  As I walked back, the white color of the
> instrument caught my eye.  It is located on the back side of a tree
> within
> 10 feet of the trail.
> 
> I'm sure at least a few other people have spotted this thermometer,
> but no
> one has removed it during the 11 years or so I've known of its
> existence;
> and for all I know, it may have been there for years before the early
> 1990's.  It is NOT in a wilderness area, just a regular National
forest
> area, so it doesn't violate any wilderness ethics.  The numbers
> showing 50,
> 60, 70, 80 degrees have definitely faded with time, but are still
> readable.
> 
> You will need to look at 2 words on the thermometer.  At the top
there
> is
> one word (probably brand name); write that down.  In the lower left,
> below
> minus 60 degrees (doubt it ever gets anywhere near that cold here),
is
> a
> word followed by 3 initials (probably the company name); write that
> down.
> This item in the lower left is faded and a bit hard to read, so I
will
> accept reasonable fascimiles of what it says.  The word on top is
still
> very clear, however.
> 
> To get credit for this virtual cache, you will need to email me
(Mike)
> with
> the word at the top, and the word plus 3 initials on the lower left
of
> the
> thermometer.  Make sure you do NOT post your answers here, even if
> encrypted.
> 
> Then, note the temperature reading on the thermometer, and please DO
> post
> that with your log, along with the time of day.  It will be
> interesting to
> see how the readings vary with whether its early morning or
afternoon,
> whether its rained recently, and of course, the time of year.  For
the
> record, it read 73 degrees at 5 PM on 5/25/2003.
> 
> When you get to the listed coordinates, at about 6920 feet elevation,
> look
> on the back side of a tree within 10 feet of the trail, on the north
> side
> of the trail.  This is a ponderosa pine forest, and even though the
> trees
> aren't real tall here, GPS signals can be degraded some.  If you
don't
> find
> the thermometer right away, search in a 40-foot radius.  The trail
> isn't
> too high-traffic, but in case a group of hikers or horseback riders
> comes
> by when you are at the thermometer, be discrete and try not to draw
> attention to it until they pass.  As with a physical cache container,
> we
> don't want those who don't currently know about the thermometer to
> know of
> its existence, and possibly decide to remove it.
> 
> If you feel so inclined, and have the time, continue on up the trail
> to the
> summit of Spruce Mtn.  This will be a 6 mile roundtrip hike, with
1400
> feet
> of elevation gain total.  Or, if you're really ambitious, do the
full 9
> mile loop hike clockwise.  If you haven't been to the Spruce "Wild
> Goose" Cache yet, that cache awaits you near the summit, just 1.5
> miles
> from here!  So, score 2 caches on this hike, not just this one!
> 
> Have fun contributing to the climatic records for Arizona!
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> HINT:
> Some shrubbery guards the approach to the back side of the tree; it's
> not
> very open there.  However, I have yet to wear long pants on this
trail.
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------
> 
> Mike
> Team Malthusian
> 
> Brian wrote:
> >
> >Message: 1
> >Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 21:38:14 -0700
> >From: Brian Cluff 
> >To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Thermometer Virtual Cache rejected  :(
> >Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
> >
> >Mike Schwarz wrote:
> >> The cache is now in an archived state, and I believe it will
> >> be viewable IF you are logged in to geocaching.com, at this URL:
> >> 
> >> http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.asp?ID=71199
> >
> >> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
> >
> >Looks like it won't let anyone but you view the cache, even if you
> are 
> >logged in.  I was going to add it to the list of archived caches,
so 
> >that people could get credit for logging it.
> >Oh well.. It seemed interesting to me.
> >
> >Brian Cluff
> >Team Snaptek
> >
> >
> >--__--__--
> >
> >
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com
> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:
> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching
> 
> Arizona's Geocaching Resource
> http://www.azgeocaching.com

From listserv@azgeocaching.com  Sat May 31 15:04:29 2003
From: listserv@azgeocaching.com (Mike Schwarz)
Date: Sat, 31 May 2003 15:04:29
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Altoids tin on thermometer not recommended
In-Reply-To: <200305310115.SAA06468@ns2.sequoia.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.16.20030531150429.11177cbe@pop.mindspring.com>

At first this sounded like a good idea.  However, I'd
recommend NOT doing this, because:
The person who placed the thermometer there may still live in
the Prescott area, be checking on it periodically, and probably
knows nothing about geocaching.  So, upon seeing an altoids box
taped to their thermometer, they would probably freak out and
remove both from the tree.

Actually, since at least 11 years has gone by, and the numbers
have faded some, its likely whoever did the deed of placing
the meteorological instrument there has moved away, or no longer
checks it.  But as long as there is a possibility they are
still checking it, I think attaching an object to it should be
avoided.

They must have had the same spirit in the early 90's as geocachers
do today- leave an object on public property, and hope nobody
decides to remove it, and see what happens.  This has survived for
11 years up on that tree- wonder how many geocaches will survive
that long?

It'd be best to hide a container (of any size) within a few hundred
feet of it, and ask those finding the container to also find the
thermometer, take a reading, and note the temperature in both the
physical logbook and online log.  I would do this myself if I came
to Prescott often, but alas, I don't, maybe only 2-3 times per
year.  So, if someone else wishes to do this, feel free to.
Plagiarize whatever you want out of my cache description.

Mike
Team Malthusian

At 06:15 PM 5/30/03 -0700, TEF wrote:
>
>Message: 8
>From: "Team Evil Fish" 
>To: 
>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description
>Date: Fri, 30 May 2003 18:16:55 -0700
>Reply-To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
>
>Velcro an ALTOIDS and make it a non virtual cache
>
>just a thought
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "Mike Schwarz" 
>To: 
>Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 5:12 PM
>Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache 71199 description
>
>
>> Well, looks like the powers that be at geocaching.com set it up
>> so nobody but me can see it, even if you ARE logged in.  Drats.
>>
>> Here's the text of the description I submitted, just to satisfy
>> any curiousity anyone may have about my ill-fated virtual cache.
>> Or if anyone wants to try to locate the thermometer, even though you
>> won't increase your numbers for anything by doing so.  This does
>> require a 2 mile round trip hike, with 500 feet of elevation gain.
>> Unless you're doing more of the Groom Creek trail.  Again, if
>> anyone does locate it, let me know via an email.  And if someone
>> who lives in the Prescott area wishes to place a physical cache
>> near it, that would be great:
>>
>> NAME: What's the Temperature?
>>
>> N 34 27.750  W 112 25.526
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Get a little workout, make a weather observation, and score a cache.
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------
>>
>> RATING: 1.5/2.5
>>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> This is probably the first cache in Arizona that asks you to make a
> meteorological observation!
>
> I don't like to have people driving around in circles trying to figure out
> where to park, and contributing to air pollution.  So, drive south from
> Prescott on the paved Senator Highway, go about 6 miles, and park at the
> Groom Creek trailhead parking lot, at N 34 27.881, W 112 26.448.  There is
> a 2 dollar forest service fee there.  Then put on your hiking boots and
> walk just over a mile up the 307 trail, with about 500 feet of elevation
> gain, to a thermometer in the middle of nowhere.
>
> What is a thermometer doing HERE, of all places?  Beats me.  I didn't
place
> it here, but it's been here for over 10 years.  I first noticed it after
> relieving myself in the early 1990's, long before geocaching started, just
> north of the the trail.  As I walked back, the white color of the
> instrument caught my eye.  It is located on the back side of a tree within
> 10 feet of the trail.
>
> I'm sure at least a few other people have spotted this thermometer, but no
> one has removed it during the 11 years or so I've known of its existence;
> and for all I know, it may have been there for years before the early
> 1990's.  It is NOT in a wilderness area, just a regular National forest
> area, so it doesn't violate any wilderness ethics.  The numbers showing
50,
> 60, 70, 80 degrees have definitely faded with time, but are still
readable.
>
> You will need to look at 2 words on the thermometer.  At the top there is
> one word (probably brand name); write that down.  In the lower left, below
> minus 60 degrees (doubt it ever gets anywhere near that cold here), is a
> word followed by 3 initials (probably the company name); write that down.
> This item in the lower left is faded and a bit hard to read, so I will
> accept reasonable fascimiles of what it says.  The word on top is still
> very clear, however.
>
> To get credit for this virtual cache, you will need to email me (Mike)
with
> the word at the top, and the word plus 3 initials on the lower left of the
> thermometer.  Make sure you do NOT post your answers here, even if
encrypted.
>
> Then, note the temperature reading on the thermometer, and please DO post
> that with your log, along with the time of day.  It will be interesting to
> see how the readings vary with whether its early morning or afternoon,
> whether its rained recently, and of course, the time of year.  For the
> record, it read 73 degrees at 5 PM on 5/25/2003.
>
> When you get to the listed coordinates, at about 6920 feet elevation, look
> on the back side of a tree within 10 feet of the trail, on the north side
> of the trail.  This is a ponderosa pine forest, and even though the trees
> aren't real tall here, GPS signals can be degraded some.  If you don't
find
> the thermometer right away, search in a 40-foot radius.  The trail isn't
> too high-traffic, but in case a group of hikers or horseback riders comes
> by when you are at the thermometer, be discrete and try not to draw
> attention to it until they pass.  As with a physical cache container, we
> don't want those who don't currently know about the thermometer to know of
> its existence, and possibly decide to remove it.
>
> If you feel so inclined, and have the time, continue on up the trail to
the
> summit of Spruce Mtn.  This will be a 6 mile roundtrip hike, with 1400
feet
> of elevation gain total.  Or, if you're really ambitious, do the full 9
> mile loop hike clockwise.  If you haven't been to the Spruce "Wild
> Goose" Cache yet, that cache awaits you near the summit, just 1.5
miles
> from here!  So, score 2 caches on this hike, not just this one!
>
> Have fun contributing to the climatic records for Arizona!
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> HINT:
> Some shrubbery guards the approach to the back side of the tree; it's not
> very open there.  However, I have yet to wear long pants on this trail.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>



 
----- Original Message=
 -----
 
From: Jerry Nelson
 
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 7:48 AM
 
To: listserv@azgeocaching.com
 
Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Fw: [LOG] Watch List Notification<=
/DIV> 
 
Looks like omniterraunt may have broken the record=
 instead of only tied it.

Jerry
Offtrail


For a couple months I've been contemplating changing my caching =
name from=20
Offtrail, which I originally chose from the type of hiking I enjoy the =
most. I=20
don't hike that way except in places where the impact of such travel is=20
negligible, if not zero. But, from a desire to show geocaching as an=20
environmentally friendly activity, which generally it is, I'm thinking =
of=20
changing to Peakbagger, my long-time email name.  I think it's =
available.


 


Familiar names are important, though, and shouldn't be changed =
easily or=20
often. A certain mountain peak in Phoenix is a good example.


 


So, two questions for anyone who cares to give an =
opinion:


 


1. Does "Offtrail" have negative connotations, or am I =
concerned about=20
nothing?


 


2. Have others who have changed their name experienced any =
complications=20
at the main site or at azgeocaching regarding stats, etc.?


 


Jerry


Offtrail....for awhile, =
anyway