Six pairs. I don't know why I carry so many extras, but it does allow me to share with those who are less prepared. :-D PATRICK FINLEY wrote: > Brian..............Your reply is exactly what I expected in response > to my post. I know you organized the Adopt-A-Highway cleanup and I'm > sure it has made a difference along this section of highway. I applaud > your efforts and those who have participated in the cleanup events. I > never said it was "wrong" to cleanup this section of highway as you > implied, but don't need somebody telling me or other cachers that we > aren't serious geocachers because we didn't show up to do this > cleanup. CITO is a good thing, and if you were to ask other cachers > we've hunted with, I'm sure they would tell you that we practice CITO > as much as the next guy. I know this is important to you and that's > fine, but I'd much rather spend my time cleaning up an area that is > closer to my heart That's my choice and is just as important to me as > the Geocaching section is to you. Myself and Mrs. Wrangler spent an > hour and a half picking up trash along Cochran Rd. heading into the > Cochran Campout last month, and actually had one of the local > residents stop and thank us for helping keep this small area a little > cleaner. Isn't "this" what CITO is supposed to be about? I guess I > consider myself and Mrs. Wrangler "serious" geocachers, regardless > what Sport Trac/K or anybody else thinks. To imply that the 20 or so > people who showed up for the cleanup are the only dedicated CITO > geocachers in Az. is ludicrous. The quote from Sport Trac/K makes me > assume that he was a little disappointed with the turnout. As stated > before, some people have commitments and/or family business to tend > to, and can't make it to the cleanups. Don't for one second believe > that these cachers aren't as dedicated as those who turned out for the > cleanup. Anyway, I think I made my point and won't dwell on this any > longer. .....................P.S. ............Steve...How many AA > batteries does it take to make your pants sag?................. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Brian Casteel > *Sent:* Thursday, April 28, 2005 12:13 AM > *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com > *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] CITO 2005 #2 > > I took many deep breaths before I opted to say anything in > response. So, here goes... > > It WAS the dirtiest section of highway because it was unlucky > enough to be on the receiving end of regional winds that happen to > flow across the landfill before reaching this area. It also > happens to cut right through the heart of reservation land, which > unless blind, isn't well maintained unless it falls within the > immediate proximity of a sacred cash cow (aka, casinos). It also > happens to be a public highway, and a fair percentage of those who > travel it feel that the world is their trash can, from cigarette > butts to used drug paraphernalia. True, state highways cut right > through these lands, and state easements on either side of said > highway isn't the responsibility of those whose land it cuts > through. The state really should be the ones handling this, but > thanks to everyone else holding out their hand for a piece of the > taxpayer pie, that possibility is never going to be realized. > Looking for a way to let groups/individuals/families promote > themselves through community service, ADOT created the > Adopt-A-Highway Program, in an effort to allow generous and able > folks to volunteer their time for the betterment of all, not just > for the pimping of their groups or ideals. Now, you suspect that > this stretch of highway was available because it was such a dump. > I'm here to tell you that you are DEAD WRONG, and here's why I > know this. Beneath the words Arizona Geocachers is the name of a > local business in Phoenix, who shall remain nameless. This > business, according to ADOT has completely neglected this stretch > of highway for quite awhile, allowing it to fall into such > disarray, which made it available for adoption, as well as several > other stretches that weren't as close to town as this for us. It > also has a less than desired reputation, which follows the lack of > desire to uphold their commitment. > > Thanks to the cachers throughout Arizona who have participated in > this program, as it has become one of the cleanest sections of > highway out there. Proof is in the numbers. If I recall, the > first ever cleanup resulted in 150+ bags being collected. This > most recent one resulted in 66% less trash collected, or > approximately 50 bags. The Adopt-A-Highway Program is a wonderful > way to volunteer time for a truly worthwhile effort. The CITO > program is something I feel is an integral part of what makes > Geocaching such a good thing, especially in rural areas. The > concept follows the NFS 'Leave No Trace' program, as well as > others and have been wildly successful. I put myself on the line > for the commitment because I believe that Arizona Geocachers are > people who believe in such commitments, and that a number of them > would dedicate time as opportunity presented itself and work as a > group to help keep Arizona beautiful. I still believe this, but > know it isn't for everyone. You also say, 'why not clean up a > section of our beautiful desert instead?' Why should it be so > wrong to clean up this section? Personally, I have cleaned up > this 'beautiful desert' on countless occasions, that had nothing > to do with publicity or 'getting the good name of Geocaching out > there in a positive light'. I've cleaned up areas in Bulldog > Canyon numerous times, and have done so on several occasions up > here as well. Just because the CITO cleanups exist, doesn't make > them a bad thing, and I really wonder where such venomous > hostility came from. Why can't one do both? CITO cleanups on > that stretch of highway are something we as cachers should be > proud of, because it's certainly practicing what we preach. We > collectively imply that we support the concept of CITO, which > anyone in their right minds should do anyway. It shouldn't be a > shunned concept because one single method was chosen that is overt > in nature, and one that can potentially affect the opinions of > those very people who could take this enjoyment away from us. > There is an area up here called simply '17 Mile' It's just past > MP17 on a highway leading out of town here, hence its name > origin. Just a few weeks ago, the annual cleanup for this rural > shooting range was held. Had I not just started a new job <1 week > earlier, I'd have driven myself out there and spent the day > cleaning up other people's messes. Not in the name of Geocaching, > but in the name of volunteerism, and in order to do my part to > ensure that an area I enjoy remains open for not only myself, but > others who entertain themselves at this area. No, we don't need > to do the CITO cleanup along a highway to show we care. But isn't > it a great way to do so? > > I think the comment made by Sport Trac/k was taken way out of > context. It's one thing to enjoy each other's company inside an > air-conditioned environment where only 'fun' is the name of the > game. It's an entirely different thing to put in the physical > labor outside, sometimes under extreme heat in order to improve > the appearance of an area thousands see daily. To some, it isn't > fun, and that's why they don't show up. To others, family > commitments scheduled in advance take precedence. To even more, > physical limitations prevent them from participating, whereas > sitting down to dinner at a restaurant is something they are able > to do, not only due to timing, but environmental/physical concerns > can be thrown out the window because it isn't as physically > demanding Two hours in the sun along a stretch of asphalt truly > isn't as fun as two hours on the trail. It's not for everyone, > and that's fine I organized/participated because I saw the need > to clean it up. I did this because it was important to me, and I > wanted to make a difference. For the time I was able to > participate with everyone there, I truly enjoyed it, and felt that > I did make a difference. I'm sorry you don't feel like > participating in such a program, but this is your right and I'm > not going to feel any less toward you because of it. Those who > show up to help, do because they want to. Of those who don't, > some don't because they don't want to, but not all of them. That > is their right and I can't fault them for it. But I do have a > problem with faulting people because they want to, which is what I > feel some of your reply...implies. You truly should care what > people in the Valley think of Geocaching, because some of those > people are those who can take it away. All that aside, an > activity such as CITO cleanups are truly worthwhile. > > Brian > Team A.I. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* PATRICK FINLEY > *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com > ; ShadowAce > > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 27, 2005 8:46 PM > *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] CITO 2005 #2 > > Personally, I really don't have any interest in cleaning up > one of the dirtiest section of highways in the state of Az. I > suspect this section of highway was available for adoption > because it is such a dump. I know it's close to the landfill, > and that's probably one reason why it's so littered. It's nice > that geocachers are interested in cleaning up this highway, > but why not clean up a section of our beautiful desert > instead? Granted, Geocaching may not receive any attention > from the general public by cleaning up a shooting/dumping area > in the rural area, but I don't really care what others in the > Valley think of geocachers. We pick up trash while caching all > the time and don't need to pick up trash along an urban > highway to show we care. Besides, I'd like to know what the > definition of a "serious" cacher is. I really don't think that > picking up urban trash 1 day for 2 hours makes somebody a > "serious" geocacher. How about going out seeking and placing > caches on a regular basis, instead of giving the geocaching > world the definition of serious geocaching?............Flatiron > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* ShadowAce > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 27, 2005 8:07 AM > *To:* listserv@azgeocaching.com > *Subject:* Re: [Az-Geocaching] CITO 2005 #2 > > Not to worry Gale, I think most people saw it for what it > is, an > attempt to make others feel bad. I am sorry that I was > unable to miss > training and drive almost 4 hours round trip to pick up > trash in > Phoenix again. > > I did not know that meant I was anything less of a cacher. > I am sure > most of Phoenix will drive down here when we do cleanups. > So... > > On 4/26/05, Gale wrote: > > > > I disagree with that last statement. > > > > > > "Will5119@cox.net" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I would like to thank all of those who came out to help > us with this CITO > > event. Only the most serious geocachers turn out for > this type of cache! > > > > Sport Trac/k > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > > > > > > Tsegi Mike and Desert Viking > > > > Till a voice, as bad as Conscience, rang interminable > changes > > On one everlasting Whisper day and night repeated -- so: > > "Something hidden. Go and find it. Go and look behind > the Ranges -- > > "Something lost behind the Ranges. Lost and waiting > for you. Go!" > > > > Rudyard Kipling , The Explorer 1898 > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection > around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > > > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > > ____________________________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com > To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >____________________________________________________________ >Az-Geocaching mailing list listserv@azgeocaching.com >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: >http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > >Arizona's Geocaching Resource >http://www.azgeocaching.com > >