I all for this one. I can show you examples that will make your stomach turn. I'm friends with Pete Weinel who is the "Recreation Specialist" at the Tonto main headquarters in Phoenix who would be a good person to start talking to. I've done cleanup trips with other organizations and the Tonto is always appreciative of these efforts. It would be good PR for geocaching I'm sure. Let me know if you want to first decide on more details such as time and location or if you want suggestions from them. I'll can give Pete a call when you want to pursue this further. Jerry-Offtrail On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 14:31:20 -0700 "Team Tierra Buena" writes: If you didn't see the article in this morning's "Republic" about the trash problem in Tonto National Forest, you can read it here: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0218trash18.html I'd like your thoughts on an idea I've been thinking about that fits in with this story. What about holding an event cache somewhere in Tonto, the objective of which (other than the social) would be to do a group cleanup of an area that needs it? I was originally thinking that we'd "just do it", but in light of the article I wonder if we shouldn't contact one of the NFS personnel named in the story, let them know what we're doing (and when and where). Perhaps we could even persuade someone to plant a traditional cache near the event cache, which then might be archived after the event. Not only would that provide additional incentive for people to show up, but if the NFS folks showed up we could show them what a cache is and is not. Maybe we could even offer the NFS people the opportunity to request where we'd do the cleanup. I'm open to any comments. TIA. Steve Team Tierra Buena