Well we Hiked Sycamre canyon today and it was 200 + feet down and after 2+ miles out and 2+ miles back we had to clime back out! :-) and them we did the geocache that was .22 away :-) -- Patrick Brown PANDA77 N7FHB Check out http://forsale.wickenburg.net/ http://www.geocaching.com/ http://www.azgeocaching.com/ http://users.w3az.net/panda77/ http://www.robsonsminingworld.com/