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In reality, caches on private property like Home Depot, Kohls, or Ikea
are probably a bad idea, EVEN <u>WITH</u> PERMISSION! <br>
<br>
So Joe Cacher goes to the manager, and gets approval...the right thing
to do, yes?<br>
He gets the manager's name and number, and even posts them on the cache
page. So far, so good.<br>
The manager is <u>so good</u> as to even inform all the employees
about the approved cache. Now we in like Flynn!<br>
Weeks and months go by, employees come and go. Have they all been
informed about the APPROVED Geocache on company property?<br>
More weeks and months go by, I am looking for the cache, and am
challenged by a rookie store employee who never heard of the manager
who approved the cache because that manager has since been assigned to
the store in Duluth. Employee turnover has left no-one who remembers
about the Geo-what on the property, and the police are called.<br>
<br>
<br>
Jon Liming wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid20060815134543.74324.qmail@web52906.mail.yahoo.com"
type="cite">Well, soeaking as a law enforcement officer, if I
encountered a situation like this and wasn't a geocacher, I would've
handled it much in the way that the officer Scott ran into did. <br>
<br>
Now I'm not a lawyer and no legal advice is offered in this, but the
detained cacher in question may have an actionable offense against Home
Depot for unlawful detainment. In a case like this, Home Depot could
have directed the cacher to leave and not return, but the detention is
in question. Law Enforcement often has to deal with over zeolous
businesses doing things like this. I'd wager the officer was a little
less than tactful if it happened as recorded since this type of
nonsense takes away from our real jobs. Best thing to do in a situation
if you were dentained in this manner is to simply walk away. If they
attempt to detain you, inform them you will be filing a lawsuit.
Chances are, they will back down. Also, the cacher in question in this
home depot incident probably needs also mention the person in charge of
the detention in his or her letter to the corporate office. Odds are
this person will recieve some sort of reprimand and retraining on how
to handle these situations. <br>
<br>
I also prefer more remote caches, mostly because I don't like being
watched when I'm caching. <br>
<br>
Jon<br>
Team LawDog<br>
<br>
<b><i>Roping The Wind <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:arizcowboy@hotmail.com"><arizcowboy@hotmail.com></a></i></b> wrote:
<blockquote class="replbq"
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;">
While I agree the situation that occured at the Home Depot is a bit <br>
extreme...<br>
<br>
MANY caches placed in urban areas are often placed at business
locations... <br>
usually in parking lots (lamp posts) or around back of the stores, etc.
<br>
Although these places 'seem' to be public, they are VERY MUCH private <br>
property. THE CACHE OWNER NEEDS TO GET PERMISSION WHENEVER A CACHE IS
PLACED <br>
ON PRIVATE PROPERTY!!!! It is stated so clearly on the geocaching.com
web <br>
site! Unfortunately, probably 99 percent of the time, the cache owner
does <br>
not get permission and just places the cache, thinking the area is
public. <br>
Unless you are patronizing the business, then you are trespassing.<br>
<br>
I thought a person would have to be asked first to leave, then if they <br>
didnt... they could be considered trespassing. But I am not a police <br>
officer, so I dont really know the extent of that law. But that isnt
what <br>
this is about.<br>
<br>
It is about getting permission before placing caches on private
property. I <br>
can tell of a similar situation at a cache behind the businesses on <br>
Stapley/60. I was searching for the cache when a police officer came up
and <br>
asked me what I was doing. I told him I was geocaching and explained
what it <br>
was and offered to show him the cache. He wasnt really interested and
just <br>
told me I needed to leave or whatever and that I was trespassing. So I
left. <br>
I have had similar situations a number of times.<br>
<br>
I can tell you of yet another situation I encountered. I parked my
truck in <br>
the parking lot of a business to find a cache nearby. This cache was
not <br>
actually on this businesses property. But rather on the property of a <br>
business across the street! This cache took me a while to find, but it
didnt <br>
take very long for a tow truck to show up to my truck. As I came back
to my <br>
truck, I found the tow truck getting into position to hook it up. After
some <br>
smooth talking, I was able to leave.<br>
<br>
Perhaps some people get a thrill out of the 'stealth' factor of
geocaching <br>
in urban places such as these and the need to trespass to find a cache.
<br>
Perhaps the cache owners get a kick out of reading logs about
situations <br>
like this and even situations like that that occured at that Home
Depot. <br>
Frankly, I do not. We all know that it is easy enough to say we are
shopping <br>
at the business and not that we are geocaching. But why should I have
to lie <br>
to someone when I am approached? I just tell them what I am doing. I am
<br>
geocaching. I will offer to show them the cache everytime. If they dont
like <br>
it, I tell them how they can email the cache owner to have it removed.
If <br>
they ask me to leave, I will leave. These situation are occuring more
and <br>
more these days, it seems. But again, these situations should not
happen. If <br>
the cache owner got permission in the first place. I would feel so much
more <br>
relaxed and comfortable walking toward a cache in an area that is <br>
questionable (in terms of private property) if the cache description
simply <br>
said in it "this cache was placed with permission from property owner".<br>
<br>
Geocaching.com cant police these kinds of things. It is up to the <br>
geocachers, those that find the caches, to police the game. If there
are <br>
people out there that insist on placing caches on private property
without <br>
the consent of the property owners... then the cachers that first seek
out <br>
those caches should put an archive note log on the cache page. This
assumes, <br>
of course, that the cache description doesnt have something stating
that <br>
permission was obtained to place the cache. If it doesnt state in the <br>
description that permission was obtained, I can only assume that it was
not.<br>
<br>
There are several caches placed at Home Depots around the valley, I
might <br>
add.<br>
<br>
I would bet any amount of money, that if you asked a store owner if you
<br>
could place a cache on the property..... most of the time they would be
cool <br>
with it (why not!? It promotes the store and brings more people onto
the <br>
property).<br>
<br>
You will notice that over the past year or more, I have been doing less
and <br>
less urban caching. I prefer caches outside of the city areas, as I
dont <br>
have to deal with stuff like this. I still do urban caches, but I dont
feel <br>
the need to go find every one anymore. There are several within a
couple <br>
miles of my house that I have passed up on finding because they just
dont <br>
interest me anymore. I have no interest in playing 'stealth ninja'
anymore. <br>
I did that for many years back in my childhood days. Ive grown up
since. Its <br>
situations like the one that just occured at the Home Depot that turn
me off <br>
more and more from geocaching. But soon enough, I find myself out on a
quite <br>
and pleasant hike thru the forest to search for a tupperware container
or an <br>
ammo box in some quite remote location that keeps the joy and
excitement of <br>
geocaching alive for me.<br>
<br>
Scott<br>
Team Ropingthewind<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote>
<br>
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