<P>Ed, you said it very well and make a great point....everyone needs to be familar with all the methods so we can communicate the info needed. Lat/Long is probably here to stay, UTM is also. It's kinda fun to convert someone reporting Lat/Long in DD.MM.mmm (what some people use and what geocachers use) to DD.MM.SS.s (what we still use in Yavapai co, and in NAD27 to boot!) and then to UTM. Our teams up here do the same thing you do....run more than one GPS, and redundancy is good anyway.</P>
<P>Everyone ready for fire season? Let's all keep our fingers crossed.... pray.... hope.... think good thoughts .....(whatever your preference) , and practice even better fire safety when we are out there.....it's gonna be a miracle if we get thru to the monsoon moisture without major fires and major destruction some where(s). We normally gear up our evacuation training during Feb/Mar (our Posse helps train the 'paid help' police and sheriff, etc) but instead we are already in "go" mode.</P>
<P>Trisha ~ Lightning</P>
<P>On an on-topic thought, I have yet to have had to search for geocachers. Hunters, children, elderly/Alzheimer, hunters....stupid teens doing drugs who lie for three days and tie up all the resources before 'fessin' up....hunters.....but never a geocacher. Guess we DO know where we are going, or at least are smart enough to use our trackback features.</P>
<P><BR><BR> </P>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Ed & Mimi Philpott" <MPHILPOTT@RNI.NET><BR>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash~ digress to SAR<BR>Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2006 18:57:12 -0700<BR><BR>
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<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I have found that most SAR teams, at least the ones I have been with, prefer the UTM method.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Unfortunately the helo’s that we work with use lat/long.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>We usually run with one GPS in lat/long and one in UTM so we don’t have to change the settings for the command post.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Ed Philpott (Trail Gypsy)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:place><st1:PlaceName><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">MCSO</SPAN></FONT></st1:PlaceName><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> </SPAN></FONT><st1:PlaceType><SPAN class=SpellE><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Mtn</SPAN></FONT></SPAN><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">.</SPAN></FONT></st1:PlaceType></st1:place><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Rescue<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> az-geocaching-bounces@listserv.azgeocaching.com [mailto:az-geocaching-bounces@listserv.azgeocaching.com] <B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Trisha Brasher<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Thursday, February 23, 2006 6:15 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash~ digress to SAR</SPAN></FONT></P>
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<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">SEE? Thanks Dirk!! I knew that someone from "flatland' SAR (Phoenix/Tucson areas) would know UTM very well. We don't use it up here (yet) in Yavapai Co, but we have had to learn it for when we work a large search with units from your areas. The first time a Maricopa Mtn SAR guy reported his position in UTM to me on the radio (on the Lake Mary search about 5 years ago, and btw we did find the 2 brothers alive after almost 3 days in December freezing weather!) I turned to my Capt, who was ex-Marine, and immediately had him start plotting positions. It was especially important as it was the middle of the night and these specialized rescue teams were being inserted along the sides of a steep canyon (Mormon Cyn) so we needed to be sure we had good position reports. But, I digress....<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Trisha ~ Lightning<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 5.0pt"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><A href="http://www.ycjp.org/">www.ycjp.org</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN-LEFT: 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 0in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">----- Original Message -----<BR>From: ShadowAce <BR><SHADOWACE.AZ@GMAIL.COM>To: listserv@azgeocaching.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash<BR>Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2006 15:46:07 -0700<BR><BR><A href="http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/FieldMethods/UTMSystem.htm">http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/FieldMethods/UTMSystem.htm</A><BR><BR>this site is very informative and explains how UTM works. UTM would look something like:<BR>12S E 385060 N 3704249 for the Drinking hole cache #16 <BR>or the DMM we know as N 33 28.293 W 112 14.220<BR><BR>The reason it is easier to determine distance on a smaller scale is UTM is metric, so lets say someone gave you those numbers and told you to go 100 meters west.<BR><BR> With UTM the coordinates would become: <BR>12S E 385160 N 3704249<BR>while in DMM it would become:<BR>N 33 28.293, W 112 14.155<BR><BR>It is easier to add to metric in UTM or subtract then to try to figure out the distance in Lat Long.. <BR>.001 degrees in Long for the Flagstaff area is about 4.9 feet while .001 degrees Lat is about 6.07 feet<BR><BR>In Tucson the distances are 5.15 feet for Long and 6.07 for Lat<BR><BR>The differences are minor, but in some areas DMM formats are much different then in others. <BR><BR>Most GPSr units can handle UTM and you might find a good bit of help on some projection and calculation type puzzles by trying UTM instead of Lat Long. :)<BR style="mso-special-character: line-break"><BR style="mso-special-character: line-break"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
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<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><SPAN class=gmailquote><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On 2/23/06, <B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold"><A href="mailto:crystalh@cox.net">crystalh@cox.net</A></SPAN></B> <<A href="mailto:crystalh@cox.net">crystalh@cox.net</A>> wrote:</SPAN></FONT></SPAN> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0in; mso-margin-top-alt: 0in"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">OK, so for those of us boneheads that don't know what that means, could you tell us what UTM is? I could Google it, but it's so much more fun to hear it from the "pros".<BR><BR>Crystal<BR>HinkleHouse<BR>><BR>> From: "Trisha Brasher" <<A href="mailto:trisha@brasher.com">trisha@brasher.com</A>><BR>> Date: 2006/02/23 Thu PM 01:54:09 PST<BR>> To: <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com </A><BR>> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash<BR>><BR>> Find someone ex-military (or SAR) to teach you UTM.<BR>><BR>> ----- Original Message -----<BR>> From: "Apryl Clark"<BR>> To: <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A><BR>> Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash<BR>> Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2006 14:09:27 -0700<BR>><BR>> I think there was mention about this last year and someone <BR>> participated in it?<BR>><BR>> Apryl<BR>><BR>> ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>><BR>> From: <<A href="mailto:crystalh@cox.net">crystalh@cox.net </A>><BR>> Reply-To: <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A><BR>> To: <<A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A>><BR>> Subject: [Az-Geocaching] Cache Clash <BR>> Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2006 12:31:43 -0800<BR>> >Hi everyone,<BR>> ><BR>> >I just stumbled across this today and I don't know anything<BR>> about it except what is mentioned in the text I pasted below. On <BR>> the main website<BR>> (<A href="http://www.sierraadventuresports.com/sierrahome2events.htm">http://www.sierraadventuresports.com/sierrahome2events.htm</A>) it<BR>> mentions the date as 5/20/06. Anyone else know anything? <BR>> ><BR>> >Crystal<BR>> >HinkleHouse<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >What is a Cache Clash you ask? Have you ever heard of<BR>> Geocaching? Well, we're going to hide 25-35 cache's around a <BR>> very large area, and give you a list of UTM coordinates to find<BR>> them. You'll need a GPS unit to find them as they will be hidden<BR>> well. There is some strategy involved in deciding if you want to <BR>> just plug all the coordinates in to your system and let it point<BR>> you to them, or whether you would like to plot them on maps and<BR>> only use your GPS unit when you're real close. There is also <BR>> strategy in your route choice.<BR>> ><BR>> >The first person or team done within in a maximum of 3 hours<BR>> will win. If nobody has completed it in 3 hours, the person or<BR>> team who has found the highest number of cache's will <BR>> win. Solo's will be $35 and teams of 2 $55. Both solo's and<BR>> teams may carry a maximum of 2 GPS units with them. Sponsor<BR>> provided prizes will be awarded to first place in both<BR>> categories, and everyone's finish will be listed here on our <BR>> results page. The Phoenix Cache Clash will begin at 7:30 a.m. and<BR>> close at 10:30 a.m. You'll need to show up earlier though to<BR>> sign a waiver and get signed in. We'll have a pre-event meeting <BR>> at 7:00.<BR>> ><BR>> >Register now by click on the <A href="http://active.com/">Active.com</A> button here:<BR>> ><BR>> >The Cache Clash will be traveling to Phoenix, Denver, & LA. If <BR>> well received, plan on East Coast and Midwest Cache Clash's in<BR>> the summer and fall.<BR>> ><BR>> >What is a Cache? The cache's we place will be small containers,<BR>> about the size of a soup can, containing a slip of paper (or some <BR>> other trinket) identifying that you've been there.<BR>> >What is a GPS unit? GPS stands for Global Positioning<BR>> System. You may have seen people here and there walking around<BR>> carrying what looks like a thick cell phone or calculator, and <BR>> oddly searching for something amongst a pile of rocks or<BR>> bushes. They can be purchased at REI, electronics stores, map<BR>> stores, and they're becoming increasingly popular in<BR>> vehicles. They cost anywhere from $80-$500 depending on <BR>> features, though all of them are able to read satellite signals<BR>> being beamed toward earth, and they tell you exactly where you<BR>> are.<BR>> >What modes of travel are allowed? All travel must be done on <BR>> foot, so bring plenty of water and energy bars. We'll get<BR>> started early so you won't be out in the terrible heat.<BR>> >Can teams work together? We ask that you do not as it would<BR>> give you an unfair advantage. <BR>> >How can I learn more about Geocaching and using a GPS unit? You<BR>> can find a plethora of information about Geocaching at<BR>> <A href="http://www.navicache.com/">www.NaviCache.com</A> & <A href="http://geocaching.com/">Geocaching.com</A> and if you want to learn how<BR>> to use your GPS unit, REI holds regular clinics on using<BR>> them. You may be surprised when you find that there are probably <BR>> cache's hidden right near your home now.<BR>> >Why do I need a map? You could actually do it without the map,<BR>> and many GPS units have software built in that would show you<BR>> where the cache's are. Some people however prefer to see the <BR>> "Big Picture" in order to plan their route. Plotting 25<BR>> coordinates will take some time, though may make a sizeable<BR>> difference when it comes to which direction you want to go to <BR>> seek the cache's.<BR>> >Where else will you hide cache's besides under rocks? We may<BR>> also hide them within reach on a short tree, in a saguaro boot,<BR>> in a cave, bushes, under bridges, etc. <BR>> >How big of an area will be used? We anticipate using an area of<BR>> about 4 square miles, though we may adjust this for varying<BR>> terrain.<BR>> >Where will the Cache Clash take place? We anticipate using a <BR>> rural area, possibly near one of our lakes, or in a large park<BR>> like the Phoenix Mountain Preserve.<BR>> >What about a t-shirt? T-shirts will be available for purchase<BR>> for $12 when you register. You must register at least 3 weeks <BR>> prior to the event in order to purchase a t-shirt, and they will<BR>> be distributed at the event.<BR>> >You're an Adventure Racing company, why are you putting on this<BR>> event? A big part of Adventure Racing is using maps, compasses <BR>> and coordinates. Many of us also do it for fun, and orienteering<BR>> practice so it makes a great crossover sport. There is another<BR>> fun activity called Orienteering that bears some similarities as <BR>> well, and the Phoenix Orienteering club, along with the Tucson<BR>> Orienteering club put on some great events year round.<BR>> >What kind of people will be doing this? Geocacher's are a wide <BR>> range of people. All age groups and abilities are<BR>> represented. If you can hike around the desert, it's likely you<BR>> can complete this event. Some will be competitive going out real<BR>> fast, though probably 80% will be out for fun and adventure.<BR>> >What do I need to bring with me? A GPS unit, and a method of<BR>> carrying enough water to keep you well hydrated. Trail type<BR>> shoes are best, and you may want some sort of energy bars and an<BR>> electrolyte replacement like Gatorade. You may also want a spare<BR>> set of batteries for your unit.<BR>> >How will we receive our coordinates? We'll write them all down <BR>> on a large board and you'll need to transcribe them to your paper<BR>> or input them directly into your GPS unit. If the group is very<BR>> large, we may use multiple boards, or elect to hand them out on a <BR>> sheet of paper.<BR>> ><BR>> >More info will be posted in the next couple of weeks. Look for<BR>> Cache Clashes in Denver and LA soon!<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >____________________________________________________________ <BR>> >Az-Geocaching mailing list <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A><BR>> >To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR>> ><A href="http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching"> http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching</A><BR>> ><BR>> >Arizona's Geocaching Resource<BR>> ><A href="http://www.azgeocaching.com/">http://www.azgeocaching.com</A><BR>> <BR>><BR>> ____________________________________________________________<BR>> Az-Geocaching mailing list <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A><BR>> To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit: <BR>> <A href="http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching</A><BR>><BR>> Arizona's Geocaching Resource<BR>> <A href="http://www.azgeocaching.com/">http://www.azgeocaching.com</A><BR>><BR>><BR><BR><BR>____________________________________________________________<BR>Az-Geocaching mailing list <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A> <BR>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR><A href="http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching</A><BR><BR>Arizona's Geocaching Resource <BR><A href="http://www.azgeocaching.com/">http://www.azgeocaching.com</A><BR><BR><BR><BR>____________________________________________________________<BR>Az-Geocaching mailing list <A href="mailto:listserv@azgeocaching.com">listserv@azgeocaching.com</A><BR>To edit your setting, subscribe or unsubscribe visit:<BR><A href="http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching </A><BR><BR>Arizona's Geocaching Resource<BR><A href="http://www.azgeocaching.com/">http://www.azgeocaching.com</A><BR style="mso-special-character: line-break"><BR style="mso-special-character: line-break"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
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